This is happening soon after Waymo has began to test out Boston for future expansion. The Uber and Lyft drivers there are fighting it pretty hard. I expect they will use their union power to try...
This is happening soon after Waymo has began to test out Boston for future expansion. The Uber and Lyft drivers there are fighting it pretty hard. I expect they will use their union power to try to lobby their politicians to keep self-driving taxis out of the state.
There's an episode from the Search Engine podcast about this. I'm very pro-unionization and pro-worker, but I couldn't help but think about the old Upton Sinclair quote as I heard the drivers argue against self-driving cars.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it."
The drivers are convinced self-driving won't work and is a net negative. I think they're wrong, but I'm always happy to see labor get organized.
Normally I'd agree with you, because self-driving cars are a technology that is – to my understanding – approaching the "safe enough to use" milestone, at least in common scenarios. And...
Normally I'd agree with you, because self-driving cars are a technology that is – to my understanding – approaching the "safe enough to use" milestone, at least in common scenarios. And theoretically, once it's there, it'll be way safer than people because a machine doesn't really get distracted or angry.
Problem is, LLMs have reframed this problem for me, in that they've made me internalize just how much our society is dependent on having a lot of jobs to work. Mass automation like this, under capitalism, is very much a threat. Google/Waymo's not about to start pushing for UBI for the gig workers, after all. Nobody's gonna catch them, and many of them will not be able to find other jobs they can survive on. I don't think this is acceptable without solving for that.1
1. Secondarily though I also think it's a bad answer, because while it would be better if this problem were solved for, I still strongly believe it's just "worse trains" again. Walkable cities would be an even better solution.
Previously longshoremen have been able to get compensated for losing their jobs to automation. I don't see why that can't happen here. We shouldn't be stuck in the past just to keep some people...
Previously longshoremen have been able to get compensated for losing their jobs to automation. I don't see why that can't happen here. We shouldn't be stuck in the past just to keep some people employed. But we also shouldn't starve people to death as technology progresses.
Sure does. I'm not sure if it'll be enough though. We've had those before, and frankly I'd feel safer with more thorough, systemic change, since otherwise this'll be a battle that'll just keep...
Sure does. I'm not sure if it'll be enough though. We've had those before, and frankly I'd feel safer with more thorough, systemic change, since otherwise this'll be a battle that'll just keep happening.
How ironic that not too long ago Uber and Lyft were the ones that were being fought against by those whose jobs they took/now compete against. But yeah workers organizing is almost always a good...
How ironic that not too long ago Uber and Lyft were the ones that were being fought against by those whose jobs they took/now compete against. But yeah workers organizing is almost always a good thing.
Ride-share drivers for app-based companies such as Uber (UBER.N) and Lyft (LYFT.O) have unionized in Massachusetts, forming what state officials and labor leaders said was the first officially recognized organization in the U.S. to represent such gig workers.
The newly formed App Drivers Union received certification from the Massachusetts Department of Labor Relations on Friday to represent nearly 70,000 ride-share drivers operating as independent contractors in the state.
The certification occurred after voters in November 2024 approved a ballot measure that created a novel framework to allow drivers for companies like Uber and Lyft to organize and bargain collectively over pay and benefits.
Drivers for Uber and Lyft do not have the right to organize under the National Labor Relations Act, a federal law that covers only traditional employees.
In California, ride-share drivers gained the right to unionize under legislation signed into law in October by Democratic Governor Gavin Newsom. Similar legislation is pending in Illinois.
This is happening soon after Waymo has began to test out Boston for future expansion. The Uber and Lyft drivers there are fighting it pretty hard. I expect they will use their union power to try to lobby their politicians to keep self-driving taxis out of the state.
There's an episode from the Search Engine podcast about this. I'm very pro-unionization and pro-worker, but I couldn't help but think about the old Upton Sinclair quote as I heard the drivers argue against self-driving cars.
The drivers are convinced self-driving won't work and is a net negative. I think they're wrong, but I'm always happy to see labor get organized.
Normally I'd agree with you, because self-driving cars are a technology that is – to my understanding – approaching the "safe enough to use" milestone, at least in common scenarios. And theoretically, once it's there, it'll be way safer than people because a machine doesn't really get distracted or angry.
Problem is, LLMs have reframed this problem for me, in that they've made me internalize just how much our society is dependent on having a lot of jobs to work. Mass automation like this, under capitalism, is very much a threat. Google/Waymo's not about to start pushing for UBI for the gig workers, after all. Nobody's gonna catch them, and many of them will not be able to find other jobs they can survive on. I don't think this is acceptable without solving for that.1
1. Secondarily though I also think it's a bad answer, because while it would be better if this problem were solved for, I still strongly believe it's just "worse trains" again. Walkable cities would be an even better solution.
Previously longshoremen have been able to get compensated for losing their jobs to automation. I don't see why that can't happen here. We shouldn't be stuck in the past just to keep some people employed. But we also shouldn't starve people to death as technology progresses.
Lack of political will.
Besides, this is the kinda thing that needs to be solved first, not post-hoc.
Maybe a union could help?
Sure does. I'm not sure if it'll be enough though. We've had those before, and frankly I'd feel safer with more thorough, systemic change, since otherwise this'll be a battle that'll just keep happening.
How ironic that not too long ago Uber and Lyft were the ones that were being fought against by those whose jobs they took/now compete against. But yeah workers organizing is almost always a good thing.