With NaNoWriMo coming up, I thought I would share my favourite "writing tips" video. Not sure if it made me a better writer, but it definitely made me more insufferable when discussing YA novels.
With NaNoWriMo coming up, I thought I would share my favourite "writing tips" video. Not sure if it made me a better writer, but it definitely made me more insufferable when discussing YA novels.
Many of these are (or should be!) common sense. I was surprised to see her recommend that "said" and "asked" should make up the majority of your dialogue tags. I was taught quite emphatically in...
Many of these are (or should be!) common sense.
I was surprised to see her recommend that "said" and "asked" should make up the majority of your dialogue tags. I was taught quite emphatically in high school that we should use a variety of words to indicate speech, so that stories don't become a series of "he said" and "she said" sentences.
No thesaurus writing? But that's how I write normally! I don't necessarily go looking for the bigger, fancier words - they just come out that way. :(
Elmore Leonard had two writing rules on the topic. 3: Never use a verb other than “said” to carry dialogue: The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose...
Elmore Leonard had two writing rules on the topic.
3: Never use a verb other than “said” to carry dialogue: The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in. But said is far less intrusive than grumbled, gasped, cautioned, lied.
4. Never use an adverb to modify the verb “said” … he admonished gravely. To use an adverb this way (or almost any way) is a mortal sin. The writer is now exposing himself in earnest, using a word that distracts and can interrupt the rhythm of the exchange.
True. But there are a lot of less-intrusive dialogue words one could use than these cheesy ones ripped from the pulp pages - such as remarked, replied, or observed. Also, some dialogue words are...
But said is far less intrusive than grumbled, gasped, cautioned, lied.
True. But there are a lot of less-intrusive dialogue words one could use than these cheesy ones ripped from the pulp pages - such as remarked, replied, or observed.
Also, some dialogue words are necessary to set the scene: having someone whisper "I love you" sets a very different tone than having them simply say it; if they shout "I love you!", it sets a different tone again.
To use an adverb this way (or almost any way) is a mortal sin.
"She walked along the road." What do we care if she strode briskly or strolled casually? That doesn't matter. It's not like knowing how she walked tells us anything about her state of mind or her character. All we care about is that she walked.
7. Use regional dialect, patois, sparingly:
Once you start spelling words in dialogue phonetically and loading the page with apostrophes, you won’t be able to stop.
Welp. That's it for Charles Dickens and Mark Twain! They're obviously bad writers. Because we all know that all characters speak with exactly the same accents. We're all talking Received Pronunciation to each other.
9. Don’t go into great detail describing places and things:
You don’t want descriptions that bring the action, the flow of the story, to a standstill.
Going back to our protagonist walking along a road, it's obviously entirely irrelevant whether the road is a crowded city street filled with shops and offices, or a suburban avenue lined with houses, or a country laneway shaded by trees. The road is just a means to an end, rather than an actual place.
Leonard seems to be advocating a very spartan, bare, minimalist approach which strips away some of the enjoyable and useful parts of prose. I'm sure that Leonard's tips worked for him, but I'm not sure they apply universally. Or, if they do apply to everyone, then we have to rely on good writers knowing which rules to break, and when.
His rules are probably too strict because new writers are too in love with their words. I doubt specifying a tree-lined suburban street is too detailed. But go the other way to techno-thrillers...
His rules are probably too strict because new writers are too in love with their words. I doubt specifying a tree-lined suburban street is too detailed. But go the other way to techno-thrillers where the author details the exact grain weight of the bullet fired from the exact model of the pistol using exactly this much pressure on the exact aftermarket trigger... Ugh.
As for writing patois, I much prefer the author that says "he said in a thick Southern drawl" compared to all the apostrophes and painful phonetics through a long conversation. If the pronunciation matters to the topic, say it causes a misunderstanding, sure, show me how they said it.
Definitely should be common sense, especially the first point about consistent spelling. When it comes to thesaurus writing, I suspect you are selecting the best word where a lot of people...
Definitely should be common sense, especially the first point about consistent spelling.
When it comes to thesaurus writing, I suspect you are selecting the best word where a lot of people literally just look for fancier words. I know I use to :p
In many of the books I read, they don't even have "said"s, it's mostly just lists of quotations back and forth and you have to remember or guess from context who's saying what. This mostly works...
In many of the books I read, they don't even have "said"s, it's mostly just lists of quotations back and forth and you have to remember or guess from context who's saying what. This mostly works fine for 1:1 conversations.
I often find that, about halfway through those passages, I have to go back to the beginning and start counting each line of dialogue! "A, B, A, B, A, B, A, B, A... ah-hah! So this line was said by...
I often find that, about halfway through those passages, I have to go back to the beginning and start counting each line of dialogue! "A, B, A, B, A, B, A, B, A... ah-hah! So this line was said by B. Now it makes sense!"
Yeah, I have to do that sometimes too. Often I find that authors (purposefully?) put in turns of phrase or things in the dialog to help anchor. (Like "Your sister" if you know only one character...
Yeah, I have to do that sometimes too. Often I find that authors (purposefully?) put in turns of phrase or things in the dialog to help anchor. (Like "Your sister" if you know only one character has a sister or whatever, or calling someone by a title that only works for one person in the conversation like "dad")
I was taught similar, but a lot of the modern common advice I read is in favor of "said", or to occasionally abstain from tags if the flow makes it clear who is speaking. The idea is that any...
I was taught similar, but a lot of the modern common advice I read is in favor of "said", or to occasionally abstain from tags if the flow makes it clear who is speaking. The idea is that any dialogue tags ought to be invisible to the reader to let the dialogue remain in focus. Show how something is said, rather than tell the reader straight-up. For example:
"You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off!" Charlie said loudly.
vs
Charlie's face fell as the smoke cleared. "You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off!"
Arthur winced at the words.
Both are perfectly alright, but something along the lines of the latter is currently in fashion. Of course there will be differences in expectations between age groups, subject matter, literary vs genre fiction, and such. As an art-form, there is no objectively correct way to write; just a kind of zeitgeist to be aware of, which we can decide to go along with, or to subvert in our own way.
Of the two examples you gave, the second is clearly better. Of course, it benefits from having someone react to Charlie's dialogue, which the first example lacks. I would point out, though, that...
Of the two examples you gave, the second is clearly better. Of course, it benefits from having someone react to Charlie's dialogue, which the first example lacks.
I would point out, though, that "said loudly" is very clunky. I would go for the simple "shouted" in that case. Maybe "shouted in exasperation" (because "exasperatedly" is too awkward) if one wants to add a bit of colour.
Another approach would be:
Charlie evaluated the scene as the smoke cleared. "You were only supposed to blow the bloody doors off," he muttered through gritted teeth. Arthur winced.
As an art-form, there is no objectively correct way to write; just a kind of zeitgeist to be aware of, which we can decide to go along with, or to subvert in our own way.
I would neither go along with, nor subvert, a zeitgeist. I'll write my way, dammit!
I agree with these, though of course some of them can be tweaked from time to time. The whole thing about not writing about mundane details, for example: "Williams continued thinking about the...
I agree with these, though of course some of them can be tweaked from time to time. The whole thing about not writing about mundane details, for example:
"Williams continued thinking about the crime scene all that morning, and it was while he was in his grooming routine that the pieces finally clicked. He went slack-jawed, the toothbrush falling unnoticed into the sink as he turned and ran to the phone."
Yeah I think definitely it's about purposefully using them and not just allowing them to slip into your writing without reason. Having said that, there are so many published authors that do a lot...
Yeah I think definitely it's about purposefully using them and not just allowing them to slip into your writing without reason. Having said that, there are so many published authors that do a lot of these.
With NaNoWriMo coming up, I thought I would share my favourite "writing tips" video. Not sure if it made me a better writer, but it definitely made me more insufferable when discussing YA novels.
Many of these are (or should be!) common sense.
I was surprised to see her recommend that "said" and "asked" should make up the majority of your dialogue tags. I was taught quite emphatically in high school that we should use a variety of words to indicate speech, so that stories don't become a series of "he said" and "she said" sentences.
No thesaurus writing? But that's how I write normally! I don't necessarily go looking for the bigger, fancier words - they just come out that way. :(
And adverbs are fun! Hmph.
EDIT: Oops!
Elmore Leonard had two writing rules on the topic.
3: Never use a verb other than “said” to carry dialogue:
The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in. But said is far less intrusive than grumbled, gasped, cautioned, lied.
4. Never use an adverb to modify the verb “said”
… he admonished gravely. To use an adverb this way (or almost any way) is a mortal sin. The writer is now exposing himself in earnest, using a word that distracts and can interrupt the rhythm of the exchange.
https://www.liferichpublishing.com/AuthorResources/General/Elmore-Leonards-Ten-Rules-Of-Writing.aspx
True. But there are a lot of less-intrusive dialogue words one could use than these cheesy ones ripped from the pulp pages - such as remarked, replied, or observed.
Also, some dialogue words are necessary to set the scene: having someone whisper "I love you" sets a very different tone than having them simply say it; if they shout "I love you!", it sets a different tone again.
"She walked along the road." What do we care if she strode briskly or strolled casually? That doesn't matter. It's not like knowing how she walked tells us anything about her state of mind or her character. All we care about is that she walked.
Welp. That's it for Charles Dickens and Mark Twain! They're obviously bad writers. Because we all know that all characters speak with exactly the same accents. We're all talking Received Pronunciation to each other.
Going back to our protagonist walking along a road, it's obviously entirely irrelevant whether the road is a crowded city street filled with shops and offices, or a suburban avenue lined with houses, or a country laneway shaded by trees. The road is just a means to an end, rather than an actual place.
Leonard seems to be advocating a very spartan, bare, minimalist approach which strips away some of the enjoyable and useful parts of prose. I'm sure that Leonard's tips worked for him, but I'm not sure they apply universally. Or, if they do apply to everyone, then we have to rely on good writers knowing which rules to break, and when.
EDIT: Missed a word.
His rules are probably too strict because new writers are too in love with their words. I doubt specifying a tree-lined suburban street is too detailed. But go the other way to techno-thrillers where the author details the exact grain weight of the bullet fired from the exact model of the pistol using exactly this much pressure on the exact aftermarket trigger... Ugh.
As for writing patois, I much prefer the author that says "he said in a thick Southern drawl" compared to all the apostrophes and painful phonetics through a long conversation. If the pronunciation matters to the topic, say it causes a misunderstanding, sure, show me how they said it.
Definitely should be common sense, especially the first point about consistent spelling.
When it comes to thesaurus writing, I suspect you are selecting the best word where a lot of people literally just look for fancier words. I know I use to :p
In many of the books I read, they don't even have "said"s, it's mostly just lists of quotations back and forth and you have to remember or guess from context who's saying what. This mostly works fine for 1:1 conversations.
I often find that, about halfway through those passages, I have to go back to the beginning and start counting each line of dialogue! "A, B, A, B, A, B, A, B, A... ah-hah! So this line was said by B. Now it makes sense!"
Yeah, I have to do that sometimes too. Often I find that authors (purposefully?) put in turns of phrase or things in the dialog to help anchor. (Like "Your sister" if you know only one character has a sister or whatever, or calling someone by a title that only works for one person in the conversation like "dad")
I was taught similar, but a lot of the modern common advice I read is in favor of "said", or to occasionally abstain from tags if the flow makes it clear who is speaking. The idea is that any dialogue tags ought to be invisible to the reader to let the dialogue remain in focus. Show how something is said, rather than tell the reader straight-up. For example:
vs
Both are perfectly alright, but something along the lines of the latter is currently in fashion. Of course there will be differences in expectations between age groups, subject matter, literary vs genre fiction, and such. As an art-form, there is no objectively correct way to write; just a kind of zeitgeist to be aware of, which we can decide to go along with, or to subvert in our own way.
Of the two examples you gave, the second is clearly better. Of course, it benefits from having someone react to Charlie's dialogue, which the first example lacks.
I would point out, though, that "said loudly" is very clunky. I would go for the simple "shouted" in that case. Maybe "shouted in exasperation" (because "exasperatedly" is too awkward) if one wants to add a bit of colour.
Another approach would be:
I would neither go along with, nor subvert, a zeitgeist. I'll write my way, dammit!
I agree with these, though of course some of them can be tweaked from time to time. The whole thing about not writing about mundane details, for example:
"Williams continued thinking about the crime scene all that morning, and it was while he was in his grooming routine that the pieces finally clicked. He went slack-jawed, the toothbrush falling unnoticed into the sink as he turned and ran to the phone."
Yeah I think definitely it's about purposefully using them and not just allowing them to slip into your writing without reason. Having said that, there are so many published authors that do a lot of these.
Some of the examples are quite humorous
I thought the similar names and unnecessary small talk were pretty funny myself.
Thanks! I didn't know there were so many ways to mess up!
There are definitely a couple things I never noticed in my own writing, but now just seem like glaringly bad after watching this lol.