This kind of stood out to me. Are you in a very harsh conditions, e.g. salt water? Steel beams exposed to rain should not be "rusting immediately". Even scratches in paint should quickly passivate...
All parts of our machinery that aren't fully coated in paint (or have a scratch etc.) start rusting pretty much immediately.
This kind of stood out to me. Are you in a very harsh conditions, e.g. salt water? Steel beams exposed to rain should not be "rusting immediately". Even scratches in paint should quickly passivate in air and not continue to succumb to rust. If there's salt water, you're fighting an entirely different battle, and there's no way around regularly reapplying the coating.
In the end, corrosion engineering is a complex subject. If you don't trust your suppliers to do it well, you might need outside help. Either another supplier or an expert consultant.
More information is needed. A rust-resistant process/coating is relatively easy for something that just sits outside, but like war, no plan survives contact with the enemy. You can't rustproof the...
More information is needed.
A rust-resistant process/coating is relatively easy for something that just sits outside, but like war, no plan survives contact with the enemy. You can't rustproof the bucket of an excavator for example because the nature of the work itself is going to remove any rustproof coating and the sheer size of the piece negates the use of inherently rustproof materials.
What is the machinery required to do?
What is the material's purpose? Sheet metal surrounding a power unit is easier than plate used for the machine's tool, for example.
What are the cost/size restraints?
At present if you're experiencing rust as soon as the powdercoating is breached, then it sounds like you're using a very low carbon steel which is going to be more susceptible to such than a higher carbon steel which takes more time to do so.
Yep. Low carbon steel is also known as mild steel, it's quite ductile, but has low surface hardness, low tensile strength, is faster to wear, faster to fail, and is far cheaper.
Bonus question: wouldn't higher carbon steel also be more structurally sound at the same time (regarding bearing loads)?
Yep. Low carbon steel is also known as mild steel, it's quite ductile, but has low surface hardness, low tensile strength, is faster to wear, faster to fail, and is far cheaper.
I'm no expert, but I believe your choices are: Spray paint Powder coat Galvanize Stainless steel I think these probably run in both cost and effectiveness from bad to good from the spray painting...
I'm no expert, but I believe your choices are:
Spray paint
Powder coat
Galvanize
Stainless steel
I think these probably run in both cost and effectiveness from bad to good from the spray painting to the stainless.
There might also be different choices when it comes to the powder coat material. Also ensure that the coating used is UV stablised if it's going to be used outside. I'd also look into what can be done prior to coating to ensure that the metal is fully free from grease and impurities.
But you can't blame your manufacturer for rusting of scratched and unpainted parts: why else do you think you're painting them in the first place?
If you're unhappy with the resultant coating, you should talk to your supplier about what other options are available or look for other companies if this doesn't bear fruit.
This is one of those weird areas I happen to randomly have some experience with due to some past work experience. Check out Cortec since they specialize in making products for exactly this type of...
This is one of those weird areas I happen to randomly have some experience with due to some past work experience. Check out Cortec since they specialize in making products for exactly this type of rust prevention. They make a variety of products and even have some strong enough in use on oil platforms out in the ocean dealing with salt water rust corrosion. Maybe they have a type of product that can help for your needs.
This might sound strange, but maybe get in contact with vegogarden. I have their beds, and they've been far better than any other metal garden bed I've owned. I thought it was just powder-coated...
This might sound strange, but maybe get in contact with vegogarden. I have their beds, and they've been far better than any other metal garden bed I've owned.
I thought it was just powder-coated galvanized steel, but they supposedly have created their own material. Perhaps they'd be willing to license it.
VZ 2.0 is a highly corrosion-resistant steel substrate, hot-dip-coated in a specialized layer of Zinc, Aluminum, and about 3% Magnesium. While Aluzinc is quite impervious, the addition of Magnesium to this formula revolutionizes the metal’s ability to resist corrosion, especially on cut or raw edges. Over time as a cut edge of the metal is exposed, the Zinc and Magnesium work together to form a protective film, sealing the exposed steel substrate and protecting it from rust and corrosion.
ZAM (Zinc-Aluminum-Magnesium coated steel), is a common material/coating available in manufacturing so they didn't create their own material, they just upgraded from Aluzinc to ZAM. The evolution...
ZAM (Zinc-Aluminum-Magnesium coated steel), is a common material/coating available in manufacturing so they didn't create their own material, they just upgraded from Aluzinc to ZAM.
The evolution of coated sheet metal like the corrugated steel used in their beds has generally gone from galvanzing (zinc only) to Aluzinc (aluminium, zinc, silicon) to ZAM as the processes to make each have become more refined and economically feasible.
What you say makes sense. I think their VZ 2.0 is also with a coating of AkzoNobel anti-corrosive paint, probably something like this. Still helpful to know what they say is mostly marketing fluff.
What you say makes sense. I think their VZ 2.0 is also with a coating of AkzoNobel anti-corrosive paint, probably something like this. Still helpful to know what they say is mostly marketing fluff.
I wonder how hard that is to set up. I'm guessing that if that company OP is dealing with didn't suggest it or isn't' doing it already then they're likely not set up to do it. They could look at...
hot-dip-coated
I wonder how hard that is to set up. I'm guessing that if that company OP is dealing with didn't suggest it or isn't' doing it already then they're likely not set up to do it.
They could look at doing a sacrificial cathode](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathodic_protection). This whole thing is not my skill set, but it shouldn't be that hard to slap a chunk of zinc onto the equipment.
I used to manage a lot of structural steel projects for highways locations (regular weather plus winter road salt exposure). The bullet-proof combination that provided high coating durability and...
I used to manage a lot of structural steel projects for highways locations (regular weather plus winter road salt exposure). The bullet-proof combination that provided high coating durability and long-term corrosion protection was sand-blast or wheel-abrading to remove scale and surface rust, immediately followed by high-build zinc-based primer (before rust bloom starts), then epoxy or urethane top coat (depending on how critical long-term color stability is). Even if scratched or chipped, the primer impeded corrosion.
Solutions like this aren't cheap, but you truly get what you pay for in this case.
You should definitely look at zinc plating as an undercoat to the powdercoating. Just powdercoating is not enough for rust protection. Or use stainless steel (316 grade is the best for rust...
You should definitely look at zinc plating as an undercoat to the powdercoating. Just powdercoating is not enough for rust protection.
Or use stainless steel (316 grade is the best for rust protection, but is expensive and has greater hardness which makes machining a bit more time consuming) . Also Take a look at PVD if the budget is high.
Plenty of other users have already mentioned types of steel (stainless), metal treatments (galvanization) and coatings such as various zinc / aluminium based materials. Good suggestions all to...
Plenty of other users have already mentioned types of steel (stainless), metal treatments (galvanization) and coatings such as various zinc / aluminium based materials. Good suggestions all to look into.
I'd also add that you should be looking at contact points between metals: are your fasteners (especially the fasteners which are surface-exposed) a dissimilar metal? If they are even a different alloy or don't have the same treatment (galvanization / alloy coating) then you can be creating an anode-cathode contact point which will be primed and ready to initiate corrosion. This is generally an easy thing to test for as it becomes visually obvious if you have corrosion starting / spreading out from fasteners.
Next up: you mention that the rust is happening on what is essentially an excavator chassis. That sounds like heavy equipment that will be expected to endure harsh conditions including things like gravel strikes and such (digging / stone breaking / earth moving). There is only so much endurance you can expect a surface treatment to endure if it is the thickness of a few coats of paint. An armoring process might be called for such as a certain thickness of Rhino-Liner. This can be put on to most any specified thickness, the trade-off (other than cost) being that it will make welding repairs afterwards an absolute pain - or anything else that needs access to the metal surface such as bolts.
This kind of stood out to me. Are you in a very harsh conditions, e.g. salt water? Steel beams exposed to rain should not be "rusting immediately". Even scratches in paint should quickly passivate in air and not continue to succumb to rust. If there's salt water, you're fighting an entirely different battle, and there's no way around regularly reapplying the coating.
In the end, corrosion engineering is a complex subject. If you don't trust your suppliers to do it well, you might need outside help. Either another supplier or an expert consultant.
More information is needed.
A rust-resistant process/coating is relatively easy for something that just sits outside, but like war, no plan survives contact with the enemy. You can't rustproof the bucket of an excavator for example because the nature of the work itself is going to remove any rustproof coating and the sheer size of the piece negates the use of inherently rustproof materials.
At present if you're experiencing rust as soon as the powdercoating is breached, then it sounds like you're using a very low carbon steel which is going to be more susceptible to such than a higher carbon steel which takes more time to do so.
Yep. Low carbon steel is also known as mild steel, it's quite ductile, but has low surface hardness, low tensile strength, is faster to wear, faster to fail, and is far cheaper.
I'm no expert, but I believe your choices are:
I think these probably run in both cost and effectiveness from bad to good from the spray painting to the stainless.
There might also be different choices when it comes to the powder coat material. Also ensure that the coating used is UV stablised if it's going to be used outside. I'd also look into what can be done prior to coating to ensure that the metal is fully free from grease and impurities.
But you can't blame your manufacturer for rusting of scratched and unpainted parts: why else do you think you're painting them in the first place?
If you're unhappy with the resultant coating, you should talk to your supplier about what other options are available or look for other companies if this doesn't bear fruit.
This is one of those weird areas I happen to randomly have some experience with due to some past work experience. Check out Cortec since they specialize in making products for exactly this type of rust prevention. They make a variety of products and even have some strong enough in use on oil platforms out in the ocean dealing with salt water rust corrosion. Maybe they have a type of product that can help for your needs.
This might sound strange, but maybe get in contact with vegogarden. I have their beds, and they've been far better than any other metal garden bed I've owned.
I thought it was just powder-coated galvanized steel, but they supposedly have created their own material. Perhaps they'd be willing to license it.
ZAM (Zinc-Aluminum-Magnesium coated steel), is a common material/coating available in manufacturing so they didn't create their own material, they just upgraded from Aluzinc to ZAM.
The evolution of coated sheet metal like the corrugated steel used in their beds has generally gone from galvanzing (zinc only) to Aluzinc (aluminium, zinc, silicon) to ZAM as the processes to make each have become more refined and economically feasible.
What you say makes sense. I think their VZ 2.0 is also with a coating of AkzoNobel anti-corrosive paint, probably something like this. Still helpful to know what they say is mostly marketing fluff.
I wonder how hard that is to set up. I'm guessing that if that company OP is dealing with didn't suggest it or isn't' doing it already then they're likely not set up to do it.
They could look at doing a sacrificial cathode](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathodic_protection). This whole thing is not my skill set, but it shouldn't be that hard to slap a chunk of zinc onto the equipment.
I was thinking about the powder coat/paint and I found out you can get paint with a large amount of zinc in it. Example.
I used to manage a lot of structural steel projects for highways locations (regular weather plus winter road salt exposure). The bullet-proof combination that provided high coating durability and long-term corrosion protection was sand-blast or wheel-abrading to remove scale and surface rust, immediately followed by high-build zinc-based primer (before rust bloom starts), then epoxy or urethane top coat (depending on how critical long-term color stability is). Even if scratched or chipped, the primer impeded corrosion.
Solutions like this aren't cheap, but you truly get what you pay for in this case.
You should definitely look at zinc plating as an undercoat to the powdercoating. Just powdercoating is not enough for rust protection.
Or use stainless steel (316 grade is the best for rust protection, but is expensive and has greater hardness which makes machining a bit more time consuming) . Also Take a look at PVD if the budget is high.
Plenty of other users have already mentioned types of steel (stainless), metal treatments (galvanization) and coatings such as various zinc / aluminium based materials. Good suggestions all to look into.
I'd also add that you should be looking at contact points between metals: are your fasteners (especially the fasteners which are surface-exposed) a dissimilar metal? If they are even a different alloy or don't have the same treatment (galvanization / alloy coating) then you can be creating an anode-cathode contact point which will be primed and ready to initiate corrosion. This is generally an easy thing to test for as it becomes visually obvious if you have corrosion starting / spreading out from fasteners.
Next up: you mention that the rust is happening on what is essentially an excavator chassis. That sounds like heavy equipment that will be expected to endure harsh conditions including things like gravel strikes and such (digging / stone breaking / earth moving). There is only so much endurance you can expect a surface treatment to endure if it is the thickness of a few coats of paint. An armoring process might be called for such as a certain thickness of Rhino-Liner. This can be put on to most any specified thickness, the trade-off (other than cost) being that it will make welding repairs afterwards an absolute pain - or anything else that needs access to the metal surface such as bolts.