TBH I think it's time we talk about how we view foreign engineers. I think people making $9 an hour to make mission critical software are exploited, and I definitely would prefer they make more,...
TBH I think it's time we talk about how we view foreign engineers. I think people making $9 an hour to make mission critical software are exploited, and I definitely would prefer they make more, but I think a lot of the outrage is simply anti Indian racism. I see it a ton in tech, sure most of the shitty bottom of the barrel contractors are fresh from India, but the hatred runs deeper. I think tech really has a problem with India.
The reason I bring this up is because I think this whole fiasco is a scapegoat. The software worked, and did what it was supposed to do. It seems to me that the entire problem was on the design side, but now we can feel good about our American designers and blame it on Indian engineers.
I think it could be similar to the "build-a-wall" mentality that other rural Americans have. But I think it feels deep because there is a fundamental language barrier. In the book, Born a Crime,...
I think it could be similar to the "build-a-wall" mentality that other rural Americans have.
But I think it feels deep because there is a fundamental language barrier. In the book, Born a Crime, Trevor tells a story about how speaking the same language would disarm a person and establish trust. WIth the many tribes in Africa, there is something like 10+ languages, and Trevor spoke 7 or so (IIRC). One day a group of guys walks up to him to mug him. He knew they wanted to mug him because he understood them discussing it in their language...that he too could speak. When the guys came up to him and greeted the guys in their native tongue, they immediately changed course and chatted a while and let him be. They explained that their intention was to mug a non-speaker of their tongue and that they did not know he was one of them. Sure he was not part of their tribe, but speaking the language instantly converted Trevor from foe to friend.
I too have seen this personally as an Asian American. My mother still waxes on about how there was an expensive Caucasian lawyer that she once spoke too, but upon answering the phone, the lawyer talked in perfect Korean. I made life long friends with all the international Korean students due to my fluent Korean, while other Korean Americans did not develop strong relationships at all.
In my tech circles, every day, I see frustrations because of the difficulty in communicating because of the accents. I see this even amongst blue-eyed, blond Caucasian people from the west (Cali) and north-east (NY) going south (TN) and being repugnant of the southern accent. I think Asians seem to get along better as a lot of American born Asians can sound indistinguishable from their Caucasian counterparts, while it seems that the Indians in America are seem to skew as 1st gen immigrants. FOBs (Fresh-off-the-boat)
Accents are like the holy wars of code syntax: tabs versus spaces, opening curly bracket lined up with closing curly? White space at the end of a line? We have all sorts of weird stereotypes like european accents are hot, australian accents are goofy, etc. I'd imagine that in another generation or two where American Indians don't have accents leading to difficulty in communicating, much of this hate will likely dissipate. We have other Indians like Hasan Minaj and Aziz Ansari who have made it, but.... they sound a LOT more white than they do Indian.
As far as the software being the scapegoat, it's like what Lex Luthor in Smallville said, "Clark, there's plenty of blame to go around"
I think its mostly a bias against outsourced workers, which tend to be almost always in India. The only reason you would outsource a job is to get it done at the absolute cheapest price ever so...
I think its mostly a bias against outsourced workers, which tend to be almost always in India. The only reason you would outsource a job is to get it done at the absolute cheapest price ever so all outsourced workers are the bottom of the barrel lowest price you can get. All the talented Indian programmers either do not work in these code sweatshops or have moved to another country to work.
I haven't seen any bias against Indians working in Australia and the one I work with is a more skilled programmer than me.
The title is a bit misleading. The article in-depth really goes on about how Boeing sacrificed just about everything possible to rubber stamp the plane at the lowest cost possible, pointing out...
The title is a bit misleading. The article in-depth really goes on about how Boeing sacrificed just about everything possible to rubber stamp the plane at the lowest cost possible, pointing out that outsourcing the inexpensive programmers was one of those missteps alongside other cost cutting measures. In reality, HCL, the company agreed to not take up-front payment and rather do a revenue sharing deal once the plane was bringing in revenue from being sold.
I wouldn’t trust engineers making $9 per hour to build static websites for me. This is a catastrophe.
TBH I think it's time we talk about how we view foreign engineers. I think people making $9 an hour to make mission critical software are exploited, and I definitely would prefer they make more, but I think a lot of the outrage is simply anti Indian racism. I see it a ton in tech, sure most of the shitty bottom of the barrel contractors are fresh from India, but the hatred runs deeper. I think tech really has a problem with India.
The reason I bring this up is because I think this whole fiasco is a scapegoat. The software worked, and did what it was supposed to do. It seems to me that the entire problem was on the design side, but now we can feel good about our American designers and blame it on Indian engineers.
I think it could be similar to the "build-a-wall" mentality that other rural Americans have.
But I think it feels deep because there is a fundamental language barrier. In the book, Born a Crime, Trevor tells a story about how speaking the same language would disarm a person and establish trust. WIth the many tribes in Africa, there is something like 10+ languages, and Trevor spoke 7 or so (IIRC). One day a group of guys walks up to him to mug him. He knew they wanted to mug him because he understood them discussing it in their language...that he too could speak. When the guys came up to him and greeted the guys in their native tongue, they immediately changed course and chatted a while and let him be. They explained that their intention was to mug a non-speaker of their tongue and that they did not know he was one of them. Sure he was not part of their tribe, but speaking the language instantly converted Trevor from foe to friend.
I too have seen this personally as an Asian American. My mother still waxes on about how there was an expensive Caucasian lawyer that she once spoke too, but upon answering the phone, the lawyer talked in perfect Korean. I made life long friends with all the international Korean students due to my fluent Korean, while other Korean Americans did not develop strong relationships at all.
In my tech circles, every day, I see frustrations because of the difficulty in communicating because of the accents. I see this even amongst blue-eyed, blond Caucasian people from the west (Cali) and north-east (NY) going south (TN) and being repugnant of the southern accent. I think Asians seem to get along better as a lot of American born Asians can sound indistinguishable from their Caucasian counterparts, while it seems that the Indians in America are seem to skew as 1st gen immigrants. FOBs (Fresh-off-the-boat)
Accents are like the holy wars of code syntax: tabs versus spaces, opening curly bracket lined up with closing curly? White space at the end of a line? We have all sorts of weird stereotypes like european accents are hot, australian accents are goofy, etc. I'd imagine that in another generation or two where American Indians don't have accents leading to difficulty in communicating, much of this hate will likely dissipate. We have other Indians like Hasan Minaj and Aziz Ansari who have made it, but.... they sound a LOT more white than they do Indian.
As far as the software being the scapegoat, it's like what Lex Luthor in Smallville said, "Clark, there's plenty of blame to go around"
I think its mostly a bias against outsourced workers, which tend to be almost always in India. The only reason you would outsource a job is to get it done at the absolute cheapest price ever so all outsourced workers are the bottom of the barrel lowest price you can get. All the talented Indian programmers either do not work in these code sweatshops or have moved to another country to work.
I haven't seen any bias against Indians working in Australia and the one I work with is a more skilled programmer than me.
I definitely see anti-indian racism against immigrants on the West Coast USA
The title is a bit misleading. The article in-depth really goes on about how Boeing sacrificed just about everything possible to rubber stamp the plane at the lowest cost possible, pointing out that outsourcing the inexpensive programmers was one of those missteps alongside other cost cutting measures. In reality, HCL, the company agreed to not take up-front payment and rather do a revenue sharing deal once the plane was bringing in revenue from being sold.
I've personally had dealings with HCL, and they're an all around nightmare.