AlphaOC's recent activity
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentI'm using firefox. I thought it would just grab my password and whatnot, but apparently it didn't. So, failure case #1. Edit Notably, I let firefox grab pretty much all my passwords, safe or not....I'm using firefox. I thought it would just grab my password and whatnot, but apparently it didn't. So, failure case #1.
Edit Notably, I let firefox grab pretty much all my passwords, safe or not. I wont lie, i'm more convenience over security, so when convenience fails, I get a bit puzzled.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentA matter of perspective. I was only invited a few days ago, had an issue and then made a post. Other members have laid out their own opinion along these lines. My opinion, the site is new enough...A matter of perspective. I was only invited a few days ago, had an issue and then made a post. Other members have laid out their own opinion along these lines.
My opinion, the site is new enough that the title should be self descriptive. What else would I be talking about but this site? Later on, I would agree with you, because that would no longer be the case. Context is king.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentFair, I might not have read your comment as thoroughly as I should have. I think it's obvious people should use password managers more, but unless people are forced they wont. I'll admit, I don't....Fair, I might not have read your comment as thoroughly as I should have. I think it's obvious people should use password managers more, but unless people are forced they wont. I'll admit, I don't. I'm lazy. Depression may be a part of that, but i'm not saying that for sympathy, just an answer to why many people who are aware of the problem may not fix it.
Writing down passwords isn't the worst solution, but it's still not a great one and it's the one the site is forcing us into. I'm not sure there's a better solution, which is the uncertainty written into my original post. The post, at least, has generated some good, civil discussion about the matter.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentWell unfortunately, we live in the Eternal September. We have to deal with everyone, not just the people we want to deal with.Well unfortunately, we live in the Eternal September. We have to deal with everyone, not just the people we want to deal with.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentI'm not arguing that there are more convenient ways of managing this nonsense, but those ways may not be apparent to the average user. I made up a password and I honestly mostly forgot it after...I'm not arguing that there are more convenient ways of managing this nonsense, but those ways may not be apparent to the average user. I made up a password and I honestly mostly forgot it after having registered it. It's still something I remembered, but I didn't write it down. Firefox normally saves this nonsense for me, but in this case it didn't. I was able to run through all the iterations I thought it could be, and finally found it out.
Maybe the average user would write it down, but what for anyone else? I'm not trying to be obtuse. I didn't write it down because I thought i'd remember it, and then woops. My grace is that I was able to work it out and if I hadn't, I had at least entered my email before the last time I signed out so I could recover it. I may be dumb, but can you deny that about the average computer user? When designing a system, you need to consider the least intelligent people who will be using it.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentFollow it to its logical conclusion. How many sites does a user view? How many unique passwords? A password manager might mitigate that, but how many users would actually go that route? How many...Follow it to its logical conclusion. How many sites does a user view? How many unique passwords? A password manager might mitigate that, but how many users would actually go that route? How many post-it notes do I need to paste to my computer to remember all the unique passwords I should have?
You may see it as just "the cost of doing business" but that may not be the way the average user sees it. It's "what is" vs "what should be".
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentIn theory people would use password managers, but we shouldn't be talking about security. We should be talking about humans. The users are humans. We may want them to be perfect users but we both...In theory people would use password managers, but we shouldn't be talking about security. We should be talking about humans. The users are humans. We may want them to be perfect users but we both know that they are not. We may want to turn them into perfect users and shit on them when they're not. Hopefully, we both know that regardless of how much we do that, we can't fix human nature. Users aren't going to do all the things we want them to and we should plan accordingly.
That's not to say I disagree with what you think people should and perhaps rightly do. It's just that I don't think that's how actually people will act.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentSorry, i'm not a trained in debate or philosophy. I try to formulate the most rational arguments I can and try to leave little to no interpretation otherwise. But, obviously, i'm not there yet....Sorry, i'm not a trained in debate or philosophy. I try to formulate the most rational arguments I can and try to leave little to no interpretation otherwise. But, obviously, i'm not there yet. This is not a condescending point. Arguing on the internet for years, I try to make myself as clear as I can. That said, it's difficult. Thanks for your understanding.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC (edited )Link ParentThanks. I wont disagree with you for providing first hand information. The current system is inconvenient, but since you provided legitimate, first hand information, i'm willing to accept that...Thanks. I wont disagree with you for providing first hand information. The current system is inconvenient, but since you provided legitimate, first hand information, i'm willing to accept that there is a reason for it. It might be worth explaining to new users the reason why things are the way they are in a bit more verbose way than is done on the new user registration pages.
Saw your post (edited 47 seconds ago)
I didn't notice anything different, but nice to know you care? <3
Edit 2: still not sure what you changed, because it all looks the same to me but: 7 hours, 15 minutes ago
(edited 18 minutes ago)It's nice to see site admins that are on top of stuff? That said, might I suggest some sort of wiki bit? Like, when a post gets edited, let us read the changes. Some are obviously benign (spelling) but some will be changing the dialogue.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentYes, that's a solution, but a solution I had to look for. What of all the other users who come after me, who don't know to look for such a solution? Do you want to ask new users to logout and back...Yes, that's a solution, but a solution I had to look for. What of all the other users who come after me, who don't know to look for such a solution? Do you want to ask new users to logout and back in as part of the new user registration system?
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentPassword managers are above the likes of the average user. At best they allow the browser to save their password. Then what? As I said, usability vs security. What do we gain vs what we lose?Password managers are above the likes of the average user. At best they allow the browser to save their password. Then what? As I said, usability vs security. What do we gain vs what we lose?
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentYeah, but then what? Is every user expected to use a password manager? What are your expectations of the average user? For me, I look at the lowest common denominator. I would like to envision...Yeah, but then what? Is every user expected to use a password manager? What are your expectations of the average user? For me, I look at the lowest common denominator. I would like to envision myself as more than that. That would mean that there are a lot of people who use the system that would have problems at least as much as I have.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentI don't disagree with what you're saying, but requiring new (possibly unique) passwords may open people up to other security threats. Just asking people if they want to use a password that is...I don't disagree with what you're saying, but requiring new (possibly unique) passwords may open people up to other security threats. Just asking people if they want to use a password that is known to be vulnerable is one thing. Requiring people to use a different password is another. I'm probably going to have to write the password for this down, because all my others are on the list. That list is going to expand. I can't remember all the passwords. There are external solutions, like password managers, but that isn't a solution for the average user.
There's the ideal, "IT" solution, and the one that includes the human factor. I'm not sure the solution we have is the one that deals with that.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentSaw your edit, thanks for your honesty <3Saw your edit, thanks for your honesty <3
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentAre there not other ways to control that? If an account is suddenly accessed from another IP, could that not trigger a flag? I mean there's issues of course, with vpns and the like, but it's not...Are there not other ways to control that? If an account is suddenly accessed from another IP, could that not trigger a flag? I mean there's issues of course, with vpns and the like, but it's not like other solutions don't exist. Google shits on me nearly every time I try to access my mail from somewhere new.
And i'm not trying to deny the serious problem of spam and manipulator accounts. I bleed with you. I'm just not sure if what we have is best. I said in the original post, I may be wrong, but I am willing to be convinced one way or the other.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentYou may be right about that. As I said at the end, I think it's a point to debate. I'm not sure what the goal of the people who run the site is regarding security.You may be right about that. As I said at the end, I think it's a point to debate. I'm not sure what the goal of the people who run the site is regarding security.
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Comment on Passwords in ~talk
AlphaOC Link ParentHonest answer, I use that extensively. However, the password I signed up with wasn't saved automatically and I basically had to burn through a lot of iterations until I arrived at the correct one...Honest answer, I use that extensively. However, the password I signed up with wasn't saved automatically and I basically had to burn through a lot of iterations until I arrived at the correct one in order to log in and make this post. I was pretty close to having to use the password retrieval system because I had to use a password I almost never use.
Again, usability vs security.
Anyone who recognizes that reference is cool. That said, You may "get" it but i'm not sure you "grok" it. Look at your own comment from the lense a "September" user. You didn't know that I was in the know when you made your comment, you assumed. I understand you, but will other, less 'in the know' users be able to?