I have to be honest, all my excitement for this game completely evaporated once the reviews and gameplay footage starting rolling out. The universe, story and cutscenes still look really...
I have to be honest, all my excitement for this game completely evaporated once the reviews and gameplay footage starting rolling out. The universe, story and cutscenes still look really interesting, but the gameplay looks rather bland and boring (and I say that as someone who generally enjoys walking sims). I still want to play it, but I will probably be waiting til the price drops quite a bit before I do.
As someone who played it, I don't think it's possible to capture what makes the gameplay so unique or good from video alone. You can't derive from video the experience of feeling what it's like to...
As someone who played it, I don't think it's possible to capture what makes the gameplay so unique or good from video alone. You can't derive from video the experience of feeling what it's like to engage in movement as you can when physically playing this game.
Kojima's genius is in the mechanical design of his gameplay and this game's big achievement is making something so mundane become an emotionally tense, draining affair at times—that act of going from A to B actually feels like a journey as opposed to walking across a map.
I think of videos on YouTube where someone walks across the world of the Witcher 3 or Skyrim in x many minutes or hours, and they simply stroll right through. That's not at all possible in this game because the journey is the challenge. The way the game makes use of the journeying to bring out these moments that other games leave to other mechanics like combat, shock scares, music, and art, this game does with the loss or effort of control just to move around.
It's not a game for everyone and it is divisive but the one thing I was very surprised by was the actual gameplay. It did not feel or respond at all the way gameplay videos gave me the idea it would. I think it's because this game doesn't control or function like any other video game, and my assumptions based on the frame of reference of the average video game movement does not apply to it.
As someone who also played it, I really don't think it was a good game (I still finished it), and I sure think "Kojima's genius" is a big overstatement. I often wonder why people call him a...
As someone who also played it, I really don't think it was a good game (I still finished it), and I sure think "Kojima's genius" is a big overstatement. I often wonder why people call him a genius, and why a lot of people seem to think he invented a genre of game. He didn't, he made a game that had some great aspects (the part where you didn't play), some VERY bad writing, and I mean very freaking bad writing. It's a game that, to me, suffers an identity crisis. It doesn't really know what it is. Is it a deep game? Is it a funny one? A goofy one ? I don't know, and I'm not sure anyone really knows. And to that, you add a whole lot of cheesy non-sense moments that I can only compare to Kingdom Hearts.
If I had to point out games that actually invented a genre, I'd say Monster Hunter for sure, and Dark Souls to some degree (more like a spin off of a genre).
But Death Stranding? Yeah, an experience for sure. Some of the mechanics were nicely thought, but most of the time, it was pretty annoying to carry stuff. And the whole is about carrying stuff. It's like taking that one RPG quest where the pnj tells you "hey can you deliver this to the other end of the world please?" and make a whole game out of it with clunky movement. The structure sharing part was great, but seriously, the weight management was a pain in the ass. I can understand why it's there, but I personnaly didn't like it at all.
I guess I'm ranting a bit here, but I'll finish with this. I also don't agree with you when you say it doesn't feel or respond the way video game. I think it feels like a heavier Geralt pre-movement patch (you know, when turning in the Witcher 3 was a pain), or somewhat like Red Dead Redemption 2. Your character has weight, and any small rock on his way will throw him off balance. It's supposed to be "realistic" I guess, but I don't think it is : as humans, we have many reflexes that a controller can't translate. And most of the time, Sam is the most clunky character I've every played.
Also, Die-Hardman almost made me quit the game with his calls and "Sam" after each quest. Can't the game let me figure some things out instead of having a dude call me every 5 min for 30h to tell me what to do? "Sam, go to a terminal", as if there was anything else I could do in the game anyway. :(
There, rant over, it had to come out. Sorry !
All of that being said, a lot of people liked the game, so it must be good to some, but to me, it's not. And I kind of regret putting those 65€ in it.
Yeah, there's a lot about this game that I think people won't like about it. The story with a Kojima game is always something of a trouble. Lots of cool ideas and themes, but way too much...
Yeah, there's a lot about this game that I think people won't like about it. The story with a Kojima game is always something of a trouble. Lots of cool ideas and themes, but way too much exposition and stilted writing. Death Stranding also has some of the worst named characters I think I've ever experienced.
I don't really agree with that meme-ified notion of Hideo Kojima, legendary genius/video game maker. But I also don't think any work has to be perfect in all aspects to be notable or for aspects of it to be considered genius. I think anyone who expects good writing out of a Kojima game might as well also check the end of every rainbow in case there really is a pot of gold sitting there.
I maintain Kojima's genius is specifically of the mechanical design of gameplay, developed over decades of trying to make games that are interesting to actually play. His games always feature approaches to gameplay in new or exciting ways that don't fit with the rest of the industry, and he uses them to great affect to punctuate moments, or reinforce themes where other games would choose to do it for you automatically in a cutscene, or play it out in a scripted event.
Changing controller ports, messing with game over screens, letting a boss die of old age if you put the game down long enough, inducing vomiting to expel poison, and so many more, Kojima's games have a list of gameplay mechanics, large and small, that let you interact with the world or develop a situation or character in a way where other games would have simply served you some text or a cutscene to do the same. He won't make you simply press F to do something as emotionally taxing as paying respects, he made you press the same shoot button you've been using all game in one of the most heartbreaking moments of MGS3.
This is a whole game based around the concept of delivering packages because the world is difficult to traverse. Using any regular game's movement would defeat the value of exploring this as an idea. But, at the same time, making movement too much of a pain in the ass will likely kill a game too. There's an extremely fine balance to hit when coordinating all the mechanics between balance, weight distribution, speed, stamina, and more. I don't think many game developers would have even begun exploring this, letalone have the skills and experience to find that balance. It's a lot of what makes this game so divisive, and you end up either liking what it's doing enough to keep participating or not enjoying participating in it enough to continue.
When I hear Kojima's working on a game, I make sure to play it because I can reliably expect him to make a game play in a way that no other game quite hits, and he can manipulate gameplay in ways that most other games never even think of.
I also don't agree with you when you say it doesn't feel or respond the way video game. I think it feels like a heavier Geralt pre-movement patch (you know, when turning in the Witcher 3 was a pain), or somewhat like Red Dead Redemption 2. Your character has weight, and any small rock on his way will throw him off balance. It's supposed to be "realistic" I guess, but I don't think it is : as humans, we have many reflexes that a controller can't translate. And most of the time, Sam is the most clunky character I've every played.
I don't think I said the game doesn't control like a video game. After all, it's all within the context of inputting commands through a controller. Gran Turismo and Forza can only be so realistic when you have to steer with an analogue stick and a trigger button. But even with RDR2 and pre-patch Witcher 3, there are a lot of shortcuts taken to allow players to traverse the world easily, even if the characters have momentum in their basic movements. These games aim for some semblance of realism but they don't commit to it as strongly in all aspects, and movement is definitely one. I've taken Arthur running up and down craggy rocks without a drop in speed, for example, and the horses make a lot of magic jumps with little to no lead-ups. What Death Stranding takes to another level is that it doesn't really allow for many traversal shortcuts at all. In Witcher 3 and RDR2, I don't have to think twice about running full speed over a knee-high rock but I certainly do in Death Stranding lest Sam lose his footing, my pack shifts its weight to one direction, and Sam loses control of his own momentum.
More than fair, I rarely buy games at full price these days. I only got Death Stranding on launch because of a great Amazon preorder deal two years before its release (got it for CA$40 on Day 1)....
More than fair, I rarely buy games at full price these days. I only got Death Stranding on launch because of a great Amazon preorder deal two years before its release (got it for CA$40 on Day 1). I also did not expect to like it very much either based on gameplay footage and early reviews too, but it's easily one of the most memorable AAA titles in recent memory for me (though not necessarily the best AAA title I've played in recent years).
I haven't played it yet, maybe later this year when I get a new rig. But question: do you expect that these new genius mechanics will eventually be adopted by other games or is it more niche to...
I haven't played it yet, maybe later this year when I get a new rig. But question: do you expect that these new genius mechanics will eventually be adopted by other games or is it more niche to Kojima's style of games?
There's not really any one mechanic that I would call genius, since what I'm referring to as mechanical genius here is the purposeful combination of distinct mechanics, but also I doubt even...
There's not really any one mechanic that I would call genius, since what I'm referring to as mechanical genius here is the purposeful combination of distinct mechanics, but also I doubt even Kojima himself would use the collection of mechanics again. It's very specific to the purpose and intent of the game and would be out of place for any other game.
I have to be honest, all my excitement for this game completely evaporated once the reviews and gameplay footage starting rolling out. The universe, story and cutscenes still look really interesting, but the gameplay looks rather bland and boring (and I say that as someone who generally enjoys walking sims). I still want to play it, but I will probably be waiting til the price drops quite a bit before I do.
As someone who played it, I don't think it's possible to capture what makes the gameplay so unique or good from video alone. You can't derive from video the experience of feeling what it's like to engage in movement as you can when physically playing this game.
Kojima's genius is in the mechanical design of his gameplay and this game's big achievement is making something so mundane become an emotionally tense, draining affair at times—that act of going from A to B actually feels like a journey as opposed to walking across a map.
I think of videos on YouTube where someone walks across the world of the Witcher 3 or Skyrim in x many minutes or hours, and they simply stroll right through. That's not at all possible in this game because the journey is the challenge. The way the game makes use of the journeying to bring out these moments that other games leave to other mechanics like combat, shock scares, music, and art, this game does with the loss or effort of control just to move around.
It's not a game for everyone and it is divisive but the one thing I was very surprised by was the actual gameplay. It did not feel or respond at all the way gameplay videos gave me the idea it would. I think it's because this game doesn't control or function like any other video game, and my assumptions based on the frame of reference of the average video game movement does not apply to it.
As someone who also played it, I really don't think it was a good game (I still finished it), and I sure think "Kojima's genius" is a big overstatement. I often wonder why people call him a genius, and why a lot of people seem to think he invented a genre of game. He didn't, he made a game that had some great aspects (the part where you didn't play), some VERY bad writing, and I mean very freaking bad writing. It's a game that, to me, suffers an identity crisis. It doesn't really know what it is. Is it a deep game? Is it a funny one? A goofy one ? I don't know, and I'm not sure anyone really knows. And to that, you add a whole lot of cheesy non-sense moments that I can only compare to Kingdom Hearts.
If I had to point out games that actually invented a genre, I'd say Monster Hunter for sure, and Dark Souls to some degree (more like a spin off of a genre).
But Death Stranding? Yeah, an experience for sure. Some of the mechanics were nicely thought, but most of the time, it was pretty annoying to carry stuff. And the whole is about carrying stuff. It's like taking that one RPG quest where the pnj tells you "hey can you deliver this to the other end of the world please?" and make a whole game out of it with clunky movement. The structure sharing part was great, but seriously, the weight management was a pain in the ass. I can understand why it's there, but I personnaly didn't like it at all.
I guess I'm ranting a bit here, but I'll finish with this. I also don't agree with you when you say it doesn't feel or respond the way video game. I think it feels like a heavier Geralt pre-movement patch (you know, when turning in the Witcher 3 was a pain), or somewhat like Red Dead Redemption 2. Your character has weight, and any small rock on his way will throw him off balance. It's supposed to be "realistic" I guess, but I don't think it is : as humans, we have many reflexes that a controller can't translate. And most of the time, Sam is the most clunky character I've every played.
Also, Die-Hardman almost made me quit the game with his calls and "Sam" after each quest. Can't the game let me figure some things out instead of having a dude call me every 5 min for 30h to tell me what to do? "Sam, go to a terminal", as if there was anything else I could do in the game anyway. :(
There, rant over, it had to come out. Sorry !
All of that being said, a lot of people liked the game, so it must be good to some, but to me, it's not. And I kind of regret putting those 65€ in it.
Yeah, there's a lot about this game that I think people won't like about it. The story with a Kojima game is always something of a trouble. Lots of cool ideas and themes, but way too much exposition and stilted writing. Death Stranding also has some of the worst named characters I think I've ever experienced.
I don't really agree with that meme-ified notion of Hideo Kojima, legendary genius/video game maker. But I also don't think any work has to be perfect in all aspects to be notable or for aspects of it to be considered genius. I think anyone who expects good writing out of a Kojima game might as well also check the end of every rainbow in case there really is a pot of gold sitting there.
I maintain Kojima's genius is specifically of the mechanical design of gameplay, developed over decades of trying to make games that are interesting to actually play. His games always feature approaches to gameplay in new or exciting ways that don't fit with the rest of the industry, and he uses them to great affect to punctuate moments, or reinforce themes where other games would choose to do it for you automatically in a cutscene, or play it out in a scripted event.
Changing controller ports, messing with game over screens, letting a boss die of old age if you put the game down long enough, inducing vomiting to expel poison, and so many more, Kojima's games have a list of gameplay mechanics, large and small, that let you interact with the world or develop a situation or character in a way where other games would have simply served you some text or a cutscene to do the same. He won't make you simply press F to do something as emotionally taxing as paying respects, he made you press the same shoot button you've been using all game in one of the most heartbreaking moments of MGS3.
This is a whole game based around the concept of delivering packages because the world is difficult to traverse. Using any regular game's movement would defeat the value of exploring this as an idea. But, at the same time, making movement too much of a pain in the ass will likely kill a game too. There's an extremely fine balance to hit when coordinating all the mechanics between balance, weight distribution, speed, stamina, and more. I don't think many game developers would have even begun exploring this, letalone have the skills and experience to find that balance. It's a lot of what makes this game so divisive, and you end up either liking what it's doing enough to keep participating or not enjoying participating in it enough to continue.
When I hear Kojima's working on a game, I make sure to play it because I can reliably expect him to make a game play in a way that no other game quite hits, and he can manipulate gameplay in ways that most other games never even think of.
I don't think I said the game doesn't control like a video game. After all, it's all within the context of inputting commands through a controller. Gran Turismo and Forza can only be so realistic when you have to steer with an analogue stick and a trigger button. But even with RDR2 and pre-patch Witcher 3, there are a lot of shortcuts taken to allow players to traverse the world easily, even if the characters have momentum in their basic movements. These games aim for some semblance of realism but they don't commit to it as strongly in all aspects, and movement is definitely one. I've taken Arthur running up and down craggy rocks without a drop in speed, for example, and the horses make a lot of magic jumps with little to no lead-ups. What Death Stranding takes to another level is that it doesn't really allow for many traversal shortcuts at all. In Witcher 3 and RDR2, I don't have to think twice about running full speed over a knee-high rock but I certainly do in Death Stranding lest Sam lose his footing, my pack shifts its weight to one direction, and Sam loses control of his own momentum.
Thanks, your perspective definitely rekindled my interest a bit... but even so, I still don't know if I want to spend $80 Canadian on it. :/
More than fair, I rarely buy games at full price these days. I only got Death Stranding on launch because of a great Amazon preorder deal two years before its release (got it for CA$40 on Day 1). I also did not expect to like it very much either based on gameplay footage and early reviews too, but it's easily one of the most memorable AAA titles in recent memory for me (though not necessarily the best AAA title I've played in recent years).
I haven't played it yet, maybe later this year when I get a new rig. But question: do you expect that these new genius mechanics will eventually be adopted by other games or is it more niche to Kojima's style of games?
There's not really any one mechanic that I would call genius, since what I'm referring to as mechanical genius here is the purposeful combination of distinct mechanics, but also I doubt even Kojima himself would use the collection of mechanics again. It's very specific to the purpose and intent of the game and would be out of place for any other game.