18 votes

Why White people don't use White emoji: Does shame explain the disparity in the lesser use of light-skin-tone symbols in the US?

34 comments

  1. [9]
    Heichou
    (edited )
    Link
    I think this may just be a result of white people not giving a shit, put bluntly. For other races or even parts of the world, culture and pride of said culture is very important. Some wear their...

    I think this may just be a result of white people not giving a shit, put bluntly. For other races or even parts of the world, culture and pride of said culture is very important. Some wear their skin tone as a badge of honor, and that's rad. I dig that. However, as a white dude, I can't say I've ever been inclined to use any of the white skinned emojis purely because I don't care enough to put the extra second or two into holding and selecting the tone. It's not a matter of laziness, I just see no reason to do it. While the title of this article does seem to be teetering on the edge of sensationalism, it's a very interesting observation, and one I can only offer my limited perspective on. I wonder if white people just don't care as much about representation?

    38 votes
    1. icey
      Link Parent
      I reckon you've hit the nail on the head here - from what I've seen/encountered, different skin-tone emoji are often used by POC as a means by which they can express their identity through...

      I wonder if white people just don't care as much about representation?

      I reckon you've hit the nail on the head here - from what I've seen/encountered, different skin-tone emoji are often used by POC as a means by which they can express their identity through something as simple as a thumbs up or a high five. As a white person, I simply don't feel the desire to connect with others in a racial sense, presumably as my race hasn't (consciously) shaped me into the person I am today to the extent that being a POC may do, what with the shared hardships and the like which can help to mould someone into the person they are.

      18 votes
    2. [2]
      demifiend
      Link Parent
      I don't bother to use the "white emoji" for the same reason I try not to call much attention to my mostly western European ancestry in other contexts. There's a substantial population that makes a...

      I don't bother to use the "white emoji" for the same reason I try not to call much attention to my mostly western European ancestry in other contexts. There's a substantial population that makes a big deal about being white, and they're the sort of people I want nothing to do with. I'm not interested in being mistaken for a white supremacist or in making myself a convenient target for anti-white prejudice.

      15 votes
      1. Heichou
        Link Parent
        Yeah that's also in the back of my mind whenever I think about it. It's not something I need to draw attention to lol

        Yeah that's also in the back of my mind whenever I think about it. It's not something I need to draw attention to lol

        1 vote
    3. [3]
      Sahasrahla
      Link Parent
      As a white person I don't feel like I care about representation but I'm pretty sure that's because I have it. When I think of areas where I'm not well represented, such as nationality or religion,...

      I wonder if white people just don't care as much about representation?

      As a white person I don't feel like I care about representation but I'm pretty sure that's because I have it. When I think of areas where I'm not well represented, such as nationality or religion, I actually do kind of care. I roll my eyes about how in every story the hero must be American even if it's based on a true story where that wasn't true. I'm also bothered (if not necessarily offended) by seeing the same jokes and stereotypes over and over again. Go ahead and make fun of me but at least base your humour in truth and get some new material! (This is one reason I like South Park's take on Canadians: even if it doesn't always show us in the best light it's at least original and sometimes even shows some understanding of Canadian culture if you know enough to look for it.)

      7 votes
      1. cfabbro
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        *cough* Argo *cough* (am also Canadian ;) p.s. <3 South Park's piss-taking of us too. Canadian Bacon is another great example I can appreciate... but I especially love our own piss-taking of...

        I roll my eyes about how in every story the hero must be American even if it's based on a true story where that wasn't true.

        *cough* Argo *cough* (am also Canadian ;)

        p.s. <3 South Park's piss-taking of us too. Canadian Bacon is another great example I can appreciate... but I especially love our own piss-taking of ourselves, E.g. Strange Brew, Trailer Park Boys, Letterkenny, Out For A Rip (fuckin' eh right, bud!)

        3 votes
      2. Heichou
        Link Parent
        Yeah I find my eyes rolling for the same reasons as well despite being American myself haha

        Yeah I find my eyes rolling for the same reasons as well despite being American myself haha

        1 vote
    4. [2]
      alexandria
      Link Parent
      If you are represented everywhere, then of course you don't consciously think or care about representation.

      I wonder if white people just don't care as much about representation?

      If you are represented everywhere, then of course you don't consciously think or care about representation.

      1 vote
      1. Heichou
        Link Parent
        Yeah I suppose that would be the case here. I definitely see why others opt to use their skin tone for their emojis now that they have the option

        Yeah I suppose that would be the case here. I definitely see why others opt to use their skin tone for their emojis now that they have the option

  2. [2]
    Emerald_Knight
    Link
    Or maybe the answer is even simpler: The default yellow takes less effort to use, isn't associated with a particular ethnicity and is thus unable to really misrepresent someone, and is what most...

    Or maybe the answer is even simpler: The default yellow takes less effort to use, isn't associated with a particular ethnicity and is thus unable to really misrepresent someone, and is what most people have gotten used to seeing for a very long time.

    It always feels weird to deviate from long-held conventions and habits. It always feels weird when you type ":)" into a messenger and a new type of emoji shows up that you're not used to seeing. It always feels weird when anything suddenly looks different from what you're used to (which is why people tend not to like sudden, unexpected UI changes). When anything disrupts the norm, we feel discomfort. So naturally we tend not to go out of our way to intentionally disrupt the norm. We don't like change and we're lazy. It's normal human nature in action.

    Then again, I could be completely off the mark. Still, it's worth considering. There doesn't always have to be prejudice underlying this sort of discomfort.

    18 votes
    1. [2]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. Emerald_Knight
        Link Parent
        Same here. Not only do they feel wrong, but more often than not the emoji will turn out to be way, way different from what I'd intended with a simple emoticon. They're unpredictable. I don't like...

        Same here. Not only do they feel wrong, but more often than not the emoji will turn out to be way, way different from what I'd intended with a simple emoticon. They're unpredictable. I don't like that.

        3 votes
  3. [3]
    Thunder-ten-tronckh
    Link
    This strikes me as the "have your cake and eat it too" of oppression rhetoric. You desire representation, and emojis are added that give you representation. But in your words, the thing you...

    “Every time I use an emoji, I have to make a choice: Do I use a colored racemoji, and draw attention to my ethnicity (even when it's not pertinent), or do I use a default emoji, which may misrepresent me altogether?” he wrote in an email. “It’s disempowering because people of color are uniquely burdened with this choice.”

    This strikes me as the "have your cake and eat it too" of oppression rhetoric. You desire representation, and emojis are added that give you representation. But in your words, the thing you desired now disempowers you, so what is to be done?

    7 votes
    1. cfabbro
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Is it so wrong to explore the potentially negative unintended consequences of diversifying the emoji set? It's easy to dismiss that quote as "have your cake and eat it too" "oppression rhetoric"...

      Is it so wrong to explore the potentially negative unintended consequences of diversifying the emoji set?

      It's easy to dismiss that quote as "have your cake and eat it too" "oppression rhetoric" when you're coming from the position of privilege, where you have never really had to think about such things because the default choices already more-or-less accurately represent you... However when the default choices don't represent you, having to then make the following conscious decision every time you use something does seem like a potentially uncomfortable, demoralizing and degrading thought process to have to go through:

      Do I call attention to my race/gender/sexuality by explicitly choosing the emoji that accurately represents me (and suffer the potential consequences of revealing that about myself)? Or do I just swallow my pride and go with the default so as not to call attention to myself despite the fact that it misrepresents who I am (as if I am ashamed of it)?

      11 votes
    2. papasquat
      Link Parent
      I never really understood the purpose of having different colored emoji in the first place. Maybe it's different on Apple devices, which I don't use, but all of my emoji have always been yellow,...

      I never really understood the purpose of having different colored emoji in the first place. Maybe it's different on Apple devices, which I don't use, but all of my emoji have always been yellow, and barely human looking. I don't think of a white person, or even a person at all when I see them, I just see a concept. Were people interpreting the emoji as white before? Is there really a difference in messaging between a brown thumbs up and a yellow one?

      Maybe this is my privilege speaking or whatever, but the whole issue reeks of desperately, feverishly seeking a solution to a problem that never actually existed.

      2 votes
  4. knocklessmonster
    Link
    Arguably, it would be more of an Asian identity, considering many refer to Asian skin-tones as "yellow." I kinda rolled my eyes when skin tones were first introduced, because I don't think they're...

    It’s not surprising to me that people are not opting to go lighter, even if that’s closer to what their skin tone is, because they’re kind of represented by the default anyway

    Arguably, it would be more of an Asian identity, considering many refer to Asian skin-tones as "yellow."

    I kinda rolled my eyes when skin tones were first introduced, because I don't think they're at all necessary. If somebody wants to convey something where their race is actually an influencing factor, they'll just come out and say it, otherwise it's just aesthetics, and gives more work to the people who create and implement the standards for the sake of "representation". It is also a potential sticking point that could lead to politicizing an issue that would be better off not being at all political, at least in terms of identity politics, which I would also extend to most technological issues. I can sort of see the point of gendered emoji, and even then they all aren't gendered, so it doesn't really affect anything. Mostly, I see it as a way for somebody to use their race, by accident or intention, as the "other," as though it were a key part of their identity. Within the scope of the article, that may be why the lighter skin tones don't get used that much because the only people who generally seem to feel the need for strong expressions of "whiteness" are doing so at the expense of other groups.

    6 votes
  5. [4]
    Fin
    Link
    fun fact, press windows key + period and you get an emoji menu. Keep typing to try and narrow your search

    fun fact, press windows key + period and you get an emoji menu. Keep typing to try and narrow your search

    4 votes
    1. [2]
      cfabbro
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Huh, neat. Apparently that feature was added to Windows 10 in the fall Creators Update. p.s. Emojis are so weird now. The ZWJ Sequences ones especially... E.g. 🐱(cat) + zero width joiner +...

      Huh, neat. Apparently that feature was added to Windows 10 in the fall Creators Update.

      p.s. Emojis are so weird now. The ZWJ Sequences ones especially... E.g.

      🐱(cat) + zero width joiner + 👓(glasses) = 🐱‍👓 (hipster cat)
      🐱(cat) + zero width joiner + 👤(bust in silhouette) = 🐱‍👤 (ninja cat)

      3 votes
      1. Fin
        Link Parent
        👍 right on

        👍 right on

        2 votes
    2. unknown user
      Link Parent
      Also works on macOS too with ^-⌘-Space.

      Also works on macOS too with ^-⌘-Space.

      3 votes
  6. BuckeyeSundae
    Link
    Slack and discord have similar features, and I set it to default to one of the darker tones eons ago. That is about as far from my natural skin tone as it gets, because I'm so pale that some...

    Slack and discord have similar features, and I set it to default to one of the darker tones eons ago. That is about as far from my natural skin tone as it gets, because I'm so pale that some people have actually occasionally unironically asked if I'm technically albino. But I would do that because I wanted to obscure the numbers of how white the communities I'm engaged in actually are, in case there were unidentified people of color who felt awkward about self-identifying as The Only One. I figure I can't not be white, but I can make it less of a focal point for the people who aren't to identify in a way they feel is both comfortable and true to them.

    4 votes
  7. [4]
    acdw
    Link
    I actually wasn't aware that white emoji we're available; I've just been using the yellow ones as the "default". I have been trying to change them to see how it feels, but I can't figure it out!...

    I actually wasn't aware that white emoji we're available; I've just been using the yellow ones as the "default". I have been trying to change them to see how it feels, but I can't figure it out! Does anyone have any tips on changing the emoji color with Gboard?

    3 votes
    1. PaulBGD
      Link Parent
      Hold down on the emoji then drag to the color you want 👍🏻

      Hold down on the emoji then drag to the color you want 👍🏻

      3 votes
    2. [2]
      halfjew22
      Link Parent
      👍🏽👍🏼👍🏻👍👍🏾👍🏿 To change the color of emojis with the different colors available, you can just long press on the emoji character. (Sent from Gboard)

      👍🏽👍🏼👍🏻👍👍🏾👍🏿

      To change the color of emojis with the different colors available, you can just long press on the emoji character. (Sent from Gboard)

      3 votes
      1. thundergolfer
        Link Parent
        After a long Australian summer, the one on the left is basically what me (and more so my sister) look like, and we're half english half Italian. I occasionally use that left one because my skins...

        After a long Australian summer, the one on the left is basically what me (and more so my sister) look like, and we're half english half Italian. I occasionally use that left one because my skins looks like that, but I'm still white.

        Other times I'll just use whatever because it's like what Hiechou said, "whatever".

  8. zydeco
    Link
    White guy here. I can't imagine a context where it would even occur to me to claim a race, and certainly not via an emoji. In America at least, I would think that was because white is the de-facto...

    White guy here. I can't imagine a context where it would even occur to me to claim a race, and certainly not via an emoji. In America at least, I would think that was because white is the de-facto default setting, and anything else is like 'Select: (other)'.

    1 vote
  9. welly
    Link
    I actually find it odd if/when anyone does change the skin colour to white. I just think how queer to have gone out of your way to change the skin colour of an emoji to white. And for what reason?...

    I actually find it odd if/when anyone does change the skin colour to white. I just think how queer to have gone out of your way to change the skin colour of an emoji to white. And for what reason?

    The emoji is there to express a particular emotion or feeling rather than to convey an accurate depiction of your race.

    Perhaps emojis should all be a completely race neutral colour - green or blue.

    1 vote
  10. [7]
    halfjew22
    Link
    Guilty of not reading the article but commenting, I’m quite annoyed by content like this surfacing around the Internet zeitgeist. Finding another reason to write about race to get clicks is just...

    Guilty of not reading the article but commenting, I’m quite annoyed by content like this surfacing around the Internet zeitgeist.

    Finding another reason to write about race to get clicks is just not very useful.

    Quality of things that were reported began to downgrade with the 24 hour news cycle and now we’re just seeing the continuation of that with the Internet news “cycle”.

    This is something that doesn’t deserve to be written about anywhere, especially on any kind of recognizable platform, regardless of the obvious slant of such platform.

    13 votes
    1. culturedleftfoot
      Link Parent
      Is it just to get clicks though? By what metric have you judged that, if you haven't read the article? The fact that you're annoyed probably is part reason why you should read it. Usually, when...
      • Exemplary

      Is it just to get clicks though? By what metric have you judged that, if you haven't read the article? The fact that you're annoyed probably is part reason why you should read it. Usually, when you get past your immediate emotional reaction to something that you're not comfortable with, that's when you have the opportunity for growth. Not to say that everything annoys you is worth your time, but the potential is there.

      There is a lot of unpacking the American public has to do with respect to race, and while I agree that this particular aspect may not be the most significant thing in the world, there is bound to be some fluff as the boundaries and range of the discussion take shape. Still, it contributes to a larger context. The way I try to think of it is like this - not every single book about motorcycles is going to interest me, but that doesn't mean somebody else doesn't need the ones I don't. Same principle applies.

      8 votes
    2. [6]
      Comment removed by site admin
      Link Parent
      1. [5]
        Deimos
        Link Parent
        Please don't make comments like this. There's no possible way for a conversation to proceed in a reasonable direction starting from a comment like this. You write a lot of good comments, I know...

        Please don't make comments like this. There's no possible way for a conversation to proceed in a reasonable direction starting from a comment like this.

        You write a lot of good comments, I know you can disagree with them in a much better manner than this.

        9 votes
        1. [4]
          NaraVara
          Link Parent
          You are right that the tone was short, I can apologize for that. (Maybe we need a "You're not wrong Walter, you're just an asshole" tag). But It's not really about disagreement, you can't agree or...

          You are right that the tone was short, I can apologize for that. (Maybe we need a "You're not wrong Walter, you're just an asshole" tag). But It's not really about disagreement, you can't agree or disagree with someone who resents the fact that the conversation is even happening (while not even bothering to RTFA). There is just something about comments that exist solely to complain about the content people have posted that rubs me the wrong way.

          Multiple people put work into writing, editing, and publishing an article thinking it might interest people. Someone else posted this article because they found it interesting and were hoping it would be of interest to others. Maybe it will be or maybe it won't, but what would be the point in shitting on them for wanting to raise it in the first place? What does that accomplish besides demoralizing the person who posted it, especially when you do it by announcing "Your contribution is so far beneath me I'm not even going to bother reading what you sent before dismissing it out of hand" while implying that the poster is dumb for caring about it all. That's just petty "Mean Girls" stuff.

          It's one thing to say "this is off topic" or "this is racist" or even "this reads like the ravings of an unmedicated schizophrenic." Those are, at least, actual criticisms of the content and their value. But implying that someone is ignorant or stupid for being interested in a general topic at all isn't really raising a point for conversation so much as complaining that others are doing thier own thing rather than catering to your personal interests.

          14 votes
          1. [3]
            Deimos
            Link Parent
            Yeah, I agree. With the site's activity kicking up again, I've been thinking lately about writing up some more formal submitting and commenting guidelines, and one of the commenting guidelines I...

            Yeah, I agree. With the site's activity kicking up again, I've been thinking lately about writing up some more formal submitting and commenting guidelines, and one of the commenting guidelines I think about a lot is something like, "Don't post reflexive, offhand dismissals". They never add anything to a discussion, there's no value in posting "I don't care about this" (and usually implying that anyone that does care is inferior to you).

            You're also right that there isn't really a label currently that perfectly fits it, but I think that either Noise or Offtopic could be appropriate. We may also want to consider something like a "Meta" label that's for "this comment is about the topic itself (its title, etc.), not the actual content".

            8 votes
            1. [2]
              NaraVara
              Link Parent
              I was actually thinking about an appropriate tag for my own comment, kind of a rap on the knuckles to say "You're being rude" without having to bundle it with "I disagree." It might go some way...

              You're also right that there isn't really a label currently that perfectly fits it, but I think that either Noise or Offtopic could be appropriate. We may also want to consider something like a "Meta" label that's for "this comment is about the topic itself (its title, etc.), not the actual content".

              I was actually thinking about an appropriate tag for my own comment, kind of a rap on the knuckles to say "You're being rude" without having to bundle it with "I disagree." It might go some way towards encouraging people to be nice, or at least prompt them to settle down or cool off if tempers start to flare (which didn't happen here, but could happen in theory). I work with a lot of very opinionated people and spend a lot time just telling people "Hey, you're right about this but you need to be nicer about how you say it."

              On the other hand two people zinging each other can be fun, provided everyone has a thick skin about it. But you can't really manage that in a way that's constructive unless the people involved know each other well enough to be on friendly terms.

              3 votes
              1. Deimos
                Link Parent
                I think Malice might make sense for that. Calling it malicious behavior feels a little heavy, but I think it's certainly in the same direction—bad-faith/inflammatory/etc.

                I think Malice might make sense for that. Calling it malicious behavior feels a little heavy, but I think it's certainly in the same direction—bad-faith/inflammatory/etc.

                2 votes
  11. nothis
    Link
    Since all racists start their post with "I'm not racist, but", I'll just say, yes, I'm racist enough to have changed my emojis to look white because I think the Simpsons-yellow looks ugly as sin...

    Since all racists start their post with "I'm not racist, but", I'll just say, yes, I'm racist enough to have changed my emojis to look white because I think the Simpsons-yellow looks ugly as sin and I'm white.

    Sorry, but this is ridiculous.