The FBI opened an investigation on Trump and Russia but the only top-level comment here is blaming that on the Democrats somehow, so I'm fixing that now. It's beyond the pale that for millions of...
The FBI opened an investigation on Trump and Russia but the only top-level comment here is blaming that on the Democrats somehow, so I'm fixing that now. It's beyond the pale that for millions of people, their immediate kneejerk response to hearing that law enforcement investigated the president for crimes of betrayal to his nation is to blame the opposition party. It's so transparently authoritarian, brainwashed thinking that I can't stand it.
piggybacking off this comment, i'd like to give a quick shout out to what might be the NYT's worst aging headline: Investigating Donald Trump, F.B.I. Sees No Clear Link to Russia i'm getting the...
Well, this thread became extremely antagonistic immediately, and I can't imagine it's going to suddenly get better somehow, so I'm just going to lock it and save everyone the stress. If you feel...
Well, this thread became extremely antagonistic immediately, and I can't imagine it's going to suddenly get better somehow, so I'm just going to lock it and save everyone the stress. If you feel the need to yell at the opposite team more about politics, I'm sure you can find many other sites to do that on.
I want to say something like "I just want this to be over so neoliberals can't shout Russia every time someone criticizes them.", but I know that they'll be doing it for years to come no matter...
I want to say something like "I just want this to be over so neoliberals can't shout Russia every time someone criticizes them.", but I know that they'll be doing it for years to come no matter the outcome of anything.
The have successfully repurposed the Red Scare as a means of deflecting all criticism of their policy or blame for their losses.
I think it's the other way around: the Democrats have been almost fully consumed by Trump and his personal life. They're no longer getting their policy across. They're not mounting an effective...
I think it's the other way around: the Democrats have been almost fully consumed by Trump and his personal life.
They're no longer getting their policy across.
They're not mounting an effective political platform, they just come off as the Anti-Trumpers.
They're no longer presenting alternative foreign policy to the Republicans.
They've appear to be largely reactionary, responding to Republicans at the steering wheel.
Of course that's what Gingrich and McConnell and their compadres have been trying to engineer to effectively dismantle as much of government as possible through breaking Congress.
When your goal is small and ineffective government, you break government, then point out it's working poorly to justify building it down, then break it even more.
I think Trump and the Republicans are the one who're best off with the conversation being all about politicians and not actual politics and policy.
You definitely have a point, but I think it can be both. Democrats use it to deflect criticism from all sides, but that doesn't really end up affecting Republicans that much, and like you said...
You definitely have a point, but I think it can be both. Democrats use it to deflect criticism from all sides, but that doesn't really end up affecting Republicans that much, and like you said might even be helping them. But it is hurting the left because the left and neolibs are fighting for a similarly minded voting base, whereas Republicans have a completely different base that couldn't care less about Russia as long as the wall gets built.
Did you want the five year long Benghazi investigation to just be over? Did you want the investigation into Hillary's emails to just be over? Or are you hypocritically manufacturing outrage over...
I just want this to be over
Did you want the five year long Benghazi investigation to just be over?
Did you want the investigation into Hillary's emails to just be over?
Or are you hypocritically manufacturing outrage over this instance, because it hurts your guy?
Trump is definitely not "my guy". Those were investigations into personal mismanagement, the Russia stuff is about a boogeyman trying to control everything. There's a pretty big difference. I want...
Trump is definitely not "my guy". Those were investigations into personal mismanagement, the Russia stuff is about a boogeyman trying to control everything. There's a pretty big difference. I want this to be over because I don't want the people calling for actual progress to be dismissed as propped up by Russia.
Any criticism of neoliberal policy, even from the left, is suddenly a bad thing because "Russia scary".
I don't think it's questionable anymore that collision took place nor that the GOP party apparatus is complicit in allowing it to happen, but online there has grown an incredible tendency to blame...
I don't think it's questionable anymore that collision took place nor that the GOP party apparatus is complicit in allowing it to happen, but online there has grown an incredible tendency to blame literally everything on Russia and it's hurting the Democrats' ability to work as a meaningful opposition. I've been accused multiple times (on reddit, never here fortunately) of being a paid Russian troll for criticizing centrist democrats and their policies. It's becoming a thought-terminating cliche and it's eerily similar to the way people on the alt-right will blame things on the deep state or whatever. For fucks sake, there's basically a messianic cult around Robert Muller, a man who as FBI director lied about Iraq possessing WMDs and helped start that war.
The fact of the matter is that nothing is going to be done about Trump and any crimes he may have committed until the democrats control the government again, and you don't win elections by shifting all the blame for your previous failure onto some evil external power.
I'll remind people that Ronald Regan sold weapons to Iran then used the money to fund terrorist death squads in central america. He got away with it an a huge portion of the country loves him to this.
George Bush started multiple disastrous and illegal conflicts AND had the economy completely collapse on his watch and he's currently being rehabilitated by the mainstream for painting and handing out candy.
While I don't endorse the view, I can understand it at least. If you think about it, a long, drawn-out investigation with only tiny breadcrumbs coming out sounds exactly like the Hillary Clinton...
While I don't endorse the view, I can understand it at least. If you think about it, a long, drawn-out investigation with only tiny breadcrumbs coming out sounds exactly like the Hillary Clinton Benghazi investigation. That being said, there are still plenty of reasons to be upset about a DJT presidency outside of his ties with Russia.
The FBI opened an investigation on Trump and Russia but the only top-level comment here is blaming that on the Democrats somehow, so I'm fixing that now. It's beyond the pale that for millions of people, their immediate kneejerk response to hearing that law enforcement investigated the president for crimes of betrayal to his nation is to blame the opposition party. It's so transparently authoritarian, brainwashed thinking that I can't stand it.
piggybacking off this comment, i'd like to give a quick shout out to what might be the NYT's worst aging headline: Investigating Donald Trump, F.B.I. Sees No Clear Link to Russia
i'm getting the sense that this article is going to go down as one of those ignominious "Dewey defeats Truman" type articles
Well, this thread became extremely antagonistic immediately, and I can't imagine it's going to suddenly get better somehow, so I'm just going to lock it and save everyone the stress. If you feel the need to yell at the opposite team more about politics, I'm sure you can find many other sites to do that on.
I want to say something like "I just want this to be over so neoliberals can't shout Russia every time someone criticizes them.", but I know that they'll be doing it for years to come no matter the outcome of anything.
The have successfully repurposed the Red Scare as a means of deflecting all criticism of their policy or blame for their losses.
I think it's the other way around: the Democrats have been almost fully consumed by Trump and his personal life.
They're no longer getting their policy across.
They're not mounting an effective political platform, they just come off as the Anti-Trumpers.
They're no longer presenting alternative foreign policy to the Republicans.
They've appear to be largely reactionary, responding to Republicans at the steering wheel.
Of course that's what Gingrich and McConnell and their compadres have been trying to engineer to effectively dismantle as much of government as possible through breaking Congress.
When your goal is small and ineffective government, you break government, then point out it's working poorly to justify building it down, then break it even more.
I think Trump and the Republicans are the one who're best off with the conversation being all about politicians and not actual politics and policy.
You definitely have a point, but I think it can be both. Democrats use it to deflect criticism from all sides, but that doesn't really end up affecting Republicans that much, and like you said might even be helping them. But it is hurting the left because the left and neolibs are fighting for a similarly minded voting base, whereas Republicans have a completely different base that couldn't care less about Russia as long as the wall gets built.
Did you want the five year long Benghazi investigation to just be over?
Did you want the investigation into Hillary's emails to just be over?
Or are you hypocritically manufacturing outrage over this instance, because it hurts your guy?
Trump is definitely not "my guy". Those were investigations into personal mismanagement, the Russia stuff is about a boogeyman trying to control everything. There's a pretty big difference. I want this to be over because I don't want the people calling for actual progress to be dismissed as propped up by Russia.
Any criticism of neoliberal policy, even from the left, is suddenly a bad thing because "Russia scary".
I don't think it's questionable anymore that collision took place nor that the GOP party apparatus is complicit in allowing it to happen, but online there has grown an incredible tendency to blame literally everything on Russia and it's hurting the Democrats' ability to work as a meaningful opposition. I've been accused multiple times (on reddit, never here fortunately) of being a paid Russian troll for criticizing centrist democrats and their policies. It's becoming a thought-terminating cliche and it's eerily similar to the way people on the alt-right will blame things on the deep state or whatever. For fucks sake, there's basically a messianic cult around Robert Muller, a man who as FBI director lied about Iraq possessing WMDs and helped start that war.
The fact of the matter is that nothing is going to be done about Trump and any crimes he may have committed until the democrats control the government again, and you don't win elections by shifting all the blame for your previous failure onto some evil external power.
I'll remind people that Ronald Regan sold weapons to Iran then used the money to fund terrorist death squads in central america. He got away with it an a huge portion of the country loves him to this.
George Bush started multiple disastrous and illegal conflicts AND had the economy completely collapse on his watch and he's currently being rehabilitated by the mainstream for painting and handing out candy.
While I don't endorse the view, I can understand it at least. If you think about it, a long, drawn-out investigation with only tiny breadcrumbs coming out sounds exactly like the Hillary Clinton Benghazi investigation. That being said, there are still plenty of reasons to be upset about a DJT presidency outside of his ties with Russia.
But what happens when it's over? Democrats will continue to see Russians in all opposition to them, no matter what the reality is.