I found the footnotes to be the most interesting part : Their main conclusion is that hotline alone doesn't work for reducing suicide mortality. I hope the administration doesn't look at this and...
I found the footnotes to be the most interesting part :
For example, firearm possession is tied to suicide counts but is not associated with suicide ideation rates (Cook and Ludwig, 2006; Lang, 2013). Other recent evidence suggests that laws that delay the purchase of handguns reduce suicide (Donohue et al.,
2023). Moreover, Carpenter and Dobkin (2009) find alcohol access increases suicidality by 40 percent, and alcohol consumption is linked closely with impulsivity (Oscar-Berman and Marinković, 2007).
2These concerns are even higher among marginalized populations: 77% of Black respondents, 72% of Hispanic respondents, and 80% of LGBTQ+ respondents reported being afraid that police could harm them or their loved ones during a mental health
response. Empirical evidence supports these survey responses (Ang et al., 2025)
Their main conclusion is that hotline alone doesn't work for reducing suicide mortality. I hope the administration doesn't look at this and go okay let's defund it it doesn't work. This research doesn't go into reasons why someone is looking to hurt themselves. The act itself may be impulsive but if the prevailing circumstances around their despair doesn't improve, if access to alcohol is easy and socially everywhere, if guns are easily within reach, if meaningful mental health services are beyond affordability, if ongoing health problems are not addressed due to lack of health care finances, if they don't feel like their existence is safe and accepted in wider society or by the administration, if the police are to be feared rather than being of any help .... It's not impulsivity if after they hang up they're facing the same and every day declining situation.
This tracks with my education. I requested the full study to read the details (or may be able to access at work later today) but access to deadly means - firearm - is more predictive of death than...
This tracks with my education. I requested the full study to read the details (or may be able to access at work later today) but access to deadly means - firearm - is more predictive of death than having ideation. And likely the people calling hotlines are the folks who aren't at that absolute final crisis point where they choose to act. We just don't know which of the folks with ideation will act without a full evaluation (and even then). Alcohol is a known factor because along with altering your mood directly, it lowers your inhibitions and makes you more likely to act on an impulsive thought.
I try to remind people that to someone who is suicidal, death is the solution to all of those unsolvable problems, and the suicidal thoughts aren't "the problem" and shouldn't be treated as "the problem" to someone offering support, especially professionally.
Nitpick: I wouldn't even say that it's a solution to the actual problems, but more, pain alleviation to the actual problems. Eg, if I can't feed my kid I still won't be able to, but I might...
Nitpick: I wouldn't even say that it's a solution to the actual problems, but more, pain alleviation to the actual problems. Eg, if I can't feed my kid I still won't be able to, but I might desperately need to stop feeling pain about it.
I would love to hear more insights from you if you have the time, for this paper as well as other things about youth/eveyeone suicide. The hopelessness is probably a big part? Like, I think most people are aware that if they have a set time it gets better they will pull through?
It's pain relief but it's also sometimes a "perceived solution" for that reason. I'm not saying it's a good solution, but even in cases of literal chronic, terminal illness, it is a solution to...
It's pain relief but it's also sometimes a "perceived solution" for that reason. I'm not saying it's a good solution, but even in cases of literal chronic, terminal illness, it is a solution to not just the (literal and metaphorical) pain but to finances, to the feeling of being a burden, etc. In the type of situation you describe it's more that "I'm such a failure, my kid will be better off without me" is sort of a (bad) solution. But as someone who deals with passive "If I could just rest" sorts of ideation personally, there's some difference in those active vs passive thoughts.
I would love to hear more insights from you if you have the time, for this paper as well as other things about youth/eveyeone suicide. The hopelessness is probably a big part? Like, I think most people are aware that if they have a set time it gets better they will pull through?
Lack of hope, or of reasonable hope is huge. Most folks can get through that peak crisis point to the other side, even if they're fairly persistently suicidal, so they're not at immediate risk. Genuinely all it can take is "hey I'm worried about you, are you ok?" "Damn that's rough. Are you talking to a counselor or anything? When can you see them again?" And you can help folks through a lot. I don't think hotlines are able to be more effective because they can only do so much by phone or text from afar. (Set time helps but most stress is complex and not just 1 short term cause, everyone is unique though)
Oof, yeah, I guess in my hypothetical scenario if the mother has, say, life insurance, that might nudge the scenario towards "solution". Not a good one but these are folks without any good...
Oof, yeah, I guess in my hypothetical scenario if the mother has, say, life insurance, that might nudge the scenario towards "solution". Not a good one but these are folks without any good solutions and they all look pretty bleak.
I think about the let potato rest for 5 minutes (Reddit) meme a lot. I know I'm off by several magnitudes of heaviness but I hope those 5 minutes on the phone with someone helps . Sometimes it needs to be from friends, sometimes it has to be from strangers.
Ooh I don't know that meme, I'll have to look up an explainer. But yeah it's distorted thinking generally, but it's still how someone genuinely feels. And the suicide prevention program I teach to...
Ooh I don't know that meme, I'll have to look up an explainer.
But yeah it's distorted thinking generally, but it's still how someone genuinely feels. And the suicide prevention program I teach to our staff and students and sometimes faculty, emphasizes the benefit of hope.
The rollout substantially improved crisis line operations in states with larger baseline capacity gaps: these states answered more calls in-state and increased their in-state answer rates. However, these operational gains did not translate into detectable reductions in suicide mortality. The mortality estimates are precise enough to rule out even modest short-run reductions. We also find no statistically significant improvements in broader population mental health outcomes. These findings suggest that expanding crisis line capacity alone may be insufficient to reduce suicide deaths.
I found the footnotes to be the most interesting part :
Their main conclusion is that hotline alone doesn't work for reducing suicide mortality. I hope the administration doesn't look at this and go okay let's defund it it doesn't work. This research doesn't go into reasons why someone is looking to hurt themselves. The act itself may be impulsive but if the prevailing circumstances around their despair doesn't improve, if access to alcohol is easy and socially everywhere, if guns are easily within reach, if meaningful mental health services are beyond affordability, if ongoing health problems are not addressed due to lack of health care finances, if they don't feel like their existence is safe and accepted in wider society or by the administration, if the police are to be feared rather than being of any help .... It's not impulsivity if after they hang up they're facing the same and every day declining situation.
This tracks with my education. I requested the full study to read the details (or may be able to access at work later today) but access to deadly means - firearm - is more predictive of death than having ideation. And likely the people calling hotlines are the folks who aren't at that absolute final crisis point where they choose to act. We just don't know which of the folks with ideation will act without a full evaluation (and even then). Alcohol is a known factor because along with altering your mood directly, it lowers your inhibitions and makes you more likely to act on an impulsive thought.
I try to remind people that to someone who is suicidal, death is the solution to all of those unsolvable problems, and the suicidal thoughts aren't "the problem" and shouldn't be treated as "the problem" to someone offering support, especially professionally.
Nitpick: I wouldn't even say that it's a solution to the actual problems, but more, pain alleviation to the actual problems. Eg, if I can't feed my kid I still won't be able to, but I might desperately need to stop feeling pain about it.
I would love to hear more insights from you if you have the time, for this paper as well as other things about youth/eveyeone suicide. The hopelessness is probably a big part? Like, I think most people are aware that if they have a set time it gets better they will pull through?
It's pain relief but it's also sometimes a "perceived solution" for that reason. I'm not saying it's a good solution, but even in cases of literal chronic, terminal illness, it is a solution to not just the (literal and metaphorical) pain but to finances, to the feeling of being a burden, etc. In the type of situation you describe it's more that "I'm such a failure, my kid will be better off without me" is sort of a (bad) solution. But as someone who deals with passive "If I could just rest" sorts of ideation personally, there's some difference in those active vs passive thoughts.
Lack of hope, or of reasonable hope is huge. Most folks can get through that peak crisis point to the other side, even if they're fairly persistently suicidal, so they're not at immediate risk. Genuinely all it can take is "hey I'm worried about you, are you ok?" "Damn that's rough. Are you talking to a counselor or anything? When can you see them again?" And you can help folks through a lot. I don't think hotlines are able to be more effective because they can only do so much by phone or text from afar. (Set time helps but most stress is complex and not just 1 short term cause, everyone is unique though)
Oof, yeah, I guess in my hypothetical scenario if the mother has, say, life insurance, that might nudge the scenario towards "solution". Not a good one but these are folks without any good solutions and they all look pretty bleak.
I think about the let potato rest for 5 minutes (Reddit) meme a lot. I know I'm off by several magnitudes of heaviness but I hope those 5 minutes on the phone with someone helps . Sometimes it needs to be from friends, sometimes it has to be from strangers.
Ooh I don't know that meme, I'll have to look up an explainer.
But yeah it's distorted thinking generally, but it's still how someone genuinely feels. And the suicide prevention program I teach to our staff and students and sometimes faculty, emphasizes the benefit of hope.