15 votes

Why does some songs begins with the notes C-F ?

Merrily abusing my piano with my horrifying lack of skill, I keep noticing songs beginning with the notes C-F:

  • Moonlight Shadows
  • Auld Lang Syne
  • Es hatt ein Bauer ein junges Weib
  • Der sad to katte på et bord
  • Forest Green

It sorta feels like the melody exists in the area around F, while C is used as kind of special effect. Are there some connection or tradition behind those C-F openings, or is it just me seeing patterns where there is none?

9 comments

  1. [6]
    TooFewColours
    Link
    (A heads up, I know only any music theory tangentially) The songs you've listed are quite rooted in European folk, which are often played on certain instruments, and these instruments tend to have...

    (A heads up, I know only any music theory tangentially)

    The songs you've listed are quite rooted in European folk, which are often played on certain instruments, and these instruments tend to have a standard tuning. From my time playing guitar/mandolin etc they're often tuned so that chords like C, F, G, D, Em are much easier to play, and as a result many songs are written using those chords and a familiarity is built around a certain sound. Rock grew from European folk and so borrowed that same familiarity.

    Why exactly those chords/tunings, who knows. It's a stone that's gathered moss. Which chords and notes sound good together is very much a product of our culture and what we surround ourselves in. If the songs you listed were of traditional South Asian origin, you'd see very different results.

    12 votes
    1. TemulentTeatotaler
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      The two main styles of tuning are equal temperament and just intonation, and there's pros and cons of both. Equal temperament keeps a constant ratio between one note and it's neighbor. That lets...

      The two main styles of tuning are equal temperament and just intonation, and there's pros and cons of both.

      Equal temperament keeps a constant ratio between one note and it's neighbor. That lets you have a simple logarithmic function that will double a frequency after 12 steps (with Western and other traditions) and makes it easy to switch keys.

      Just intonation keeps a whole number ratio between notes, which gets more pure intervals. You can see the outcomes are similar, but a little off.

      It's arguably not arbitrary that we prefer certain intervals (e.g., perfect fourths/fifths), but instead have some preference about how their frequencies line up. An octave interval will sound nice because one note is twice the frequency of the other, and a C-G has a 3/2 ratio, a C-F 4/3.

      On the more dissonant side you have the "diabolus in musica" tritone, a diminished fifth with a ratio of 64/45. *Put to great effect in Danse Macabre

      There was an alternative keyboard someone put together a while back that used this for the basis for the layout.

      is very much a product of our culture

      There's other stuff, like the number of notes in an octave or the patterns of notes in a scale that's definitely a product of our culture.

      For an example of the latter, Greek modes. We still use Ionian (major scales) and Aeoliani (natural minor), but a Phyrgian or Dorian scale would sound weird.

      For the former, Arabic/Turkish makam uses 24 steps, and classical Indian music uses 22.

      (afaik, definitely not knowledgable about non-Western music)

      8 votes
    2. [4]
      ecchi
      Link Parent
      I think that you are right about open string chords, as they are easier to play as well as they sound great. As for rock taking its roots from European folk music, this is probably wrong. What I...

      I think that you are right about open string chords, as they are easier to play as well as they sound great.

      As for rock taking its roots from European folk music, this is probably wrong. What I heard is it evolved from rhythm and blues music in America.

      3 votes
      1. [3]
        boxer_dogs_dance
        Link Parent
        But rhythm and blues has its own origins. Irish and Scottish and English folk songs influenced American music, along with African musical traditions. Louisiana has French derived music that was...

        But rhythm and blues has its own origins. Irish and Scottish and English folk songs influenced American music, along with African musical traditions. Louisiana has French derived music that was part of the mix.

        8 votes
        1. [2]
          ecchi
          Link Parent
          I thought the main influence for rhythm and blues were black musicians playing pentatonic on western instruments. However what you are saying also makes sense as they were probably influenced by...

          I thought the main influence for rhythm and blues were black musicians playing pentatonic on western instruments. However what you are saying also makes sense as they were probably influenced by music of other cultures as well.

          4 votes
          1. TooFewColours
            (edited )
            Link Parent
            Right - those western instruments came over from the European settlers, much of which were used in folk. Rhythm and Blues is a clash of styles from Africa played on European instruments (to...

            Right - those western instruments came over from the European settlers, much of which were used in folk. Rhythm and Blues is a clash of styles from Africa played on European instruments (to simplify it).

            1 vote
  2. WeAreWaves
    Link
    C is the fifth in the key of F, so it acts as a good lead in for a melody where the first beat is a strong F (like Auld Lang Syne)

    C is the fifth in the key of F, so it acts as a good lead in for a melody where the first beat is a strong F (like Auld Lang Syne)

    8 votes
  3. aphoenix
    (edited )
    Link
    I'm going to follow your question with a question - where are you getting the sheet music for the songs that you are playing? If you are following a piano system like Alfred's Basic, for example,...

    I'm going to follow your question with a question - where are you getting the sheet music for the songs that you are playing? If you are following a piano system like Alfred's Basic, for example, then they will often transpose music to suit starting in a specific and generally relatively easy key, which is often close to C major, by which I mean having as few sharps or flats as possible.

    For sung songs, the first note should usually be relatively easy to sing and in the middle of most singer's ranges, and are arranged accordingly. All those notes are easy to hit for most people without working up to it.

    Interestingly, I think Auld Lang Syne was originally in E flat major, and starts on a B flat, which is outside the range, so whatever version you are playing may have been transposed to be closer to C.

    Edit: after readying some of the other replies, especially @skybrian's I think I actually misinterpreted the question; I thought you were asking why many songs start in that region between C and F, but I think you actually mean why do so many songs start with First Note: C then Second Note: F. In addition to what skybrian said, I will add that in western music we have this thing about resolving chords in a way that sounds good and normal to our ears.

    I touch on it a bit in this lengthy comment specifically the "why are chords the way they are" section, but in brief, we are conditioned to like the sound of C going to F because C -> F is the Fifth of a chord to the root of a chord. It's a very common musical resolution (exactly as @WeAreWaves said).

    6 votes
  4. skybrian
    Link
    This is a combination of two different questions: Why are many songs in the key of F? Why do some songs start with these two notes? Regarding which key to use, musicians play songs in different...

    This is a combination of two different questions:

    • Why are many songs in the key of F?
    • Why do some songs start with these two notes?

    Regarding which key to use, musicians play songs in different keys all the time. How easy it is to adapt varies. Jazz musicians will learn to play a song in all keys so they can adapt easily to what other band members are doing. If there’s a singer, the other musicians might adapt to what the singer prefers.

    By contrast, there are folk instruments that are designed to only be played in one key (or a few related keys). If you want to play in another key then you can get a different instrument.

    Also, many instruments have a narrower range of notes than a piano. The lowest note on a violin is normally G below middle C, so melodies won’t go below that, which means some keys are more useful for some tunes.

    Even on piano which can be played in any key, transposing a song might make it sound a little better or worse, just because the song is played enough higher or lower that it changes the sound. Playing in F versus E isn’t something a listener is likely to notice (unless they have perfect pitch), but C versus F is a larger difference.

    So there’s nothing particularly special about playing in F versus a nearby key like G, but it might be easier to play (or sing) for whatever reason.

    Regarding that two note interval, it’s a quick way to establish which key you’re in and it will work for any key. (This is a bit circular because how people understand what they hear depends on what else they’ve heard.)

    4 votes