32 votes

Topic deleted by author

11 comments

  1. [6]
    SUD0
    Link
    This resonates with me. I am pretty new to the world of FOSS and I try to use it whenever possible. I find myself wanting to give back as well, but I feel like I am not a good enough developer to...

    I shipped the first version of curl as open source since I wanted to "give back" to the open source world that had given me so much code already. I had used so much open source and I wanted to be as cool as the other open source authors.

    This resonates with me.
    I am pretty new to the world of FOSS and I try to use it whenever possible.
    I find myself wanting to give back as well, but I feel like I am not a good enough developer to contribute to a lot of the projects that I use.
    Might just be nerves though, I really should just take the time one weekend to fix a small bug on a project that I use often.

    9 votes
    1. [2]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. SUD0
        Link Parent
        I think I am still guilty of attaching my ego/self worth to what I write and worry about what others will think if I make a mistake. It would probably be better for me if I owned up to them....

        I think I am still guilty of attaching my ego/self worth to what I write and worry about what others will think if I make a mistake. It would probably be better for me if I owned up to them. Thanks for the insight.

        2 votes
    2. [2]
      cfabbro
      Link Parent
      Totally self-serving related link: https://gitlab.com/tildes/tildes ;) p.s. Great username. Coveted.

      I really should just take the time one weekend to fix a small bug on a project that I use often.

      Totally self-serving related link:
      https://gitlab.com/tildes/tildes ;)

      p.s. Great username. Coveted.

      4 votes
      1. SUD0
        Link Parent
        Thanks! Perks of hearing about this cool site early. :) I'll definitely check out that link for some low-hanging fruit.

        Thanks! Perks of hearing about this cool site early. :) I'll definitely check out that link for some low-hanging fruit.

        3 votes
    3. unknown user
      Link Parent
      There is so much to a FOSS project (or any software project, for that matter) than coding: documentations, translations, reporting bugs, testing, etc. These are just as valuable as code...

      find myself wanting to give back as well, but I feel like I am not a good enough developer to contribute to a lot of the projects that I use.

      There is so much to a FOSS project (or any software project, for that matter) than coding: documentations, translations, reporting bugs, testing, etc. These are just as valuable as code contributions themselves, and many projects are looking for it. It is a good place to start when you're still learning how to code.

      3 votes
    4. CrazyOtter
      Link Parent
      It is a very rewarding feeling to improve a project and personally I find it a good outlet for creativity. Try to make your first contribution an small one that is excellent (this standard varies...

      It is a very rewarding feeling to improve a project and personally I find it a good outlet for creativity.

      Try to make your first contribution an small one that is excellent (this standard varies by project) but don't get hung on being perfect, it's a learning process.

      2 votes
  2. [5]
    Diff
    Link
    Shame, seems to have been removed now.

    Shame, seems to have been removed now.

    3 votes
    1. cfabbro
      Link Parent
      Gotcha covered: https://web.archive.org/web/20190428171951/https://stackoverflow.com/questions/55884514/what-is-the-incentive-for-curl-to-release-the-library-for-free

      Gotcha covered:
      https://web.archive.org/web/20190428171951/https://stackoverflow.com/questions/55884514/what-is-the-incentive-for-curl-to-release-the-library-for-free

      What is the incentive for curl to release the library for free?

      Recently started using libCurl for my VC++ project and wondering, the incentive for curl creators to release the entire library for free.

      Is it purely for helping other fellow developers? This is one of the best open source libraries I've used in the recent times. (Other than Python and R programming language).

      I'm Daniel Stenberg.

      I made curl

      I founded the curl project back in 1998, I wrote the initial curl version and I created libcurl. I've written more than half of all the 24,000 commits done in the source code repository up to this point in time. I'm still the lead developer of the project. To a large extent, curl is my baby.

      I shipped the first version of curl as open source since I wanted to "give back" to the open source world that had given me so much code already. I had used so much open source and I wanted to be as cool as the other open source authors.

      Thanks to it being open source, literally thousands of people have been able to help us out over the years and have improved the products, the documentation. the web site and just about every other detail around the project. curl and libcurl would never have become the products that they are today were they not open source. The list of contributors now surpass 1900 names and currently the list grows with a few hundred names per year.

      Thanks to curl and libcurl being open source and liberally licensed, they were immediately adopted in numerous products and soon shipped by operating systems and Linux distributions everywhere thus getting a reach beyond imagination.

      Thanks to them being "everywhere", available and liberally licensed they got adopted and used everywhere and by everyone. It created a defacto transfer library standard.

      At an estimated six billion installations world wide, we can safely say that curl is the most widely used internet transfer library in the world. It simply would not have gone there had it not been open source. curl runs in billions of mobile phones, a billion Windows 10 installations, in a half a billion games and several hundred million TVs - and more.

      Should I have released it with proprietrary license instead and charged users for it? It never occured to me, and it wouldn't have worked because I would never had managed to create this kind of stellar project on my own. And projects and companies wouldn't have used it.

      Why do I still work on curl?

      Now, why do I and my fellow curl developers still continue to develop curl and give it away for free to the world?

      1. I can't speak for my fellow project team members. We all participate in this for our own reasons.
      2. I think its still the right thing to do. I'm proud of what we've accomplished and I truly want to make the world a better place and I think curl does its little part in this.
      3. There are still bugs to fix and features to add!
      4. curl is free but my time is not. I still have a job and someone still has to pay someone for me to get paid every month so that I can put food on the table for my family. I charge customers and companies to help them with curl. You too can get my help for a fee, which then indirectly helps making sure that curl continues to evolve, remain free and the kick-ass product it is.
      5. curl was my spare time project for twenty years before I started working with it full time. I've had great jobs and worked on awesome projects. I've been in a position of luxury where I could continue to work on curl on my spare time and keep shipping a quality product for free. My work on curl has given me friends, boosted my carreer and taken me to places I would not have been at otherwise.
      6. I would not do it differently if I could back and do it again.

      Am I proud of what we've done?

      Yes. So insanely much.

      But I'm not satisfied with this and I'm not just leaning back, happy with what we've done. I keep working on curl every single day, to improve, to fix bugs, to add features and to make sure curl keeps being the number one file transfer solution for the world even going forward.

      We do mistakes along the way. We make the wrong decisions and sometimes we implement things in crazy ways. But to win in the end and to conqer the world is about patience and endurance and constantly going back and reconsidering previous decisions and correcting previous mistakes. To continously iterate, polish off rough edges and gradually improve over time.

      Never give in. Never stop. Fix bugs. Add features. Iterate. To the end of time.

      For real?

      Yeah. For real.

      Do I ever get tired? Is it ever done?

      Sure I get tired at times. Working on something every day for over twenty years isn't a paved downhill road. Sometimes there are obstacles. During times things are rough. Occasionally people are just as ugly and annoying as people can be.

      But curl is my life's project and I have patience. I have thick skin and I don't give up easily. The tough times pass and most days are awesome. I get to hang out with awesome people and the reward is knowing that my code helps driving the Internet revolution everywhere is an ego boost above normal.

      curl will never be "done" and so far I think work on curl is pretty much the most fun I can imagine. Yes, I still think so even after twenty years in the driver's seat. And as long as I think its fun I intend to keep at it.

      8 votes
    2. [3]
      Deimos
      Link Parent
      Huh, that's unusual for SO to completely remove something like that. I've updated the link to point to his repost of the answer on his blog.

      Huh, that's unusual for SO to completely remove something like that. I've updated the link to point to his repost of the answer on his blog.

      6 votes
      1. [2]
        vektor
        Link Parent
        I dunno. Moderation of StackOverflow has always seemed kinda volatile to me, often locking very interesting topics with no nod as to where it actually belongs. "Well, not here." is not exactly...

        I dunno. Moderation of StackOverflow has always seemed kinda volatile to me, often locking very interesting topics with no nod as to where it actually belongs. "Well, not here." is not exactly satisfying and productive.

        Anyway, I found this if anyone is interested in the mod/meta side of things: https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/384376/are-questions-about-the-motives-of-programming-library-developers-on-topic

        6 votes
        1. unknown user
          Link Parent
          Huh... lots of masturbation and hurt egos under that question, e.g.: And then, How the bloody heck a licence is a delivery mechanism, and how is a question about licencing off topic on a...

          Huh... lots of masturbation and hurt egos under that question, e.g.:

          @CodyGray I don't believe the libCurl question is anything but fool's gold, upvoted only because curl is very popular in the programming community, and people wanted to reward the author for that contribution, not necessarily for the Stack Overflow answer as a stunning exemplar.

          And then,

          Allow me to suggest an alternate interpretation of this question. We already allow questions that inquire on the motivations for language features. So extending that to library features is hardly unreasonable.

          However, that's not really what this question is asking, is it? It's asking about the motivation for a library's license. That is essentially asking about a delivery mechanism for the library.

          How the bloody heck a licence is a delivery mechanism, and how is a question about licencing off topic on a programmers' Q&A forum, given picking a licence for your project is one of the most important decisions to make, and open-sourcing a project can easily change the whole life of it.

          SO mods are the most pedantic folks I've seen on the internet, and that'd be a good thing---maybe---if they did not fail miserably at it all the time. So many questions locked b/c they can't have a good answer, but there often is a great answer there that someone managed to add before it was locked. But then, you see questions with many dumb answers or answrs that just rephrase other answers below them, and nothing's done to them.

          5 votes