Goodness. An ethical dilemma. On one hand, I really don't like DHH and would prefer to distance myself from things he is involved with. On the other, this is exactly how I want Kanban to be...
Goodness. An ethical dilemma. On one hand, I really don't like DHH and would prefer to distance myself from things he is involved with. On the other, this is exactly how I want Kanban to be (looking at videos on their product page).
Sorry I'm a bit out of the loop. Why would one want to distance from DHH? I did some googling and only found basic info about him being the creator of Ruby on Rails.
Sorry I'm a bit out of the loop. Why would one want to distance from DHH? I did some googling and only found basic info about him being the creator of Ruby on Rails.
Yep. I was surprised that wasn't brought up sooner. He has personally endorsed Tommy Robinson in one off his racist blog posts, who is a full on neonazi pushing "remigration" (ethnic cleaning...
Yep. I was surprised that wasn't brought up sooner. He has personally endorsed Tommy Robinson in one off his racist blog posts, who is a full on neonazi pushing "remigration" (ethnic cleaning through deportation of immigrants and their descendants) rhetoric.
Racism is putting it lightly, when he's actively promoting ethnic cleansing.
I used to think 37Signals has some interesting design philosophies, and have liked some of the things Rails has done, but I now consider anything he touches radioactive. Also, kind of odd he built his fortune around a Japanese programming language and is now whining about there being too many Asian people in London...
Not that it makes it better, but “Asian” in the UK = of Indian and Pakistani descent first and foremost. A Japanese person wouldn’t be considered “Asian”. It’s reversed in the US side of the...
Not that it makes it better, but “Asian” in the UK = of Indian and Pakistani descent first and foremost. A Japanese person wouldn’t be considered “Asian”. It’s reversed in the US side of the anglosphere.
I imagine that DHH probably wouldn’t mind more Japanese people in London, he just doesn’t like more brown people.
I'm not sure if that applies or not, as DHH is Danish and has lived in Denmark and the US at different times. His only apparent connection to Britain is a desire to travel or move to a...
I'm not sure if that applies or not, as DHH is Danish and has lived in Denmark and the US at different times. His only apparent connection to Britain is a desire to travel or move to a predominantly Anglo-Saxon enclave.
The linked critical post is what named Asian as a specific demographic, while DHH's post was more vague about the percentage of "native British" (historically...lol) with numbers that just so happened to map to white/not. Since that was drawn from a UK census, it's likely that Asian in that case does mean Indian and Pakistani.
Something tells me he doesn't care for Eastern Europeans either...
@zestier has effectively captured it. I've often been able to accept he has views further right than mine and been okay with it. I've read his stuff for years, as I'd always admired him as a...
@zestier has effectively captured it. I've often been able to accept he has views further right than mine and been okay with it. I've read his stuff for years, as I'd always admired him as a software engineer and pragmatic entrepreneur.
Looks interesting, but not interesting enough for me to switch to. Currently using Linear, for personal task management and getting things done around the house with my husband, and if you're...
Looks interesting, but not interesting enough for me to switch to. Currently using Linear, for personal task management and getting things done around the house with my husband, and if you're going to be a kanban system you gotta be at least Linear levels of fun and efficient. This looks like a lot of style over substance, and I really don't vibe with many of the choices here (like only ever showing two columns at a time, not even offering an optional overview of all cards). That, and they lose points for being a DHH-involved product (if their incessant need to be "opinionated" didn't tip you off). Maybe in a year or two when it's more fleshed out.
I do really like the idea of all issues falling into "Maybe?" first, and also having the "Not Now" column. But any good Kanban app can do that.
Pretty interesting tool in my opinion. Seems to bring some fresh ideas (as expected from this company), it’s lightweight and fast. A bit unexpected also that it’s fully open-source.
Thanks for sharing this! I’ll probably use it for a couple personal projects I’ve been putting off forever…I had tried using Trello but it seemed too bloated. 1000 cards for free should be plenty...
Thanks for sharing this! I’ll probably use it for a couple personal projects I’ve been putting off forever…I had tried using Trello but it seemed too bloated.
1000 cards for free should be plenty for a personal project.
Also a big fan of the license they’re putting it out with - basically a “open source but don’t directly compete with our SaaS product” seems fair enough to me. Sure, it’s not 100% in the spirit of truly open software, but I can’t really fault them too much for it.
I'd rather see the AGPL used for cases like this. It's the GPL, and fully FOSS (unlike this), but with the addition that making the software accessible over a network counts as distribution. So...
I'd rather see the AGPL used for cases like this. It's the GPL, and fully FOSS (unlike this), but with the addition that making the software accessible over a network counts as distribution. So you can't maintain a private fork with additional changes if you try to run a SaaS offering: any changes you make to the source must be made available.
That doesn’t really help. Take two main examples of where open source maintainers feel “sherlocked” by a bigger company. Amazon’s fork of elasticsearch is fully open source. WPEngine didn’t modify...
That doesn’t really help. Take two main examples of where open source maintainers feel “sherlocked” by a bigger company. Amazon’s fork of elasticsearch is fully open source. WPEngine didn’t modify WP to begin with.
In both cases, what the authors were afraid of is that another company competes directly with them with their own product. In Amazon’s case, their platform just has more scale, and they can bundle it in with AWS to make a package that’s hard for an independent company to beat on price, even if they upstream all changes they make.
Automattic, in fact, also built SaaS products on someone else's GPL project. B2 was a precursor blogging tool that WordPress started as a fork of, inheriting the license. They have no more of a...
Automattic, in fact, also built SaaS products on someone else's GPL project. B2 was a precursor blogging tool that WordPress started as a fork of, inheriting the license.
They have no more of a right to exclusivity on SaaS nonsense than WP Engine does. Perhaps less, given the tax fraud that came to light during the lawsuit (nasty commingling of three distinct legal entities).
It seems to me that the GPL is working as intended there, if many individuals and companies could all independently build things and contribute in the project until Mullenweg pissed in the pool.
I think he has somewhat of a point. The reality is that if you develop and host OSS as a service, your competitor which only hosts it as a service will always have lower costs than you, and always...
I think he has somewhat of a point. The reality is that if you develop and host OSS as a service, your competitor which only hosts it as a service will always have lower costs than you, and always be able to undercut you, because you have to pay for R&D and they don't. Obviously his blowup was a mistake, but that's another discussion.
It's something other competitors have the right to do under the GPL, and that is what it is, but it can create dynamics where other companies just drive you out of business, and that would also be unfortunate.
It's more clear cut in the Amazon example. It's easy to see how Elasticsearch felt they just couldn't compete with Amazon. Amazon already has dominant marketshare in the cloud space, and can offer hosted Elasticsearch for less than Elasticsearch could, and there's not much they could really do about it. Not only would Amazon not pay for R&D, but they have economies of scale to bully smaller companies out anyhow.
I'm all for a modern project tracking software, our choices these days are pretty grim. They say in their faq they don't offer any two way binding back to github or anything else which is...
I'm all for a modern project tracking software, our choices these days are pretty grim.
They say in their faq they don't offer any two way binding back to github or anything else which is unfortunate. At least for now that means either manual tracking or a requirement to write some intermediate service to tie together PRs and Fizzy tickets.
If it gets some traction, maybe someone will add it!
Goodness. An ethical dilemma. On one hand, I really don't like DHH and would prefer to distance myself from things he is involved with. On the other, this is exactly how I want Kanban to be (looking at videos on their product page).
Sorry I'm a bit out of the loop. Why would one want to distance from DHH? I did some googling and only found basic info about him being the creator of Ruby on Rails.
I got curious myself and found https://jakelazaroff.com/words/dhh-is-way-worse-than-i-thought/. I guess here's the corresponding Reddit thread https://www.reddit.com/r/ruby/comments/1nwcwad/dhh_is_way_worse_than_i_thought/. The reason I added the Reddit thread was the potential for the "well actually" counters, although they don't really seem present.
The tl;dr is racism.
Yep. I was surprised that wasn't brought up sooner. He has personally endorsed Tommy Robinson in one off his racist blog posts, who is a full on neonazi pushing "remigration" (ethnic cleaning through deportation of immigrants and their descendants) rhetoric.
Racism is putting it lightly, when he's actively promoting ethnic cleansing.
I used to think 37Signals has some interesting design philosophies, and have liked some of the things Rails has done, but I now consider anything he touches radioactive. Also, kind of odd he built his fortune around a Japanese programming language and is now whining about there being too many Asian people in London...
Not that it makes it better, but “Asian” in the UK = of Indian and Pakistani descent first and foremost. A Japanese person wouldn’t be considered “Asian”. It’s reversed in the US side of the anglosphere.
I imagine that DHH probably wouldn’t mind more Japanese people in London, he just doesn’t like more brown people.
I'm not sure if that applies or not, as DHH is Danish and has lived in Denmark and the US at different times. His only apparent connection to Britain is a desire to travel or move to a predominantly Anglo-Saxon enclave.
The linked critical post is what named Asian as a specific demographic, while DHH's post was more vague about the percentage of "native British" (historically...lol) with numbers that just so happened to map to white/not. Since that was drawn from a UK census, it's likely that Asian in that case does mean Indian and Pakistani.
Something tells me he doesn't care for Eastern Europeans either...
@zestier has effectively captured it. I've often been able to accept he has views further right than mine and been okay with it. I've read his stuff for years, as I'd always admired him as a software engineer and pragmatic entrepreneur.
My tipping point was the racist nonsense he spewed about native Brits, which once again platformed a member of the far-right.
Looks interesting, but not interesting enough for me to switch to. Currently using Linear, for personal task management and getting things done around the house with my husband, and if you're going to be a kanban system you gotta be at least Linear levels of fun and efficient. This looks like a lot of style over substance, and I really don't vibe with many of the choices here (like only ever showing two columns at a time, not even offering an optional overview of all cards). That, and they lose points for being a DHH-involved product (if their incessant need to be "opinionated" didn't tip you off). Maybe in a year or two when it's more fleshed out.
I do really like the idea of all issues falling into "Maybe?" first, and also having the "Not Now" column. But any good Kanban app can do that.
Some release blog posts by 37signals:
https://world.hey.com/dhh/fizzy-is-our-fun-modern-take-on-kanban-and-we-made-it-open-source-54ac41b6
https://world.hey.com/jason/introducing-fizzy-our-newest-product-83a4144f
Pretty interesting tool in my opinion. Seems to bring some fresh ideas (as expected from this company), it’s lightweight and fast. A bit unexpected also that it’s fully open-source.
Thanks for sharing this! I’ll probably use it for a couple personal projects I’ve been putting off forever…I had tried using Trello but it seemed too bloated.
1000 cards for free should be plenty for a personal project.
Also a big fan of the license they’re putting it out with - basically a “open source but don’t directly compete with our SaaS product” seems fair enough to me. Sure, it’s not 100% in the spirit of truly open software, but I can’t really fault them too much for it.
I'd rather see the AGPL used for cases like this. It's the GPL, and fully FOSS (unlike this), but with the addition that making the software accessible over a network counts as distribution. So you can't maintain a private fork with additional changes if you try to run a SaaS offering: any changes you make to the source must be made available.
That doesn’t really help. Take two main examples of where open source maintainers feel “sherlocked” by a bigger company. Amazon’s fork of elasticsearch is fully open source. WPEngine didn’t modify WP to begin with.
In both cases, what the authors were afraid of is that another company competes directly with them with their own product. In Amazon’s case, their platform just has more scale, and they can bundle it in with AWS to make a package that’s hard for an independent company to beat on price, even if they upstream all changes they make.
Automattic, in fact, also built SaaS products on someone else's GPL project. B2 was a precursor blogging tool that WordPress started as a fork of, inheriting the license.
They have no more of a right to exclusivity on SaaS nonsense than WP Engine does. Perhaps less, given the tax fraud that came to light during the lawsuit (nasty commingling of three distinct legal entities).
It seems to me that the GPL is working as intended there, if many individuals and companies could all independently build things and contribute in the project until Mullenweg pissed in the pool.
I think he has somewhat of a point. The reality is that if you develop and host OSS as a service, your competitor which only hosts it as a service will always have lower costs than you, and always be able to undercut you, because you have to pay for R&D and they don't. Obviously his blowup was a mistake, but that's another discussion.
It's something other competitors have the right to do under the GPL, and that is what it is, but it can create dynamics where other companies just drive you out of business, and that would also be unfortunate.
It's more clear cut in the Amazon example. It's easy to see how Elasticsearch felt they just couldn't compete with Amazon. Amazon already has dominant marketshare in the cloud space, and can offer hosted Elasticsearch for less than Elasticsearch could, and there's not much they could really do about it. Not only would Amazon not pay for R&D, but they have economies of scale to bully smaller companies out anyhow.
I'm all for a modern project tracking software, our choices these days are pretty grim.
They say in their faq they don't offer any two way binding back to github or anything else which is unfortunate. At least for now that means either manual tracking or a requirement to write some intermediate service to tie together PRs and Fizzy tickets.
If it gets some traction, maybe someone will add it!