Kielyr's recent activity

  1. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I think you're overstating their importance in this particular situation. If it was something more complicated, like access to higher education, or jobs, or a more healthy relationship with food...

    forces and the effects they have on people.

    I think you're overstating their importance in this particular situation. If it was something more complicated, like access to higher education, or jobs, or a more healthy relationship with food or excercise, or the ability to have a more stable marriage... I'd give you the point in all of that.

    But it's the most basic spelling I am asking for. Not even grammar, really.

    Earlier today, I saw a comment on r/geopolitics. Awful grammar. They were using present continuous forms where they weren't the ones that belonged. BUT they had capitalized the I, I had 0 problems with it. They had the basic courtesy of capitalizing the I. They were someone that cared. I don't ask for more.

    And if there's anyone in this world, with enough knowledge of the English language, to end up on Reddit, particularly on r/geopolitics of all places, and understand that subreddit enough to comment on it, but they somehow don't know that the i's are capitalized and that “u” is not a standard form of the second person; then I am deeply sorry from the bottom of my heart that I am excluding this 2-3 extraordinary people from participating in this community (not that I can't prevent them from doing anything, I'm not a mod).

    You cannot simply dismiss history.

    But history is not always relevant on 100% of the situations. It sometimes doesn't matter. Because, again, people are more than their background. And of all the things that you could argue are conditioned by background, spelling would be one of the easiest ones to change. But again, I'm not asking for people to know the difference between affect and effect or the meaning of sesquipedalian, just merely asking some little, tiny, itty, bity efort; that literally everyone fluent enough to end up on r/geopolitics is capable of. So I seriously doubt I am excluding anyone.

    First you accuse people of having aspergers

    I didn't accuse anyone of being Asperger's. I said that I wasn't discriminating against anyone that wasn't Asperger's. It's a pretty big jump you did there.

    then you say you're immune to the racism, classism, etc. because you came from an immigrant poor background.

    I'm not saying I'm immune to anything. I am saying I have plenty of experience with people from poor, working class and immigrant backgrounds and know that they're fully 100% capable of having basic spelling. So they don't really deserve an exception. And making them folllow the same rules as everyone else isn't excluding them.

    I'm just telling you that poor people aren't animals. They can learn extremely basic things like capitalizing i's even if they didn't go past high school. And not requiring them to abide by the same extremely basic rules as everyone else, means you think they are less than everyone else, and thus incapable of the most basic things.

    I'm happy that you were able to overcome diversity

    I haven't overcome anything. I just know how to capitalize i's and write “you”. It's seriously not that hard. Poor people can do it too. That was my point with that whole tangent.

    by your inability to empathize with others

    As a matter of fact, I am very much capable of empathy, I have deep feelings and deep thoughts and can be moved to tears by warm sunlight on my face..

    I can also empathize with neo-nazis. But being able to doesn't mean that I should nor that I would want to.

    Everyone has always an excuse for everything. But everyone also has the ability to make choices. Sure, there is a place for compassion and comprehension of different life circumstances that would move different people into different paths of life but at some point, you have to start judging people as executors of their free will.

    If you wanted to, you could think how reasonable it is for someone who was born in a racist family in a racist town in a racist state, that was never in contact with a person from the race he considers inferior, that didn't have enough introspection to question his views on this group of people, that was taught biased versions of history and is influenced by biased, unfair news... to be racist, and thus conclude that they're not in the wrong, or that they get a pass because of this and that circumstance.

    But does it make their racism acceptable?

    However, this is all unnecessary. It's not a very complex subject we're dealing with here. It's the i's and the u's. I really don't think it's as conditioned by background as you think it is.

    your unwillingness to accept other viewpoints on life.

    It seems to me a rather big jump going from “cant accept one different viewpoint” to “can't accept viewpoints”. Also, one thing is accepting, and another different one is agreeing with. Not agreeing doesn't mean not accepting. I can accept unconventional grammar if it comes from someone trying to make a point, following an idea, a personal philosophy. Not if it's just mere carelessness on a place where it's precisely stated that carelessness is discouraged. Because, again, I'm not talking about YouTube comments here, but “scholar” subreddits.

    unwillingness to accept other viewpoints on life.

    Couldn't the same be said about you not accepting my viewpoint?

    it's that people are diverse and this diversity is a huge boon to society.

    Sure. But not everything that deviates from the standard is a positive addition. E.g. alt-right, anti-vaxxers.

    We should not be looking to exclude

    You keep accusing me of wanting to exclude, but I really don't think that's what I'm trying to do.

    Just like you don't go to someone else's house and insist on leaving your shoes on when they're a household that takes their outside shoes off when they're inside; you don't go to a subreddit and do whatever you please without following the rules. And I'm not talking about unfair rules or discriminatory ones, they're very reasonable, and very essential to the health of the community. It's in poor taste, inconsiderate, and rude. Like going to a party and blasting your music without asking for permission or having any regard for the well-being and tastes of the people in there, it's just selfish.

    We should not be looking to exclude simply because we do not understand or share the viewpoint or ideology.

    And we should not be looking into imposing our viewpoints on other people.

    Disagreeing with other people's viewpoints is perfectly acceptable. It's not morally wrong by any means to disagree with other people. Not are we forced in any way to accept all viewpoints and ideologies.

    Again, I'm not discriminating anyone on bases they didn't have a choice on. I'm merely disapproving of certain behaviors in certain places. It is behavior no one is forced to have, it's not a thing they cannot change about themselves. And it's not places they need to be in. So, if they don't want to follow that very minimum set of rules, they can just not go into these communities. These communities aren't anything they need, so a basic right isn't being denied to them. So, we're neither preventing them entry for things they cannot change, nor are we depriving them of things they need.

    It's basically like a restaurant requiring you to enter clothed. Not well-dressed, not an expensive entry fee, not a certain height, a certain sexuality, a certain race, a certain education... Merely asking you to enter with some clothes on. I feel like this is a very fair analogy for the requirement I'm asking people respect. If you feel like that's excluding, then, well; I can't come up with anything against that.

    1 vote

  2. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    (edited )
    Link Parent
    The only thing I'm asking for is basic spelling and not too atrocious grammar. The people that bother me are not people who cannot do better, but rather people who choose not to. Yes. When I first...

    That's the thing, though, their education and upbringing will directly affect how they communicate on a forum like those you mentioned. It's impossible to separate the two.

    The only thing I'm asking for is basic spelling and not too atrocious grammar. The people that bother me are not people who cannot do better, but rather people who choose not to.

    you learned that this was the case at some point.

    Yes. When I first started to communicate with people online. I didn't need to go for university to learn that. The only people I could be discriminating against unfairly could maybe be people with Asperger's, who are unable to read social cues and react accordingly to context. However, in the subreddits I mentioned (r/askhistorians and r/geopolitics) it's very clear from reading the sidebar that informal low quality discussion is discouraged. Thus, not even “Aspies” get a pass.

    or may simply not want to comport themselves in that manner because they do not feel it is important because they do not share your ideals or upbringing.

    Okay. Then we're back to me being elitist based on people's choice. I believe that's okay. If they're allowed to not capitalize their i's and shortcut their you's, then I'm allowed to complain about it.

    They can, but hard and fast rules like "if you use the word 'u' instead of 'you' I will ignore you" are not the right way to approach the fluidity of language and the diversity of humans.
    An outright dismissal of an idea based on the language alone is a bias.

    I have never implied I go that far. Because I don't.

    I mean, the reason this bothers me alone is because I take the time to read their comment to find the faults (or what I believe are faults) in it. If I dismissed it entirely at the first sight of such occurrences, then I wouldn't know how prevalent they are, nor would I have correlated them with lackluster comments.

    This assumption is built upon the framework of education and upbringing, which are viewed through the lens of your own experiences.

    I'm not white. I'm not American. I am an immigrant, in one of the shittiest yet-somehow-developed economies. I come from a working class environment. My mother is a flat out anti-intellectual that pushes back and occasionally even insults me whenever I write things in any style that isn't of utmost mediocrity. The people I have to work with in menial jobs to pay for my studies also consider me weird because I don't engage in their smalltalk Sports talk with them. The people I study with consider me weird because I know about “intellectual” topics outside of the “intellectual” topics we study (it's like somehow you're not allowed to know about demographic trends if you're not an economist, much less cite a quote from a writer if you're not a literature major). All of this is to tell you, you can't play the “oh, you're a white, university educated upper class American male, so you can't understand” card.

    If people were nothing but class and upbringing, I'd be whitetrash as fuck (without the white part). The only person who has sided with me in my affinity for knowledge was my grandmother, who grew up below the poverty line in a dictatorial communist regime in te 40s. And who didn't even finish high school and was forced to raise two kids from the age of 20. Who, by all accounts of This assumption is built upon the framework of education and upbringing, which are viewed through the lens of your own experiences should also be anti-intellectual and as trashy as they come. But she isn't.

    So when someone makes a conscious decision to type “im literally dyiiiing rite now [insert emojis]”, I don't believe their class or their upbringing excuses it. I believe they just don't care about something which I care about deeply. And I don't think there's anything wrong with me disagreeing with them in such situation.

    Also, again, the people typing this “im literally dyiiiing rite now [insert emojis]”, it's just everyone. Regardless of culture, upbringing or education. It's a behavior and a choice, not a biological imperative.

    I mean, going by your logic, then if someone is a white supremacist from Alabama, then we shouldn't judge them harshly because “they're poor Alabama people, they don't know any better, it's in their DNA”.

    Sure, background plays a role, but my sister got the same background as me, and had the same grandmother. And she can't type for shit, but I can. It's not our background that has determined that, it's our personality and our personal choice to either care about capitalization or not to. The same goes for my father and his brother, both the sons of my grandmother.

    At some point, you have to draw the line. People aren't just a portrait of their background. They have free will and the ability to choose. Maybe not in what state to live or whether to drive a lamborghini or a maserati, but whether to capitalize their i's or not? Yeah, I'm pretty sure they do have a choice over the last one.

    This biased lens is a lens that is inherently biased against differing upbringing

    Most of the people I study with are upple middle class. And they do the same shit.

    I judge people on their choices and opinions, not their background.

    therefore making it necessarily racist, classist, and ethnocentrist.

    You're making people out to be a caricature of whatever social groups they're a part of. Completely disregarding their ability to make certain choices.

    It needs to be a lot more nuanced than "u" instead of "you" leading to an outright dismissal of an idea.

    I never claimed that.

    And I think my moderately long list of very long comments are nuanced enough to deduct from them that I have no issue with nuance.

    Note that I'm not particularly fond of sharing my personal life online. Least of all my family situation or history. But I thought I'd make a point of it. Far too often are my opinions dismissed or their value diminished on the assumption that I am the much despised “white upper middle class American English native male” and thus I'm unable to understand the poor or the working class immigrants, which I happen to be a part of.

    Not to repeat myself, but, people are more than just their background.

  3. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I never said they were. What I do believe they are is often a mark of lower quality. Not always, but more often than not. I'm not complaining about people not keeping proper grammar in a chat...

    Grammar and capitalization are not, in themselves, markers of "high quality" discussion.

    I never said they were. What I do believe they are is often a mark of lower quality. Not always, but more often than not.

    I know several published scholars with tenure track positions at well regarded universities who either don't capitalize or capitalize very inconsistently in casual discussion.

    I'm not complaining about people not keeping proper grammar in a chat room. And I don't believe r/askhistorians or r/geopolitics are places for casual discussion. It merely takes one reading the sidebar rules for knowing that, because it is clearly said so in there.

    I'm not complaining about people in r/memes or r/casualuk being blasé about grammar and spelling. I'm complaining about the lack of effort in “scholar” subreddits. They're very different communities.

    I wouldn't discount my friend who is an actual historian when she's talking about history just because she doesn't care about prescriptivist formalism in an online discussion.

    But I'm sure that when she wants to be taken seriously she puts in the effort to abide by prescriptivist rules.

    There are also plenty of people for whom English is not a first language and come from cultural backgrounds where texting shorthand is common even in business communication.

    So? If you're in a place that's meant to house in-depth discussion, you should try to put in some effort in your comments. Regardless of your culture.

    It's not typos and grammar mistakes I'm complaining about. It's the complete disregard of rules and spelling. Typing “u” instead of “you” and “im” instead of “I'm” is not something that an L2 speaker would do because they don't know any better. It's something that you do when you just couldn't care less about typing “you” and “I'm”. It's a conscious decision to take a shortcut. A shortcut that is known by anyone who's not very deep in the Asperger's syndrome to be informal and casual. In a subreddit that is clearly stated to not be meant to be informal and casual. It's a disregard for the context. So L2 speakers don't get a pass. Because it's not L2 rules that make the mistakes I'm complaining about. People make these mistakes regardless of their knowledge of the language.

    Grammatical prescriptivism is, largely, a matter of aesthetic preference.

    So is wearing a suit to a presidential debate. You could also go in a diaper. But then don't expect people to take you seriously.

    There are also very good reasons for prescriptivism to exist. And I hope the trend of dismissing it that's so common online doesn't translate into real life in meaningful ways, though that ship has probably already sailed.

    1 vote

  4. Comment on ‘I am dreaming of a way to kill almost every last person on earth’: A self-proclaimed white nationalist planned a mass terrorist attack, the government says in ~news

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    To me, those read like very aggressive moves that will turn toxic in no time and make the whole site more toxic, argumentative and hostile.

    They're such a waste of time. And when you determine the person you're communicating with just isn't reading you right, it might be helpful to label them as such and move on. Helpful to the appropriate party. "Pedant" ... "this has devolved into pedantry, and I'm out." It might be helpful to people in/following the comment chain.

    To me, those read like very aggressive moves that will turn toxic in no time and make the whole site more toxic, argumentative and hostile.

    1 vote

  5. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    The only political sub I have ever commented on was r/laststagecapitalism and I got banned the very first time I commented there because I had posted once to r/cringe_anarchy several years ago....

    /r/leftcommunism, Generally most of the leftist factional subreddits

    The only political sub I have ever commented on was r/laststagecapitalism and I got banned the very first time I commented there because I had posted once to r/cringe_anarchy several years ago. Neither my comment not my post were in any way whatsoever in the slightest bit political, offensive or controversial. My post in the other sub only had got 3 upvotes, so it wasn't even right for that subreddit by most accounts. And I hadn't participated in that sub outside of that instance before or after.

    I'm not part of any other political or drama ridden sub, but I've read this type of behavior is common among all of them.

    I also like to challenge people's views even when I agree with those views, and would rather not join a subreddit where they'll ban me just for not agreeing with them.

    Are those subs any different?

  6. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I interpreted “informal” as in using words like “dude”, “bro” and swear words. My bad. Language has different levels of formality and informality, the use of which varies depending on context. You...

    Okay but I'm going with your premise in the original response. You took issue with the following:

    I interpreted “informal” as in using words like “dude”, “bro” and swear words. My bad.

    "u" vs. "you" and "i" vs "I" is an issue of formality. The content is exactly the same, the presentation is the only thing that differs.

    Language has different levels of formality and informality, the use of which varies depending on context. You won't speak the same way to a foreign ambassador in a parlamentary building that you would your girlfriend in bed.

    Why must the internet be different? Why is it that scholar subreddits and communities cannot have a higher standard for comment quality?

    Unless, you think that it would be perfectly okay for G7 to meet in their underwear. Because it's only presentation that changes and the context is the same.

    My language teacher in high school told us, repeatedly, that speaking in a vulgar register isn't inherently wrong nor speaking in a formal register is always right. But rather, they were correct or not depending on the situation. This is the notion I ascribe to.

    That's a dangerous assumption.

    Dangerous how?

    Some people make mistakes even though they're trying not to because their task of not making mistakes is harder based on the circumstance that English is their no their native language. Other people make mistakes not because they cannot avoid making mistakes, but because they just don't care that they're making mistakes. I'm judging these people differently. How is that dangerous?

    Language is a tool that adapts over time to meet the needs and wants of society.

    And its adaptation comes from the tug of war between the careless and the meticulous.

    the needs and wants of society.

    Society doesn't know what it wants. Society is not a person. Society is made out of different people with different opinions towards language. The part of society that wants language to have rules and for these to be followed is not any less important than the part of society that doesn't care about rules or following them.

    There are plenty of examples in linguistic history of archaic words which are no longer used, in many cases, because an informal word replaced them.

    Yes, we have words like “literally” that lose their meaning and force people to say things like “literally literally” or “literally, as in a literal sense”.

    Wouldn't it be a better world if “biweekly” had a clear, non-ambiguous meaning? I mean, with how ambiguous it is, it's essentially useless. You always have to clarify what you mean by it when you use it.

    “Fornicating”, which used to mean “having sexual relationships with a 3d person when you're married”, is now increasingly being used to mean plain old “fucking”. Yet another word that we lose to language adaptation.

    In exchange, we get words like “yeet” or “friendzone”, which don't even have a clear meaning.

    Language more often than not adapts not to be more efficient in communicating ideas, but to make up for the carelessness of its users. Often to be less efficient.

    I understand where you are coming from and I used to think very similarly about grammar and presentation. I missed out on a lot of very important, very valid, and very useful ideas doing this. I also unintentionally was racist, classist, and nationalist/ethnist because of this. I only point all of this out because I wish I hadn't missed out on the wonderful ideas that the world has to offer. Something to consider.

    I appreciate the advice, but my elitist views are based on the behavior and attitude of people. Not aspects of their life they haven't had a choice in. Which is I allow myself to have more stern views on the topic. Also, because I've been thinking about it for many, many, many years now, without really changing my views on it (which I cannot say about all topics).

    Feel free to expand on unintentionally was racist, classist, and nationalist/ethnist because of this., though. Maybe there are aspects I'm not seeing.

    I only point all of this out because I wish I hadn't missed out on the wonderful ideas that the world has to offer.

    Well, the world has too many ideas for us to know them all. Thus we can only know some of them. It's only fair to have some sort of filter.

    3 votes

  7. Comment on ‘I am dreaming of a way to kill almost every last person on earth’: A self-proclaimed white nationalist planned a mass terrorist attack, the government says in ~news

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    Yes, and this is a problem on its own.

    With so little text to work with, people tend to jump to conclusions.

    Yes, and this is a problem on its own.

    3 votes

  8. Comment on ‘I am dreaming of a way to kill almost every last person on earth’: A self-proclaimed white nationalist planned a mass terrorist attack, the government says in ~news

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    On one hand, yes. On the other hand, why is that we can't take comments at face value anymore? Must we always try to find hidden second meanings in them (I'm referring to the general internet...

    On one hand, yes.

    On the other hand, why is that we can't take comments at face value anymore? Must we always try to find hidden second meanings in them (I'm referring to the general internet culture, not this particular case, in which I disagree with both parties)?

    Basically, I'm saying: We should strive to make our statements as clear as possible. But we should also try not to jump to conclussions so easily. Which is why I believe both parties here are at fault, not that I want to get into an argument with either.

    8 votes

  9. Comment on ‘I am dreaming of a way to kill almost every last person on earth’: A self-proclaimed white nationalist planned a mass terrorist attack, the government says in ~news

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I think that's part of the point of Tildes' system. You can't just label their reply and move on with life. You have to explain to them how they misunderstood.

    because it could very well become a downvote button, but there are times when I read comments and think, "yeah, this person didn't understand what they were replying to at all."

    I think that's part of the point of Tildes' system. You can't just label their reply and move on with life. You have to explain to them how they misunderstood.

    3 votes

  10. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    Maybe, but I'm sure these people aren't the average Reddit user. Being low quality doesn't equate to being informal nor vice versa. The typical user that ends up his post or comment with “I'm...

    Their time is valuable and they aren't willing to waste it.

    Maybe, but I'm sure these people aren't the average Reddit user.

    I think you will lose out on a lot of valuable content by dismissing language because it is informal.

    Being low quality doesn't equate to being informal nor vice versa.

    In fact, I think you will unintentionally introduce racism and nationalism because you will, by nature of grammatical exclusion, unintentionally end up ignoring people for whom which English is not their first language or who did not grow up with the same quality of education.

    The typical user that ends up his post or comment with “I'm sorry, English isn't my first language” or “excuse my mistakes, I'm trying to improve my English” has far better regard for what they're writing that the people who flat out refuse to take the time to type “y” and “u”.

    I don't think we're thinking of the same people.

    Language is a concrete tool for sharing abstract ideas.

    Yes. Language is a public tool. We need to take care of it when we use it so that we don't destroy it and turn it useless.

    By it's very nature it is imperfect.

    Yes. But there are different degrees of imperfection. Some aspire to a language with less imperfections. Some just don't care, and more often than not drive the imperfections way, way up.

    I also think this fight between them is part of the nature of languages. You'll always have people doing whatever they want with it, and people trying to set up rules and enforce them. And their equilibrium is what characterizes most modern languages.

    Why draw the line at grammar and presentation?

    You could also ask “why draw the line at all?”.

    And I'd answer that “to ensure that language continues to be a tool of communication we can rely on. Least we end up like Latin and the ensuing romance languages with the reduced communication abilities between them”.

    That seems like a silly hill to die on to me.

    And I think it's of utmost importance.

    4 votes

  11. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    The degreed people of r/askhistorians aren't the people who were making the comments I'm complaining about. If they can't spend an extra minute making sure their spelling isn't atrocious, then I...

    Chances are the degreed people of askhistorians/askscience/etc

    The degreed people of r/askhistorians aren't the people who were making the comments I'm complaining about.

    than spend an extra couple minutes making sure their I's are capitalized.

    If they can't spend an extra minute making sure their spelling isn't atrocious, then I doubt they have the time at all to make insightful comments.

    Regardless, it's not the spell-check I'm complaining about. If you write “u” and “ur” and “im”, it's not the spell-check that failed here, it's your complete lack of interest with regards to typing “you”, “you're” and “I am”.

    I don't necessarily think worrying about precise punctuation should be more important than sharing the knowledge you have with someone who wants it.

    The occasional typo is okay. The complete disregard for a well presented, punctuated, and spell-checked comment is what I'm referring to.

    It's like when you're buying any product and you make sure to check the quality of the exterior material. Does cheap plastic and chipped edges mean that the technology inside is low quality? Well, technically, no. But more often than not, it does correlate to it. If they cheap out on the presentation, they probably cheap out on the interior.

    I have never seen a well thought-out and insightful comment that was as careless with spelling and punctuation as the average low quality comment on the site is trending towards lately.

    In-depth discussion requires a bit of effort, if the person typing the comment can't even bother to type “you” instead of “u” because they want to save the tiny effort of moving their fingers a wee bit to the left and right in the same key row, then I honestly don't think they're going to bother putting in the effort it takes to type up an insightful comment

    I'm sure you could come up with a better argument than that for why you feel reddit doesn't contain discussion.

    Maybe. But this is the argument I wanted to use in this particular ocasion. I wasn't trying to give a complete list of reasons.

    1 vote

  12. Comment on ‘I am dreaming of a way to kill almost every last person on earth’: A self-proclaimed white nationalist planned a mass terrorist attack, the government says in ~news

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I don't think so. I think it's just a cultural movement that's becoming more popular. I was recently recommended a podcast about the lives of past authoritarian leaders. I thought I'd give it a...

    I think people just like to be outraged because of other problems in their life. I understand it... but man, I'm so exhausted with it.

    I don't think so. I think it's just a cultural movement that's becoming more popular.

    I was recently recommended a podcast about the lives of past authoritarian leaders. I thought I'd give it a try since I like to play informative things in the background while I do chores and learn something useful while I'm at it.

    But after a few episodes I was getting very annoyed at it. Since a quarter of the episode or even half of it was the hosts commenting on how bad x or y thing was. They couldn't state facts without judging them as right or wrong. I know killing 15 million people is bad, same as neglecting your kids and dating underage girls, you don't need to tell me every second how bad each of these things and continuously repeat yourself in the process. I also feel like the invitees were sort of the people that want everything always 100% politically correct and would often shift the blame on “us” the listeners and imply we were somehow complicit of the crimes these people did even before we were even born, or at least that was the feeling I got out of it. Very judgy. They were also very quick into ascribing their crimes to certain psychological disorders.

    You can see the same attitude on Reddit all the time.

    3 votes

  13. Comment on What are the arguments against antinatalism? What are the arguments for natalism? [Ramble warning] in ~talk

    Kielyr
    (edited )
    Link Parent
    Defending life. No. I think the key is embracing nihilism and learning to be okay with it. I'm halfway there. Any meaning I could ascribe to my life would be superficial and artificial and thus...

    But, what is the non-nihilistic value that you are being drawn too?

    Defending life.

    it could be the key reaching the stability / coherence you are seeking.

    No. I think the key is embracing nihilism and learning to be okay with it. I'm halfway there.

    So, what do you mean by that?

    Any meaning I could ascribe to my life would be superficial and artificial and thus fake.

    I also don't want to dedicate my life to anything.

    I would also recommend reading Camus' "The Stranger"; it really connected with me. I think it might do the same for you.

    It's on my list. I just hope it's more entertaining or insightful than The Myth of Sisyphus.

  14. Comment on I've taken the leap from reddit in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    Where? “u” can even see people not bothering to even capitalize their i's on allegedly scholar subreddits like r/askhistorians or r/geopolitics. Which is why many people don't want to allow fluff...

    I think Reddit had, and still has, enclaves of actual discussion.

    Where?

    “u” can even see people not bothering to even capitalize their i's on allegedly scholar subreddits like r/askhistorians or r/geopolitics. Which is why many people don't want to allow fluff on tildes, because the low quality content spills over even to groups where it's not appropriate and attracts users who aren't interested in keeping the quality high.

    5 votes

  15. Comment on Emoji are showing up in court cases exponentially, and courts aren’t prepared in ~tech

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    Emojis were a mistake.

    Emojis were a mistake.

    2 votes

  16. Comment on What are the arguments against antinatalism? What are the arguments for natalism? [Ramble warning] in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I don't think it works in a mathematical and quantifiable way. Why would they want to cease to live if they didn't perceive it to be more beneficial to their well-being than continuing to live?...

    preventing harm/shame to family, outweighs the benefit of ceasing to live. the calculation results in net positive for life in the situation you've described.

    I don't think it works in a mathematical and quantifiable way.

    Why would they want to cease to live if they didn't perceive it to be more beneficial to their well-being than continuing to live? There are many people who would rather not exist than exist. But the only way for them to stop existing is a rather negative experience, on top of the negative experience that they consider living to be.

    It's like if you kidnapped someone and chained them to a tree by their ankle and gave them a saw. And then when they've been living in that situation for months you come and say: well, you obviously like being chained to the tree, otherwise you would have cut your ankle to free yourself. So, since you haven't cut your ankle, that means you don't really want to be free.

    Following your logic, staying chained to the tree is a net positive for them.

    That doesn't seem quite right to me.

  17. Comment on What are the arguments against antinatalism? What are the arguments for natalism? [Ramble warning] in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    Because it's difficult to do so, not because they don't want to.

    Because it's difficult to do so, not because they don't want to.

  18. Comment on What are the arguments against antinatalism? What are the arguments for natalism? [Ramble warning] in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    I have thought of that too in the few days that I've been thinking about it. But my problem with it is that I am not consistent on being nihilistic or non-nihilistic. But rather I mix arguments...

    I see the crux of your "conflict" as a direct offshoot of Nihilism.

    I have thought of that too in the few days that I've been thinking about it. But my problem with it is that I am not consistent on being nihilistic or non-nihilistic. But rather I mix arguments from both sides, thus I get stuck. I should pick one side and follow arguments from that side alone. But that's easier said than done.

    So if you accept meaning can exist, then that meaning can transform suffering into the meaning. I am not arguing for any form of transcendence, merely of a change in kind. The costs of pursuing your meaning are not then pain, but an element of that pursuit.

    I have tried really hard to make existentialism work for me in the past. But it didn't quite catch on. The alternative is just way easier.

  19. Comment on When will there be a group for photographers? in ~tildes

    Kielyr
    (edited )
    Link Parent
    Maybe a year ago? Well, the other day I checked out r/pics to see that [progress] pics aren't allowed there anymore. That doesn't mean that a while ago it wasn't unbearably common to see mediocre...

    When was this?

    Maybe a year ago?

    I just (re?)subbed to r/earthporn a little while ago and the content has been pretty reasonable.

    Well, the other day I checked out r/pics to see that [progress] pics aren't allowed there anymore. That doesn't mean that a while ago it wasn't unbearably common to see mediocre pictures of initially overweight people and their normal weight results. Happy for them, don't get me wrong. But I seriously doubt those are interesting pictures on their own without the sob story behind them.

    I unsubscribed from most of the major subs due to the lowest common denominator (LCD) content that was posted to them, highly upvoted by people with no respect for sidebar rules about the relevancy of the content to the subreddit.

    A lot of it is good quality content.

    This is subjective. I see a lot of extremely oversaturated, full of jpeg artifacts, very recycled, noisy, shitty HDR pictures on r/europe getting massively upvoted a lot. Obviously, the people who upvote it think that is good photography. But I don't think anyone with a slight knowledge of photography agrees with them. There's always a few people in the comments complaining about them. I haven't been subscribed to r/earthporn for a long time now, but I remember it used to be the same.

    I don't know about you, but I think this is just painful to look at: https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/89xtlc/spring_has_arrived_to_timisoara_romania/

    And that's just one example of thousands.

    So, people upvoting and liking it doesn't mean it's quality content. One of the major problems with Reddit is that people upvote what they like, not what is relevant or good content. And if the community gets big enough, then you will have people who don't really know or care much about the subject upvoting and downvoting content. Which leads to most content being LCD interests that are, at best, mediocre, and at worst, completely irrelevant or flat out inappropriate for the subreddit. Reddit voting democracy is, in my opinion, a poor system because of that.

    Certainly, photography as an art will include low quality content.

    Not necessarily. There are many types of low quality content.

    I'm okay with an amateur that has read the sidebar rules and posted something that is adequate for the subreddit, even if the picture itself is not particularly good.

    I'm not okay with people who just come to the subreddit for the first time and start posting asking for advice without reading the rules (rules which would give him/her the advice they need without wasting other people's time and cluttering the front page).

    I don't think this is me being a gatekeeper trying to keep “noobs” away. It's just me talking from the perspective of someone who has been subscribed to several communities for a while and has seen the decrease in quality as they grow, due to the LCD factor I've already mentioned. You let new people in and post whatever low quality content, so they stay, and start upvoting low quality content further, and it's a cycle that repeats itself over and over and over and over on Reddit, where the original users of a subreddit always end up leaving it for a newly formed one due to the massive decrease in quality with time.

    As for those touristy landscape shots, they are, again, useful to a silent group of users who use them as inspiration for their own work.

    Most people are just copying the same picture over and over again: https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/9lt06o/average_photo_of_moraine_lake_submitted_to/

    It gets upvoted because it's a really beautiful landscape that everyone likes, not because of the quality of the picture. You take a half decent picture of a beautiful place and this gets far more points than an objectively good looking photo of a more mundane place. I think that, if we're judging things by their photographic value and skill, it should be the other way around. And I think a community formed by people with knowledge in photography, that has control over what is posted to their community and what gets popular in it can prevent that community from being overriden by LCD posts.

    if someone is genuinely new to photography and trying to improve, where should they post?

    I'm not opposed to them posting. By all accounts I am an amateur myself. I just want people to read the rules and try to keep a high quality community instead of a LCD one.

    By definition their content will be low quality because they're new. Should we forbid the newbie from posting and improving?

    Again, not all LQC is created equal.

    I think a photogaphy Tildes group would have a sidebar with a couple of links to a wiki and some YouTube videos that teach you basic things; which if you bother to read, will prevent you from posting low quality content. It's just a matter of getting people to read the rules and put some minimal amount of effort into making a post, rather than just arriving and start posting without any regard for the community guidelines, as it often happens on Reddit.

    Some Reddit users do have the excuse of being mobile users on apps that don't make the existence of sidebar rules obvious, I'm aware of that. But the vast majority of them just don't give two shits about a community they're not a part of, and thus aren't bothered by diluting the quality of it, much to demise of the long-term users and helped by the indifference of the moderators.

    2 votes

  20. Comment on What are the arguments against antinatalism? What are the arguments for natalism? [Ramble warning] in ~talk

    Kielyr
    Link Parent
    From my browsing of depressing online communities, I'm pretty certain that there are a lot of people who want to commit suicide, but they cannot do it for many different reasons. They would have...

    From my browsing of depressing online communities, I'm pretty certain that there are a lot of people who want to commit suicide, but they cannot do it for many different reasons. They would have preferred it if they had not been born at all and not been forced to take this decision. They are forced to live (according to them) by their relatives, which would suffer greatly and blame them if they were to commit suicide, by society, and by the fear of the unknown, among other reasons.

    1 vote