unai's recent activity
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai Yes, it is. What would I be arguing about otherwise?Yes, it is. What would I be arguing about otherwise?
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai Aesthetics before usability and user growth, then. I can't see how. But anyway, isn't that what alphas are for? That a solution, but still seems like a workaround that users would have to learn....The reason to keep it is that its the name of the website
Aesthetics before usability and user growth, then.
and would be incredibly hard to change
I can't see how. But anyway, isn't that what alphas are for?
I think @Eva had a wonderful solution
That a solution, but still seems like a workaround that users would have to learn.
I'm not dumb, I can see how tied up the character is with the brand, I just don't think that should be a reason to keep it.
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Comment on Any good alternatives to imgur? in ~tech
unai Sadly, there isn't. I mean, there are a bunch of sites that work mostly the same, but if I want to kinda know the image will be there six months from now, I trust imgur more than any other...Sadly, there isn't. I mean, there are a bunch of sites that work mostly the same, but if I want to kinda know the image will be there six months from now, I trust imgur more than any other pet-project alternative. And I'd be happy with imgur if not for that update they made where .jpg links now redirect to their site. But then again, I don't see how such a service can actually exist, economically.
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Comment on Besides some of the good things like game compatibility and enterprise, what are some things you like about Windows 10? in ~tech
unai Two things I think most people just get used to and forget they were not there before. Scrolling on any non-active window, and changing the sound playback device by just clicking the volume icon.Two things I think most people just get used to and forget they were not there before. Scrolling on any non-active window, and changing the sound playback device by just clicking the volume icon.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai That still depends on the mobile keyboard layout, and I still think that we're dancing around the issue just to keep the character for aesthetic reasons, while there are many other characters that...That still depends on the mobile keyboard layout, and I still think that we're dancing around the issue just to keep the character for aesthetic reasons, while there are many other characters that could work just as well and exist on (almost) every keyboard, like @, #, etc. In all this thread I haven't heard a single reason to keep it besides avoiding any change on a site that's still in alpha.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai Because that's not the same in any way. You can speak many languages, but every single keyboard you can buy in a given country comes with that country's layout. You can't just switch that. I don't...Honestly, if the rest of the world has accepted English as the de facto language of the Internet (and I'm not saying that's actually the case), why should they not accept an English keyboard layout as well (hypothetically)?
Because that's not the same in any way. You can speak many languages, but every single keyboard you can buy in a given country comes with that country's layout. You can't just switch that. I don't think buying an imported US/UK keyboard to comfortably use a single website makes sense either. For your reply I assume that you don't care much about having users from other places, so there's not much to talk about here, since my original question was about the difficulties this community will have expanding.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai Is it on your keyboard? Would you think the same if the character was § instead of ~? The 'Ñ' character is probably on more keyboard than ~. I just think that the possible limiting effects of it...Is it on your keyboard? Would you think the same if the character was § instead of ~? The 'Ñ' character is probably on more keyboard than ~.
I just think that the possible limiting effects of it (user growth wise) weight more than the aesthetic/brand importance, more so given that this is still in beta and such a change wouldn't be that important at this point. Being afraid of change now (or lazy, or just convenient) might just be the difference between reaching critical user base or not. Google spend months choosing between hundreds of shades of blue on A/B tests for the links on the search page; I think this is way more substantial than that.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai Is that a threshold that we specifically want to impose on a subset of users for an actual reason, or a burden we impose onto them because of an aesthetical reason?Is that a threshold that we specifically want to impose on a subset of users for an actual reason, or a burden we impose onto them because of an aesthetical reason?
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai Not really. What keyboard layout can't type a period, or an @, or a #? Most can, but ~ is not in the same category, because the number of keyboard layouts that have that character are way lower.Not really. What keyboard layout can't type a period, or an @, or a #? Most can, but ~ is not in the same category, because the number of keyboard layouts that have that character are way lower.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai I agree that it is an important character to use in this site, but I don't agree that the number of users that can't type it is a small set. Even if English is the most used language on the...I agree that it is an important character to use in this site, but I don't agree that the number of users that can't type it is a small set. Even if English is the most used language on the Internet, English keyboard layouts are the minority around the world. I see this problem where people of English speaking countries don't really get a grasp of the amount of people that exist and engage from other countries, because the default imaginary user is a male white american user, just because they don't announce they aren't. And English has become the universal language, there's no discussion about it, but this is an interesting and particular case where language is not the issue, but keyboard-layout is. And even if a huge amount of people from non English speaking countries have no problem communicating in English with the rest of the community, a seemingly non-issue as a keyboard layout is actually a huge issue.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai (edited )Link ParentNo, of course not, but I'm not sure changing the character equals changing the whole brand. I understand it is a big issue, but I still think it's necessary, and the earliest the better for big...No, of course not, but I'm not sure changing the character equals changing the whole brand. I understand it is a big issue, but I still think it's necessary, and the earliest the better for big changes. Hope you aren't afraid of that.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai I understand this is not the most urgent issue, but if this community is gonna grow and expand, the sooner this problems gets solved the better, so less users need to re-learn how it works....I understand this is not the most urgent issue, but if this community is gonna grow and expand, the sooner this problems gets solved the better, so less users need to re-learn how it works. Personally, I don't see any of those solutions as actual solutions, since users would still need to learn that there's an alternate character (which is redundant), and having a button just to type one character seem to be kind of overthinking a solution to a problem that it's, really, a thing of aesthetics vs user experience. And I understand the attachment to the aesthetics, don't get me wrong, specially when is tied up to the core of the brand, but I still think UX should come first.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai I reckon that shouldn't be a requirement for every user, so I think my point still stands.I reckon that shouldn't be a requirement for every user, so I think my point still stands.
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Comment on The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs? in ~tildes
unai The problem is not that it's impossible to do tho, is that is not easy and/or people don't know how to type the character :/The problem is not that it's impossible to do tho, is that is not easy and/or people don't know how to type the character :/
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The ~ character is not in my keyboard. Can you see Tildes expanding when most people can't write the URLs?
Even if Tildes is an English-only community, I can see how it been "US keyboard layout"-only might stop other users from using the site. I understand that the character is even in the site's icon...
Even if Tildes is an English-only community, I can see how it been "US keyboard layout"-only might stop other users from using the site. I understand that the character is even in the site's icon and name, and it feels pretty aesthetically and brand-crucial, but I don't think it is related to the main idea of the site/community or its functionality; and being still in alpha is not too late to make a change that could help it expand and get more users (or at the very least, not limite it).
What do you think?
28 votes
I've said many times that there's no need for rebranding. I don't see how the site's name or logo should have to change.
That's what I've been doing, and you quote an example just after. Seems like you want me to agree to any solution, but I just don't think those solutions solve anything. And I still haven't read a single reason for keeping it but aesthetics, and that is not worth changing something you're used to for a small set of users, which I think is a terrible reason, and also, if this site does get critical mass at some point, the current users that are so used to the character will make a way smaller set than the users who won't be able to type it, so I think that's pretty short-minded. That won't happen anyway, since those who can't type it probably won't use the site in the first place. In any case, I think I'm repeating myself, and your comment attacking me personally has burned me out, so I'm gonna leave it here. I posted this here because I wanted to help the community and I want to see it grow, because I like the ideas is based on, but I also think communities should make up their own rules to a certain point, and imo most of you seem to prefer the character and the brand over the diversity, so maybe it should stay like that, even if in my opinion it's a waste of potential.