mundane_and_naive's recent activity

  1. Comment on How Hollow Knight's community crafted gibberish into a real language in ~hobbies

    mundane_and_naive
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    Amazing. On a meta note, how likely is it for a reasonably intelligible conlang to be created based on an arbitrary collection of symbols, sound bites and their corresponding context. Like, a...

    Amazing. On a meta note, how likely is it for a reasonably intelligible conlang to be created based on an arbitrary collection of symbols, sound bites and their corresponding context. Like, a functional language in action would probably have some recognizable patterns right? What are the chances that an artist's random creation, of which main concern is aesthetics, would also have enough regularity for meaning to be mapped into. In other words, what are the criteria for "translatability"?

    1 vote
  2. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #4 - What is your most "thinking outside the box", "pie in the sky", and/or "out there" idea for Tildes? in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    I think their relationship would be similar to that between 'views' and 'likes' on Youtube. Maybe there's some statistics about that which we can use to infer for our system.

    I've been thinking about a score that counts when users see a post or comment but decide not to interact with it. Would that be a better or worse metric than votes alone?

    I think their relationship would be similar to that between 'views' and 'likes' on Youtube. Maybe there's some statistics about that which we can use to infer for our system.

    2 votes
  3. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #4 - What is your most "thinking outside the box", "pie in the sky", and/or "out there" idea for Tildes? in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    Hm, that's a sensible addition, we need a way to decide how to arrange those with the same vote count after all. If so, high quality posts would probably tend to be at the top of their respective...

    Hm, that's a sensible addition, we need a way to decide how to arrange those with the same vote count after all. If so, high quality posts would probably tend to be at the top of their respective score bracket, which is a handy rule-of-thumb indeed. Though I suspect truly high quality ones would still have a somewhat intermediate negative score, since the longer they stay near the top, the more chance they has to get downvoted. So finding wouldn't be too straightforward.

    Alternatively you could sort them by number of downvotes divided by age.

    That's one way to counteract the above-mentioned effect. In this vein, a better way would be the 'best' system on Reddit, since it takes into account the stochastic nature of the vote accumulation process. The math details may need modification to account for the fact that only negative points are collected of course. I'm no statistician so I can't say what kind of difference that could lead to. I'll just assume that if the math works the way it's intended, the resulted ranking would be more or less similar to if the same list of contents were put on Reddit and sorted by its 'best' system. So sorting wise we're back to the status quo I suppose.

    The only other difference with this platform that I can think of is the type of people who enjoy it perhaps. Our system provide only tools for expressing negativity, so perhaps people participating here regularly would tend to be more negative. On the other hand, people may comment more when they want to express their approval for OP, since they cannot communicate that with votes anymore, so the overall atmosphere might be more positive, maybe.

    1 vote
  4. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #4 - What is your most "thinking outside the box", "pie in the sky", and/or "out there" idea for Tildes? in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    Job training for would-be moderators perhaps? Like 'We see that you have a good track record of tagging and labeling well. Although we're not sure if we should let you moderate all posts in our...

    Why do you favor the OP to have that power?

    Job training for would-be moderators perhaps? Like 'We see that you have a good track record of tagging and labeling well. Although we're not sure if we should let you moderate all posts in our group yet, since it's a big responsibility and quite different from the individual tasks. We can, however, let you undergo a trial period on your own submissions first, which you should be most comfortable with, to get you familiarize with the overall workflow, while we also get to see how you confront public backlash and manage personal bias.'

    3 votes
  5. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #4 - What is your most "thinking outside the box", "pie in the sky", and/or "out there" idea for Tildes? in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
    (edited )
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    Here's something fun. What if we have a platform with only downvote and no upvote, i.e. if you see something you don't like, you can vote to demote it but if you see something you like, you cannot...

    Here's something fun. What if we have a platform with only downvote and no upvote, i.e. if you see something you don't like, you can vote to demote it but if you see something you like, you cannot do anything. I wonder what kind of user behavior would proliferate there...

    For the sake of the experiment, let's say on this platform, users can create posts and downvote posts. This platform only has a frontpage with two sorting function: chronological (for content discovery) and by vote count (i.e. highest quality first). This will be the only social media platform around and no one knows any programming to make a better one. People in general are still allowed the option to not use it if they choose so over time, we expect the only stable user base left is comprised of those who engage willingly and so any patterns that arise should not be solely due to a desire to destroy the platform.

    First thing we can expect is that vote counts will always tend to go down, the top post as a consequence will have at most 0 vote. If a post have 0 vote, it's either a very high quality post or a new post. So the top of the feeds will be a mix of new and high quality posts, new being the majority (with a large enough user base, the amount of new content being created is vastly larger than the portion that has been seen and judged). Because of this, the top sections would be a pretty crappy indicator of post quality and for the most part it's probably not very different from the chronological sort. A casual user would default to either sorting option and their experience would probably be largely unaffected.

    That said, a dedicated user would still be able to discern the high quality ones, by comparing the two list and see which top posts appear in the voted sort but not the chronological sort. This is somewhat easier than having to browse through the whole list chronologically but still require some effort, so we can expect the majority of the user base would not do this. This is different from normal platform where high quality posts are promoted and thus gain lots of visibility and activity.

    On the other hand, the more heavily downvoted posts further down is very likely to be truly low quality, since these are the posts that only dedicated users who bother to scroll further down can see, and then they're still triggered enough to continue downvoting them. I expect the situation here to not be much different from conventional voting scheme.

    In conclusion, by implementing only downvote but not upvote mechanics, we have managed to create a platform that functions like a traditional forum for casual users, a way to allow dedicated users to find and interact with high quality posts somewhat easily, keep niche content from being too exposed (thus avoid an Eternal September type scenario), while still intolerant enough to push disruptive behavior into oblivion.

    3 votes
  6. Comment on What are the genres in tabletop games? in ~games.tabletop

    mundane_and_naive
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    I was just curious is all, since my gaming experience is mostly with video games and occasional card games with friends when we go on a trip or something. So I wanted to have a bit more general...

    why you are asking this question.

    I was just curious is all, since my gaming experience is mostly with video games and occasional card games with friends when we go on a trip or something. So I wanted to have a bit more general understanding of tabletop games as a whole and maybe explore a few.

    4 votes
  7. Comment on Proposal: Community Sourcing in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    A somewhat easier-to-implement fix that can partly fulfill your suggestion (a platform level feature to provide sources without disrupting the flow of dialogue) is to have a [citation needed]...

    A somewhat easier-to-implement fix that can partly fulfill your suggestion (a platform level feature to provide sources without disrupting the flow of dialogue) is to have a [citation needed] comment label and have it be displayed clearly and visibly next to the comment after a certain number of people apply it.

    What this does is that it communicates to the public that enough people have called into question the legitimacy of the claim that an "official" stamp is in place, and the fact that it's highly visible make sure that people's first impression upon reading it would be skepticism, which should diminish its likelihood to be internalized into the public consciousness.

    Once the label is triggered, the comment's author may be notified and they may decide to edit their comment with additional sources on their own terms. After all, the burden of proof is on them to defend their claim. Say you're casually browsing you see a comment labeled [citation needed] with no source provided, you'd know not to take what they say seriously. On the other hand, what they choose to use as sources will also tell you a lot about its legitimacy.

    At some point later on, a trust-worthy mod may go around checking all labeled comment and decide whether the sources provided are sufficient. If yes, they may remove the label, if no, they may leave it. Either way, the function of the label has been fulfilled and this step is just for formality. Good to carry out, but still fine if not.

    The nice thing about this setup is that no complex system is required since its effect is mostly psychological. It sort of just formalize a process that already happen naturally in the wild: 1st user makes a claim, 2nd user demand source several replies lower, maybe several rounds of back and forth later that 1st users finally provide sources. At that point, the comment chain is already too deep that most viewers wouldn't see it, all they remember is the original comment that may or may not be true. Now, the whole process is compressed within the original comment, where there's most visibility.

    2 votes
  8. Comment on Hong Kong Government Withdraws Extradition Bill, A Key Demand Of Protesters in ~news

    mundane_and_naive
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    From what I see in r/HongKong, public opinions is that 1. this is too little too late and they will continue to protest until all 5 demands are met, 2. the bill still hasn't been withdrawn yet,...

    From what I see in r/HongKong, public opinions is that 1. this is too little too late and they will continue to protest until all 5 demands are met, 2. the bill still hasn't been withdrawn yet, all she said is that they are going to once the Legislative Council resume meeting in October, the meeting which said bill could also be passed. So this announcement may be meant to buy time.

    10 votes
  9. Comment on Hong Kong police families call for independent inquiry into protest clashes (translation of the demonstration's speakers in comments) in ~news

    mundane_and_naive
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    Considering the escalating violence happened later that same day, that path is going to be rocky.

    Considering the escalating violence happened later that same day, that path is going to be rocky.

    1 vote
  10. Comment on Cryptic, allusive messages from Hong Kong's wealthiest tycoon. No sooner had Li Ka-shing's ad been published than sharp netizens began to see that it contained an artfully constructed hidden message. in ~news

    mundane_and_naive
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    Quite unfortunate that it was quickly taken down within the day but at least it was able to reach 1.95 million people.

    The hashtag #LiKa-shingSpeakingOut was one of the most searched-for phrases on Weibo, China’s Twitter, with about 1.95 million searches by about 1pm on Friday. By the afternoon though, the hashtag was no longer available for searches on the social network

    Quite unfortunate that it was quickly taken down within the day but at least it was able to reach 1.95 million people.

    1 vote
  11. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #3 - Argument de-escalation and disengagement brainstorming session in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    People always have the power to stop themselves from escalating by just not replying anymore. If the back-and-forth reach a stage where neither do so means that any mechanics we implement for them...

    Do we have an [agree to disagree] button that, once used by either party, terminates the exchange and any future notifications caused by the two parties in that part of the thread?

    People always have the power to stop themselves from escalating by just not replying anymore. If the back-and-forth reach a stage where neither do so means that any mechanics we implement for them wouldn't get touched by either. So, intervention needs to come from a third party.

    The easiest way is probably to just have a dedicated mod position whose sole job is diffusing argument. They can send "official" warning in the form of whisper comment, or removing the reply button on specific comments or comment chains that tend to get aflame, or more. Of course this person need to have a solid reputation among the community for it to work but that will probably be the job for the much anticipated trust system.

    2 votes
  12. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #3 - Argument de-escalation and disengagement brainstorming session in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    Like your 1 and 2, you express the same thoughts I have better than I could. Number 3 could get annoying though, it feels like those censorship policies for swear words that not only aren't...

    Like your 1 and 2, you express the same thoughts I have better than I could.

    Number 3 could get annoying though, it feels like those censorship policies for swear words that not only aren't effective at stopping people from using them (since they just use the bastardization versions of the words to get around) but also become grounds for mockery and distraction. This could then backfire as being annoyed is like a step closer to being angry, which we don't want. Rules are only as good as guidelines and punishments are only corrective measures. If we want to be preventive, we need ways to calm people down and keep everyone in a good mood. Although how to do so in the form of a mechanics on a social media platform, I have no idea. Maybe awarding people with "civil points" or something idk.

    5 votes
  13. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #3 - Argument de-escalation and disengagement brainstorming session in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    I'm in favor of pretty much all suggestions here, especially the bickering label, as far as de-escalation is concerned. I also think there's room to explore more fine-grained options for our...

    I'm in favor of pretty much all suggestions here, especially the bickering label, as far as de-escalation is concerned. I also think there's room to explore more fine-grained options for our punishment system instead of just locking an entire thread for everyone (which is warranted only when the thread is sensitive enough that it affect pretty much everyone) or banning a user from the whole site (either temporary or permanently, which is sensible if the person display consistent misdemeanors).

    More frequently, bickering happens between a few people over a specific issue and it may only arise circumstantially due to a commenter's poor choice of words or whatever. So I think smaller-scale actions that are applied more frequently but narrowly may be more effective to prevent an argument from gaining enough momentum to reach ban-worthy level of toxicity, while also not to affect the flow of discussions, as well as the person's ability to participate in other threads if they largely remain civil. Maybe something like stopping a user from commenting for different amounts of time (minutes, hours, days...) and apply it with different degrees of locality (only the comment chain that the bickering is going on, the thread that they're picking a fight with everyone in, group-wide or site-wide for recurring behaviors).

    5 votes
  14. Comment on ADLaM: How a new alphabet is helping an ancient people write its own future in ~humanities

    mundane_and_naive
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    I think there's value in having a custom script for your language rather than adopting an existing one, value that's more than just inspiring people to learn. One is avoiding confusion whenever a...

    I think there's value in having a custom script for your language rather than adopting an existing one, value that's more than just inspiring people to learn. One is avoiding confusion whenever a foreign character is re-purposed for a special sound. Instead of learning that a character like "a" is used to pronounce this sound in French but that sound in ADLaM, they will instead learn that "a" is used to pronounce this sound and "#" is used to pronounce that sound. No confusion.

    Another possible benefit is how easy it would be to pick up. Consider the method they used to come up with their script:

    When one of them called stop they’d open their eyes, choose the shapes they liked and decide what sound of the language they matched best.

    So it seems that there's a certain level of intuitiveness in how their script looks and the sound it's suppose to represent. If you adopt another alphabet, everything would just seem arbitrary and hard to memorize.

    It's like programming languages, technically you can write every programs in C right? Why bother coming up with different languages for different purposes.

    3 votes
  15. Comment on Taiwan can win a war with China in ~misc

    mundane_and_naive
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    It's interesting that nowadays it's easier to defend than to attack. Seems to go against the old adage that "the best defense is a good offense".

    Costs favor the defense: It is much cheaper to build a ship-killing missile than it is to build a ship.

    It's interesting that nowadays it's easier to defend than to attack. Seems to go against the old adage that "the best defense is a good offense".

    1 vote
  16. Comment on What are your unpopular anime opinions? in ~anime

    mundane_and_naive
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    Reminds me of the first time I watched Breaking Bad, I thought the inciting incident was kind of weird: man has cancer and decides to make meth to cover the cost. Like, what's so bad about cancer...

    ... so it's just not quite going to work as well when viewed by people from other cultures.

    Reminds me of the first time I watched Breaking Bad, I thought the inciting incident was kind of weird: man has cancer and decides to make meth to cover the cost. Like, what's so bad about cancer treatment that you cannot find more feasible ways to raise money for it? Of course after I know more about how insane American healthcare system is that I appreciate the plot device more.

    5 votes
  17. Comment on The Fragmentation of Truth in ~news

    mundane_and_naive
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    Anyone can help me understand what the author is referring to here? I'm quite ignorant on economics and history in general.

    Major tech, however, was designed as a response to the takeover culture of the 1980s. That’s one of the reasons you see these controls over stocks, these attempts to not let hedge funds and private equity gain control.

    Anyone can help me understand what the author is referring to here? I'm quite ignorant on economics and history in general.

    1 vote
  18. Comment on Unofficial Weekly Discussion #2 - Topic tag system brainstorming session in ~tildes

    mundane_and_naive
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    Yeah you're right. I've just tried again, if I click on the tag while in the group in returns only results in the group, but if I click on the tag while on the frontpage then it returns results...

    Yeah you're right. I've just tried again, if I click on the tag while in the group in returns only results in the group, but if I click on the tag while on the frontpage then it returns results site-wide.

    Hm, if I'm currently in reading a post and wants to check its tag site-wide, I'd have to go back to the frontpage and type that tag into search then.

    2 votes