14 votes

‘Fuck your feelings’ never applies to White men

8 comments

  1. vord
    (edited )
    Link
    Hardly a delusion, they go hand in hand, a chicken and egg problem if you will. You can't build emotional literacy when you're conditioned to suppress your emotions. To this day, it takes...

    One of the most persistent delusions of our age is that men are emotionally repressed when, in fact, they are emotionally illiterate.

    Hardly a delusion, they go hand in hand, a chicken and egg problem if you will. You can't build emotional literacy when you're conditioned to suppress your emotions. To this day, it takes something horrible for me to completely surrender to an emotional reaction after a solid 15+ years of working at it. Might be a contributing factor to my Bipolar, given how emotions affect mood.

    I have a lot of other problems with the article, which I guess they anticipated. But knowing that it's going to be inflammatory and doing it anyway has the same vibe to it as "I'm not racist but..."

    The problem isn't Men. It's conservatives. The lot of them. Conservatism is rooted in preserving existing power structures, so of course the conservatives are still coping with women having the right to vote, let alone anything that has come since. I don't see a single progressive (or even centerist) man doing anything listed in that article, but I sure see a boatload of conservative women doing everything in that article. I don't see her providing any examples from non-Republican men performing these horrible actions.

    And finally, the Facts/Feelings problem. As almost always, the problem is when Facts are not facts, and when both facts and feelings butt heads against ideology.

    All sorts of freedom-related ideologies have conflicting problems with both feelings and facts from virtually everyone. Sometimes ignoring facts is the right answer, because legislating in support of the fact is utterly destructive to the ideology...particularly when the fact is taken in isolation. For example, child pornographers and terrorists use encryption. This does not justify weakening encryption.

    As always, no good answers, but Wil Wheaton's "Don't be a dick" is certainly a good start.

    22 votes
  2. Omnicrola
    Link
    Oof. I have definitely done this.

    If men are unable to acknowledge their own emotions, they will start behaving as if their sentiments were simple fact, dressing their own subjective emotional responses up as objective truth.

    Oof. I have definitely done this.

    8 votes
  3. [6]
    kilroy
    Link
    I don't get why the author thinks this is particular to white men. They use events in the US as an indicator, but the conservative US is predominantly white. Conservatives in much of East Asia act...

    I don't get why the author thinks this is particular to white men. They use events in the US as an indicator, but the conservative US is predominantly white. Conservatives in much of East Asia act in the same way. The correlation is not skin color based, but more likely to be conservatism.

    13 votes
    1. Micycle_the_Bichael
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      I think you're expanding the scope beyond what the author intends. They are an author in the US discussing US culture and politics using US examples. I don't see anywhere where she says this...

      I think you're expanding the scope beyond what the author intends. They are an author in the US discussing US culture and politics using US examples. I don't see anywhere where she says this applies globally (though if I missed it please let me know!). I think the author's target audience for this article is Americans, and that's why she explicitly says white men and leaves discussions about non-American cultures to those who live there.

      A problem with the internet as it stands is that it is hard to distinguish what the intended scope of something is because once it is online it is viewable by the whole world. The local paper in my hometown can easily be read by anyone globally who speaks English (and non-english speakers can view it but you know what I mean), even if the author's scope is limited to that town.

      8 votes
    2. [4]
      Whom
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      It isn't just conservatives. In fact (lol), though it's also very prevalent with the right, I'd say in the US I see it the most among younger center-left techbro types. The idea that one's...

      It isn't just conservatives. In fact (lol), though it's also very prevalent with the right, I'd say in the US I see it the most among younger center-left techbro types. The idea that one's thoughts are backed by science and reason and above emotion is something I've definitely observed the most in white men.

      5 votes
      1. [2]
        kilroy
        Link Parent
        Do you think it's because you are predominantly around white men? I say this as someone who is predominantly around Asians, and it seems to be exactly the same thing. I think adding skin tone into...

        Do you think it's because you are predominantly around white men? I say this as someone who is predominantly around Asians, and it seems to be exactly the same thing. I think adding skin tone into the equation is unhelpful and avoids the underlying issue.

        6 votes
      2. vord
        Link Parent
        As someone who knows a fair number of techbro types... they might present as a center left, but I've noticed in private they lean more center-right. They tend to spout things like "there is no...

        As someone who knows a fair number of techbro types... they might present as a center left, but I've noticed in private they lean more center-right.

        They tend to spout things like "there is no systemic inequality" and "poor people should just get an education so they stop making poor financial choices."

        Elon Musk is a good barometer with this group. The more supportive of him, the more rightward they are in private.

        4 votes