There are good critiques of the Rabbit R1, and I personally won't be purchasing one, but this is a strange criticism if you can even call it that. Does using AOSP as a base "cheapen" the product?...
There are good critiques of the Rabbit R1, and I personally won't be purchasing one, but this is a strange criticism if you can even call it that. Does using AOSP as a base "cheapen" the product? Does being able to (unsuccessfully) emulate this device's software on another device reduce it's value? It's $199, this is not a premium product.
It's cheap, quirky, hacky, and has a few deal-breaking flaws, but I think it's use of AOSP is interesting, not a mark against it.
It’s just emblematic of how redundant the product is. People already know that it is basically just a cell phone with some quirky features, and this is just the cherry on top. $200 is not a lot...
It’s just emblematic of how redundant the product is. People already know that it is basically just a cell phone with some quirky features, and this is just the cherry on top. $200 is not a lot for a device like this, but it’s basically e-waste when there is no reason for it not to be an app on the phone you already own.
There's a growing trend of products that aim to replace your smartphone at least part of the time. Many folks think having a smartphone with you 24/7 isn't ideal/healthy and want something that...
there is no reason for it not to be an app on the phone you already own.
There's a growing trend of products that aim to replace your smartphone at least part of the time. Many folks think having a smartphone with you 24/7 isn't ideal/healthy and want something that can still meet some of the core needs a smartphone fills. I, for one, love quirky hardware, and love a $200 price point for an experimental product over, say, the $700+ Humane AI Pin. Though products like Light Phone are more likely to get my money than some AI-powered thing (unless it's a local model...)
I totally understand the mindset of wanting to be less constantly connected and having such easy access to doom-scrolling social media. It does seem odd to me though that the solution is just a...
I totally understand the mindset of wanting to be less constantly connected and having such easy access to doom-scrolling social media. It does seem odd to me though that the solution is just a second smart phone that's more locked down and has less apps installed.
Surely we can accomplish that through software that limits the use of the existing hardware rather than creating more e-waste.
The light phone at least has some unique features that a smartphone simply doesn't (mainly the e-ink display), but I still wonder why we don't see so much buzz around a "light phone app" that locks your device down and behaves how a light phone does for some period of time.
There’s a difference between being a smartphone and running an OS designed for smartphones. I can do weird shit to have my car infotainment run Steam OS (probably) but that won’t make it a game...
There’s a difference between being a smartphone and running an OS designed for smartphones. I can do weird shit to have my car infotainment run Steam OS (probably) but that won’t make it a game console, and running Android doesn’t make a smart refrigerator a phone either.
I agree that just because something runs an ASOP based OS doesn't necessarily mean it's a smartphone (Android set top boxes like a Shield are great examples), but that seems mostly semantics to...
I agree that just because something runs an ASOP based OS doesn't necessarily mean it's a smartphone (Android set top boxes like a Shield are great examples), but that seems mostly semantics to me.
The end result here is an additional Android-based portable device with a touch screen and a SIM card running an Android application. If we don't want to call that device a smartphone, I'm not sure I agree, but I won't die on that hill.
The key point to me is that it's still an extra device and additional e-waste for something that could run on your existing device.
Form factor matters. There’s a reason “handhelds” and “game consoles” are treated as different product categories even though they ostensibly do the same thing. Even today, with things like the...
Form factor matters. There’s a reason “handhelds” and “game consoles” are treated as different product categories even though they ostensibly do the same thing. Even today, with things like the Steam Deck or Nintendo Switch being able to substantially bridge the difference. Nobody looks at a Playdate or a Retroid Pocket and says “This is just a shitty Nintendo Switch.” And for that matter, only really stupid people look at a Nintendo Switch and say “this is just a shitty PlayStation 4.”
Perhaps I'm missing something, but at least in the case of the Rabbit the form factor really seems to be essentially the same as a smartphone. There are a number of fundamental differences between...
Perhaps I'm missing something, but at least in the case of the Rabbit the form factor really seems to be essentially the same as a smartphone. There are a number of fundamental differences between a PlayStation and Switch/Steamdeck that cannot be overcome by software alone (e.g. having a display, becoming portable). I don't know that I see that between a Rabbit and a smartphone.
If you are saying that the Rabbit is fundamentally different in some way and does something software on a smartphone couldn't do, I'm curious what that is.
That's true, but in this case it functionally is a smartphone. It's got a touchscreen, it's got a battery, it's got a camera, and it's running on a smartphone SOC with all it's trappings,...
That's true, but in this case it functionally is a smartphone. It's got a touchscreen, it's got a battery, it's got a camera, and it's running on a smartphone SOC with all it's trappings, including the cellular radio. The only thing that makes it different from a smartphone is the addition of a huge bezel and a thumbwheel.
In what way? Every smartphone comes with a way to interact with voice and image recognition built in these days and I remember the BlackBerry Pearl coming with a trackball.
In what way? Every smartphone comes with a way to interact with voice and image recognition built in these days and I remember the BlackBerry Pearl coming with a trackball.
The iPad and the iPhone are different product categories even though they run slightly forked versions of the same OS. The form factor changes how people are expected to use it and what they use...
The iPad and the iPhone are different product categories even though they run slightly forked versions of the same OS. The form factor changes how people are expected to use it and what they use it for.
Am I crazy here or is saying $200 is "cheap" for an up-jumped app ludicrous? That is not a trivial amount of money for me and many other people. This looks like a neat toy for those that can...
Am I crazy here or is saying $200 is "cheap" for an up-jumped app ludicrous? That is not a trivial amount of money for me and many other people.
This looks like a neat toy for those that can afford it, and who want yet another widget to mess about with for a month before something new and shiny comes out.
that’s mostly because it’s contrasted against the $700+$24/mo humane ai pin, which is the only product i’m aware of that would be considered a direct competitor. it’s pretty much a low-end...
that’s mostly because it’s contrasted against the $700+$24/mo humane ai pin, which is the only product i’m aware of that would be considered a direct competitor.
it’s pretty much a low-end smartphone with some twists on the hardware/software; purely based on the hardware the price isn’t unreasonable imo.
It highlights the fact that this "product" doesn't need to be sold as yet another plastic trinket destined for a landfill. They could just sell it as a smartphone app, where it might even have...
It highlights the fact that this "product" doesn't need to be sold as yet another plastic trinket destined for a landfill. They could just sell it as a smartphone app, where it might even have more actual utility since it can interoperate with other apps and functionality on the device.
Not too surprised by this given how much work it takes to build a whole operating system from scratch. The article also mentions that the Humane Ai Pin also runs a customized version of AOSP....
Not too surprised by this given how much work it takes to build a whole operating system from scratch. The article also mentions that the Humane Ai Pin also runs a customized version of AOSP. There are YouTube videos of the R1 running random APKs people sideloaded too.
The more I learn about the Rabbit R1, the more disappointed I get sadly. It doesn't really seem like AI at all. Found a thread on X/Twitter (linked below) where someone digs into the APK following the response from the CEO that bootleg APKs won't work. In that thread, the user mentions that the reason bootleg APKs didn't work anymore is because Rabbit hastily added a check for the app version and OS version. They were previously not checking anything about the app or its runtime before connecting to their servers. The "LAM" is apparently just a hardcoded list of pre-made apps toggled by their backend servers. The "learn mode" is basically like browser automation tools in which you give it a series of steps to take and it'll recreate them faithfully. Overall, the R1 seems a bit hastily put together.
Lately I have found it is worth checking out articles about the best stuff coming out at CES specifically to ignore them. This and the Humane AI Pin were on pretty much all of them, and every...
Lately I have found it is worth checking out articles about the best stuff coming out at CES specifically to ignore them. This and the Humane AI Pin were on pretty much all of them, and every other product tends to be just as useless. To my memory the only device that seemed even somewhat useful from last year was an all-in-one health monitoring thing that synced with an app.
I actually bought one. I was one of the first preorders and it'll be here in about a week. I'm saying this because I don't know how anyone could think this would shake out any other way. Let me...
I actually bought one. I was one of the first preorders and it'll be here in about a week. I'm saying this because I don't know how anyone could think this would shake out any other way. Let me explain.
Of course it was gonna run android. There's no universe in which it doesn't. Hell, fridges and washers run android these days. The Ai Pin does, too. Who expected these guys to come up with their bespoke bare-metal ARM OS on a device that's 200 quid? Nobody with a brain, I hope.
And even though this might be a bit off-topic, I don't really understand how everyone is so mad at the product. Sure, it doesn't work half the time, but like, have you actually been using apps like Claude and Perplexity? They get shit wrong all the time. Hallucinations were one of the biggest problems ever since the LLM was introduced as a concept. This group of former grifters and Teenage Engineers isn't going to solve one of the biggest problems in computer science currently, and if they do, they're not gonna sell it for 200 dollars a pop.
I think it was mismarketed. I think people were right to expect that it could do all the things it promised and then some. Especially the layman who doesn't understand how the technology works. If they had – and this is a thesis I've voiced before – just marketed it as a toy, a slightly smarter iPod, a curiosity device you can ask random questions that are on your mind and maybe a smart dictaphone that summarises your audio logs, I don't think they would have fallen on their face quite as much.
Hell, the Meta Smart Glasses prove this. They sold glasses with a camera, that's that, and they added Spotify and now multimodal LLMs in a free update. Everyone's happy with those, and were they not made by Mark and his merry band of privacy violators, I'd already have two.
I'm not sure I've ever seen a hallucination with Perplexity. Maybe it's just an issue of what I search for there vs with Google, but it's been great for me.
I'm not sure I've ever seen a hallucination with Perplexity. Maybe it's just an issue of what I search for there vs with Google, but it's been great for me.
Working on learning Svelte + Tauri to help a friend with his startup project, it’s pretty cool to be able to bolt a typescript + html interface onto a rust layer that handles business logic
Working on learning Svelte + Tauri to help a friend with his startup project, it’s pretty cool to be able to bolt a typescript + html interface onto a rust layer that handles business logic
There are good critiques of the Rabbit R1, and I personally won't be purchasing one, but this is a strange criticism if you can even call it that. Does using AOSP as a base "cheapen" the product? Does being able to (unsuccessfully) emulate this device's software on another device reduce it's value? It's $199, this is not a premium product.
It's cheap, quirky, hacky, and has a few deal-breaking flaws, but I think it's use of AOSP is interesting, not a mark against it.
It’s just emblematic of how redundant the product is. People already know that it is basically just a cell phone with some quirky features, and this is just the cherry on top. $200 is not a lot for a device like this, but it’s basically e-waste when there is no reason for it not to be an app on the phone you already own.
There's a growing trend of products that aim to replace your smartphone at least part of the time. Many folks think having a smartphone with you 24/7 isn't ideal/healthy and want something that can still meet some of the core needs a smartphone fills. I, for one, love quirky hardware, and love a $200 price point for an experimental product over, say, the $700+ Humane AI Pin. Though products like Light Phone are more likely to get my money than some AI-powered thing (unless it's a local model...)
I totally understand the mindset of wanting to be less constantly connected and having such easy access to doom-scrolling social media. It does seem odd to me though that the solution is just a second smart phone that's more locked down and has less apps installed.
Surely we can accomplish that through software that limits the use of the existing hardware rather than creating more e-waste.
The light phone at least has some unique features that a smartphone simply doesn't (mainly the e-ink display), but I still wonder why we don't see so much buzz around a "light phone app" that locks your device down and behaves how a light phone does for some period of time.
There’s a difference between being a smartphone and running an OS designed for smartphones. I can do weird shit to have my car infotainment run Steam OS (probably) but that won’t make it a game console, and running Android doesn’t make a smart refrigerator a phone either.
I agree that just because something runs an ASOP based OS doesn't necessarily mean it's a smartphone (Android set top boxes like a Shield are great examples), but that seems mostly semantics to me.
The end result here is an additional Android-based portable device with a touch screen and a SIM card running an Android application. If we don't want to call that device a smartphone, I'm not sure I agree, but I won't die on that hill.
The key point to me is that it's still an extra device and additional e-waste for something that could run on your existing device.
Form factor matters. There’s a reason “handhelds” and “game consoles” are treated as different product categories even though they ostensibly do the same thing. Even today, with things like the Steam Deck or Nintendo Switch being able to substantially bridge the difference. Nobody looks at a Playdate or a Retroid Pocket and says “This is just a shitty Nintendo Switch.” And for that matter, only really stupid people look at a Nintendo Switch and say “this is just a shitty PlayStation 4.”
Perhaps I'm missing something, but at least in the case of the Rabbit the form factor really seems to be essentially the same as a smartphone. There are a number of fundamental differences between a PlayStation and Switch/Steamdeck that cannot be overcome by software alone (e.g. having a display, becoming portable). I don't know that I see that between a Rabbit and a smartphone.
If you are saying that the Rabbit is fundamentally different in some way and does something software on a smartphone couldn't do, I'm curious what that is.
That's true, but in this case it functionally is a smartphone. It's got a touchscreen, it's got a battery, it's got a camera, and it's running on a smartphone SOC with all it's trappings, including the cellular radio. The only thing that makes it different from a smartphone is the addition of a huge bezel and a thumbwheel.
And a fundamentally different interaction paradigm.
In what way? Every smartphone comes with a way to interact with voice and image recognition built in these days and I remember the BlackBerry Pearl coming with a trackball.
The iPad and the iPhone are different product categories even though they run slightly forked versions of the same OS. The form factor changes how people are expected to use it and what they use it for.
Am I crazy here or is saying $200 is "cheap" for an up-jumped app ludicrous? That is not a trivial amount of money for me and many other people.
This looks like a neat toy for those that can afford it, and who want yet another widget to mess about with for a month before something new and shiny comes out.
that’s mostly because it’s contrasted against the $700+$24/mo humane ai pin, which is the only product i’m aware of that would be considered a direct competitor.
it’s pretty much a low-end smartphone with some twists on the hardware/software; purely based on the hardware the price isn’t unreasonable imo.
of course it can’t really do anything…
It highlights the fact that this "product" doesn't need to be sold as yet another plastic trinket destined for a landfill. They could just sell it as a smartphone app, where it might even have more actual utility since it can interoperate with other apps and functionality on the device.
Not too surprised by this given how much work it takes to build a whole operating system from scratch. The article also mentions that the Humane Ai Pin also runs a customized version of AOSP. There are YouTube videos of the R1 running random APKs people sideloaded too.
The more I learn about the Rabbit R1, the more disappointed I get sadly. It doesn't really seem like AI at all. Found a thread on X/Twitter (linked below) where someone digs into the APK following the response from the CEO that bootleg APKs won't work. In that thread, the user mentions that the reason bootleg APKs didn't work anymore is because Rabbit hastily added a check for the app version and OS version. They were previously not checking anything about the app or its runtime before connecting to their servers. The "LAM" is apparently just a hardcoded list of pre-made apps toggled by their backend servers. The "learn mode" is basically like browser automation tools in which you give it a series of steps to take and it'll recreate them faithfully. Overall, the R1 seems a bit hastily put together.
https://x.com/uwukko/status/1785626783900930447
Here's Marques Brownlee's review of the Rabbit R1 if you haven't seen it in action just yet.
So this thing is useless and I was right to have no idea what I was missing.
Lately I have found it is worth checking out articles about the best stuff coming out at CES specifically to ignore them. This and the Humane AI Pin were on pretty much all of them, and every other product tends to be just as useless. To my memory the only device that seemed even somewhat useful from last year was an all-in-one health monitoring thing that synced with an app.
I actually bought one. I was one of the first preorders and it'll be here in about a week. I'm saying this because I don't know how anyone could think this would shake out any other way. Let me explain.
Of course it was gonna run android. There's no universe in which it doesn't. Hell, fridges and washers run android these days. The Ai Pin does, too. Who expected these guys to come up with their bespoke bare-metal ARM OS on a device that's 200 quid? Nobody with a brain, I hope.
And even though this might be a bit off-topic, I don't really understand how everyone is so mad at the product. Sure, it doesn't work half the time, but like, have you actually been using apps like Claude and Perplexity? They get shit wrong all the time. Hallucinations were one of the biggest problems ever since the LLM was introduced as a concept. This group of former grifters and Teenage Engineers isn't going to solve one of the biggest problems in computer science currently, and if they do, they're not gonna sell it for 200 dollars a pop.
I think it was mismarketed. I think people were right to expect that it could do all the things it promised and then some. Especially the layman who doesn't understand how the technology works. If they had – and this is a thesis I've voiced before – just marketed it as a toy, a slightly smarter iPod, a curiosity device you can ask random questions that are on your mind and maybe a smart dictaphone that summarises your audio logs, I don't think they would have fallen on their face quite as much.
Hell, the Meta Smart Glasses prove this. They sold glasses with a camera, that's that, and they added Spotify and now multimodal LLMs in a free update. Everyone's happy with those, and were they not made by Mark and his merry band of privacy violators, I'd already have two.
I'm not sure I've ever seen a hallucination with Perplexity. Maybe it's just an issue of what I search for there vs with Google, but it's been great for me.
Working on learning Svelte + Tauri to help a friend with his startup project, it’s pretty cool to be able to bolt a typescript + html interface onto a rust layer that handles business logic