Related article about how the Biden 2020 compares with the Hillary 2016 map for the Democratic nomination. If Elizabeth Warren ran in 2016, she would have won and sanders wouldn't be anywhere near...
If Elizabeth Warren ran in 2016, she would have won and sanders wouldn't be anywhere near national policy. 3 out of 5 of her supporters had moderates as their second choices. They want progressivism but they do not want Sanders anywhere near it. Also these people seem to Ironically be far more numerous and consequential than Bernie or bust-ers.
What I'm reading out of that map is that Bernie's Spanish language outreach people deserve a medal and the rest of his campaign people need to fuck right off forever. All his Clinton -> Sanders...
What I'm reading out of that map is that Bernie's Spanish language outreach people deserve a medal and the rest of his campaign people need to fuck right off forever.
All his Clinton -> Sanders gains were in heavily Hispanic regions. Evidently his worst supporters just don't speak Spanish.
The “dirtbag left” has been mostly Brooklyn hipsters, struggling writers and media types, and failed academics. The actual working class folks involved aren’t on twitter or writing...
The “dirtbag left” has been mostly Brooklyn hipsters, struggling writers and media types, and failed academics. The actual working class folks involved aren’t on twitter or writing catastrophically bad takes in Jacobin. But they are specifically targeting people who mainline media coverage all day.
I don't believe it has as much to do with convincing centrist and center-left dems of the value of the "far" left's ideas as Mr. McElwee would imply. The majority of Dems already agree with many...
I don't believe it has as much to do with convincing centrist and center-left dems of the value of the "far" left's ideas as Mr. McElwee would imply. The majority of Dems already agree with many (thought not all) of the policies Bernie touts as is evidenced by the shifting policy landscape of the party and the large amounts of support both Bernie and Warren were getting prior to the consolidation.
The issue with Bernie specifically is they don't like that he comes off so aggressive in general, as the article mentioned. He could be preaching to their choir specifically and they would still avoid him because this isn't about choosing who would best help the American people anymore (if it ever really was), this is about what's going to make them feel the safest.
Not that I can blame them. Times are rough; choosing the option you view as safest (whether it actually is the safest or not) during rough times is Humanity 101. Doesn't make it any less asinine though.
I think you're 100% on the money here. I think many people go even further: The decades of voting history many Sanders' supporters tout as a strong and good record, unwavering principles and being...
If Sanders was elected president tomorrow that wouldn't mean a single one of his ideas becomes effect. He could be given a Democratic Senate and there is still going to be an incredible uphill battle to get any major changes through the system.
Voters still have to consider which candidate will be the most effective within the political system we have. Like it or not Sanders has not proven himself on that matter, Biden is the clear cut winner there.
I think you're 100% on the money here. I think many people go even further:
The decades of voting history many Sanders' supporters tout as a strong and good record, unwavering principles and being on the right side of history, betray his lack of political ability to get things done.
Sanders has for decades showed he's unwilling to compromise to change the law for the better because those suggested compromises aren't perfectly in line with his primary political standpoint.
Being president is all about brokering compromise to get laws enacted. Sanders has proven he's actively unwilling to do what it takes to be successful within the US political system. For decades. Why will this man in his late 70s suddenly change if he gets into office and become a master pragmatist? He won't.
I would point to his vote on the ACA in response. When it mattered most, when Bernie was faced with the choice of idealism or a compromise for incremental change in the always-important healthcare...
The decades of voting history many Sanders' supporters tout as a strong and good record, unwavering principles and being on the right side of history, betray his lack of political ability to get things done.
I would point to his vote on the ACA in response. When it mattered most, when Bernie was faced with the choice of idealism or a compromise for incremental change in the always-important healthcare debate, he cast the deciding vote for the ACA.
So let’s contrast the centrist former-Democrat-turned-Independent with the progressive from that debate. Joe Lieberman refused to compromise on a public option and would not vote for the bill without removing it. Bernie Sanders compromised on his ideals—even though he wanted a public option—because he recognized the positive change that would come from passing the bill without a public option.
The most useful data point for arguably the most important policy debate from his voting record proved his ability to be pragmatic and compromise. I have no reason to believe he wouldn’t compromise on his ideal of M4A if the binary choice is no change or incremental change.
Precisely. You don't start negotiations by putting forth a pre-compromised plan. You go in with a strong, bold policy and make bare minimum concessions until it is passed. When negotiating a...
The most useful data point for arguably the most important policy debate from his voting record proved his ability to be pragmatic and compromise. I have no reason to believe he wouldn’t compromise on his ideal of M4A if the binary choice is no change or incremental change.
Precisely. You don't start negotiations by putting forth a pre-compromised plan. You go in with a strong, bold policy and make bare minimum concessions until it is passed.
When negotiating a salary for a new job, you don't make a low-ball offer to start with....a company will always pay you less if they can. You reach high and work your way down from there.
I had forgotten that. Thanks for the correction. So it was the two independent Senators from that session at opposite ends of the Democratic Party spectrum. One compromising and one uncompromising.
I had forgotten that. Thanks for the correction. So it was the two independent Senators from that session at opposite ends of the Democratic Party spectrum. One compromising and one uncompromising.
Do you think someone like Elizabeth Warren stands a better chance at doing so then? I don't really think most Congresspeople would support progressive policy just because Warren is calmer than...
If Sanders was elected president tomorrow that wouldn't mean a single one of his ideas becomes effect. He could be given a Democratic Senate and there is still going to be an incredible uphill battle to get any major changes through the system.
Do you think someone like Elizabeth Warren stands a better chance at doing so then? I don't really think most Congresspeople would support progressive policy just because Warren is calmer than Sanders and a registered Democrat.
This is just wrong. There are plenty of policies he had proposed that do not require anything from the legislative branch. Off the top of my head, end to the wars in the middle east, legalization...
If Sanders was elected president tomorrow that wouldn't mean a single one of his ideas becomes effect. He could be given a Democratic Senate and there is still going to be an incredible uphill battle to get any major changes through the system.
This is just wrong. There are plenty of policies he had proposed that do not require anything from the legislative branch. Off the top of my head, end to the wars in the middle east, legalization of marijuana, and end to the border camps are all policies he has proposed that can be done through a combination of appointments and executive orders. He has specifically stated his plan to legalize marijuana on day 1. The president cannot do everything on his own, but he can do a great deal.
I'm curious as to why we all seem to assume that it must be a devil whispering on his shoulder and not just an intrinsic part of the guy's personality.
Bernie being particularly ill-served by a campaign staff that want to attack other Democrats and the party establishment, continuing to present Bernie as an indepent and aggressive outside
I'm curious as to why we all seem to assume that it must be a devil whispering on his shoulder and not just an intrinsic part of the guy's personality.
I mean, you make an inference. We don't have any way to "truly know" that his staff are serving him poorly rather than just taking their cues from their leadership either. It just seems strange...
I mean, you make an inference. We don't have any way to "truly know" that his staff are serving him poorly rather than just taking their cues from their leadership either. It just seems strange that we're willing to accept that tone-at-the-top matters when we ascribe Zuckerberg's general creepiness as an explanatory factor in Facebook being a creepy company that doesn't respect people's privacy but people won't do it here.
Related article about how the Biden 2020 compares with the Hillary 2016 map for the Democratic nomination.
If Elizabeth Warren ran in 2016, she would have won and sanders wouldn't be anywhere near national policy. 3 out of 5 of her supporters had moderates as their second choices. They want progressivism but they do not want Sanders anywhere near it. Also these people seem to Ironically be far more numerous and consequential than Bernie or bust-ers.
What I'm reading out of that map is that Bernie's Spanish language outreach people deserve a medal and the rest of his campaign people need to fuck right off forever.
All his Clinton -> Sanders gains were in heavily Hispanic regions. Evidently his worst supporters just don't speak Spanish.
It's less mysterious when you consider that they're the ones most likely to be heavily exposed to Bernie Twitter.
Why would college educated people be more exposed to the dirtbag left? If anything I'd think they'd be the ones to take them the least seriously.
The “dirtbag left” has been mostly Brooklyn hipsters, struggling writers and media types, and failed academics. The actual working class folks involved aren’t on twitter or writing catastrophically bad takes in Jacobin. But they are specifically targeting people who mainline media coverage all day.
I don't believe it has as much to do with convincing centrist and center-left dems of the value of the "far" left's ideas as Mr. McElwee would imply. The majority of Dems already agree with many (thought not all) of the policies Bernie touts as is evidenced by the shifting policy landscape of the party and the large amounts of support both Bernie and Warren were getting prior to the consolidation.
The issue with Bernie specifically is they don't like that he comes off so aggressive in general, as the article mentioned. He could be preaching to their choir specifically and they would still avoid him because this isn't about choosing who would best help the American people anymore (if it ever really was), this is about what's going to make them feel the safest.
Not that I can blame them. Times are rough; choosing the option you view as safest (whether it actually is the safest or not) during rough times is Humanity 101. Doesn't make it any less asinine though.
I think you're 100% on the money here. I think many people go even further:
The decades of voting history many Sanders' supporters tout as a strong and good record, unwavering principles and being on the right side of history, betray his lack of political ability to get things done.
Sanders has for decades showed he's unwilling to compromise to change the law for the better because those suggested compromises aren't perfectly in line with his primary political standpoint.
Being president is all about brokering compromise to get laws enacted. Sanders has proven he's actively unwilling to do what it takes to be successful within the US political system. For decades. Why will this man in his late 70s suddenly change if he gets into office and become a master pragmatist? He won't.
I would point to his vote on the ACA in response. When it mattered most, when Bernie was faced with the choice of idealism or a compromise for incremental change in the always-important healthcare debate, he cast the deciding vote for the ACA.
So let’s contrast the centrist former-Democrat-turned-Independent with the progressive from that debate. Joe Lieberman refused to compromise on a public option and would not vote for the bill without removing it. Bernie Sanders compromised on his ideals—even though he wanted a public option—because he recognized the positive change that would come from passing the bill without a public option.
The most useful data point for arguably the most important policy debate from his voting record proved his ability to be pragmatic and compromise. I have no reason to believe he wouldn’t compromise on his ideal of M4A if the binary choice is no change or incremental change.
Precisely. You don't start negotiations by putting forth a pre-compromised plan. You go in with a strong, bold policy and make bare minimum concessions until it is passed.
When negotiating a salary for a new job, you don't make a low-ball offer to start with....a company will always pay you less if they can. You reach high and work your way down from there.
I had forgotten that. Thanks for the correction. So it was the two independent Senators from that session at opposite ends of the Democratic Party spectrum. One compromising and one uncompromising.
Do you think someone like Elizabeth Warren stands a better chance at doing so then? I don't really think most Congresspeople would support progressive policy just because Warren is calmer than Sanders and a registered Democrat.
This is just wrong. There are plenty of policies he had proposed that do not require anything from the legislative branch. Off the top of my head, end to the wars in the middle east, legalization of marijuana, and end to the border camps are all policies he has proposed that can be done through a combination of appointments and executive orders. He has specifically stated his plan to legalize marijuana on day 1. The president cannot do everything on his own, but he can do a great deal.
I'm curious as to why we all seem to assume that it must be a devil whispering on his shoulder and not just an intrinsic part of the guy's personality.
Because none of us has any personal experience with him personally and we can't truly know unless someone who actually has those credentials says so.
I mean, you make an inference. We don't have any way to "truly know" that his staff are serving him poorly rather than just taking their cues from their leadership either. It just seems strange that we're willing to accept that tone-at-the-top matters when we ascribe Zuckerberg's general creepiness as an explanatory factor in Facebook being a creepy company that doesn't respect people's privacy but people won't do it here.