11 votes

Weekly coronavirus-related chat, questions, and minor updates - week of July 12

This thread is posted weekly, and is intended as a place for more-casual discussion of the coronavirus and questions/updates that may not warrant their own dedicated topics. Tell us about what the situation is like where you live!

20 comments

  1. [4]
    balooga
    Link
    One thing that's been bothering me lately is the lack of a formal end condition for the pandemic in a given region. I am starting to hear phrases like "[some past event happened] during the...

    One thing that's been bothering me lately is the lack of a formal end condition for the pandemic in a given region. I am starting to hear phrases like "[some past event happened] during the pandemic" or "[now we are] post-pandemic." But as far as I can tell, there's no consensus about this. I'm thankful that cases are presently low where I live, but my kids still can't get vaccinated. Until they do, I can't act as if this thing is behind us. Sure, my vaccine restored a lot of my personal normalcy but our family lifestyle is still dominated by masking and social distancing, for the kids' sake. Even apart from that I'm constantly concerned about new variants and breakthrough infections for myself.

    Does anyone else have the creeping suspicion that these declarations of the pandemic's end are both premature, and based on little more than wishful thinking?

    I would feel a lot better if there was some objective, formalized criteria for marking the end. Currently there's just too much room for political biases muddying the waters, and on the flip side when things truly are "over" it would be comforting to acknowledge that officially so people don't continue to worry needlessly.

    12 votes
    1. [2]
      kr2
      Link Parent
      Where I'm from (Singapore), the government intends to declare covid-19 as endemic some time in the future after a certain percentage of the population has been vaccinated. IMO, it seems to be the...

      Where I'm from (Singapore), the government intends to declare covid-19 as endemic some time in the future after a certain percentage of the population has been vaccinated.

      IMO, it seems to be the most logical approach, since there can be enough certainties to come up with conditions to transition out of covid being a pandemic, and though it might not be an actual end, actually feels like progress.

      5 votes
      1. vektor
        Link Parent
        Yup, that's reasonable. You basically have two well-defined endpoints. If the level of immunization (from any cause) is at an equilibrium in the balance of infections vs (loss of immunity &&...

        Yup, that's reasonable. You basically have two well-defined endpoints. If the level of immunization (from any cause) is at an equilibrium in the balance of infections vs (loss of immunity && Population replacement), then it is obviously endemic. If level of immunization is zero, it's obviously epidemic/pandemic. Somewhere in between those two extremes, you're going to have to draw a line. Since the equilibrium is moving about, you're just going to have to pick a level of immunization and go with it. With the major industrial nations sitting at 40-70% vaccination (depending on if you count partly vaccinated) +X% recovered, these countries are certainly closer to endemic status than epidemic.

        I don't think it'd be unreasonable to call the pandemic over in some of those highly vaccinated countries. Then again, because of non-random vaccine distribution, there might be clusters left that are still susceptible where the disease will keep on spreading. Case numbers might prove me wrong, I suppose.

        3 votes
    2. imperialismus
      Link Parent
      Are your kids in a special risk group?

      But as far as I can tell, there's no consensus about this. I'm thankful that cases are presently low where I live, but my kids still can't get vaccinated. Until they do, I can't act as if this thing is behind us.

      Are your kids in a special risk group?

      3 votes
  2. [3]
    skybrian
    Link
    Although cases are mostly pretty low in the US, the trends look bad: Current state of affairs: July 12.

    Although cases are mostly pretty low in the US, the trends look bad: Current state of affairs: July 12.

    11 votes
    1. [2]
      FrankGrimes
      Link Parent
      I've never seen this site before - looks interesting. Do they typically post daily updates?

      I've never seen this site before - looks interesting. Do they typically post daily updates?

      2 votes
      1. skybrian
        Link Parent
        It's new to me as well. looking at archives, they seem to be blogging irregularly?

        It's new to me as well. looking at archives, they seem to be blogging irregularly?

        1 vote
  3. [2]
    kfwyre
    Link
    Question for the crowd: what does vaccine availability and uptake look like in your area/region?

    Question for the crowd: what does vaccine availability and uptake look like in your area/region?

    7 votes
    1. Kuromantis
      Link Parent
      According to my state's vaccination website, half of the population of my state has been given their first dose, while 16 or so % has been fully/"properly" vaccinated. Given we're vaccinating 40...

      According to my state's vaccination website, half of the population of my state has been given their first dose, while 16 or so % has been fully/"properly" vaccinated. Given we're vaccinating 40 year olds right now (they're vaccinating people by oldest to youngest), it seems most people are okay with the vaccines and are taking them up. Not so sure about availability, I saw an article suggesting the government is going to need to stop for a little to get some more vaccines but I'm honestly following local news rather little.

      6 votes
  4. krg
    Link
    For those who haven’t been following, there’s another promising vaccine on the way.

    For those who haven’t been following, there’s another promising vaccine on the way.

    6 votes
  5. skybrian
    Link
    The estimates in this story seem dubious because it's not like anyone can do a survey, but it still sounds pretty serious. ‘Everyone is dying’: Myanmar on the brink of decimation

    The estimates in this story seem dubious because it's not like anyone can do a survey, but it still sounds pretty serious.

    ‘Everyone is dying’: Myanmar on the brink of decimation

    Now in Thailand, I get over 200 encrypted texts per day from friends there. Until last week, most were promoting armed and political resistance to the coup. “Responsibility to Protect” and “No Fly Zone” came up over and over.

    Now, 100% of the texts are desperate pleas for health assistance and an international humanitarian intervention. “We need help,” read so many social media posts and flash protestor signs these days.

    6 votes
  6. [3]
    skybrian
    Link
    COVID-19 rebounding in Orange County, other Southern California suburbs […]

    COVID-19 rebounding in Orange County, other Southern California suburbs

    Fourteen days ago, Orange County was reporting a weekly average of about 48 new cases per day. Now, the figure is 150. During that same time, averages grew in San Diego County from 92 cases per day to 344; in San Bernardino County from 55 cases per day to 215; and in L.A. County from 298 cases per day to 983.

    […]

    Though cases in these counties are nowhere near the levels of the pandemic’s earlier waves — and there’s optimism the current uptick won’t grow into anything of that magnitude — health officials have long noted that increases in cases are the first warning sign, as more infections could eventually trigger corresponding increases in hospitalizations and, possibly, deaths.

    The second phase is now also currently on display in Southern California. On June 29, there were 56 COVID-19 positive patients hospitalized in Orange County, state figures show. As of Tuesday, that number had swelled to 119.

    5 votes
    1. knocklessmonster
      Link Parent
      My brother is doing clinicals at a hospital in OC, and they're seeing kids coming in with COVID. As a student, they're keeping him away from the COVID patients. I'm mostly bracing for yet another...

      My brother is doing clinicals at a hospital in OC, and they're seeing kids coming in with COVID. As a student, they're keeping him away from the COVID patients. I'm mostly bracing for yet another semester of online classes at this point, even though I'd much rather be doing them in person. He's also getting married next month, but this may throw a wrench in the works, which is messed up because they specifically planned it to try to find a time after we'd managed to deal with this pandemic.

      9 votes
  7. skybrian
    Link
    Canada took a risk delaying second COVID-19 vaccine doses. Now, its vaccination campaign is one of the best in the world [...]

    Canada took a risk delaying second COVID-19 vaccine doses. Now, its vaccination campaign is one of the best in the world

    Now, as Canada’s vaccination rate has skyrocketed in recent weeks — covering nearly 70% of the population with at least one dose, passing the United States’ 55% and most other nations — and its cases and hospitalizations have tapered, it seems that the risk is paying off.

    [...]

    As of July 9, Canada was quickly gaining on the United States’ fully vaccinated rate of 47% of the population, which has now slowed to a crawl. On June 1, less than 6% of Canada’s population was fully vaccinated, but on July 8, it had reached 40%, according to Our World in Data.

    5 votes
  8. skybrian
    Link
    Delta Is Driving a Wedge Through Missouri - Ed Yong […]

    Delta Is Driving a Wedge Through Missouri - Ed Yong

    [Mercy Hospital Springfield] is now busier than at any previous point during the pandemic. In just five weeks, it took in as many COVID-19 patients as it did over five months last year. Ten minutes away, another big hospital, Cox Medical Center South, has been inundated just as quickly. “We only get beds available when someone dies, which happens several times a day,” Terrence Coulter, the critical-care medical director at CoxHealth, told me.

    Last week, Katie Towns, the acting director of the Springfield–Greene County Health Department, was concerned that the county’s daily cases were topping 250. On Wednesday, the daily count hit 405. This dramatic surge is the work of the super-contagious Delta variant, which now accounts for 95 percent of Greene County’s new cases, according to Towns. It is spreading easily because people have ditched their masks, crowded into indoor spaces, resumed travel, and resisted vaccinations. Just 40 percent of people in Greene County are fully vaccinated. In some nearby counties, less than 20 percent of people are.

    […]

    Those ICUs are also filling with younger patients, in their 20s, 30s, and 40s, including many with no underlying health problems. In part, that’s because elderly people have been more likely to get vaccinated, leaving Delta with a younger pool of vulnerable hosts. While experts are still uncertain if Delta is deadlier than the original coronavirus, every physician and nurse in Missouri whom I spoke with told me that the 30- and 40-something COVID-19 patients they’re now seeing are much sicker than those they saw last year. “That age group did get COVID before, but they didn’t usually end up in the ICU like they are now,” Jonathan Brown, a respiratory therapist at Mercy, told me. Nurses are watching families navigate end-of-life decisions for young people who have no advance directives or other legal documents in place.

    Almost every COVID-19 patient in Springfield’s hospitals is unvaccinated, and the dozen or so exceptions are all either elderly or immunocompromised people. […]

    4 votes
  9. skybrian
    Link
    How vaccine-skeptic France and Germany came to support near-mandates [...] [...]

    How vaccine-skeptic France and Germany came to support near-mandates

    [...] the European Union is using digital covid certificates, with scannable QR codes that quickly show if someone has been vaccinated, tested negative or recovered from covid-19. The certificates were designed with the primary goal of easing movement across borders, but many E.U. countries are using them internally, as well.

    In Germany, vaccinated people have gained privileged access to restaurants and bars that would otherwise require a recent negative coronavirus test. Some of those restrictions have now been lifted because of low caseloads. But rules could be tightened again, as the European CDC predicts incidence rates across the bloc to triple within the next two weeks because of the delta variant.

    [...]

    In France, President Emmanuel Macron announced this past week that people would have to flash their certificates before entering trains, planes, restaurants, cafes and many other places starting next month.

    [...]

    The French government says the measures are essential to revive a flagging inoculation campaign — which had stalled at around 53 percent for first shots — and to prevent a deadly fourth wave of the virus.

    4 votes
  10. [2]
    skybrian
    Link
    HMS Queen Elizabeth: Covid outbreak on Navy flagship I’m wondering when they got the vaccine, and which one? If everyone was vaccinated, does this mean herd immunity is impossible?

    HMS Queen Elizabeth: Covid outbreak on Navy flagship

    The BBC has been told there have been around 100 cases on the aircraft carrier, which is part way through a world tour.

    Several other warships in the fleet accompanying it are also affected.

    Defence Secretary Ben Wallace said all crew on the deployment had received two doses of a Covid-19 vaccine and the outbreak was being managed.

    I’m wondering when they got the vaccine, and which one? If everyone was vaccinated, does this mean herd immunity is impossible?

    3 votes
    1. Thales
      Link Parent
      Given it’s the UK, there’s a high a probability they were using the AZ vaccine which is apparently less effective against the delta variant than the mRNA-based shots. Herd-immunity is still...

      Given it’s the UK, there’s a high a probability they were using the AZ vaccine which is apparently less effective against the delta variant than the mRNA-based shots. Herd-immunity is still possible against the delta variant but it’s probably going to be less likely in countries with widespread anti-vax sentiment (the first half of this article talks a bit about what the new requirements for herd-immunity might look like).

      2 votes
  11. skybrian
    Link
    Covid vaccines for kids under 12 expected midwinter, FDA official says [...]

    Covid vaccines for kids under 12 expected midwinter, FDA official says

    The regulatory agency is asking for four to six months of safety follow-up data for kids under age 12, the FDA official said. Just two months of follow-up data was required for the clinical trials in adults.

    [...]

    As of July 8, more than 4 million children had been diagnosed with Covid-19, representing 14.2 percent of all cases, according to the American Academy of Pediatrics. At least 335 children, ages 17 and younger, have died from Covid-19, according to the latest data from the CDC.

    2 votes