10 votes

What makes Disney villains so gay?

6 comments

  1. [5]
    cloud_loud
    Link
    I wrote my college thesis on femininity in Disney movies. Snow White, Cinderella, and Aurora were all white and petit, with a natural beauty to them. And their villains were really drag...

    I wrote my college thesis on femininity in Disney movies. Snow White, Cinderella, and Aurora were all white and petit, with a natural beauty to them. And their villains were really drag queen-esque. This continued even in Tangled with the main villain having a resemblance to Cher.

    I’m sure there’s more examples in the Disney world.

    6 votes
    1. [4]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      Seems like it's changed in recent decades, though? Consider: Encanto, Moana, Mulan. Encanto is sort of contrasting old-fashioned Disney femininity (represented by Isabella) with Mirabel and Luisa.

      Seems like it's changed in recent decades, though? Consider: Encanto, Moana, Mulan.

      Encanto is sort of contrasting old-fashioned Disney femininity (represented by Isabella) with Mirabel and Luisa.

      3 votes
      1. [2]
        cloud_loud
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        Yeah. That’s how I ended my thesis. I did the three Golden Age princess (Snow White, Cinderella, Aurora) and contrasted them with three modern ones (Rapunzel, Merida, and Mona). Rapunzel still has...

        Yeah. That’s how I ended my thesis.

        I did the three Golden Age princess (Snow White, Cinderella, Aurora) and contrasted them with three modern ones (Rapunzel, Merida, and Mona). Rapunzel still has a lot of the same femininity tropes but the princess takes a more active role in the action of the story rather than passive. Brave is when it really took a shift, where there is no clear bad guy, the conflict is all about communications between a mother and a daughter.

        In Moana it’s not even considered that the princess is going to marry anyone. Nor is her being a woman explicitly preventing her from being a leader/warrior like Merida wanted to be. The villain isn’t even really a villain. They got rid of a lot of that stuff when they stopped having actual villains, even Encanto lacks a villain.

        6 votes
        1. skybrian
          Link Parent
          There isn't a villain as a character in Encanto, but there are people setting fires and anonymous horsemen with swords in the flashback in "Dos Oruguitas". The scary villainy is moved far into the...

          There isn't a villain as a character in Encanto, but there are people setting fires and anonymous horsemen with swords in the flashback in "Dos Oruguitas". The scary villainy is moved far into the past as an almost impersonal force.

          This is a further digression, but under unquestioned assumptions, there's why the Madrigals seem to be the richest people in town, or used to be, anyway. The magic house and their magic gifts are a sort of reimagining of royal families and princesses of other Disney movies.

          In a more realistic, non-magical movie, there would be an economic basis for their relationships with ordinary townspeople. For example, paying for things to be built. Instead, economic relations are hidden away and transformed into magical relationships, such as the work that Luisa does using magical strength. The cracks in the house perhaps symbolize the family's economic decline, and the pressure for Isabela to get married to another prominent (presumably rich) family might be an attempt to shore that up. Their wealth isn't what it once was, but there is pressure to keep up appearances.

          Later the townspeople help rebuild because, um, they want to? That's another way of avoiding the economics.

          4 votes
      2. vord
        Link Parent
        I do think Encanto is a great movie and a fantastic step forward... but I would have loved to see an alternate version where more of the leads were men. Straight man spraying flowers. Men singing...

        I do think Encanto is a great movie and a fantastic step forward... but I would have loved to see an alternate version where more of the leads were men.

        Straight man spraying flowers. Men singing about how it's OK to cry.

        4 votes
  2. Bearskin
    (edited )
    Link
    I'm not big on Disney movies, but absolutely a John Waters fan. This video highlighted a fair bit about representation that I never considered before, and felt like 25 minutes well-spent. Edit:...

    I'm not big on Disney movies, but absolutely a John Waters fan. This video highlighted a fair bit about representation that I never considered before, and felt like 25 minutes well-spent.

    Edit: there is so much more to say about this. I'm still unpacking it and... at a loss for words. Something that should have seemed obvious... went over my head for decades.

    Edit 2: Those animated features were seen by essentially everyone. I'm still curious why the "template" carried on for so long, and if there was nefarious intention behind the choices after the rules in Hollywood changed. It was tempting to dive into the animation of other countries, but I'm not going down that rabbit hole. Matt Baume has another video that covers the battle to include gay characters on Star Trek (worth a watch).

    4 votes