6 votes

What happened to my Tildes bookmark on my Android phone?

Posted by Algernon_Asimov
Tags: ask.help, bug, phones.smart, android, browsers

I'm using an Android phone with Chrome 65.0.3325.109 installed.

There's an option in this browser to add a page to the home screen. This creates a shortcut on my home screen. When I tap on that shortcut, it opens the saved page in Chrome.

I had done this with Tildes. However, I deleted the shortcut and made it again. The behaviour has now changed.

Previously, this shortcut opened Tildes as a tab within Chrome. Now, it opens Tildes as its own separate "application". It's not in Chrome. That means I don't get the functionality that comes with Chrome, such as opening a link in a new Chrome tab. In this pseudo-application version, I'm stuck with only one window. I can't open other tabs. I can't simply copy links from one Chrome tab (news website) to another Chrome tab (Tildes).

Did you change something in the past week or so? Can you please change it back? I want a shortcut to a web page to open something that behaves like a web page, not a stand-alone application.

37 comments

  1. [17]
    Deimos
    Link
    I changed the mobile manifest to suggest that mobile browsers should use a "minimal UI", which (I thought) was supposed to still give access to browser functionality but in a more minimal form....

    I changed the mobile manifest to suggest that mobile browsers should use a "minimal UI", which (I thought) was supposed to still give access to browser functionality but in a more minimal form. Maybe Chrome doesn't support it well, I'll check into it tomorrow and change it back if that wasn't a good idea.

    9 votes
    1. William
      Link Parent
      I wonder if it's practical to make manifest.json dynamic? Be able to change the "display" parameter by account and have Pyramid serve up the JSON dependent on user... Bit overkill, but would keep...

      I wonder if it's practical to make manifest.json dynamic? Be able to change the "display" parameter by account and have Pyramid serve up the JSON dependent on user... Bit overkill, but would keep some of the power users happy.

      4 votes
    2. [13]
      starchturrets
      Link Parent
      While you’re at it, could you please look into doing the opposite for iOS? I keep opening new tabs ad infinittum.

      While you’re at it, could you please look into doing the opposite for iOS? I keep opening new tabs ad infinittum.

      3 votes
      1. [12]
        Deimos
        Link Parent
        I'm not sure what you mean, nothing should be opening a new tab. Or do you mean that you're doing it manually?

        I'm not sure what you mean, nothing should be opening a new tab. Or do you mean that you're doing it manually?

        2 votes
        1. [11]
          starchturrets
          Link Parent
          I’m not getting the PWA. Tapping on the shortcut just brings up Safari.

          I’m not getting the PWA. Tapping on the shortcut just brings up Safari.

          2 votes
          1. [10]
            Gloomystery
            Link Parent
            That's ios's fault, I think it can't open apps in chromes custom tab mode.

            That's ios's fault, I think it can't open apps in chromes custom tab mode.

            2 votes
            1. [9]
              starchturrets
              Link Parent
              No, it supports PWAs —I’ve played flappy bird from a shortcut. Adding xeddit.com to the home screen also opens it as a separate app. Also, I don’t even have Chrome installed.

              No, it supports PWAs —I’ve played flappy bird from a shortcut. Adding xeddit.com to the home screen also opens it as a separate app.

              Also, I don’t even have Chrome installed.

              1 vote
              1. [7]
                Deimos
                Link Parent
                Hmm, here's xeddit's manifest: { "name": "Xeddit Private Browser", "short_name": "Xeddit", "description" : "Browse reddit.com without any scroll tracking or analytics.", "start_url" : "/",...

                Hmm, here's xeddit's manifest:

                {
    "name": "Xeddit Private Browser",
    "short_name": "Xeddit",
    "description"       : "Browse reddit.com without any scroll tracking or analytics.",
    "start_url"         : "/",
    "icons": [
        {
            "src": "/android-chrome-192x192.png",
            "sizes": "192x192",
            "type": "image/png"
        },
        {
            "src": "/android-chrome-512x512.png",
            "sizes": "512x512",
            "type": "image/png"
        }
    ],
    "theme_color": "#efefef",
    "background_color": "#efefef",
    "display": "standalone"
}

                and here's Tildes's:

                {
    "name": "Tildes",
    "short_name": "Tildes",
    "start_url": "/",
    "display": "minimal-ui",
    "icons": [
        {
            "src": "/android-chrome-192x192.png",
            "sizes": "192x192",
            "type": "image/png"
        },
        {
            "src": "/android-chrome-512x512.png",
            "sizes": "512x512",
            "type": "image/png"
        }
    ]
}

                The only significant difference seems to be me using "display": "minimal-ui" while they use "display": "standalone". I think standalone might be even worse from @Algernon_Asimov's perspective though, my understanding was that minimal-ui was kind of a halfway option. Here's MDN's descriptions of the options: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Manifest#display

                4 votes
                1. [2]
                  freestylesno
                  Link Parent
                  Could this be <strike>toggleable toggle-able toggleble </strike> a option set in the account settings?

                  Could this be <strike>toggleable toggle-able toggleble </strike> a option set in the account settings?

                  4 votes
                  1. Deimos
                    Link Parent
                    Probably yes, I think that's going to be about the only way to have it as an option if there isn't one setting that everyone likes.

                    Probably yes, I think that's going to be about the only way to have it as an option if there isn't one setting that everyone likes.

                    3 votes
                2. [3]
                  Gloomystery
                  Link Parent
                  Yeah you're right. In standalone app you dont have the three dots in the corner and the url at the top but you have those in min ui.

                  Yeah you're right. In standalone app you dont have the three dots in the corner and the url at the top but you have those in min ui.

                  3 votes
                  1. [2]
                    merick
                    Link Parent
                    I don't think that's right. I'm using Tildes from the shortcut-webapp-thing and I don't have the URL or the menu. Maybe it's the other way around? minimal-ui doesn't show that and standalone does?...

                    I don't think that's right. I'm using Tildes from the shortcut-webapp-thing and I don't have the URL or the menu. Maybe it's the other way around? minimal-ui doesn't show that and standalone does? Honestly I'd love to have Tildes as a separate "app" as it is right now, but with the menu so I can use the "send tab to desktop" feature in Firefox.

                    EDIT: Maybe it's because I'm using Firefox. Are you on Chrome?

                    2 votes
                3. geosmin
                  (edited )
                  Link Parent
                  Confirming that minimal-ui (tildes.net) keeps opening new Firefox tabs and standalone (xeddit.com) works as expected.

                  Confirming that minimal-ui (tildes.net) keeps opening new Firefox tabs and standalone (xeddit.com) works as expected.

                  3 votes
              2. Gloomystery
                Link Parent
                Oh sorry I thought you had chrome installed because OP's having problem on chrome.

                Oh sorry I thought you had chrome installed because OP's having problem on chrome.

                2 votes
    3. Algernon_Asimov
      Link Parent
      That would be good. At the moment, it's behaving differently to all the other web shortcuts on my phone's home screen, which is a bit confusing. Thanks.

      That would be good. At the moment, it's behaving differently to all the other web shortcuts on my phone's home screen, which is a bit confusing.

      Thanks.

      2 votes
    4. Qwerty
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      I do want to mention that it works great on Firefox and I actually prefer it to how it was before. Maybe this is Firefox specific funtionality but whenever I used the shortcut before, it would...

      I do want to mention that it works great on Firefox and I actually prefer it to how it was before. Maybe this is Firefox specific funtionality but whenever I used the shortcut before, it would open a new tab, even though I might already have a Tildes tab open.

      2 votes
  2. unknown user
    Link
    Conversely, I really like the PWA behaviour, I hope it doesn't go away. Would a user preference be overkill for this?

    Conversely, I really like the PWA behaviour, I hope it doesn't go away. Would a user preference be overkill for this?

    9 votes
  3. [16]
    Gloomystery
    Link
    Tbh you can just press the three dots in the corner and click open in Chrome. In my opinion the "app" looks better than a tab but thats just my opinion

    Tbh you can just press the three dots in the corner and click open in Chrome.
    In my opinion the "app" looks better than a tab but thats just my opinion

    4 votes
    1. [15]
      Algernon_Asimov
      Link Parent
      Yes, I discovered that option. However, that doesn't change the fact that the bookmark is operating differently than it used to. And I'd like the old behaviour back. :)

      Tbh you can just press the three dots in the corner and click open in Chrome.

      Yes, I discovered that option. However, that doesn't change the fact that the bookmark is operating differently than it used to. And I'd like the old behaviour back. :)

      1 vote
      1. [14]
        Gloomystery
        Link Parent
        you're technically right, Have you tried firefox?

        you're technically right, Have you tried firefox?

        3 votes
        1. [13]
          Algernon_Asimov
          Link Parent
          No, and I don't intend to. My phone came with Chrome installed, and I use Chrome for all my internet browsing on my phone. I don't want to install a whole new browser just because of the behaviour...

          No, and I don't intend to. My phone came with Chrome installed, and I use Chrome for all my internet browsing on my phone. I don't want to install a whole new browser just because of the behaviour of this one website.

          2 votes
          1. [12]
            Bear
            Link Parent
            Firefox has another nicety that you don't commonly get on mobile browsers - It can run normal Firefox addons (at least, the Android version can), such as uBlock Origin. Something to consider?

            Firefox has another nicety that you don't commonly get on mobile browsers - It can run normal Firefox addons (at least, the Android version can), such as uBlock Origin.

            Something to consider?

            8 votes
            1. [11]
              Algernon_Asimov
              Link Parent
              I'm just not interested in installing another browser, sorry. That's not how I roll. I'm not really interested in the coding/software side of computers: I'm of a processes/usability person (hence...

              I'm just not interested in installing another browser, sorry. That's not how I roll. I'm not really interested in the coding/software side of computers: I'm of a processes/usability person (hence my previous work as a Business Analyst rather than as a developer).

              To demonstrate my ignorance in this area: I don't even know what this "uBlock Origin" is or what it does. And if someone tries to explain it to me, my eyes will probably just glaze over (so save yourself the effort, folks!). :)

              I'm only half a step up from a dumb user. Truly.

              1. starchturrets
                Link Parent
                Origin blocks ads. I can’t even imagine what it must be like for you browsing without an adblocker.

                Origin blocks ads. I can’t even imagine what it must be like for you browsing without an adblocker.

                9 votes
              2. [9]
                Bear
                Link Parent
                I don't know if it was your intention, but the text I quoted from your reply made it seem like you were both intentionally ignorant about things, and unwilling to learn about new things. In short,...

                To demonstrate my ignorance in this area: I don't even know what this "uBlock Origin" is or what it does. And if someone tries to explain it to me, my eyes will probably just glaze over (so save yourself the effort, folks!). :)

                I'm only half a step up from a dumb user. Truly.

                I don't know if it was your intention, but the text I quoted from your reply made it seem like you were both intentionally ignorant about things, and unwilling to learn about new things.

                In short, browser add-ons such as "uBlock Origin" block (most) ads on all the sites you visit. There are many more to choose from for extra functionality.

                Chrome on PC/Mac supports add-ons, while Chrome on mobile does not. Firefox on mobile does.

                3 votes
                1. [8]
                  Algernon_Asimov
                  Link Parent
                  It's me stumbling around trying to find a polite way of saying I'm simply not interested in that sort of stuff. My last attempt ended up copping me lots of flak, so I tried a different tack here -...

                  It's me stumbling around trying to find a polite way of saying I'm simply not interested in that sort of stuff. My last attempt ended up copping me lots of flak, so I tried a different tack here - and that didn't seem to work either!

                  If I have problems with my car, I take it to a mechanic. I don't change my own spark plugs. I take a similar approach to my IT devices: I just switch 'em on and use them. We're not all interested in finding & installing new software to do different things. I just want my phone to do what it does without hassle and without fuss. And it does. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

                  2 votes
                  1. [7]
                    Bear
                    Link Parent
                    Having read your linked comment and the replies - I see. So you view it as impolite, and yet, struggle to avoid appearing impolite while still being impolite. That seems somehow... wrong....

                    It's me stumbling around trying to find a polite way of saying I'm simply not interested in that sort of stuff. My last attempt ended up copping me lots of flak, so I tried a different tack here - and that didn't seem to work either!

                    Having read your linked comment and the replies - I see. So you view it as impolite, and yet, struggle to avoid appearing impolite while still being impolite.

                    That seems somehow... wrong. Deceitful. If that's the kind of person you are, you probably won't fit in here. Your comments (especially in the linked Tildes theme thread) weren't blunt, they were stereotypical and condescending.

                    A shame, because while I do welcome discussion and learning, a person who tries to condescendingly shut down specific topics that he/she is not into is not someone who I want to see influencing this site, as you have spoken of.

                    2 votes
                    1. [5]
                      Soptik
                      Link Parent
                      I'm sorry to interrupt your discussion, but I strongly don't agree with your If that's the kind of person you are, you probably won't fit in here. He just doesn't care. For example I don't care...

                      I'm sorry to interrupt your discussion, but I strongly don't agree with your If that's the kind of person you are, you probably won't fit in here. He just doesn't care. For example I don't care about overclocking my hardware - yes, my computer could be 10% faster, but I'm not interested in it, I like it how it is. If he doesn't want new (better, faster) browser (with better privacy and addons, such as adblockers or uMatrix), let him live. And do not say that he doesn't belong here. 90% Tilders are interested in these things, but it doesn't mean, that he doesn't belong here. I'm glad we have opposite thoughts here, otherwise it would soon become Reddit-like.

                      I do agree with you on Firefox, addons and adblockers, but I disagree with your opinion that he doesn't belong here.

                      8 votes
                      1. [3]
                        Bear
                        Link Parent
                        His technological choices were not my issue. Read his linked comments on the Solarized Light theme thread, linked here again for your ease....

                        His technological choices were not my issue. Read his linked comments on the Solarized Light theme thread, linked here again for your ease.

                        https://tildes.net/~tildes/2ci/i_like_the_solarized_light_theme#comment-po7

                        The way that he acted in that thread, combined with his comments here, of being condescending and stereotyping people, well, it worries me. His other comments (in his history) make reference to being the change you want to see, but his comments in the linked post show that the change he wants is for people to become close-minded and worse.

                        2 votes
                        1. [2]
                          Soptik
                          Link Parent
                          I don't think it's really that extreme. I think that he just doesn't know much about computers, doesn't want to learn about computers, he's not interested in it and it's waste of time for him to...

                          but his comments in the linked post show that the change he wants is for people to become close-minded and worse

                          I don't think it's really that extreme. I think that he just doesn't know much about computers, doesn't want to learn about computers, he's not interested in it and it's waste of time for him to learn about them. But almost everyone he met tried to teach him something - which he finds annoying, so now, as a result of 90% of people he met tried to teach him about computers, he just writes what he writes to prevent this from happening. It might be hostile and maybe a bit rude, but it works for him.

                          This is just my opinion, u/Algernon_Asimov could give you the real reason.

                          Edit: Algernon in the thread you linked:

                          See... the problem is... I don't understand how I have not been courteous. I haven't insulted anyone, I haven't attacked anyone. I just tried to stop someone wasting their time.

                          5 votes
                          1. Bear
                            Link Parent
                            Perhaps, perhaps not. Apparent rudeness aside.. Strikes me as incredibly odd that someone on a site that's about deeper discussions and that happens to have a large (if not huge) population of...

                            Perhaps, perhaps not.

                            Apparent rudeness aside..

                            Strikes me as incredibly odd that someone on a site that's about deeper discussions and that happens to have a large (if not huge) population of "techies" would be so completely against learning anything about tech, to the point of pre-emptively trying to stop people from commenting about tech to him, to an extreme.

                            It feels like dealing with my 70+ year old grandfather who is not a nice person. I dread conversations with him, not because he's tech-illiterate, but because he is a very condescending person in general. All discussions with him beyond pleasantries or basics eventually lead to arguments.

                            Anyhow, since I'm starting to feel like this has been over-hashed, I'm done with this, unless something different is brought up.

                            4 votes
                      2. Gloomystery
                        Link Parent
                        Overclocking is pretty different from installing an app and downloading some extension but yeah it would be difficult for someone who doesn't know anything about installing apps from...

                        Overclocking is pretty different from installing an app and downloading some extension but yeah it would be difficult for someone who doesn't know anything about installing apps from playstore/appstore

                        1 vote
                    2. crius
                      Link Parent
                      I read @Algernon_Asimov since quite some time (I think since he joined?) and I've to disagree with your for two main reason here: It's true that he comes off kinda rude sometimes but his comments...

                      I read @Algernon_Asimov since quite some time (I think since he joined?) and I've to disagree with your for two main reason here:

                      1. It's true that he comes off kinda rude sometimes but his comments are quite insightful and balanced most of the time. He becomes less pleasant when the discussion moves onto his personal preference and choices on things like these (which browser, what addons) because he thinks, and said clearly, that he don't think those are important things to spend time figuring out. And in a way I can see his point. I personally don't really care if the addon I'm using is the "best of" in terms of privacy because I know that anyway I'm not living off the grid. I'm not on the level of "don't care" of Algernon but still, he's not that absurd what he's saying.
                      2. You're assuming and judging a user based on a behaviour on a specific theme (personal preferences) without context in how he is contributing to the community until now. Now I didn't go and check his profile's history but every time I saw one of his comments, he was always at least "partecipating" on the contrary to some other users that just "post a one line comment" or "post a link" and go their way.

                      Now I'm not his advocate or something, he got under my skin as well for that exchange in which he received quite some flak, but still, I woulnd't say that he is not a good it for the community.

                      5 votes
  4. merick
    Link
    For what it's worth, I like how it works right now. I only miss the feature that lets me send a tab to a different device (which I guess wouldn't matter anymore when we get the ability to save...

    For what it's worth, I like how it works right now. I only miss the feature that lets me send a tab to a different device (which I guess wouldn't matter anymore when we get the ability to save threads).

    I have no idea how any of this works, but is the manifest unique or can you have a page with a different manifest than the rest of the site? If you can have different manifests, could you make a tildes.net/webapp that we can bookmark to have it work as it is right now while keeping the usual functionality for those that don't like it?

    4 votes
  5. [2]
    xiretza
    (edited )
    Link
    If chrome can't add a home screen shortcut to a bookmark, only to a webapp, that's a chrome problem. Works just fine both ways with mobile Firefox. Edit: I just installed chrome and tested it, it...

    If chrome can't add a home screen shortcut to a bookmark, only to a webapp, that's a chrome problem. Works just fine both ways with mobile Firefox.

    Edit: I just installed chrome and tested it, it really does seem like it can't create plain shortcuts if there's a manifest. I suggest using a more capable browser.

    1 vote
    1. crius
      Link Parent
      you can open the PWA version created, click on the three dots and save a regular shortcut to the desktop. While annoying, it's something you need to do just once.

      you can open the PWA version created, click on the three dots and save a regular shortcut to the desktop. While annoying, it's something you need to do just once.

      2 votes