14 votes

Bernie Sanders says he's staying in race, looks forward to debating Joe Biden

17 comments

  1. Flashynuff
    Link
    Good. Joe has horrible positions on just about everything and he needs to be challenged on them. If he's not, Trump will be able to run to Joe's left on a lot of important issues in the general,...

    Good. Joe has horrible positions on just about everything and he needs to be challenged on them. If he's not, Trump will be able to run to Joe's left on a lot of important issues in the general, and then he will lose.

    9 votes
  2. [3]
    Kuromantis
    Link
    Could it be? Will the debate not be a giant slugfest where Sanders attacks already omnipotent Biden to no avail?
    • Between the lines: Sanders could have gone scorched earth on Biden — and he still could at Sunday's debate — but instead he took a more measured tone as part of a clear strategy to pressure Biden to adopt more progressive policies and language.

    • Sanders said Sunday's debate will show voters which candidate is best positioned to beat Trump — but we’ve seen throughout this cycle how debates don’t really change the standings of the race, and it's especially unlikely to happen this late in the primary.

    • It's more likely that Sanders will use the debate as a last push to define the policy parameters of the race.

    Could it be? Will the debate not be a giant slugfest where Sanders attacks already omnipotent Biden to no avail?

    3 votes
    1. [2]
      reese
      Link Parent
      This is not Mothra vs. Godzilla, it's just two people, with divergent views and experience, appealing to the apathetic American public for probably no reason. I've heard much talk suggesting that...

      This is not Mothra vs. Godzilla, it's just two people, with divergent views and experience, appealing to the apathetic American public for probably no reason. I've heard much talk suggesting that Bernie supporters are overwhelmingly pinning their hopes and dreams on this event. I'm not. While there's a fleeting possibility Sanders could win the nomination, there's a fleeting possibility of a fleeting possibility that this so-called debate will have any measurable effect on the outcome of the race. Given all the shit that is not sticking to Biden, he'd have to say something so godawful that all of the birds above the venue spontaneously die, and in the background we hear the thuds of their impact against the roof while his eyes fill with blood.

      As long as that doesn't happen, I think Biden will probably win the nomnom.

      14 votes
      1. arp242
        Link Parent
        Even if there's just a 5% chance that Sanders will win, then that's still a 5% chance. Unlikely things happen, and given the large investments already done and large potential gains it seems silly...

        Even if there's just a 5% chance that Sanders will win, then that's still a 5% chance. Unlikely things happen, and given the large investments already done and large potential gains it seems silly to me to call quits now so close to the end.

        6 votes
  3. Douglas
    Link
    It's my understanding that Bernie is just: Looking for a platform to hold Biden accountable with regards to his policies. Irritatingly enough for Bernie, people appear to agree with Bernie's...

    It's my understanding that Bernie is just:

    • Looking for a platform to hold Biden accountable with regards to his policies. Irritatingly enough for Bernie, people appear to agree with Bernie's policies, but for whatever reason don't associate those policies with Bernie.

    • Looking to let his base know that Bernie still cares about them even if he drops out, and he will not go soft on Biden if/when he gets in office. He just wants to plant his seed of ideas in Biden's mind as something worth caring about and addressing, which Biden has not been doing very well/at all.

    3 votes
  4. [8]
    dubteedub
    Link
    I am pretty annoyed that Bernie is sticking in this and dragging out the primary further than necessary. We are in a very similar situation now as in 2016 where the nomination is now an almost...

    I am pretty annoyed that Bernie is sticking in this and dragging out the primary further than necessary. We are in a very similar situation now as in 2016 where the nomination is now an almost complete certainty, barring some significant health emergency. Bernie would have to win far more than half of the remaining delegates in order to win and does not have any major states left that could lead him to a massive delegate haul.

    Biden has won decisive victories in states that Bernie was supposed to win and needed to win. Places like Massachusetts, Texas, and now Michigan were huge blows to Sanders campaign. Bernie needed to have a blow-out in California, but is [only ahead in votes by 6% currently]*https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/03/03/us/elections/results-california-primary-elections.html).

    The largest of the next round of contests left is Florida where the latest polls show Bernie may not even be viable in the state, with Biden having a 44 and 56 point lead. Biden is also polling ahead in the other March 17 states including Ohio by 11 points, Illinois by 20 points, and has a massive lead in Arizona.

    In fact, of the remaining contests, 538 projects that Bernie will only win Oregon, Wyoming, and Rhode Island.

    It just seems like Bernie is continuing in this race our of pure ego or by bad advice from his campaign staff.

    We have already had a dozen debates with Bernie and Biden both on stage. Why does Bernie think that this one will make any difference?

    1. [2]
      Icarus
      Link Parent
      This is no longer a primary for the nomination but instead a primary for ideas. Biden's record is questionable for someone who is going to need to lead the charge on treating the root cause of why...

      This is no longer a primary for the nomination but instead a primary for ideas. Biden's record is questionable for someone who is going to need to lead the charge on treating the root cause of why someone like Trump came about in the first place. We need M4A, a green new deal, and an economy that doesn't leave the bottom half of Americans out of the equation. These policies are popular as demonstrated by exit polls. Biden's plans at their current rate dont do enough. The progressive movement isn't dying with the Sanders campaign. Whether it's Trump or Biden, it's still going to be there, be loud and in your face, and demand change. That's what's happening here.

      Joe Biden is going to have to earn my vote. I'm not giving it to him just because he has a 'D' next to his name. Especially if his campaign decides to shift to courting moderate never-Trumpers. Biden needs to come to this debate prepared to win people like me over. Because this situation that we are in is 30-40 years in the making and if Biden's goal is to return to it, I believe that our country is going to get much worse off.

      It just seems like Bernie is continuing in this race our of pure ego or by bad advice from his campaign staff

      Sanders explicitly stated he has an electability problem. He actually lays out everything in his brief press conference. You could watch it and learn quite a bit about why he is staying in this race.

      13 votes
      1. pvik
        Link Parent
        Here is the clip, for anyone wanting to watch it. I also think, this is an interesting (7 min) video from PhilosophyTube, he made during the 2016 elections. The scenario he is trying to ponder is...

        Sanders explicitly stated he has an electability problem. He actually lays out everything in his brief press conference. You could watch it and learn quite a bit about why he is staying in this race.

        Here is the clip, for anyone wanting to watch it.

        I also think, this is an interesting (7 min) video from PhilosophyTube, he made during the 2016 elections. The scenario he is trying to ponder is "When nobody on the ballot represents you, should you vote for the candidate you dislike the least? or stay out of it all together". I think this is quite relevant for the 2020 US elections voters as well.

        5 votes
    2. [3]
      NaraVara
      Link Parent
      I'm fine with it. Every day he continues campaigning is a day he's winning more converts for M4A and drawing attention to our terrible foreign policy and addressing the need for a higher minimum...

      I am pretty annoyed that Bernie is sticking in this and dragging out the primary further than necessary. We are in a very similar situation now as in 2016 where the nomination is now an almost complete certainty, barring some significant health emergency. Bernie would have to win far more than half of the remaining delegates in order to win and does not have any major states left that could lead him to a massive delegate haul.

      I'm fine with it. Every day he continues campaigning is a day he's winning more converts for M4A and drawing attention to our terrible foreign policy and addressing the need for a higher minimum wage and. . .

      Win or lose, it's worth it to spend the energy and the time to get the message out. This can only serve to get voters registered and engaged to improve turnout in November.

      11 votes
      1. [2]
        dubteedub
        Link Parent
        I think it is great to bring attention to those ideas. My concern is that he is convincing his supporters that he still has a good chance he can win the nomination. There are already a ton of...

        I think it is great to bring attention to those ideas. My concern is that he is convincing his supporters that he still has a good chance he can win the nomination.

        There are already a ton of conspiracy theories out there (including being pushed by some folks on Tildes) about how the DNC has rigged the election against Bernie. A lot of his supporters (again including several on Tildes) say they would not vote for Biden in the general and would rather have Trump re-elected.

        Bernie continuing to campaign will lead to more of these tin foil theories and continuing attacks on Biden will just lead more voters to feeling like he is just the same as Trump.

        3 votes
        1. NaraVara
          (edited )
          Link Parent
          I actually think the opposite. While Bernie is in the race they're going to be directing their energy towards Bernie and his campaign. Once Bernie is out the floodgates open to Jill Stein and...

          Bernie continuing to campaign will lead to more of these tin foil theories and continuing attacks on Biden will just lead more voters to feeling like he is just the same as Trump.

          I actually think the opposite. While Bernie is in the race they're going to be directing their energy towards Bernie and his campaign. Once Bernie is out the floodgates open to Jill Stein and Tulsi Gabbard and all the other associated grifters to start feasting on their frustrations. Sanders needs an opportunity to engineer a soft landing. It's not like the people being crabby right now will suddenly stop being crabby once he's out.

          4 votes
    3. AugustusFerdinand
      Link Parent
      In his statement it was clear that he sees the writing on the wall, he is not going to be the Dem candidate. He is staying in the race through the debate to give Biden an opportunity to court...

      It just seems like Bernie is continuing in this race our of pure ego or by bad advice from his campaign staff.

      We have already had a dozen debates with Bernie and Biden both on stage. Why does Bernie think that this one will make any difference?

      In his statement it was clear that he sees the writing on the wall, he is not going to be the Dem candidate. He is staying in the race through the debate to give Biden an opportunity to court progressives, which is why he gave away all the questions he will ask of Biden at the debate. He wants Biden to give good answers, and win the debate while simultaneously shift the Dem platform left. It is up to Biden to not fumble this and further alienate the more ardent Sanders supporters.

      It's obvious he's staying in to have the debate, push Biden on policies that he's sorely lacking in, have the March 17th elections, and, unless it swings mightily Sanders' way, bow out on the 18th.

      This isn't 2016 where it was Sanders vs corrupt-party-hellbent-on-pushing-establishment-candidate-during-year-of-obvious-populism and therefore should be fought to the last inch of battleground. This year, aside from the media big wigs, has been "fair", has proven that a large contingent of the populace aren't okay with the standard gutless moderate party stances, and wants the change that an impotent Obama promised but never delivered. Maybe Sanders' didn't have enough support, maybe the media is clutching their purses and crying socialism because they'd be on the hook for paying for what the rest of us need, maybe armchair activists forgot to actually get out from behind the keyboard. It's never one reason, but to act like it's just a repeat of the same thing is falsehood.

      7 votes
    4. wycy
      Link Parent
      I suspect he will only stay in after the debate if Biden malfunctions on stage and there's a massive sea change as a result. And I think the electorate deserves to see a televised Biden speaking...

      I suspect he will only stay in after the debate if Biden malfunctions on stage and there's a massive sea change as a result. And I think the electorate deserves to see a televised Biden speaking at length in preparation for the general election. But if nothing significant happens on Sunday, I don't see him trying to run out the clock much longer thereafter.

      4 votes
  5. [4]
    suspended
    Link
    The Axios article title is: Is it misleading to post this here with?:

    The Axios article title is:

    Sanders says he's staying in race, looks forward to debating Biden

    Is it misleading to post this here with?:

    Bernie Sanders might not be that aggressive in the debate against Biden

    5 votes
    1. [2]
      Deimos
      Link Parent
      Yeah, I already changed it back to the article's title.

      Yeah, I already changed it back to the article's title.

      5 votes
    2. Kuromantis
      Link Parent
      I personally did it because that's what I found most important in the article.

      I personally did it because that's what I found most important in the article.

      1 vote