112 votes

Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

72 comments

  1. [50]
    piepoter
    Link
    As they should. I just saw that r/Videos is going dark, which surprises me as most of the admins of the main subreddits are a small and 'powerful' collection of members who generally align with...

    As they should. I just saw that r/Videos is going dark, which surprises me as most of the admins of the main subreddits are a small and 'powerful' collection of members who generally align with reddit's corporate interests. I wonder how Tildes will keep up with the massive influx of users that jump ship.

    27 votes
    1. [25]
      OBLIVIATER
      Link Parent
      I'm the mod who posted the /r/videos posts. (Mod, not admin, important distinction). Most of us only mod a few subs and have no interest in reddit's corporate interests. In fact many of us are...
      • Exemplary

      I'm the mod who posted the /r/videos posts. (Mod, not admin, important distinction). Most of us only mod a few subs and have no interest in reddit's corporate interests. In fact many of us are openly frustrated with the direction reddit has been going for years now. This feels like the last straw for myself and many other moderators I know, we've been cleaning up the messes that reddit makes for over a decade now, its gotten old.

      42 votes
      1. [24]
        DMA
        Link Parent
        As someone who's 'in', do you think that a significant (enough) number of mods will leave Reddit or stop moderating in the near future for it to have an effect on the website? Obviously mods are...

        As someone who's 'in', do you think that a significant (enough) number of mods will leave Reddit or stop moderating in the near future for it to have an effect on the website? Obviously mods are essential for Reddit so there might be an impact even if the absolute number of mods who leave is small.

        I'm aware that you can't predict the future or anything, but I'm wondering what the vibe is like in the backrooms more than anything else.

        11 votes
        1. [14]
          cfabbro
          (edited )
          Link Parent
          I have handed out almost 2000 invites over the last few days on /r/tildes, and can attest to the fact that a rather staggering number of users asking for invites are doing so from 10-15+ year old...

          I have handed out almost 2000 invites over the last few days on /r/tildes, and can attest to the fact that a rather staggering number of users asking for invites are doing so from 10-15+ year old accounts, with the average probably being somewhere around 7 years old. It's still about that average after several days too... I thought it would eventually start dropping, but it hasn't. And I have also noticed that a not insignificant amount of those users are also indeed mods of rather large subreddits too. ;)

          35 votes
          1. [4]
            DMA
            Link Parent
            Heh, I'm one of those people who you gave an invite to in the last few days ;) Also worth considering that people will often switch accounts on Reddit (or at least they used to...) - I certainly...

            Heh, I'm one of those people who you gave an invite to in the last few days ;) Also worth considering that people will often switch accounts on Reddit (or at least they used to...) - I certainly didn't PM you from my oldest account.

            12 votes
            1. [3]
              cfabbro
              (edited )
              Link Parent
              Yeah, people often delete their accounts, or use alts to ask for invites... and that's one of the major reasons the account ages I'm seeing is genuinely so damn surprising. TBH, I also didn't...

              Yeah, people often delete their accounts, or use alts to ask for invites... and that's one of the major reasons the account ages I'm seeing is genuinely so damn surprising. TBH, I also didn't think that many 15+ year old accounts were even still on reddit. I deleted mine ages ago, during the last major blackout over Victoria being fired. So Reddit clearly really pissed off a lot of their oldest users this time.

              17 votes
              1. [2]
                TheCrispyDud
                Link Parent
                10 years here and yea you handed me my invite as well. It's just been one thing after another forced upon us that wasn't asked for that we had no choice but to choke down due to a lack of...

                10 years here and yea you handed me my invite as well. It's just been one thing after another forced upon us that wasn't asked for that we had no choice but to choke down due to a lack of alternatives. I think the reason so many older users are migrating is that the younger crowd just doesn't know any better. They've either only had the new stuff or the older style briefly so they're less affected by the change, it's like an Internet generational gap if that makes sense.

                12 votes
                1. cfabbro
                  (edited )
                  Link Parent
                  Yeah, I saw the writing on the wall with reddit when Victoria got fired despite being an integral part of /r/AskReddit, which is why I deleted my original account back then. But even that was only...

                  Yeah, I saw the writing on the wall with reddit when Victoria got fired despite being an integral part of /r/AskReddit, which is why I deleted my original account back then. But even that was only after years of putting up with the boneheaded decisions reddit HQ was constantly making, and their countless empty promises about the (never delivered) mod tools being improved. I lingered there in alt-form only because there was no place else to go that wasn't a total shithole filled with freeze peach warriors, bigots, and literal Nazis.

                  Once Deimos told me, about 6 years ago, he was working on a new aggregator that would keep the paradox of tolerance in mind, I jumped ship for good though. Other than occasionally stumbling on tech support answers on reddit via google, the only place I visit anymore is /r/tildes to handle the invite threads. So I totally understand the age gap thing, and your frustrations. That's part of the reason I think this new wave of users has been so well behaved here so far too. You're all just as beaten down and as tired as I was of the culture shift that's gradually taken place at reddit. You all just had a higher tolerance for the pain than I did. ;)

                  16 votes
          2. [4]
            Marukka
            Link Parent
            I've been a daily reddit user on RiF for around 12 years. I deleted the app today. I don't know why this was the final straw, but I'm just done with that site.

            I've been a daily reddit user on RiF for around 12 years. I deleted the app today. I don't know why this was the final straw, but I'm just done with that site.

            7 votes
            1. cfabbro
              Link Parent
              We all have our breaking points. This was apparently just the straw that finally broke your back. Welcome (back) to Tildes! :)

              We all have our breaking points. This was apparently just the straw that finally broke your back.

              Welcome (back) to Tildes! :)

              3 votes
            2. [2]
              Lohrun
              Link Parent
              It’s definitely going to be hard to do so for me. I end up doing a lot of searches and append “site:Reddit.com” to find what I’m looking for. And then I open all of those links in Apollo to read....

              It’s definitely going to be hard to do so for me. I end up doing a lot of searches and append “site:Reddit.com” to find what I’m looking for. And then I open all of those links in Apollo to read.

              I might delete my Reddit app as well in solidarity. Reddit is making the decision for me and everyone else on July 1st anyways. I might as well go ahead and rip the bandaid off.

              3 votes
              1. Marukka
                Link Parent
                Same. I'm going to try to set up an RSS feed for the subs I still need (programming, csMajors, cpp, python, and so on). Maybe I'll set up a web scraper? Idk. I was not planning on deleting my app...

                Same. I'm going to try to set up an RSS feed for the subs I still need (programming, csMajors, cpp, python, and so on). Maybe I'll set up a web scraper? Idk.

                I was not planning on deleting my app until July, but I was scrolling through /r/all and I became repulsed. What was I holding on to? I barely ever comment anymore, and I stopped creating content years ago. I feel oddly better.

                I'm also looking into federated communities. I really like the idea of a bunch of connected "islands" everyone can visit and interact with. Having social media concentrated to a mega corp is killing the web for me.

                3 votes
          3. [2]
            Subvocal
            Link Parent
            13 year old account checking in. Thanks for the invite, I love it over here. :)

            13 year old account checking in. Thanks for the invite, I love it over here. :)

            2 votes
          4. [3]
            wrikto
            Link Parent
            11yr account age invitee checking in. Thanks boss!

            11yr account age invitee checking in. Thanks boss!

            3 votes
            1. [2]
              cfabbro
              Link Parent
              YVW! :)

              YVW! :)

              2 votes
              1. 13th-Monkey
                Link Parent
                I feel so young again with only 9 years on my account.

                I feel so young again with only 9 years on my account.

                2 votes
        2. [4]
          OBLIVIATER
          Link Parent
          As always its difficult to tell with redditors. I only really know my team well, so I feel fairly comfortable in saying that most of them are checked out as it is. A few of us have been pretty...

          As always its difficult to tell with redditors. I only really know my team well, so I feel fairly comfortable in saying that most of them are checked out as it is. A few of us have been pretty antagonistic towards the recent changes made by the admin teams in recent years, calling them out of the factually untrue things they've claimed in announcements.

          The wider reality is less clear, there are certainly individuals who are going to leave, or at least reduce their presence on reddit after this (especially if reddit takes action against their accounts like has been threatened in the past) if this blackout doesn't work. But at the end of the day reddit is a famously addicting site, and mods are probably some of the most addicted people on the platform. I'm sure there are plenty of people who are going to continue on using the site as if nothing has changed if/when this all blows over.

          One thing is certain though, many of the moderators who have been on this site since almost the beginning are making a stand, including people who haven't participated in previous blackouts for other issues. The current list of committed subreddits is bigger than ever before and its still growing.

          (Committed subreddits: https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/1401qw5/incomplete_and_growing_list_of_participating/)

          15 votes
          1. [3]
            ChunkMcHorkle
            Link Parent
            Eh, maybe. I was a mod a few years back (different account) and honestly, beyond a quick daily browse of the news, my Reddit worldview easily and quickly shrank to just the sub I was modding. So...

            mods are probably some of the most addicted people on the platform

            Eh, maybe. I was a mod a few years back (different account) and honestly, beyond a quick daily browse of the news, my Reddit worldview easily and quickly shrank to just the sub I was modding.

            So when I left that gig, I abandoned that account and signed up to a completely different set of subs just to see if there was anything left on Reddit for me, but all in all since then my Reddit usage is a fraction of what it had been before, and part of that is because I just got tired of so much avoidable BS that Reddit admin could easily have addressed, but never did. I see it as a plain old user now, and it's just as repellent.

            To give an example, in making the API cost-inaccessible to all third party users, but without ever making good on all their promises over the years to fix the very broken accessibility issues on both the mobile app and the new desktop platform, Reddit is making the site inaccessible to the vast majority of visually impaired users AND breaking the tools of the Transcribers of Reddit. Without even blinking, apparently. It's like it never even occurred to them that they'd be kicking all the blind off Reddit, and now that they know . . . radio silence.

            I'm not visually impaired, but morally I am completely repulsed by this. And that's just one more thing on the heap.

            Add to that ALL the other crap - paid trolls, repost bots, spam, inconsistent or absent enforcement of community rules, multiple instances of open misconduct by admins, an ongoing refusal to address longstanding issues with both the platform and some of the practices, and now having third-party-dependent mod tools taken from mods, which they created on their own, elsewhere, because Reddit could not or would not - and I think many mods are actually more ready than most to just walk away. The only reason they have not done so is because they still have a love for their community and a passion for the subject they built their subs around.

            That's just my opinion as another Reddit rando, take it as such. But the odds against mods have been building for a while, both as mods and as users of the site, and this tips it, IMO.

            Even when Victoria was fired, never before have I seen this many mods openly discussing just walking away, openly saying, "If RiF [or Apollo, or Bacon, or whatever] is done, I'm done." The comments on the link you posted are one recent repository of just that sentiment, and that sub has many more. Not, "I hope they pull this back," but, "Maybe it's just time I left."

            And maybe it is.

            14 votes
            1. [2]
              Lohrun
              Link Parent
              This is something I didn’t know about until the posts about the blackout started rolling out. I’ve seen the post transcribers in the comments before but I didn’t realize that visually impaired...

              Reddit is making the site inaccessible to the vast majority of visually impaired users AND breaking the tools of the Transcribers of Reddit. Without even blinking, apparently. It's like it never even occurred to them that they'd be kicking all the blind off Reddit, and now that they know . . . radio silence.

              This is something I didn’t know about until the posts about the blackout started rolling out. I’ve seen the post transcribers in the comments before but I didn’t realize that visually impaired users and transcribers relied so hard on 3rd party apps. It makes sense thinking back on it knowing just how bad the official app and new Reddit is.

              Even if they address the API issues and keep 3rd party apps alive, imo it’s not worth staying on Reddit. Clearly their ideology has greatly shifted over the years and has only shifted further within the last few.

              I know just me leaving Reddit makes no meaningful difference but if enough users, mods, and bot owners start to leave..they’ll notice. The issue I’ve been seeing pop up in Reddit threads about the API, blackout, and Reddit alternatives is that this common comment keeps popping up: “well..there really aren’t any Reddit alternatives. There is tildes (invite only) and Lemmy (some issues here) but neither of the communities are all that active.” People want to leave and they want an alternative but they don’t see anything as a valid one.

              To be fair to Tildes and Lemmy, neither seems to really want to absorb tens of thousands of users. It would greatly disrupt their ecosystem and community. I’ve heard some rumblings on Lemmy about them completely disabling new user registration during June 12th-14th and on July 1st to avoid getting flooded with new user applications.

              Anyways sorry for the long post, just a hodge podge of thoughts about all the recent events.

              2 votes
              1. ChunkMcHorkle
                Link Parent
                Nah, keep it coming. I'm digging the long text format here. Five or six years ago, I was part of an online community that was about to lose its platform, and in searching for alternatives I recall...

                Nah, keep it coming. I'm digging the long text format here.

                Five or six years ago, I was part of an online community that was about to lose its platform, and in searching for alternatives I recall seeing an open source Reddit-like front-end that someone had developed, and all a community had to do was supply server space for it to run on. But I've been racking my brain for days and just can't recall the name. Unfortunately, I no longer have access to that gmail account where all those conversations took place, or I could just look it up. That community ended up going to a phpBB site, so it all worked out, but that Reddit-like front end was really, really good. All you need then is the back end: hosting server space, domain name, administration/maintenance, etc.

                If I ever remember, I'll let you know!

                1 vote
        3. [4]
          smithsonian
          Link Parent
          I think it absolutely will have an effect. Even if it's not the number of mods who leave reddit, the moderator morale will be severally impacted. I think we'll see a slow, steady decline in...

          I think it absolutely will have an effect. Even if it's not the number of mods who leave reddit, the moderator morale will be severally impacted.

          I think we'll see a slow, steady decline in quality on reddit. More garbage will be posted due to less motivated and experienced moderators. More spam bots and karma farming accounts succeeding.

          Not even counting moderators, there will be less activity from long-time contributors which will shift a lot of the culture. It certainly won't be enough to cause a rapid Digg-style collapse, though.

          10 votes
          1. [2]
            DMA
            Link Parent
            A slow burn and decrease in quality is how I see it too at the moment. However, Reddit's post and discussion quality have been decreasing for as long as Reddit has been around, so I'm afraid...

            A slow burn and decrease in quality is how I see it too at the moment. However, Reddit's post and discussion quality have been decreasing for as long as Reddit has been around, so I'm afraid whether the effect will be pronounced enough to make an impact on 'regular' users' experience.

            7 votes
            1. smithsonian
              Link Parent
              I think that's all dependent on the subreddit. With few exceptions, the larger the subreddit becomes, the lower the quality of posts and discussion becomes as it finds an equilibrium in the lowest...

              However, Reddit's post and discussion quality have been decreasing for as long as Reddit has been around

              I think that's all dependent on the subreddit. With few exceptions, the larger the subreddit becomes, the lower the quality of posts and discussion becomes as it finds an equilibrium in the lowest common denominator.

              I expect this will be a more pronounced effect than the gradual growth-based degradation, but it probably won't be recognizable to most users who've only been around for a few years and only follow the subs on the popular feed.

              It definitely won't have any measurable impact on the KPIs before the IPO, which is really all that matters right now; post-IPO KPIs will be someone else's problem.

              1 vote
          2. Kenny
            Link Parent
            Totally agree. It's also something that is very hard to measure so it won't be on any KPI sheets.

            Totally agree. It's also something that is very hard to measure so it won't be on any KPI sheets.

            3 votes
        4. rish
          Link Parent
          Ah! Welcome to tildes. Good to see three letter usernames are still open field.

          Ah! Welcome to tildes. Good to see three letter usernames are still open field.

          1 vote
    2. Parliament
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      I think something needs to be clarified for readers of this thread and new tildes users. Reddit admins are paid employees of the site, moderators are unpaid volunteers for specific subreddits....

      I think something needs to be clarified for readers of this thread and new tildes users. Reddit admins are paid employees of the site, moderators are unpaid volunteers for specific subreddits. Their interests often conflict. When I was a default mod up until 5 years ago, there was a somewhat working relationship with the admins, but mods were still regularly critical of them. It has always been one bad decision after another. We played nice with them to get shit done in our subs and because some admins at the lower level (like community management contacts) were decent folks, not members of executive management making all the shitty strategic decisions. Many of those admins got burnt out and moved on just like countless good moderators. That is not to say there weren't territorial power mods, but those individuals were more self-interested than they were aligning themselves with reddit corporate in my experience.

      All the mod teams use third party reddit apps, browser extensions, and custom bots to run their subreddits, and reddit does such a shitty job supporting mod teams that this creates constant friction. Every step reddit takes toward profit motives usually undercuts community management tools.

      48 votes
    3. [16]
      tsuki-no-seirei
      Link Parent
      First, we need to know if Tildes is serious about absorbing the user-base or if it wants to keep closed. Infra, dev, etc. would need to be planned for it. After all, it's massive.

      First, we need to know if Tildes is serious about absorbing the user-base or if it wants to keep closed.
      Infra, dev, etc. would need to be planned for it.

      After all, it's massive.

      12 votes
      1. [10]
        AugustusFerdinand
        Link Parent
        Deimos/Tildes has never stated it's serious about absorbing the reddit user-base and has stated time and again that this is not a reddit replacement/alternative.

        Deimos/Tildes has never stated it's serious about absorbing the reddit user-base and has stated time and again that this is not a reddit replacement/alternative.

        29 votes
        1. [9]
          geniusraunchyassman
          Link Parent
          I have a small fear that too much of the Reddit mindset will be absorbed. Reddit seemed to encourage a cycle of doom scrolling depressing content that I do not get here. Even though I'm new here,...

          I have a small fear that too much of the Reddit mindset will be absorbed.

          Reddit seemed to encourage a cycle of doom scrolling depressing content that I do not get here. Even though I'm new here, I've been happier and way less afraid to engage with others than I've been on Reddit in a long time.

          I made a post here two days ago where I made an assumption based off of incorrect information. Instead of dog-piling and downvote blasting my post, the reality of the situation was gently explained to me and I feel like I have a better grasp on the situation.

          The change and simplicity have been refreshing, and I want to see more content and diverse communities come to Tildes, but I also don't want to be followed by Reddit's dark, cynical pessimism.

          22 votes
          1. [4]
            Power0utage
            Link Parent
            I do echo that fear, but I think the rules of the site are proactive and have enough guards in place to "filter out" some of the reddit meme culture and encourage thoughtful discussion. But I also...

            I have a small fear that too much of the Reddit mindset will be absorbed.

            I do echo that fear, but I think the rules of the site are proactive and have enough guards in place to "filter out" some of the reddit meme culture and encourage thoughtful discussion.

            But I also have a separate fear that, without enough of a sustained influx of new users, activity levels may drop and create a feedback loop (less perceived activity -> less motivation to post -> even less activity -> ... -> graveyard).

            16 votes
            1. [3]
              AugustusFerdinand
              Link Parent
              Having been here awhile, there are posts that will generate a ton of comments, there are posts that will generate none. I know that many people think that interaction is required, but I'd...

              Having been here awhile, there are posts that will generate a ton of comments, there are posts that will generate none. I know that many people think that interaction is required, but I'd encourage people to adopt/accept that not everything requires discussion. A lot of the links posted anywhere on the internet don't require discussion, they're just information being shared and unless there's something wrong with the information or a personal experience that can expand on it, there isn't much reason to add commentary.

              In short, I'd ask people to understand that a lack of comments ≠ lack of interest/activity.

              24 votes
              1. MimicSquid
                Link Parent
                Yeah, there's a good number of articles where I'll read them, but I don't have anything to contribute, so I'll upvote and move on. I think of a vote in that case as "I appreciated this post," so...

                Yeah, there's a good number of articles where I'll read them, but I don't have anything to contribute, so I'll upvote and move on. I think of a vote in that case as "I appreciated this post," so that even if I don't say anything, the poster feels appreciated for going through the work of bringing something to Tildes.

                9 votes
              2. chocobean
                Link Parent
                That's a good point too - many of us have to be weaned off the karma farming addiction of seeking approval

                That's a good point too - many of us have to be weaned off the karma farming addiction of seeking approval

                3 votes
          2. [2]
            SirDeviant
            Link Parent
            Doomscrolling wasn't really a huge problem on Reddit until ~3 years ago when it started really absorbing users from traditional social media. I don't see Tildes getting that big for a long time....

            Doomscrolling wasn't really a huge problem on Reddit until ~3 years ago when it started really absorbing users from traditional social media. I don't see Tildes getting that big for a long time.

            To be clear people absolutely doomscrolled Reddit from the beginning, but I don't feel like that was a core part of the experience until at least the start of the redesign.

            7 votes
            1. WeAreWaves
              Link Parent
              Just for reference, the reddit redesign was a little over 5 years ago (spring 2018).

              Just for reference, the reddit redesign was a little over 5 years ago (spring 2018).

              3 votes
          3. [2]
            Carighan
            Link Parent
            Interesting, doesn't this depend a ton on which subreddits you subscribe to? Because I have not seen this in most subs. And I don't think I'm no longer in any that are like that.

            doom scrolling depressing content

            Interesting, doesn't this depend a ton on which subreddits you subscribe to? Because I have not seen this in most subs. And I don't think I'm no longer in any that are like that.

            3 votes
            1. BeardyHat
              Link Parent
              Anecdotally, yeah, it seems to be what you're subbed to. Most of my subs are just hobby stuff or side interests for me, so while I get some news interspersed here and there, it's largely posts and...

              Anecdotally, yeah, it seems to be what you're subbed to. Most of my subs are just hobby stuff or side interests for me, so while I get some news interspersed here and there, it's largely posts and comments that I'm having fun reading.

              2 votes
      2. [5]
        piepoter
        Link Parent
        There would definitely need to be some sort of screening. Maybe taking on specific subs? Not sure but, even though Tildes is small right now, it's a beautiful little closed garden. Would not want...

        There would definitely need to be some sort of screening. Maybe taking on specific subs? Not sure but, even though Tildes is small right now, it's a beautiful little closed garden. Would not want to destroy that with a gigantic migration of users who dont necessarily bring the site 'values'. Not sure how you would go about gatekeeping all that.

        14 votes
        1. [4]
          Omnicrola
          Link Parent
          I can't find it in the docs, but IIRC Deimos discussed at one point "shutting off the tap" if need be. The invites can be shut off/disabled for a period of time if there's too much of an influx...

          I can't find it in the docs, but IIRC Deimos discussed at one point "shutting off the tap" if need be. The invites can be shut off/disabled for a period of time if there's too much of an influx for the existing community to educate and teach norms and practices to incoming users.

          The goal with Tildes has always been slow growth, and even pausing growth if needed. We have actually grown and shrank several times (activity wise, I don't have access to actual metrics, aside from what @bauke has provided) and the site is still doing just fine. So while there's an opportunity unfolding right now with reddit seemingly shooting itself in the foot, Tildes trying to capitalize on it and maximize the number of users it can capture as they exit reddit is actually antithetical to it's goals.

          12 votes
          1. [3]
            anadem
            Link Parent
            As it happens my allocation of invites has been zeroed, perhaps to slow the influx

            invites can be shut off/disabled for a period of time

            As it happens my allocation of invites has been zeroed, perhaps to slow the influx

            1 vote
            1. [2]
              cfabbro
              Link Parent
              Nah. New users don't get invites. Deimos periodically hands them out to everyone, but I doubt he will do that until everyone who has been invited in the last few days gets more acclimatized to the...

              Nah. New users don't get invites. Deimos periodically hands them out to everyone, but I doubt he will do that until everyone who has been invited in the last few days gets more acclimatized to the place though.

              9 votes
              1. anadem
                Link Parent
                thanks for the info

                thanks for the info

                1 vote
    4. [7]
      CriticalBass
      Link Parent
      That's the one thing I don't like about reddit. The amount of subreddit's you can mod. I feel like there should be a set limit of communities you can / should moderate. I don't think it's happened...

      That's the one thing I don't like about reddit. The amount of subreddit's you can mod. I feel like there should be a set limit of communities you can / should moderate. I don't think it's happened (I'm not versed enough into "reddit politics" enough to venture a guess), but I feel like that moderating too many big communities can:

      1. Lead to becoming very power hungry, manipulative behaviors.
      2. Become too exhausting to keep up with.

      I run a Discord server with only 600 members and there's a lot to keep up with. I can't imagine how it must be for servers over the million mark...and you're managing more than three of those at a time.

      5 votes
      1. [4]
        Parliament
        Link Parent
        When I was a default mod 5 years ago, we had to leverage mods across subs because you practically needed a full stack dev who was willing to work unpaid to mod a sub with millions of users. The...

        When I was a default mod 5 years ago, we had to leverage mods across subs because you practically needed a full stack dev who was willing to work unpaid to mod a sub with millions of users. The same front-end dev did the CSS for probably hundreds of major subreddits because of how rare that type of user was, and Automoderator only exists (along with Tildes) because reddit community management is a failure. Seems like nothing has changed.

        We did encounter people who were power-hungry and did what we could to weed them out, but we often recruited mods from other big subs because it was easier to onboard someone who already used the third party apps, browser extensions, and custom bots we did. You would not believe how technically complex it is to moderate major subreddits because reddit admins do a piss-poor job of supporting mod teams with community management tools.

        26 votes
        1. [2]
          CriticalBass
          Link Parent
          As a community manager...I believe it. Thank you for sharing your experience, though. It's nice to see the perspective. This is one of the reasons why I actually don't want Tildes to get "big",...

          You would not believe how technically complex it is to moderate major subreddits because reddit admins do a piss-poor job of supporting mod teams with community management tools.

          As a community manager...I believe it.

          Thank you for sharing your experience, though. It's nice to see the perspective. This is one of the reasons why I actually don't want Tildes to get "big", ,so to speak. Activity =/= popularity and the larger a website like reddit becomes, the harder it is to manage communities and its features. reddit became too big to handle and now, in order to maintain its server costs and make a buck, are going against the grain and charging for APIs and fucking users in the process.

          8 votes
          1. Parliament
            Link Parent
            Absolutely. And that was more of the rhetorical “you” rather than “you” specifically, ha.

            Absolutely. And that was more of the rhetorical “you” rather than “you” specifically, ha.

            4 votes
        2. 10thTARDIS
          Link Parent
          I absolutely agree. I'm not a default Reddit mod, but I've been a mod of a large subreddit (>1 million users) for about ten years now. It's just easier to recruit mods who already have experience....

          I absolutely agree. I'm not a default Reddit mod, but I've been a mod of a large subreddit (>1 million users) for about ten years now. It's just easier to recruit mods who already have experience. They know what they're getting into, and they're less likely to quit after the first time somebody yells at them in modchat, or sends death threats, or doxxes you and then sends death threats...

          We definitely had a few people who wanted to be a mod just for the perceived prestige, or who had an agenda to push, but they never lasted long, and any actions they took were easily reversed.

          6 votes
      2. [2]
        millions
        Link Parent
        Yeah I saw someone earlier on a modcoord thread that moderated over 250 subreddits Nobody needs to have control over that many subreddits you’re not even gonna moderate all of them

        Yeah I saw someone earlier on a modcoord thread that moderated over 250 subreddits

        Nobody needs to have control over that many subreddits you’re not even gonna moderate all of them

        4 votes
        1. [2]
          Comment deleted by author
          Link Parent
          1. Parliament
            Link Parent
            Also we used dozens of sandbox/test/storage subs when I did the mod thing. Sometimes camped out subreddits for future expansion plans along the same theme. The subreddits moderated number can be...

            Also we used dozens of sandbox/test/storage subs when I did the mod thing. Sometimes camped out subreddits for future expansion plans along the same theme. The subreddits moderated number can be pretty misleading.

            6 votes
  2. [3]
    Humanoid
    Link
    I support the blackout and I'm happy to see some of the bigger subreddits start to take a public stance, but I'd be very surprised if the Reddit administration isn't prepared to hunker down in the...

    I support the blackout and I'm happy to see some of the bigger subreddits start to take a public stance, but I'd be very surprised if the Reddit administration isn't prepared to hunker down in the face of this backlash. I don't think they would make such an aggressive move against third-party applications unless they were committing to it as part of their corporate strategy. It's unfortunately common for businesses to alienate big segments of their clientele if it means that they can maximize profits against the ones who remain. Regardless of how this plays out, I plan on staying on Tildes as it matches my values much closer than Reddit maybe ever did.

    19 votes
    1. arghdos
      Link Parent
      You know, I had this thought in my mind that “hey, it sorta worked 5 years ago” when a bunch of the major subs (including the two defaults I modded on) went dark after Veronica was fired. But...

      I'd be very surprised if the Reddit administration isn't prepared to hunker down in the face of this backlash

      You know, I had this thought in my mind that “hey, it sorta worked 5 years ago” when a bunch of the major subs (including the two defaults I modded on) went dark after Veronica was fired. But reflecting in more detail, that quickly became (from the mod perspective) tied to frustration about the shit tooling and continual lack of support from the admins, and from the user side a weird gamergate adjacent quest to oust Ellen Pao for reasons (I may be misremembering / badly summarizing). Neither of which ended up affecting positive change in the long run.

      So, probably the right thing to do, but best of luck.

      7 votes
    2. Pudnig
      Link Parent
      To me it feels like this is "planned" from Reddit's side. My guess is that after the backlash they'll pause the API plan for a month, then come out with a cheaper one and people will be happy. And...

      To me it feels like this is "planned" from Reddit's side. My guess is that after the backlash they'll pause the API plan for a month, then come out with a cheaper one and people will be happy.

      And it's entirely possible that the "cheaper" option was their plan all along. But doing it this way makes the community happy.

      6 votes
  3. [8]
    AugustusFerdinand
    Link
    Reddit's latest response: https://www.reddit.com/r/modnews/comments/141oqn8/api_updates_questions/
    18 votes
    1. [6]
      bioemerl
      Link Parent
      They need to read the room, cancel their plans and come back with a scheme that actually works. I get that they need to make money, but the fact they want to charge app developers millions instead...

      They need to read the room, cancel their plans and come back with a scheme that actually works.

      I get that they need to make money, but the fact they want to charge app developers millions instead of trying to deal with the users themselves or target deals with only the largest app developers is crazy.

      Also it irks me to no end that reddit thinks they own people's discussions here instead of being a curator of them. Locking Internet conversations away so that AI companies can't train on them is approaching being just plain evil, and will further entrench AI as being controlled by the multi billion dollar companies.

      I want reddit to make money off the services they provide. They should do nothing more than that. My posts are still my posts, and for Reddit to charge for access to them seems deeply one sided. That sort of decision beings about the end of the internet as a platform.

      25 votes
      1. mild_takes
        Link Parent
        Based on how Reddit has handled things in the past I think it's a little beyond that at this point. It sounds like the changes that need to be made should have been worked on over the last decade....

        They need to read the room, cancel their plans and come back with a scheme that actually works.

        Based on how Reddit has handled things in the past I think it's a little beyond that at this point. It sounds like the changes that need to be made should have been worked on over the last decade. Like, on a site the size of Reddit why do all the mods require third party bots and tools to be able to run a sub?

        7 votes
      2. [3]
        Tanglebrook
        Link Parent
        What kind of timetable do you think they're on for their IPO? They've already delayed it by over a year, and I wonder if they don't have any wiggle room for further adjustments.

        They need to read the room, cancel their plans and come back with a scheme that actually works.

        What kind of timetable do you think they're on for their IPO? They've already delayed it by over a year, and I wonder if they don't have any wiggle room for further adjustments.

        5 votes
        1. smithsonian
          Link Parent
          I'm guessing we're really close. This is something they wouldn't have done sooner than they absolutely had to. I'm betting late Q4-2023 or early Q1-2024.

          I'm guessing we're really close. This is something they wouldn't have done sooner than they absolutely had to. I'm betting late Q4-2023 or early Q1-2024.

          5 votes
      3. Carighan
        Link Parent
        That is what they are doing. They are reading the room - of investors, that is. They have cancelled their plans - in favor of more money-making plans. They are using a scheme that works - to...

        They need to read the room, cancel their plans and come back with a scheme that actually works.

        That is what they are doing.

        They are reading the room - of investors, that is.
        They have cancelled their plans - in favor of more money-making plans.
        They are using a scheme that works - to increase their IPO valuation.

        It's always important to keep in mind that reddit, like all commercial sites, is a business. Not a charity. Since the service is free, the users and their content is the product. They need to increase how valuable this appears to potential buyers, so restricting the ability of third-party apps to circumvent the central ad-analysis and ad-presentation is crucial, no matter the collateral damages. Investors don't care about unusable mod-tools, they wouldn't even know what the is. They don't care. They want to know for how much money they can expect what ROI.

        4 votes
    2. ChunkMcHorkle
      Link Parent
      I hadn't seen this, but . . . god is it bad. It swerves completely around a number of legitimate complaints and give non-fixes or non-answers in return. Like they keep saying "Moderators will be...

      I hadn't seen this, but . . . god is it bad. It swerves completely around a number of legitimate complaints and give non-fixes or non-answers in return.

      Like they keep saying "Moderators will be able to see sexually-explicit content even on subreddits they don't directly moderate," but that's not the direct issue, IF it's even an issue at all. The direct issue is that without the tools built on Pushshift that allow access to REMOVED content on other subs, spotting and dealing with bad actors gets exponentially harder.

      So Reddit admin has bravely addressed a problem no mod ever had.

      And the blind are still getting kicked off.

      6 votes
  4. [4]
    atchemey
    Link
    My pitiful little subs are included. RIF or nothing!

    My pitiful little subs are included. RIF or nothing!

    15 votes
    1. [3]
      Aradon
      Link Parent
      As are mine. only 1,000 subs but will be directly effected by the changes.

      As are mine. only 1,000 subs but will be directly effected by the changes.

      4 votes
      1. [2]
        atchemey
        Link Parent
        Is it too much of a meme response to say, "apes together strong"? Because it honestly feels like that's the case.

        Is it too much of a meme response to say, "apes together strong"? Because it honestly feels like that's the case.

        2 votes
        1. Interesting
          (edited )
          Link Parent
          If you want to go full meme lord, "jannies together strong" is probably apropos of the self insult thing. In all seriousness though, there is a long history of moderators on reddit pushing and...

          If you want to go full meme lord, "jannies together strong" is probably apropos of the self insult thing.

          In all seriousness though, there is a long history of moderators on reddit pushing and forcing the platform into doing better, because reddit as a platform physically cannot exist without high quality moderation. Platforms like Facebook and (historically) Twitter have relied on expensive to develop and often faulty AI tools, and thousands of even more expensive paid human moderators; up until very recently, reddit has been able to avoid the problem entirely and moderate only on a banning subreddit scale.

          4 votes
  5. [2]
    Comment deleted by author
    Link
    1. Tanglebrook
      Link Parent
      Exactly. When The_Donald used to make a splash back on the day, it didn't do it by going dark, it did it by getting a flood of frontpage posts about their issues. On the day of the blackout, the...

      Exactly. When The_Donald used to make a splash back on the day, it didn't do it by going dark, it did it by getting a flood of frontpage posts about their issues. On the day of the blackout, the top of reddit needs to be filled with unified protest, not silence that we hope people will notice.

      7 votes
  6. Kenny
    Link
    I mod /r/design, /r/graphic_design, and a few others, and we're going to participate. And if they continue, I'm quitting reddit. You cannot charge the creators of your value to create value for...

    I mod /r/design, /r/graphic_design, and a few others, and we're going to participate. And if they continue, I'm quitting reddit. You cannot charge the creators of your value to create value for your platform. It's ridiculous.

    10 votes
  7. tomf
    Link
    I'm doing this with one of my subs (only 550k+.) A few days away from modding the one sub will be kind of... nice. I really hope this is all an over-reaction and little changes re: third party...

    I'm doing this with one of my subs (only 550k+.) A few days away from modding the one sub will be kind of... nice. I really hope this is all an over-reaction and little changes re: third party clients and the other tools.

    7 votes
  8. Bossman
    Link
    I mod a few subreddits including one that has over 600k subscribers. Trying to get the rest of my mod team on board to participate. Not solely up to me unfortunately. But I'm fully in support of...

    I mod a few subreddits including one that has over 600k subscribers. Trying to get the rest of my mod team on board to participate. Not solely up to me unfortunately. But I'm fully in support of this regardless. Insanity.

    5 votes
  9. Fin
    Link
    I've already invited a bunch of people from private communities I'm apart of on reddit. This might be tildes day in the sun

    I've already invited a bunch of people from private communities I'm apart of on reddit. This might be tildes day in the sun

    4 votes
  10. noble_pleb
    Link
    Those third party app owners can actually turn this situation into an opportunity you know. Although Reddit is a popular social network, these apps are clearly using Reddit only as a backend...

    Those third party app owners can actually turn this situation into an opportunity you know.

    Although Reddit is a popular social network, these apps are clearly using Reddit only as a backend database, albeit one which is shared by many other posters due to it's huge popularity. They should take this opportunity to build their own backend APIs instead. Until that happens, they can use one of the open source old reddit clones like Saidit and point their APIs there? A more ideal thing that could happen is that all the third party app devs come together and pool resources for hosting this backend API! That way, they get the benefits of both scaling of economies, and an increased combined userbase.

    2 votes
  11. Bullmaestro
    Link
    I was wondering why I saw a lot more activity on Tildes recently... For me Reddit's been on a massive decline over the past few years for various reasons (power mods who behave like entitied...

    I was wondering why I saw a lot more activity on Tildes recently...

    For me Reddit's been on a massive decline over the past few years for various reasons (power mods who behave like entitied assholes, shitty bug-ridden official app, widespread censorship, shadowbans, admins who can't take a stance on something until it actually hurts their bottom-line, shitloads of OnlyFans spam in my DMs and follows), and I really sincerely hope this becomes the Digg v4 moment that kills the site.

    Reddit needs a competitor that isn't a walled garden or a partisan cesspool.