26 votes

Google sued by DOJ in antitrust case over search dominance

19 comments

  1. [3]
    Wes
    Link
    One angle I haven't seen discussed yet: if Google is compelled to stop promoting Search via deals, then that could spell disaster for Mozilla. They depend on their search deal far more than Apple...

    One angle I haven't seen discussed yet: if Google is compelled to stop promoting Search via deals, then that could spell disaster for Mozilla. They depend on their search deal far more than Apple or others do.

    I hope they don't become collateral damage in a messy legal battle.

    19 votes
    1. [2]
      Deimos
      Link Parent
      That's definitely a really good point. I posted a comment the other day about just how dependent Mozilla is on that search deal.

      That's definitely a really good point. I posted a comment the other day about just how dependent Mozilla is on that search deal.

      7 votes
      1. Wes
        Link Parent
        They posted a reaction to the suit. My reading is that they're a little concerned.

        They posted a reaction to the suit. My reading is that they're a little concerned.

        9 votes
  2. [2]
    post_below
    Link
    It's important to note that various people involved with the case believe it's being rushed for political reasons (some have resigned over it). Bringing a weak case could end up helping rather...

    It's important to note that various people involved with the case believe it's being rushed for political reasons (some have resigned over it).

    Bringing a weak case could end up helping rather than hurting Google.

    The state level investigation could end up having more teeth.

    11 votes
    1. RapidEyeMovement
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      I agree wholeheartedly. When you come across headlines like this. Trump admin consulting with DoJ about Google - Kudlow Makes you question motives.... Hopefully this does not cause the State...

      I agree wholeheartedly. When you come across headlines like this. Trump admin consulting with DoJ about Google - Kudlow Makes you question motives....

      Hopefully this does not cause the State Attorney Generals to take the foot off the gas

      2 votes
  3. [4]
    Deimos
    Link
    Official DOJ release: Justice Department Sues Monopolist Google For Violating Antitrust Laws And the actual complaint (PDF, 64 pages).
    7 votes
    1. [3]
      Deimos
      Link Parent
      Google's official response blog post: A deeply flawed lawsuit that would do nothing to help consumers
      4 votes
      1. [2]
        paranoid_transdroid
        Link Parent
        What a bunch of fuckers, how can they lie so much, I'm so angry right now.

        What a bunch of fuckers, how can they lie so much, I'm so angry right now.

        1. cstby
          Link Parent
          To help develop this conversation and for other readers, can you point out specific lies?

          To help develop this conversation and for other readers, can you point out specific lies?

          4 votes
  4. [11]
    Comment deleted by author
    Link
    1. [10]
      RapidEyeMovement
      Link Parent
      Hasn't happened before. The DOJ has been "signaling" this for a while, that is why it feels like 'old news'. Also at the state level there has been movement going on for awhile. This will lead to...

      Hasn't happened before. The DOJ has been "signaling" this for a while, that is why it feels like 'old news'. Also at the state level there has been movement going on for awhile.

      50 attorneys general in a multistate, bipartisan investigation of tech giant Google’s business practices in accordance with state and federal antitrust laws.1

      This will lead to major changes. Probably not AT&T level, think Microsoft level. But it would be interesting to see what happens.

      6 votes
      1. [2]
        babypuncher
        Link Parent
        This would make interesting timing for Apple's long rumored search engine to make an appearance.

        This would make interesting timing for Apple's long rumored search engine to make an appearance.

        1. RapidEyeMovement
          Link Parent
          Wouldn't it be more strategic to wait this out? Why help Google's case?

          Wouldn't it be more strategic to wait this out? Why help Google's case?

          4 votes
      2. [7]
        Diff
        Link Parent
        What happened with Microsoft? I wasn't aware that the government had ever stepped in to chastise them.

        think Microsoft level

        What happened with Microsoft? I wasn't aware that the government had ever stepped in to chastise them.

        1. [4]
          RapidEyeMovement
          Link Parent
          Also another link that is helpful in understanding the impact. ‘Crush Them’: An Oral History of the Lawsuit That Upended Silicon Valley

          ...a judge ruled that Microsoft had violated antitrust laws and ordered that the company be split up, an order that was later overturned and replaced by a more limited settlement in which Microsoft agreed to lift some barriers to third-party software on Windows.

          Even without a split, the Microsoft settlement is credited with giving web companies like Google — and browsers like Google Chrome, which overtook Internet Explorer in 2012 — space to grow[1]

          Also another link that is helpful in understanding the impact. ‘Crush Them’: An Oral History of the Lawsuit That Upended Silicon Valley

          8 votes
          1. [3]
            Akir
            Link Parent
            IIRC, the only real major concrete thing that happened with this settlement was that they had to open up the API documentation for some of their Win32 libraries. It was very much a slap on the...

            IIRC, the only real major concrete thing that happened with this settlement was that they had to open up the API documentation for some of their Win32 libraries. It was very much a slap on the wrist.

            I'm sorry, but the idea that this lawsuit somehow "made room for competitors" for web browsers is complete bull. What made space for other browsers is that Microsoft essentially abandoned Internet Explorer and didn't bother to support newer web technologies, so IE essentially became 'the tool with which you download a real browser'.

            6 votes
            1. [2]
              RapidEyeMovement
              Link Parent
              The soft power that was flexed against MSFT seemed to have a real net effect. The 00's and the early 2010's saw MSFT flounder and stall against competition.

              The soft power that was flexed against MSFT seemed to have a real net effect. The 00's and the early 2010's saw MSFT flounder and stall against competition.

              4 votes
              1. Akir
                Link Parent
                That's coincidence, nothing more. From your own link: In reality there are plenty of reasons why Microsoft was floundering at that time period. Bill Gates wanted to transform Windows into the next...

                That's coincidence, nothing more.

                From your own link:

                Gavil: One of the myths [that Microsoft made up] is that the antitrust case somehow caused a distraction and that they had problems afterward because of all the effort that went into the antitrust case. I think it’s quite the opposite. I think they got into trouble in the first place because they were not really on the ball. They missed the internet phenomenon. Nobody did that to them.

                Mittelhauser: What both Microsoft and Netscape missed out on was that realization that the browser didn’t really matter. It was sites that mattered. We easily could have bought Yahoo, Google, etc. But the Google guys and the Yahoo guys basically worked with us and we helped get them set up.

                In reality there are plenty of reasons why Microsoft was floundering at that time period. Bill Gates wanted to transform Windows into the next generation of operating systems with some really unique features and rather famously failed to actually produce it. Transitioning to Steve Ballimer didn't really help them much, and Microsoft only recently started to really flex their muscles in the cloud and with various web services, which is where their greatest competitors began.

                2 votes
        2. [2]
          aditya
          Link Parent
          I guess this is regarding Internet Explorer? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Corp.

          I guess this is regarding Internet Explorer?

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Corp.

          6 votes
          1. mrbig
            Link Parent
            I was very aware of these issues in that era, and this did have an effect. The Internet Explorer dominance seemed unbreakable at a time, and suddenly that was not the case anymore.

            I was very aware of these issues in that era, and this did have an effect. The Internet Explorer dominance seemed unbreakable at a time, and suddenly that was not the case anymore.

            1 vote