I want to start off by saying that I don't agree with the very aggressive and attacking tone of the article title, but it felt disingenuous to the original author to edit the title when posting...
I want to start off by saying that I don't agree with the very aggressive and attacking tone of the article title, but it felt disingenuous to the original author to edit the title when posting since they use the same tone throughout the article. AA didn't work for me, I know people it did work for and I'm happy for them and that they found something that works. I'm curious what people here think of AA (either from experience or stories), and if anyone outside the US has insight into how addiction treatment in their country compares to in the US (either in general or AA specifically since they are one of the if not the most known example)
My only exposure to AA is through what I've read, but I imagine (at a super high level) that quitting drinking is a little bit like quitting smoking, which is something that I've done. My...
My only exposure to AA is through what I've read, but I imagine (at a super high level) that quitting drinking is a little bit like quitting smoking, which is something that I've done.
My experience with that was I found a way that worked for me and I really wanted to tell everyone about it. But what I quickly realized is that the path is different for every person. So, while my method of quitting smoking may not work for you, it worked for me and that's what is important. I'd think that the same is true for AA.
I feel very much the same. I have a highly addictive personality. I'm not sure if it's genetic or how I was raised or what. It feels like a universal rule: If it exists, my brain can find a way to...
I feel very much the same. I have a highly addictive personality. I'm not sure if it's genetic or how I was raised or what. It feels like a universal rule: If it exists, my brain can find a way to make an unhealthy relationship with it. I had to get off fb because I'd be checking it constantly and couldn't seem to stop myself from getting into political arguments and getting so worked up over them that I'd have panic attacks. I tried every way possible of just limited myself but I would always cave and eventually I just had to delete it for my own sake. Had the same problem with alcohol, opioids (thankful I wasn't put on them until I was pretty aware of my issue and cut myself off and talked to my doctor), and weed (no I'm not physically addicted, yes I know weed itself isn't addictive, that doesn't change my unhealthy relationship with it), hell even exercise I'll obsessively push myself too far all the time and get hurt even though I know better. Each thing I've found like that has needed a different solution. Opioids and social media I just avoid, i, alcohol I have very strict limits and all of my friends know that the fastest way to get cut out of my life is to push me on those limits, weed is a bit weird because its been a very recent revelation and I'm working on how to balance medical uses (I swear I got a medical card from a real doctor and not a medical mill) vs recreational uses. I think it's fascinating how every person can have a different path to quitting, but also within a person there are different paths for different things.
Note: I use the word "you" a lot, but I'm not directing it at you specifically. I have a bad habit of using the general you, I'll get around to breaking the habit eventually but I've got bigger fish to fry for now
Is there a way to use that quirk to your advantage? Have you heard of Tim Ferris and his book "The 4-hour Work Week"? I ask because he seems to have a similar "obsessive" streak (apologies if...
Is there a way to use that quirk to your advantage? Have you heard of Tim Ferris and his book "The 4-hour Work Week"? I ask because he seems to have a similar "obsessive" streak (apologies if that's not a term you'd use to describe yourself) and has used it to his advantage (but I don't what relationship he's had with drugs). Just a thought. Best of luck to you!
you sound like someone that has adhd. i only know this because i myself have adhd. Sounds alot like me. the obessive tendencies that consume your life for only 4 hours then you drop it at the sign...
you sound like someone that has adhd. i only know this because i myself have adhd. Sounds alot like me. the obessive tendencies that consume your life for only 4 hours then you drop it at the sign of the next new thing, use drugs to cope with life etc.
The AA model has spread to opioid treatment and in that context it's harmful bullshit that doesn't treat addiction and places blame solely on the addict for the failure. For opioid treatment you...
The AA model has spread to opioid treatment and in that context it's harmful bullshit that doesn't treat addiction and places blame solely on the addict for the failure.
For opioid treatment you need medically assisted treatment plans, and it's weird that the US choses not to fund those.
I have a few friends who have gone through AA and the way they characterize it is pretty different. Nicotine is literally physically addictive and creates compulsions and withdrawal symptoms, so...
but I imagine (at a super high level) that quitting drinking is a little bit like quitting smoking, which is something that I've done.
I have a few friends who have gone through AA and the way they characterize it is pretty different. Nicotine is literally physically addictive and creates compulsions and withdrawal symptoms, so quitting it is sort of like training yourself to not want it.
The way my sober friends talk about their relationship with alcohol, on the other hands, makes it seem like the alcohol isn't really the thing and it's a problem within themselves that's leading them to use/abuse alcohol in the first place. So quitting it is more like training yourself to solve the inner problem.
It is kind of an open question though as to whether that's a basic psychological fact or whether that's just the narrative AA teaches them. Maybe if there was an AA equivalent to smoking then ex-smokers would talk about it the same way?
Make no mistake an alcohol addiction is classically qualified as a physical addiction. Most people don't get to the point at which they get delirium tremens when abstaining, but everyone who gets...
Make no mistake an alcohol addiction is classically qualified as a physical addiction. Most people don't get to the point at which they get delirium tremens when abstaining, but everyone who gets addicted has a physical component as well - there are both compulsions and withdrawal symptoms.
Many people use drugs (alcohol, nicotine, and everything else) to avoid problems they have. It's not uncommon at all for people to need to "solve the inner problem" to truly get over addictions.
Not OP. I kidded myself when trying to quit smoking that I was't physically addicted...then I tried patches and realized just HOW addicted I was to nicotine. Really eye-opening stuff.
Not OP.
I kidded myself when trying to quit smoking that I was't physically addicted...then I tried patches and realized just HOW addicted I was to nicotine. Really eye-opening stuff.
Interesting. I find it 90% habitual for me. Of course I experience some physical need specially combined with beer but I find that my routine to be the cause of most of my needs in that matter. If...
Interesting. I find it 90% habitual for me. Of course I experience some physical need specially combined with beer but I find that my routine to be the cause of most of my needs in that matter. If I break it the need doesn't go away completely but seriously diminishes.
This would map to my experience. I don't have a problem with alcohol specifically. I have a problem, and alcohol abuse is the physical manifestation of those problems. For me personally, AA didn't...
The way my sober friends talk about their relationship with alcohol, on the other hands, makes it seem like the alcohol isn't really the thing and it's a problem within themselves that are leading them to use/abuse alcohol in the first place. So quitting it is more like training yourself to solve the inner problem.
This would map to my experience. I don't have a problem with alcohol specifically. I have a problem, and alcohol abuse is the physical manifestation of those problems.
It is kind of an open question though as to whether that's a basic psychological fact or whether that's just the narrative AA teaches them.
For me personally, AA didn't work for this reason. I have a lot of psychological and emotional/mental health issues. Those need to be treated by a doctor/psychologist/therapist. Alcohol really isn't the problem it is the outlet. Once I was in therapy for a long time and worked through a lot of issues, I found I was able to have some sort of relationship with alcohol again. I'm still very strict on my intake because while I don't think I'll have issues abusing it again, why risk it? But I think it's a little column A a little column B. Alcohol abuse a lot of times has more to do with the person than physical addiction (though that's not always the case. you can develop physical dependency), but AA definitely pushes the narrative too.
I want to start off by saying that I don't agree with the very aggressive and attacking tone of the article title, but it felt disingenuous to the original author to edit the title when posting since they use the same tone throughout the article. AA didn't work for me, I know people it did work for and I'm happy for them and that they found something that works. I'm curious what people here think of AA (either from experience or stories), and if anyone outside the US has insight into how addiction treatment in their country compares to in the US (either in general or AA specifically since they are one of the if not the most known example)
My only exposure to AA is through what I've read, but I imagine (at a super high level) that quitting drinking is a little bit like quitting smoking, which is something that I've done.
My experience with that was I found a way that worked for me and I really wanted to tell everyone about it. But what I quickly realized is that the path is different for every person. So, while my method of quitting smoking may not work for you, it worked for me and that's what is important. I'd think that the same is true for AA.
I feel very much the same. I have a highly addictive personality. I'm not sure if it's genetic or how I was raised or what. It feels like a universal rule: If it exists, my brain can find a way to make an unhealthy relationship with it. I had to get off fb because I'd be checking it constantly and couldn't seem to stop myself from getting into political arguments and getting so worked up over them that I'd have panic attacks. I tried every way possible of just limited myself but I would always cave and eventually I just had to delete it for my own sake. Had the same problem with alcohol, opioids (thankful I wasn't put on them until I was pretty aware of my issue and cut myself off and talked to my doctor), and weed (no I'm not physically addicted, yes I know weed itself isn't addictive, that doesn't change my unhealthy relationship with it), hell even exercise I'll obsessively push myself too far all the time and get hurt even though I know better. Each thing I've found like that has needed a different solution. Opioids and social media I just avoid, i, alcohol I have very strict limits and all of my friends know that the fastest way to get cut out of my life is to push me on those limits, weed is a bit weird because its been a very recent revelation and I'm working on how to balance medical uses (I swear I got a medical card from a real doctor and not a medical mill) vs recreational uses. I think it's fascinating how every person can have a different path to quitting, but also within a person there are different paths for different things.
Note: I use the word "you" a lot, but I'm not directing it at you specifically. I have a bad habit of using the general you, I'll get around to breaking the habit eventually but I've got bigger fish to fry for now
Is there a way to use that quirk to your advantage? Have you heard of Tim Ferris and his book "The 4-hour Work Week"? I ask because he seems to have a similar "obsessive" streak (apologies if that's not a term you'd use to describe yourself) and has used it to his advantage (but I don't what relationship he's had with drugs). Just a thought. Best of luck to you!
you sound like someone that has adhd. i only know this because i myself have adhd. Sounds alot like me. the obessive tendencies that consume your life for only 4 hours then you drop it at the sign of the next new thing, use drugs to cope with life etc.
food for thought.
The AA model has spread to opioid treatment and in that context it's harmful bullshit that doesn't treat addiction and places blame solely on the addict for the failure.
For opioid treatment you need medically assisted treatment plans, and it's weird that the US choses not to fund those.
I have a few friends who have gone through AA and the way they characterize it is pretty different. Nicotine is literally physically addictive and creates compulsions and withdrawal symptoms, so quitting it is sort of like training yourself to not want it.
The way my sober friends talk about their relationship with alcohol, on the other hands, makes it seem like the alcohol isn't really the thing and it's a problem within themselves that's leading them to use/abuse alcohol in the first place. So quitting it is more like training yourself to solve the inner problem.
It is kind of an open question though as to whether that's a basic psychological fact or whether that's just the narrative AA teaches them. Maybe if there was an AA equivalent to smoking then ex-smokers would talk about it the same way?
Make no mistake an alcohol addiction is classically qualified as a physical addiction. Most people don't get to the point at which they get delirium tremens when abstaining, but everyone who gets addicted has a physical component as well - there are both compulsions and withdrawal symptoms.
Many people use drugs (alcohol, nicotine, and everything else) to avoid problems they have. It's not uncommon at all for people to need to "solve the inner problem" to truly get over addictions.
Not OP.
I kidded myself when trying to quit smoking that I was't physically addicted...then I tried patches and realized just HOW addicted I was to nicotine. Really eye-opening stuff.
Interesting. I find it 90% habitual for me. Of course I experience some physical need specially combined with beer but I find that my routine to be the cause of most of my needs in that matter. If I break it the need doesn't go away completely but seriously diminishes.
This would map to my experience. I don't have a problem with alcohol specifically. I have a problem, and alcohol abuse is the physical manifestation of those problems.
For me personally, AA didn't work for this reason. I have a lot of psychological and emotional/mental health issues. Those need to be treated by a doctor/psychologist/therapist. Alcohol really isn't the problem it is the outlet. Once I was in therapy for a long time and worked through a lot of issues, I found I was able to have some sort of relationship with alcohol again. I'm still very strict on my intake because while I don't think I'll have issues abusing it again, why risk it? But I think it's a little column A a little column B. Alcohol abuse a lot of times has more to do with the person than physical addiction (though that's not always the case. you can develop physical dependency), but AA definitely pushes the narrative too.