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Authors
Bess Levin, Deanna Kizis, Jonathan Alter, Eve Batey, Keziah Weir, David Friend, Molly Jong-Fast, Kase Wickman, Caroline Rose Giuliani, Savannah Walsh, James Pogue, Richard Lawson
The absolute depravity of this rhetoric is second only to the fact that his supports (and apparently swing voters?) will not take it seriously. This election has underscored how broken not only...
The absolute depravity of this rhetoric is second only to the fact that his supports (and apparently swing voters?) will not take it seriously. This election has underscored how broken not only our political system is, but american society in general. On one hand we have serious candidates who are given the appropriate coverage, questions, critiques that any candidate should endure. On the other we have openly violent, fascistic rhetoric that is given a pass because the supporting party has a victim complex whenever they are challenged and the supports either refuse to recognize the reality of what the party is proposing or relishing that it "triggers" everyone else.
It's like watching a poker game with one player playing normal hold 'em, and the other player just making up the size of their stack and cards in hand. And it's just being treated like a normal game of poker.
A thought that I can't get out of my mind is that perhaps we are hurtling towards a fascist oppressive regime because 50% of the population doesn't have the empathy, context, worldview to actually assess the dangers of the political system they seem to espouse. Best case scenario Trump loses and fades into obscurity, his imitators try the same schtick but it fails. I'm not sure I'd bet on that right now.
I agree, and it's terrifying to me. In 2016, it was so hard to take him seriously. I think his initial success was a surprise to almost everyone, but it seems clear now that his success is rooted...
A thought that I can't get out of my mind is that perhaps we are hurtling towards a fascist oppressive regime because 50% of the population doesn't have the empathy, context, worldview to actually assess the dangers of the political system they seem to espouse. Best case scenario Trump loses and fades into obscurity, his imitators try the same schtick but it fails. I'm not sure I'd bet on that right now.
I agree, and it's terrifying to me. In 2016, it was so hard to take him seriously. I think his initial success was a surprise to almost everyone, but it seems clear now that his success is rooted in tapping in to a festering resentment in a large fraction of the population.
While I was driving yesterday, I was entertaining a fantasy about having signs printed that say, "Trump: make America racist again." Then I would take these signs and replace the ones I saw with mine. But then I realized that would only be saying the quiet part out loud, and that a large number of Trump supporters probably wouldn't care, or would only be emboldened. It seems to be what they want – a return to a white, male dominated society with minorities and women firmly "in their place".
I honestly can't understand it, except to realize that much of the story of America's greatness depends on eliding the facts of the oppression and genocide that were part of creating the America we have today (at least, this was mostly how I was taught growing up in the south). A lot of progressive stances require at the minimum acknowledging that harm and some piercing of the veil of white privilege. These are threats to an identity many people have not been forced to question, and I think we're seeing a backlash rooted in how hard it is to be forced to realize that one's success is built as much on oppression as on the "greatness" of our society.
A Democrat canvasser told me never to steal signs, and to post on social media if yours are stolen. Because the outrage of sign theft does more to rally the base than the signs themselves do. It's...
Trump supporters probably wouldn't care, or would only be emboldened.
A Democrat canvasser told me never to steal signs, and to post on social media if yours are stolen. Because the outrage of sign theft does more to rally the base than the signs themselves do.
It's a unifying force, like anger at people who don't pick up their dog's poop.
Yeah, I have seen what happens in my small town when someone posts about their Harris sign being stolen or damaged, some insane vitriol. And there are some huge Trump signs (with giant Made in...
Yeah, I have seen what happens in my small town when someone posts about their Harris sign being stolen or damaged, some insane vitriol. And there are some huge Trump signs (with giant Made in China printed American flags, yes I'm a flag snob, stitched or GTFO) in town. There's no real point. I'm not putting signs up because I don't want to add to local drama, and my immediate neighbors haven't put any up.
Maybe slapping a removable sticker on them that does that same thing would work better. The sign isn't stolen or destroyed, given them something to rally against, but the message is still sent.
Maybe slapping a removable sticker on them that does that same thing would work better. The sign isn't stolen or destroyed, given them something to rally against, but the message is still sent.
This is an absolutely disgusting turn of events. It is absolutely terrifying. Pair false claims of election meddling with the desire to imprison/kill dissenters is a great start to a dictatorship...
This is an absolutely disgusting turn of events. It is absolutely terrifying.
Pair false claims of election meddling with the desire to imprison/kill dissenters is a great start to a dictatorship and genocide.
Prefacing this: I'm not a fan of donald trump, I'm also not a fan of shitty journalism This article is quite sensationalist and they are definitely twisting his words. Luckily, they posted the...
Prefacing this: I'm not a fan of donald trump, I'm also not a fan of shitty journalism
This article is quite sensationalist and they are definitely twisting his words. Luckily, they posted the clip and we can see that he is is just suggesting that the national guard be used to keep the peace on election day.
The problem, one of the many problems, with Trump is that everyone he disagrees with is essentially a radical left lunatic. Because he said keep the peace on election day against in particular...
The problem, one of the many problems, with Trump is that everyone he disagrees with is essentially a radical left lunatic. Because he said keep the peace on election day against in particular radical left lunatics. Which is how he describes the opposing party candidate. (Among other inappropriate things).
In the same way that he vows to fight election fraud but has also said the only way he loses is fraud which means he's vowing to fight his loss. It would maybe be reasonable in the mouth of someone who doesn't regularly advocate for state violence against his opponents. That's not Trump.
Yes, naming a house representative that (glance) voted for the Iraq war and did other typical-Democrat things is obviously the radical left. Don't forget that all of his claims about fraud were...
Yes, naming a house representative that (glance) voted for the Iraq war and did other typical-Democrat things is obviously the radical left.
Don't forget that all of his claims about fraud were themselves fraudulent, or he was the one trying to fake the votes.
He's positioning himself as a "Heads I Win, Tails You Lose" candidate. And I've seen far too many "Vote Felon" signs to believe that his support among his base is waning.
He actually did admit he lost 2020–in a very offhanded, open-to-interpretation kind of way that he later walked back. One drop of contaminated water in a wide-open firehose of bullshit.
He actually did admit he lost 2020–in a very offhanded, open-to-interpretation kind of way that he later walked back. One drop of contaminated water in a wide-open firehose of bullshit.
I'm aware but he like followed it up immediately by saying it was a fraud, and has since denied losing so I don't think his heart was in that. In the aggregate, he insists he won, and this is not...
I'm aware but he like followed it up immediately by saying it was a fraud, and has since denied losing so I don't think his heart was in that. In the aggregate, he insists he won, and this is not just quirky Trump being Trump but the makings of a second coup attempt.
Oh, he's absolutely dipping his toes in that water to see if the temperature suits him. Let's hope he gets a septic toenail. I think we all knew he'd be pulling that shit again if he got the...
Oh, he's absolutely dipping his toes in that water to see if the temperature suits him. Let's hope he gets a septic toenail.
I think we all knew he'd be pulling that shit again if he got the opportunity, especially now that getting into the Oval Office again might be his best chance at staying out of prison.
We could be optimistic and speculate that he's talking this way now because he's not confident Election Day will go how he wants, but with this jagoff, who knows?
That's why I disagreed with the initial post in this thread. This article isn't twisting his words. It highlights them and says the quiet parts aloud. Prints them in black and white instead of...
That's why I disagreed with the initial post in this thread. This article isn't twisting his words. It highlights them and says the quiet parts aloud. Prints them in black and white instead of invisible ink.
I'd love to say he's flailing, and I think he's got something happening with the increasingly bizarre behavior at his rallies. But I want to scream the quiet part from the mountaintops so people will see it, not come up with excuses for him
I didn't want to give the impression I was excusing him. That wasn't my intention at all. If anything, his admission is yet more proof of his inability to keep a consistent thought in his head....
I didn't want to give the impression I was excusing him. That wasn't my intention at all. If anything, his admission is yet more proof of his inability to keep a consistent thought in his head. It's another bit of evidence that reality for him is whatever is convenient in the moment, and that he doesn't concern himself with slipping up and contradicting himself, because he'll just walk it back the next time he feels compelled to peddle bullshit.
The part you are missing is that he does this all of the time. He says things that are outrageous, and then his supporters rush in to say that he didn't mean what you heard. Can you think of any...
The part you are missing is that he does this all of the time.
He says things that are outrageous, and then his supporters rush in to say that he didn't mean what you heard. Can you think of any other politician ever where someone always has to explain what he meant?
As an adult, and someone who wants to be leader of a whole country, he has a very important responsibility to say what he means and means what he says in clear terms.
What did he mean when he called Kamala Harris "retarded"?
What did he mean when he said police should go ahead and bang suspects heads when they put them in the car.
What did he mean when he said that women let him grab them by the pussy?
What did he mean when he said that Harris supporters in at his rally shouldn't admit it because something bad may happen to them?
There is no excuse for thousands of the things he's said. He is not fit for any kind of office for this and a thousand other reasons.
That’s apples and oranges. There’s no doubt he’s not fit to be president, he seems barely functional as a human being recently. Which is precisely why you don’t need to make things up to write...
That’s apples and oranges. There’s no doubt he’s not fit to be president, he seems barely functional as a human being recently. Which is precisely why you don’t need to make things up to write scathing reporting on him.
The angle on this speech should be how everything he said is incoherent, not creating things to fear monger.
It's not incoherent to his base though, because it's all about the complete narrative. Moderate Democrats are the radical left perpetuating totally real "voter fraud." The mainstream news is lying...
It's not incoherent to his base though, because it's all about the complete narrative.
Moderate Democrats are the radical left perpetuating totally real "voter fraud."
The mainstream news is lying to you, except of course Fox News telling you "the real story."
Apparently a full 7% of the country is due to be "deported," AKA "kids in cages and other fun things ICE is known for."
Oh, and the fact he's not the president and thus has no authority to do so, but he's obviously going to try, because that's how coups work.
That's what I thought at first, too, when the first paragraph clearly broke his full quotation (which I'd already seen, though admittedly not heard) into chunks to use however they liked. But the...
That's what I thought at first, too, when the first paragraph clearly broke his full quotation (which I'd already seen, though admittedly not heard) into chunks to use however they liked. But the article goes on to make clear judgment calls, reading between the lines. One connection they're making is here:
Later in the interview, Trump said the “enemy from within” is “more dangerous than China, Russia, and all these countries,” declaring, “The thing that’s tougher to handle are these lunatics that we have inside, like Adam Schiff.”
They add to it here:
Yet in the interview, Trump appeared to be very specifically talking about Americans on the left who simply don’t support him. In addition to Trump’s name-check of Schiff, it’s important to note that Trump has for years applied the phrase “radical left” not to, say, people plotting terrorist attacks, but to the Democratic Party in general.
Maybe they're wrong about this, but personally, I rely on this kind of insight, as I have no interest in listening to all the tripe that Donald Trump has to say. I'm happy to read more about why this is poorly twisting his words (as long as I don't have to hear much of it from his own mouth), but the article as a whole offers enough evidence to further alarm me.
Trump's rhetoric is deliberately confusing, and a lot of people like to explain what he really meant. It's like the use of sarcasm online. Plausible deniability is strategic. It takes effort, but...
Trump's rhetoric is deliberately confusing, and a lot of people like to explain what he really meant. It's like the use of sarcasm online. Plausible deniability is strategic. It takes effort, but the best way to get a sense of what Trump actually means is to actually watch the video in context.
What is clear is that he habitually encourages his listeners to feel rage and fear. He also frequently calls for violence. A couple of days ago a woman heckler challenged him at Coachella and he said she should be knocked out
Keep the peace from whom, exactly? If I recall, Trump's own supporters were the source of unrest on election day during the last presidential election, and you can't honestly believe he's...
Keep the peace from whom, exactly? If I recall, Trump's own supporters were the source of unrest on election day during the last presidential election, and you can't honestly believe he's suggesting deploying the national guard against his own supporters here.
I was recently in Germany and visited the concentration camp at Dachau. It was one of the first built. I learned that the first people the Nazi party targeted were their political opponents. Mass...
I was recently in Germany and visited the concentration camp at Dachau. It was one of the first built. I learned that the first people the Nazi party targeted were their political opponents. Mass imprisonment, forced labor and death for anyone bold enough to question their authority. Donald Trump would like to take that first step.
My grandmother on my mother's side passed away a few years ago, but was still alive during Trump's first run and term as President. She lived in and eventually fled from Nazi Germany during WW2,...
My grandmother on my mother's side passed away a few years ago, but was still alive during Trump's first run and term as President. She lived in and eventually fled from Nazi Germany during WW2, and said on several occasions that Trump's rise to political power very much reminded her of Hitler's, how he's using all the same tactics and rhetoric--particularly in the way he demonizes the press and his political opponents and how it's become normalized in that he never suffers any meaningful consequences for the batshit things he says.
The absolute depravity of this rhetoric is second only to the fact that his supports (and apparently swing voters?) will not take it seriously. This election has underscored how broken not only our political system is, but american society in general. On one hand we have serious candidates who are given the appropriate coverage, questions, critiques that any candidate should endure. On the other we have openly violent, fascistic rhetoric that is given a pass because the supporting party has a victim complex whenever they are challenged and the supports either refuse to recognize the reality of what the party is proposing or relishing that it "triggers" everyone else.
It's like watching a poker game with one player playing normal hold 'em, and the other player just making up the size of their stack and cards in hand. And it's just being treated like a normal game of poker.
A thought that I can't get out of my mind is that perhaps we are hurtling towards a fascist oppressive regime because 50% of the population doesn't have the empathy, context, worldview to actually assess the dangers of the political system they seem to espouse. Best case scenario Trump loses and fades into obscurity, his imitators try the same schtick but it fails. I'm not sure I'd bet on that right now.
I agree, and it's terrifying to me. In 2016, it was so hard to take him seriously. I think his initial success was a surprise to almost everyone, but it seems clear now that his success is rooted in tapping in to a festering resentment in a large fraction of the population.
While I was driving yesterday, I was entertaining a fantasy about having signs printed that say, "Trump: make America racist again." Then I would take these signs and replace the ones I saw with mine. But then I realized that would only be saying the quiet part out loud, and that a large number of Trump supporters probably wouldn't care, or would only be emboldened. It seems to be what they want – a return to a white, male dominated society with minorities and women firmly "in their place".
I honestly can't understand it, except to realize that much of the story of America's greatness depends on eliding the facts of the oppression and genocide that were part of creating the America we have today (at least, this was mostly how I was taught growing up in the south). A lot of progressive stances require at the minimum acknowledging that harm and some piercing of the veil of white privilege. These are threats to an identity many people have not been forced to question, and I think we're seeing a backlash rooted in how hard it is to be forced to realize that one's success is built as much on oppression as on the "greatness" of our society.
A Democrat canvasser told me never to steal signs, and to post on social media if yours are stolen. Because the outrage of sign theft does more to rally the base than the signs themselves do.
It's a unifying force, like anger at people who don't pick up their dog's poop.
Yeah, I have seen what happens in my small town when someone posts about their Harris sign being stolen or damaged, some insane vitriol. And there are some huge Trump signs (with giant Made in China printed American flags, yes I'm a flag snob, stitched or GTFO) in town. There's no real point. I'm not putting signs up because I don't want to add to local drama, and my immediate neighbors haven't put any up.
Maybe slapping a removable sticker on them that does that same thing would work better. The sign isn't stolen or destroyed, given them something to rally against, but the message is still sent.
Same difference: property rights violation.
Few people like having their homes/yards intruded on, even for the smallest things.
This is an absolutely disgusting turn of events. It is absolutely terrifying.
Pair false claims of election meddling with the desire to imprison/kill dissenters is a great start to a dictatorship and genocide.
Prefacing this: I'm not a fan of donald trump, I'm also not a fan of shitty journalism
This article is quite sensationalist and they are definitely twisting his words. Luckily, they posted the clip and we can see that he is is just suggesting that the national guard be used to keep the peace on election day.
The problem, one of the many problems, with Trump is that everyone he disagrees with is essentially a radical left lunatic. Because he said keep the peace on election day against in particular radical left lunatics. Which is how he describes the opposing party candidate. (Among other inappropriate things).
In the same way that he vows to fight election fraud but has also said the only way he loses is fraud which means he's vowing to fight his loss. It would maybe be reasonable in the mouth of someone who doesn't regularly advocate for state violence against his opponents. That's not Trump.
Yes, naming a house representative that (glance) voted for the Iraq war and did other typical-Democrat things is obviously the radical left.
Don't forget that all of his claims about fraud were themselves fraudulent, or he was the one trying to fake the votes.
He's positioning himself as a "Heads I Win, Tails You Lose" candidate. And I've seen far too many "Vote Felon" signs to believe that his support among his base is waning.
Precisely, that's why this isn't just "keeping the peace on election day." He still won't admit he lost in 2020.
He actually did admit he lost 2020–in a very offhanded, open-to-interpretation kind of way that he later walked back. One drop of contaminated water in a wide-open firehose of bullshit.
I'm aware but he like followed it up immediately by saying it was a fraud, and has since denied losing so I don't think his heart was in that. In the aggregate, he insists he won, and this is not just quirky Trump being Trump but the makings of a second coup attempt.
Oh, he's absolutely dipping his toes in that water to see if the temperature suits him. Let's hope he gets a septic toenail.
I think we all knew he'd be pulling that shit again if he got the opportunity, especially now that getting into the Oval Office again might be his best chance at staying out of prison.
We could be optimistic and speculate that he's talking this way now because he's not confident Election Day will go how he wants, but with this jagoff, who knows?
That's why I disagreed with the initial post in this thread. This article isn't twisting his words. It highlights them and says the quiet parts aloud. Prints them in black and white instead of invisible ink.
I'd love to say he's flailing, and I think he's got something happening with the increasingly bizarre behavior at his rallies. But I want to scream the quiet part from the mountaintops so people will see it, not come up with excuses for him
I didn't want to give the impression I was excusing him. That wasn't my intention at all. If anything, his admission is yet more proof of his inability to keep a consistent thought in his head. It's another bit of evidence that reality for him is whatever is convenient in the moment, and that he doesn't concern himself with slipping up and contradicting himself, because he'll just walk it back the next time he feels compelled to peddle bullshit.
No no, I understand, just sharing why I think it's so important to point it all out explicitly is all.
No worries about false impressions here!
The part you are missing is that he does this all of the time.
He says things that are outrageous, and then his supporters rush in to say that he didn't mean what you heard. Can you think of any other politician ever where someone always has to explain what he meant?
As an adult, and someone who wants to be leader of a whole country, he has a very important responsibility to say what he means and means what he says in clear terms.
What did he mean when he called Kamala Harris "retarded"?
What did he mean when he said police should go ahead and bang suspects heads when they put them in the car.
What did he mean when he said that women let him grab them by the pussy?
What did he mean when he said that Harris supporters in at his rally shouldn't admit it because something bad may happen to them?
There is no excuse for thousands of the things he's said. He is not fit for any kind of office for this and a thousand other reasons.
That’s apples and oranges. There’s no doubt he’s not fit to be president, he seems barely functional as a human being recently. Which is precisely why you don’t need to make things up to write scathing reporting on him.
The angle on this speech should be how everything he said is incoherent, not creating things to fear monger.
It's not incoherent to his base though, because it's all about the complete narrative.
Moderate Democrats are the radical left perpetuating totally real "voter fraud."
The mainstream news is lying to you, except of course Fox News telling you "the real story."
Apparently a full 7% of the country is due to be "deported," AKA "kids in cages and other fun things ICE is known for."
Oh, and the fact he's not the president and thus has no authority to do so, but he's obviously going to try, because that's how coups work.
That's what I thought at first, too, when the first paragraph clearly broke his full quotation (which I'd already seen, though admittedly not heard) into chunks to use however they liked. But the article goes on to make clear judgment calls, reading between the lines. One connection they're making is here:
They add to it here:
Maybe they're wrong about this, but personally, I rely on this kind of insight, as I have no interest in listening to all the tripe that Donald Trump has to say. I'm happy to read more about why this is poorly twisting his words (as long as I don't have to hear much of it from his own mouth), but the article as a whole offers enough evidence to further alarm me.
Trump's rhetoric is deliberately confusing, and a lot of people like to explain what he really meant. It's like the use of sarcasm online. Plausible deniability is strategic. It takes effort, but the best way to get a sense of what Trump actually means is to actually watch the video in context.
What is clear is that he habitually encourages his listeners to feel rage and fear. He also frequently calls for violence. A couple of days ago a woman heckler challenged him at Coachella and he said she should be knocked out
Michael Flynn, stumping for Trump has also hinted at political executions
Keep the peace from whom, exactly? If I recall, Trump's own supporters were the source of unrest on election day during the last presidential election, and you can't honestly believe he's suggesting deploying the national guard against his own supporters here.
I was recently in Germany and visited the concentration camp at Dachau. It was one of the first built. I learned that the first people the Nazi party targeted were their political opponents. Mass imprisonment, forced labor and death for anyone bold enough to question their authority. Donald Trump would like to take that first step.
My grandmother on my mother's side passed away a few years ago, but was still alive during Trump's first run and term as President. She lived in and eventually fled from Nazi Germany during WW2, and said on several occasions that Trump's rise to political power very much reminded her of Hitler's, how he's using all the same tactics and rhetoric--particularly in the way he demonizes the press and his political opponents and how it's become normalized in that he never suffers any meaningful consequences for the batshit things he says.