I'm not entirely sure this post is the kind of content we want on tildes, but at the same time, maybe something could come out of this. Perhaps we could create a ~jokes, or ~noise, or SOMETHING...
I'm not entirely sure this post is the kind of content we want on tildes, but at the same time, maybe something could come out of this. Perhaps we could create a ~jokes, or ~noise, or SOMETHING group to contain these types of posts which don't really mean much and frankly don't contribute to the discussion, rather than let them contaminate other groups and contribute nothing. @Deimos, what do you think? Do we allow shitposts on groups or what?
That's true, and in a perfect world you're right, but I feel like if there isn't a space for them, people will just keep posting them in other groups, making discussion even harder.
That's true, and in a perfect world you're right, but I feel like if there isn't a space for them, people will just keep posting them in other groups, making discussion even harder.
What if people want to post porn here? Should we create a ~porn group to make a space for it, to prevent it being in other groups? What about videos of people dying? What about pictures of naked...
What if people want to post porn here? Should we create a ~porn group to make a space for it, to prevent it being in other groups? What about videos of people dying? What about pictures of naked children? What about videos of bestiality? The logic of "if there isn't a space for them, people will just keep posting them in other groups" leads inevitably to Tildes having groups for everything - because there will always be that one more thing that people will post that we need to create a space for.
Why does Tildes have to cater for all types of content? Why can't we just say "certain types of content are not accepted on Tildes"? What's wrong with that approach?
I see what you mean, but the issue is that we don't have a proper way to deal with them. The mod system isn't fully worked out, so as far as I know the only person who can delete submissions is...
I see what you mean, but the issue is that we don't have a proper way to deal with them. The mod system isn't fully worked out, so as far as I know the only person who can delete submissions is Deimos himself. I'm not suggesting we cater to all content, rather I propose that until we have a proper mod system, we could use a ~noise or ~offtopic or something, just to clean up submissions until we have a full moderation system with users who can delete submissions, because right now we have no way of stopping this content from being shared on Tildes.
We could have a group called ~trashcan or ~rubbishbin or ~awaitingdeletion, for people to move posts to while we're waiting for Deimos to act on them. (Here's a suggestion for you, @Deimos!)
We could have a group called ~trashcan or ~rubbishbin or ~awaitingdeletion, for people to move posts to while we're waiting for Deimos to act on them. (Here's a suggestion for you, @Deimos!)
At that point I might as well just give people access to remove posts. There's no functional difference between "I moved this to ~trashcan until it's removed" and "I removed this" (as long as...
At that point I might as well just give people access to remove posts. There's no functional difference between "I moved this to ~trashcan until it's removed" and "I removed this" (as long as there's some review of that decision). I don't mean that in a dismissive way, just that if we're going to do it we might as well do it properly.
I agree - in principle. However... Having a ~trashcan group means that people can quarantine a post, but can't actually remove it. The decision is still in your hands. You might decide not to...
I agree - in principle.
However...
Having a ~trashcan group means that people can quarantine a post, but can't actually remove it. The decision is still in your hands. You might decide not to remove the post, and move it back out to an active group.
Also, I assume that creating a new group is less work than implementing the ability for other people to remove posts. It's a smaller job to do, and can be done more quickly.
But I saw your comment elsewhere that there's not enough activity yet to justify something like this.
Honestly, I kind of feel it would be the other way. People wouldn't see a ~noise and just decide to post on other groups, because they want to post it even if there isn't a space.
Honestly, I kind of feel it would be the other way. People wouldn't see a ~noise and just decide to post on other groups, because they want to post it even if there isn't a space.
Deimos has previously said something very similar to what @Rez wrote here: if he created a group for jokes or memes or whatever, that would encourage those posts and the culture that goes with...
Deimos has previously said something very similar to what @Rez wrote here: if he created a group for jokes or memes or whatever, that would encourage those posts and the culture that goes with those posts, and that culture would inevitably spill over into other groups.
That's fair. Honestly, I could kind of see it going both ways, but it doesn't matter much. I think us mods should just agree to move it to ~misc and report it to Deimos.
That's fair. Honestly, I could kind of see it going both ways, but it doesn't matter much. I think us mods should just agree to move it to ~misc and report it to Deimos.
I'm almost certain several others will complain and Deimos will remove this, but I'm moving it to ~misc. ~jokes sounds good to me personally, but even if we do end up with a place for this kind of...
I'm almost certain several others will complain and Deimos will remove this, but I'm moving it to ~misc.
~jokes sounds good to me personally, but even if we do end up with a place for this kind of thing, it certainly wouldn't be in ~science. With nowhere else fitting, ~misc is what we've got.
I suppose misc is the best place. It's true though that these probably don't belong on tildes, but unless everyone can come together and agree that this doesn't go on tildes, we need somewhere or...
I suppose misc is the best place. It's true though that these probably don't belong on tildes, but unless everyone can come together and agree that this doesn't go on tildes, we need somewhere or stronger moderation, and without a fully implemented mod system and since this is the internet and people aren't going to stop posting crap especially as this place expands...
Sorry, I wasn't around yesterday to get involved in this while it was going on, but I think other people generally covered my opinion about it pretty well. Tildes isn't intended to be (or have) "a...
Sorry, I wasn't around yesterday to get involved in this while it was going on, but I think other people generally covered my opinion about it pretty well. Tildes isn't intended to be (or have) "a place for everything", and when posts are made that don't fit with the site's goals, the correct way of handling them is definitely just to remove them, not provide a "containment area" for them.
One of the major reasons behind having this initial slow, invite-only period is to have the opportunity to build up a good base of content and culture on the site, so that new users will see something established when they arrive. Most people are pretty good at this—if they look around and don't see any porn, they'll generally assume that it's not a site where people post porn, not think "this is obviously a porn site where I just need to be the first one to post any".
I get that, and maybe I didn't convey myself well, but rather what I mean is we could have a group for stuff that doesn't really belong on Tildes, and then moderators could move bad posts there so...
I get that, and maybe I didn't convey myself well, but rather what I mean is we could have a group for stuff that doesn't really belong on Tildes, and then moderators could move bad posts there so they don't stink up the rest of Tildes and you could remove them, since as far as I know you're the only one who can remove posts currently(?).
Yes, I'm currently the only one able to remove posts. As I said in another comment here though, if I'm going to give people the ability to move posts to the "this should be removed" group, I might...
Yes, I'm currently the only one able to remove posts. As I said in another comment here though, if I'm going to give people the ability to move posts to the "this should be removed" group, I might as well just give them actual remove permissions.
That's true, and I feel like for the time being we don't actually have enough bad posts to warrant such action just yet, but it's something to think about as Tildes goes publicly viewable.
That's true, and I feel like for the time being we don't actually have enough bad posts to warrant such action just yet, but it's something to think about as Tildes goes publicly viewable.
Definitely, and I do already have the ability to grant other users the ability to remove posts if I want to, I just don't think it's necessary yet. In the last month there have been a total of 4...
Definitely, and I do already have the ability to grant other users the ability to remove posts if I want to, I just don't think it's necessary yet. In the last month there have been a total of 4 removed posts, it's not much of an issue at this activity level.
Is there a point to this post...?
edit: Seriously can we not devolve into reddit "hurr durr poop 😂" humour? There's plenty of other sites for that.
That post isn't very "valid" either. The wikipedia link is four paragraphs and the OP includes no discussion or reason why he posted it.
But that post already has someone calling them out for it, doing the same doesn't "send a message" when everyone agrees, it just furthers the issue.
There are other ways to address a sub-standard post than by making another sub-standard post. You don't clean up shit by adding more shit.
Just FYI: When I sent a message to Deimos about your post, I also included that post as something for him to look at.
It's times like these I wish post labelling was available.
I'm not entirely sure this post is the kind of content we want on tildes, but at the same time, maybe something could come out of this. Perhaps we could create a ~jokes, or ~noise, or SOMETHING group to contain these types of posts which don't really mean much and frankly don't contribute to the discussion, rather than let them contaminate other groups and contribute nothing. @Deimos, what do you think? Do we allow shitposts on groups or what?
... or just not make them in the first place.
Yeah there are other websites for that. Tildes probably doesn't strive for including everything in the process of unlimited growth
That's true, and in a perfect world you're right, but I feel like if there isn't a space for them, people will just keep posting them in other groups, making discussion even harder.
What if people want to post porn here? Should we create a ~porn group to make a space for it, to prevent it being in other groups? What about videos of people dying? What about pictures of naked children? What about videos of bestiality? The logic of "if there isn't a space for them, people will just keep posting them in other groups" leads inevitably to Tildes having groups for everything - because there will always be that one more thing that people will post that we need to create a space for.
Why does Tildes have to cater for all types of content? Why can't we just say "certain types of content are not accepted on Tildes"? What's wrong with that approach?
I see what you mean, but the issue is that we don't have a proper way to deal with them. The mod system isn't fully worked out, so as far as I know the only person who can delete submissions is Deimos himself. I'm not suggesting we cater to all content, rather I propose that until we have a proper mod system, we could use a ~noise or ~offtopic or something, just to clean up submissions until we have a full moderation system with users who can delete submissions, because right now we have no way of stopping this content from being shared on Tildes.
We could have a group called ~trashcan or ~rubbishbin or ~awaitingdeletion, for people to move posts to while we're waiting for Deimos to act on them. (Here's a suggestion for you, @Deimos!)
That's a good idea actually, so essentially the posts get hidden until Deimos has a look and can decide whether to delete them or reinstate them.
At that point I might as well just give people access to remove posts. There's no functional difference between "I moved this to ~trashcan until it's removed" and "I removed this" (as long as there's some review of that decision). I don't mean that in a dismissive way, just that if we're going to do it we might as well do it properly.
I agree - in principle.
However...
Having a ~trashcan group means that people can quarantine a post, but can't actually remove it. The decision is still in your hands. You might decide not to remove the post, and move it back out to an active group.
Also, I assume that creating a new group is less work than implementing the ability for other people to remove posts. It's a smaller job to do, and can be done more quickly.
But I saw your comment elsewhere that there's not enough activity yet to justify something like this.
Honestly, I kind of feel it would be the other way. People wouldn't see a ~noise and just decide to post on other groups, because they want to post it even if there isn't a space.
Deimos has previously said something very similar to what @Rez wrote here: if he created a group for jokes or memes or whatever, that would encourage those posts and the culture that goes with those posts, and that culture would inevitably spill over into other groups.
That's fair. Honestly, I could kind of see it going both ways, but it doesn't matter much. I think us mods should just agree to move it to ~misc and report it to Deimos.
I'm almost certain several others will complain and Deimos will remove this, but I'm moving it to ~misc.
~jokes sounds good to me personally, but even if we do end up with a place for this kind of thing, it certainly wouldn't be in ~science. With nowhere else fitting, ~misc is what we've got.
There are plenty of places for posts like this to go.
And none of them are on tildes.
I have already sent him a message, that being the only way to report posts.
I suppose misc is the best place. It's true though that these probably don't belong on tildes, but unless everyone can come together and agree that this doesn't go on tildes, we need somewhere or stronger moderation, and without a fully implemented mod system and since this is the internet and people aren't going to stop posting crap especially as this place expands...
Sorry, I wasn't around yesterday to get involved in this while it was going on, but I think other people generally covered my opinion about it pretty well. Tildes isn't intended to be (or have) "a place for everything", and when posts are made that don't fit with the site's goals, the correct way of handling them is definitely just to remove them, not provide a "containment area" for them.
One of the major reasons behind having this initial slow, invite-only period is to have the opportunity to build up a good base of content and culture on the site, so that new users will see something established when they arrive. Most people are pretty good at this—if they look around and don't see any porn, they'll generally assume that it's not a site where people post porn, not think "this is obviously a porn site where I just need to be the first one to post any".
I get that, and maybe I didn't convey myself well, but rather what I mean is we could have a group for stuff that doesn't really belong on Tildes, and then moderators could move bad posts there so they don't stink up the rest of Tildes and you could remove them, since as far as I know you're the only one who can remove posts currently(?).
Yes, I'm currently the only one able to remove posts. As I said in another comment here though, if I'm going to give people the ability to move posts to the "this should be removed" group, I might as well just give them actual remove permissions.
That's true, and I feel like for the time being we don't actually have enough bad posts to warrant such action just yet, but it's something to think about as Tildes goes publicly viewable.
Definitely, and I do already have the ability to grant other users the ability to remove posts if I want to, I just don't think it's necessary yet. In the last month there have been a total of 4 removed posts, it's not much of an issue at this activity level.