I haven't played the game and I doubt I will, but I did massively enjoy Disco Elysium and it's probably my second favourite game of all time. To those who have played it: Does it bring something...
I haven't played the game and I doubt I will, but I did massively enjoy Disco Elysium and it's probably my second favourite game of all time. To those who have played it: Does it bring something new to the table other than "D&D Disco Elysium"? Because I struggle to contain my cynicism when looking at such a vulnerable, raw, angry, caring and earnest piece of art like Disco Elysium and seeing it filtered through the aesthetic and mechanics of Critical Role.
Its similarities to Disco are principally mechanical (and the dev has been very open about taking inspiration from Disco on this front). It engages with political themes more deeply/explicitly...
Its similarities to Disco are principally mechanical (and the dev has been very open about taking inspiration from Disco on this front). It engages with political themes more deeply/explicitly than most other games but much less deeply than Disco (though ofc Disco has set a pretty absurdly high bar there). There is also clearly a lot of passion put into its story and setting, which isn't derivative of Disco's and is at least a well-constructed take on "D&D setting". There was lore that felt unique and fascinating once I got far enough, and as someone who is not a fan of D&D5e and considers Forgotten Realms pretty meh, I honestly wasn't expecting it to. The writer has definitely put a lot of thought into worldbuilding, at least, even if it's very much not Elysium-level.
Afaik the game was already in development when Disco came out and the dev took inspiration from Disco's mechanics upon playing it, which very much shows, and it is hard to play it without noticing things that Disco did better, but it generally does use the mechanics it borrows from Disco well enough and on rare occasions improves on them. I don't think it should be begrudged for borrowing mechanical inspiration from Disco, especially when Disco itself was so heavily inspired by a lineage of CRPGs that very much also has its roots in D&D lore and culture (Planescape Torment being the obvious one to point out but by no means the only one). I'm up to embrace more entries in a genre I like -- to analogize to another gaming genre, Nine Sols is still enjoyable and telling its own story despite deriving a shitload of inspiration from Hollow Knight, and the gaming landscape is richer for having both games in them. I think the same is true for games that take obvious inspiration from Disco Elysium. After all, good art is inspiring, and taking inspiration from art you enjoy and/or respect is a key part of creation.
Esoteric Ebb doesn't remotely compare to Disco Elysium in terms of quality, but Disco Elysium is one of my favorite works of art period, so that's an impossibly high bar for anything to meet. But it is well-written on the whole and is a very fun time (with a much lighter tone than Disco) if you can avoid comparing the two constantly while playing. They're tonally going for pretty different things most of the time, and even when it borrows heavily from Disco (like the political side), Ebb does some things that are genuinely interesting in their own right, even when they aren't as good as Disco. It's also got a pretty tiny indie team behind it, and it's definitely not a cynical cash grab trying to rake in that sweet Disco money (like cough cough some other games that have been announced recently).
EDIT TO ADD: Honestly like half of this could be summed up by Yahtzee describing it as being good if you want something "shorter and snackier than Disco Elysium with goblins in it", but yeah.
TL DR. It turned into a review. Long story short. Not exactly Disco and far from any of the popular DnD shows or modules. Worth the time if on discount. One friend of mine likend it to a Monty...
TL DR. It turned into a review. Long story short. Not exactly Disco and far from any of the popular DnD shows or modules. Worth the time if on discount.
One friend of mine likend it to a Monty Python/Blackadder RPG and another said its like playing Harry from DE, playing a TTRPG. I agree with both.
It pulls a lot of the aesthetics and broad structure of DE. The PoV and map layout/styles. Your stats shaping you thinking/perspective. The investigation story and too patient assistant (its no Lt Kim but a good enough substitute). But I felt it stands on its own and the dev feels inspired while doing his own thing.
Theres an air of sillyness to the whole thing with some easier social commentary. Gender roles, politics, labour/capital, colonialism and race relations, drinking a potion that may have changed your biological sex, revival magic, eating sentient beings, religion, laws... Nothing too inflammatory like in DE but it's nice to see NPCs have opinions on these topics and it's relevant with the state of the wider world. I honestly looked forward to talking to the halfling anthropologist or the orc merchant rep and even the various politicians you cross paths with.
Its definitely not Critical Role, but there are some hints of Dimension 20 with the tone becoming pretty cerebral and introspective at times.
Because it's a very low level game, magic is a situational tool, gear is mostly stat mods/story options and there's "combat" encounters that is more about decision making over dealing damage. And overall I'd say the DnD framework was the weakest part of the game because this adventure hits all of the systems weak spots.
Fundamentally, 5e is a power fantasy engine with 500 ways to kill someone and 2 ways to navigate a conversation.
It feels like a D20 dice allowed for far too much variability and even with boosted stats, there were several times where I just had long streaks of bad to near-hit rolls. Combine that with the other DnD problem where there is very little incentive for specialists over multi-classing and I can see the RPG systems being redundant over multiple games.
I decided to go all in on charisma since this is a more social game, but it felt like I never got any meaningful moments for that skill to shine or a true tests that any other build would fail. And on the flip side, I could reliably gear my way to most other high DC rolls with minimal save scumming.
But I can see why 5e would work a lot better as a business decision given how it is the default RPG a lot of people know and its on the back of a game, movie and all the web shows.
Overall, I like it. Reminds me of my style of GMing that is a lot lighter on combat and quests are a web of intersecting interests. It feels a lot lighter to almost being whimsical at times. There is also some amazing failure outcomes and plenty of chances to do cool things with a disaster character that is surprisingly good at their job.
I think your comment is fair... I would say them comparing it to Disco Elysium does it a disservice. Other than the presentation (which is "Discolike"), it doesn't have much in common with what...
I think your comment is fair... I would say them comparing it to Disco Elysium does it a disservice. Other than the presentation (which is "Discolike"), it doesn't have much in common with what made Disco Elysium unique.
What it is, is an enjoyable game that feels like it respects your choices (either that or has manipulated me into making the choices it wants me to make...) and feels akin to playing a TTRPG, which I enjoy.
That said, while I am enjoying it, it does have a particular non-serious tone a lot of the time that I don't love (just because it feels like everything gets that exact same tone lately)
I hear you there. I also struggle with respecting this game's concept with it being a seeming copy-paste of the most interesting factors of Disco Elysium. Certainly, if you're going to copy an...
Because I struggle to contain my cynicism when looking at such a vulnerable, raw, angry, caring and earnest piece of art like Disco Elysium and seeing it filtered through the aesthetic and mechanics of Critical Role.
I hear you there. I also struggle with respecting this game's concept with it being a seeming copy-paste of the most interesting factors of Disco Elysium. Certainly, if you're going to copy an idea, copy a good one — but part of what makes these ideas compelling is their originality. The way the review says it, it sounds like the whole "stats have personalities" thing was just done because Disco did it and that to me suggests a lack of understanding or inspiration. This is made worse by the way the character's "blank slate" shtick sounds like it was done in a much more boring way than what DE did. (i.e. plain old getting killed rather than substance abuse)
But all that said, I've watched Yahtzee since 2016 and my tastes match his pretty well. If he liked this one – as it seems he does – then for all my cynicism I have to assume it's a successful case of "if you're not going to do something new, at least do it right." Probably will be a while before I get to it, but I'm gonna have to be adding it to my wishlist.
I've intentionally put off watching this episode of Yahtzee's because his teardowns either spoil the game or make me not want to play them lol. Looking forward to comparing notes once I'm finished...
I've intentionally put off watching this episode of Yahtzee's because his teardowns either spoil the game or make me not want to play them lol.
Looking forward to comparing notes once I'm finished the game. Say, as a Second Wind fan, did you follow Frost (Cold Take) on his new channel?
You must not watch him too much! His reviews were generally positive for Mewgenics and Pokemon Pokopia if I recall correctly, and last year had good reception for Dispatch and a very kind review...
in years.
You must not watch him too much! His reviews were generally positive for Mewgenics and Pokemon Pokopia if I recall correctly, and last year had good reception for Dispatch and a very kind review of Hades 2 and Blue Prince. Not to mention The Alters, which he was his GOTY for 2025 and he outright said he was championing it.
I feel like he's made a point of reviewing more of the types of games where he's likely to find redeeming qualities. At least it feels like he's reviewing more indie games and fewer exhausting...
I feel like he's made a point of reviewing more of the types of games where he's likely to find redeeming qualities. At least it feels like he's reviewing more indie games and fewer exhausting triple-A titles. I think that's definitely contributed to there being more positive reviews from him lately. I bought the Alters solely based on his review, for instance.
Different fan but no. I liked Frost's series but the way he quit and tried to publicly burn trust in (editor-in-chief) Nick Calandra afterward left me wanting nothing to do with him.
Say, as a Second Wind fan, did you follow Frost (Cold Take) on his new channel?
Different fan but no. I liked Frost's series but the way he quit and tried to publicly burn trust in (editor-in-chief) Nick Calandra afterward left me wanting nothing to do with him.
I feel similarly. I want to believe that Frost truly felt he was doing the right thing, but that belies some pretty serious naïveté and misunderstanding. Real damn shame too, because Cold Take and...
I feel similarly. I want to believe that Frost truly felt he was doing the right thing, but that belies some pretty serious naïveté and misunderstanding. Real damn shame too, because Cold Take and Chronicle were both good stuff.
Oh yeah, that was the shittiest outro ever. He published an absolute hit piece on his new channel that had my wife and I saying: "entertaining guy, but I'd hate to work with him". That said, his...
Oh yeah, that was the shittiest outro ever. He published an absolute hit piece on his new channel that had my wife and I saying: "entertaining guy, but I'd hate to work with him".
That said, his The Other Frost channel is awesome and I'd absolutely recommend it.
His take is basically a perfect distillation of my feelings on it (and I very much enjoyed the game when I played it!) and spoils pretty much nothing at all.
His take is basically a perfect distillation of my feelings on it (and I very much enjoyed the game when I played it!) and spoils pretty much nothing at all.
I played the demo and watch this and was completely turned off the game. I know Yahtzee's style well enough to pick the source material out of his jokes and have basically been informed that this...
I played the demo and watch this and was completely turned off the game. I know Yahtzee's style well enough to pick the source material out of his jokes and have basically been informed that this game isn't really gonna be for me. I didn't like DE, either, when I tried it. It... "Insists upon itself" in a similar way to Esoteric Ebb.
Not that I at all think it's a bad game. But it was a hard bounce for me. I find it funny that even a snarky aussie hopped up on caffeine and the aural equivalent of jump cuts can also accurately distill a game to its core points in an entertaining and mostly accurate way.
It's easy enough to tell. Second Wind posts their quarterly financials for transparency's sake, as they're largely supported by donations. Not individual salaries, but you can assume that as the...
It's easy enough to tell. Second Wind posts their quarterly financials for transparency's sake, as they're largely supported by donations. Not individual salaries, but you can assume that as the star attraction he's got a notable slice of the pie.
Part of the reason Frost left Second Wind on bad terms was that he was upset at how much Yahtzee gets paid. Which on it's face is legitimate, but for years Yahtzee was the only reason anyone...
Part of the reason Frost left Second Wind on bad terms was that he was upset at how much Yahtzee gets paid. Which on it's face is legitimate, but for years Yahtzee was the only reason anyone watched Escapist videos, and to be honest even today I only watch him and Design Delve.
I do think Frost's videos were an absolute highlight of early Second Wind, but competitive with Fully Ramblomatic? Something that would cause people to come back week after week for decades? I...
I do think Frost's videos were an absolute highlight of early Second Wind, but competitive with Fully Ramblomatic? Something that would cause people to come back week after week for decades? I think he did a poor job of proving that, and then a doubly poor job of making it seem like anyone should work with him in the future when he publicly blew up about it. Negotiate compensation? Absolutely. Throw a fit in public? Eeeh. He may have the voice of a career PI, but he had the business instincts of a young man trying to fight for recognition he hadn't yet earned.
Well put. Did you see Frost's initial hit piece video where he drags out all members of Second Wind for a lashing? It was in such poor taste, but like a car accident in progress, I couldn't turn away.
Well put. Did you see Frost's initial hit piece video where he drags out all members of Second Wind for a lashing? It was in such poor taste, but like a car accident in progress, I couldn't turn away.
Yeah, I did. I don't recall anything in it being all that scandalous aside from Nick's poor taste in engaging with people on social media. Beyond that, which has been resolved, it all felt like a...
Yeah, I did. I don't recall anything in it being all that scandalous aside from Nick's poor taste in engaging with people on social media. Beyond that, which has been resolved, it all felt like a nothingburger of basic workplace disagreements?
Yeah, and the musings of a bitter man about all of the super in-depth reasons to dislike everybody he worked with. For such an insightful guy, it was so incredibly small of him.
Yeah, and the musings of a bitter man about all of the super in-depth reasons to dislike everybody he worked with.
For such an insightful guy, it was so incredibly small of him.
I haven't played the game and I doubt I will, but I did massively enjoy Disco Elysium and it's probably my second favourite game of all time. To those who have played it: Does it bring something new to the table other than "D&D Disco Elysium"? Because I struggle to contain my cynicism when looking at such a vulnerable, raw, angry, caring and earnest piece of art like Disco Elysium and seeing it filtered through the aesthetic and mechanics of Critical Role.
Its similarities to Disco are principally mechanical (and the dev has been very open about taking inspiration from Disco on this front). It engages with political themes more deeply/explicitly than most other games but much less deeply than Disco (though ofc Disco has set a pretty absurdly high bar there). There is also clearly a lot of passion put into its story and setting, which isn't derivative of Disco's and is at least a well-constructed take on "D&D setting". There was lore that felt unique and fascinating once I got far enough, and as someone who is not a fan of D&D5e and considers Forgotten Realms pretty meh, I honestly wasn't expecting it to. The writer has definitely put a lot of thought into worldbuilding, at least, even if it's very much not Elysium-level.
Afaik the game was already in development when Disco came out and the dev took inspiration from Disco's mechanics upon playing it, which very much shows, and it is hard to play it without noticing things that Disco did better, but it generally does use the mechanics it borrows from Disco well enough and on rare occasions improves on them. I don't think it should be begrudged for borrowing mechanical inspiration from Disco, especially when Disco itself was so heavily inspired by a lineage of CRPGs that very much also has its roots in D&D lore and culture (Planescape Torment being the obvious one to point out but by no means the only one). I'm up to embrace more entries in a genre I like -- to analogize to another gaming genre, Nine Sols is still enjoyable and telling its own story despite deriving a shitload of inspiration from Hollow Knight, and the gaming landscape is richer for having both games in them. I think the same is true for games that take obvious inspiration from Disco Elysium. After all, good art is inspiring, and taking inspiration from art you enjoy and/or respect is a key part of creation.
Esoteric Ebb doesn't remotely compare to Disco Elysium in terms of quality, but Disco Elysium is one of my favorite works of art period, so that's an impossibly high bar for anything to meet. But it is well-written on the whole and is a very fun time (with a much lighter tone than Disco) if you can avoid comparing the two constantly while playing. They're tonally going for pretty different things most of the time, and even when it borrows heavily from Disco (like the political side), Ebb does some things that are genuinely interesting in their own right, even when they aren't as good as Disco. It's also got a pretty tiny indie team behind it, and it's definitely not a cynical cash grab trying to rake in that sweet Disco money (like cough cough some other games that have been announced recently).
EDIT TO ADD: Honestly like half of this could be summed up by Yahtzee describing it as being good if you want something "shorter and snackier than Disco Elysium with goblins in it", but yeah.
TL DR. It turned into a review. Long story short. Not exactly Disco and far from any of the popular DnD shows or modules. Worth the time if on discount.
One friend of mine likend it to a Monty Python/Blackadder RPG and another said its like playing Harry from DE, playing a TTRPG. I agree with both.
It pulls a lot of the aesthetics and broad structure of DE. The PoV and map layout/styles. Your stats shaping you thinking/perspective. The investigation story and too patient assistant (its no Lt Kim but a good enough substitute). But I felt it stands on its own and the dev feels inspired while doing his own thing.
Theres an air of sillyness to the whole thing with some easier social commentary. Gender roles, politics, labour/capital, colonialism and race relations, drinking a potion that may have changed your biological sex, revival magic, eating sentient beings, religion, laws... Nothing too inflammatory like in DE but it's nice to see NPCs have opinions on these topics and it's relevant with the state of the wider world. I honestly looked forward to talking to the halfling anthropologist or the orc merchant rep and even the various politicians you cross paths with.
Its definitely not Critical Role, but there are some hints of Dimension 20 with the tone becoming pretty cerebral and introspective at times.
Because it's a very low level game, magic is a situational tool, gear is mostly stat mods/story options and there's "combat" encounters that is more about decision making over dealing damage. And overall I'd say the DnD framework was the weakest part of the game because this adventure hits all of the systems weak spots.
Fundamentally, 5e is a power fantasy engine with 500 ways to kill someone and 2 ways to navigate a conversation.
It feels like a D20 dice allowed for far too much variability and even with boosted stats, there were several times where I just had long streaks of bad to near-hit rolls. Combine that with the other DnD problem where there is very little incentive for specialists over multi-classing and I can see the RPG systems being redundant over multiple games.
I decided to go all in on charisma since this is a more social game, but it felt like I never got any meaningful moments for that skill to shine or a true tests that any other build would fail. And on the flip side, I could reliably gear my way to most other high DC rolls with minimal save scumming.
But I can see why 5e would work a lot better as a business decision given how it is the default RPG a lot of people know and its on the back of a game, movie and all the web shows.
Overall, I like it. Reminds me of my style of GMing that is a lot lighter on combat and quests are a web of intersecting interests. It feels a lot lighter to almost being whimsical at times. There is also some amazing failure outcomes and plenty of chances to do cool things with a disaster character that is surprisingly good at their job.
I think your comment is fair... I would say them comparing it to Disco Elysium does it a disservice. Other than the presentation (which is "Discolike"), it doesn't have much in common with what made Disco Elysium unique.
What it is, is an enjoyable game that feels like it respects your choices (either that or has manipulated me into making the choices it wants me to make...) and feels akin to playing a TTRPG, which I enjoy.
That said, while I am enjoying it, it does have a particular non-serious tone a lot of the time that I don't love (just because it feels like everything gets that exact same tone lately)
I hear you there. I also struggle with respecting this game's concept with it being a seeming copy-paste of the most interesting factors of Disco Elysium. Certainly, if you're going to copy an idea, copy a good one — but part of what makes these ideas compelling is their originality. The way the review says it, it sounds like the whole "stats have personalities" thing was just done because Disco did it and that to me suggests a lack of understanding or inspiration. This is made worse by the way the character's "blank slate" shtick sounds like it was done in a much more boring way than what DE did. (i.e. plain old getting killed rather than substance abuse)
But all that said, I've watched Yahtzee since 2016 and my tastes match his pretty well. If he liked this one – as it seems he does – then for all my cynicism I have to assume it's a successful case of "if you're not going to do something new, at least do it right." Probably will be a while before I get to it, but I'm gonna have to be adding it to my wishlist.
I've intentionally put off watching this episode of Yahtzee's because his teardowns either spoil the game or make me not want to play them lol.
Looking forward to comparing notes once I'm finished the game. Say, as a Second Wind fan, did you follow Frost (Cold Take) on his new channel?
I will say that Yahtzee gave the closest thing to a glowing endorsement I've heard from him in years.
You must not watch him too much! His reviews were generally positive for Mewgenics and Pokemon Pokopia if I recall correctly, and last year had good reception for Dispatch and a very kind review of Hades 2 and Blue Prince. Not to mention The Alters, which he was his GOTY for 2025 and he outright said he was championing it.
I feel like he's made a point of reviewing more of the types of games where he's likely to find redeeming qualities. At least it feels like he's reviewing more indie games and fewer exhausting triple-A titles. I think that's definitely contributed to there being more positive reviews from him lately. I bought the Alters solely based on his review, for instance.
Glad to hear it. I'm tired of Return of the Obra Dinn and Silent Hill 2 being his most recent high watermarks ;)
Different fan but no. I liked Frost's series but the way he quit and tried to publicly burn trust in (editor-in-chief) Nick Calandra afterward left me wanting nothing to do with him.
I feel similarly. I want to believe that Frost truly felt he was doing the right thing, but that belies some pretty serious naïveté and misunderstanding. Real damn shame too, because Cold Take and Chronicle were both good stuff.
Definitely check out The Other Frost.
Oh yeah, that was the shittiest outro ever. He published an absolute hit piece on his new channel that had my wife and I saying: "entertaining guy, but I'd hate to work with him".
That said, his The Other Frost channel is awesome and I'd absolutely recommend it.
His take is basically a perfect distillation of my feelings on it (and I very much enjoyed the game when I played it!) and spoils pretty much nothing at all.
Ooh, now we're talking
I played the demo and watch this and was completely turned off the game. I know Yahtzee's style well enough to pick the source material out of his jokes and have basically been informed that this game isn't really gonna be for me. I didn't like DE, either, when I tried it. It... "Insists upon itself" in a similar way to Esoteric Ebb.
Not that I at all think it's a bad game. But it was a hard bounce for me. I find it funny that even a snarky aussie hopped up on caffeine and the aural equivalent of jump cuts can also accurately distill a game to its core points in an entertaining and mostly accurate way.
He's been at it for more than a decade now, so you'd better believe he's good at it. That said, he's a British expat in Aussie.
You know... I feel like I knew he was a Brit... But forgot.
Well, it's been more than a decade of weekly videos, so nobody can blame ya.
I went and looked it up. In July it'll be 19 years he's been doing this. It's rather impressive.
Wow - I wonder how many have been at it for as long and as consistently as he has.
Didn't he move to California some years ago?
Maybe you're right! I don't remember.
He did move to California and has mentioned living in the Bay Area in videos. TotalBiscuit (RIP) gave him a character reference for immigration.
Bay area on a content creator salary. I wonder how that's going.
It's easy enough to tell. Second Wind posts their quarterly financials for transparency's sake, as they're largely supported by donations. Not individual salaries, but you can assume that as the star attraction he's got a notable slice of the pie.
Part of the reason Frost left Second Wind on bad terms was that he was upset at how much Yahtzee gets paid. Which on it's face is legitimate, but for years Yahtzee was the only reason anyone watched Escapist videos, and to be honest even today I only watch him and Design Delve.
I do think Frost's videos were an absolute highlight of early Second Wind, but competitive with Fully Ramblomatic? Something that would cause people to come back week after week for decades? I think he did a poor job of proving that, and then a doubly poor job of making it seem like anyone should work with him in the future when he publicly blew up about it. Negotiate compensation? Absolutely. Throw a fit in public? Eeeh. He may have the voice of a career PI, but he had the business instincts of a young man trying to fight for recognition he hadn't yet earned.
Well put. Did you see Frost's initial hit piece video where he drags out all members of Second Wind for a lashing? It was in such poor taste, but like a car accident in progress, I couldn't turn away.
Yeah, I did. I don't recall anything in it being all that scandalous aside from Nick's poor taste in engaging with people on social media. Beyond that, which has been resolved, it all felt like a nothingburger of basic workplace disagreements?
Yeah, and the musings of a bitter man about all of the super in-depth reasons to dislike everybody he worked with.
For such an insightful guy, it was so incredibly small of him.