Grayscail's recent activity
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Comment on The Oatmeal: A cartoonist's review of AI art in ~comics
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Comment on The Oatmeal: A cartoonist's review of AI art in ~comics
Grayscail Link ParentPersonally I dont really think that matters. What you are saying is true, but thats a political ane economic discussion moreso than anything about art. There is a saying that there are no original...Personally I dont really think that matters. What you are saying is true, but thats a political ane economic discussion moreso than anything about art.
There is a saying that there are no original ideas, and that everything is just remixing recycled ideas. In some ways big AI models are mirrors of the collective consciousness of society, so its doing the same thing.
If you write a story about a hero fights a monster, someone might reasonably make some argument that your ideas ultimately came from Mary Shelley writing Frankenstein and Homer writing The Odyssey, and you just stole those ideas through the process of cultural osmosis, and that would kind of be true.
But nobody actually cares about that unless that already had some other reason to care. People dont insist that you list out all your inspirations in the appendix of your book so you dont accidentally pretend you had an original idea. No one makes you pay royalties to Mary Shellys decendents for monetizing her work. That guy who made a millions of dollars for taping a banana to a canvas probably didnt even grow the banana himself.
The only reason people are getting so riled up about that here is because AI is run by big corporations nobody cares about, and frankly you could come up with any kind of flimsy excuse for why they deserve to have all their money taken away and redistributed and have millions of people be on your side.
I agree. Its probably not truly creative. Its certainly not going to ever replicate genuine humanity, by definition. But neither of those things are necessary for art, or even good art. They are just ingredients that can contribute to good art when they are available.
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Comment on The Oatmeal: A cartoonist's review of AI art in ~comics
Grayscail (edited )LinkI think this guy is off-base and I would like to explain why. When I think of art, there are a bunch of different partially overlapping conditions for what that might mean. It could be something...I think this guy is off-base and I would like to explain why.
When I think of art, there are a bunch of different partially overlapping conditions for what that might mean. It could be something that someone has put a lot of passion into beyond its strict utilitarian function, it could be something that has a a lot of personal expression, it could be a deep exploration of a particular media or phenomenon, it could be something with a strong message intended to sway others. Those are all things I could recognize as art, but none of them are necessary conditions, only sufficient. I could probably come up with an example of something I see as art that lacks any specific quality if I really had to.
I think when you are the kind of artist that requires developing some kind of craft or skill over a long period of time that becomes integral to your personal experience of art, but not the universal experience.
Like if you are a concert pianist and you have spent years honing your skills to be able to precisely translate the music in your head to the music that comes out in the real world, thats going to be deeply ingrained in you. When you hear someone else play a difficult piece, it will probably resonate with you and you will relate to how much work it probably took them to get that good, and that will affect your personal emotional response to hearing that piece.
Then later you might hear some music made with sampling and DAWs, that don't require any particular skill at playing an instrument or singing. Maybe that will feel fundamentally lacking to you in particular, because you are not feeling that sense of shared struggle and emotional resonance. But that isn't a problem of artistic value, its a problem of your personal tastes not being fulfilled in the same way.
I am not an artist, so that doesn't really come into play for me when I engage with art. But I still experience value from it, even though I never have that specific feeling of appreciating whats involved in a work. Most art that anyone experiences will probably be in some medium that they are not involved in.
Honestly, I probably know more about how chatGPT works than I know about how they made the dinosaurs in Jurrassic Park. I know it took a lot of hard work by a lot of people. I also know that Stephen Speilberg did not make the dinosaurs, he just described what he wanted and then a bunch of other people did the hard work to make it, and then he adjusted his instructions until it looked the way he wanted. He was just a guy who had a vision of what he wanted his art to look like, and then found a way to manifest that into physical reality. Thats all it really takes.
But you know what? There is in fact a lot of wonder to be found in generative art and artificial intelligence, if you want there to be. Its not interesting to him because he is not putting much thought into it. If you feel like being deep and philosophical about it, its incredibly interesting to think about how a generic algorithm was able to distill out the core meaning of language by just pattern recognition of the structure of sentences. Its interesting to think about how changing one word to a synonym of that same word will change how a model interprets a sentence because of millions of nuances in how it is used by ordinary people. None of that exists if you just want look at chatGPT as a black box of science and capitalism, but it could if you so choose.
I know I started this by saying art doesn't have any specific criterion that necessarily makes it art, but after reading this guys perspective I feel that he is not really an "artist", but more of a professional illustrator who happens to think of himself as the definition of an artist. He is not worried about the denigration of art as an act of creation, he is worried about the denigration of art as a profession.
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Comment on What common misunderstanding do you want to clear up? in ~talk
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Comment on Adam Conover: Unmedicated in ~tv
Grayscail Link ParentI was familiar with Adam Conover from clips of his show Adam Ruins Everything, and I thought he was kind of a prick in that, but also that was just a character he was putting on for the show. But...I was familiar with Adam Conover from clips of his show Adam Ruins Everything, and I thought he was kind of a prick in that, but also that was just a character he was putting on for the show.
But then I saw a clip of him talking to Joe Rogan on his podcast, and it seems like that actually is just what hes like.
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Comment on What programming/technical projects have you been working on? in ~comp
Grayscail LinkI have been trying to write a Particle-In-Cell simulation to experiment with plasma physics. I want to test out a concept I have been thinking about for enhancing magnetic confinement with...I have been trying to write a Particle-In-Cell simulation to experiment with plasma physics. I want to test out a concept I have been thinking about for enhancing magnetic confinement with targeted laser/rf emitters. But building an actual physical device would be really expensive so I want to try simulating the effect instead.
I have some basic graphics set up to show the plasma, and aive derived the equations I need to implement, so now I need to put something together to efficiently run those calculations at high volume.
Unfortunately I have been stymied for a while due to unknowable issues with trying to set up OpenCL. Ive gotten my code to a point where I can build and run an executable using the library but when I actually run the program OpenCL fails its initialization with some imprecise error code. I suspect the problem is something regarding the drivers I have on my laptop not being up to date or compatible, but I have no idea how to figure out what specifically I need to change.
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Comment on What games have you been playing, and what's your opinion on them? in ~games
Grayscail LinkIve been playing Silksong, and its really fun. I am at Greymoor, which I think is still fairly early on. The game is a bit slow early on, but the game gets a lot better once you get more mobility...Ive been playing Silksong, and its really fun.
I am at Greymoor, which I think is still fairly early on. The game is a bit slow early on, but the game gets a lot better once you get more mobility equipment like the abikity to dash and hover.
I am surprised that the game isnt as hard as I was expecting, given the discourse around it. Ive seen a bunch if articles online saying stuff like "Is Silksong TOO hard?" And "Silksong raises questions about the role of difficulty in games and whether an easy mode should be included", and I really dont think its that bad?
The game is pretty difficult, sure, but its not overly punishing and all the attacks aive seen so far are well telegraphed, if fast paced. Its nothing near the level of bullshit I felt when trying to play a Dark Souls type game, for example. So I was surprised at how reasonable I thought the difficult curve is.
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Comment on Jimmy Kimmel pulled “indefinitely” by ABC after Charlie Kirk comments in ~tv
Grayscail Link ParentWell I guess we will see how long that lasts. Assuming people havent already gotten bored and moved on.Well I guess we will see how long that lasts. Assuming people havent already gotten bored and moved on.
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Comment on Jimmy Kimmel pulled “indefinitely” by ABC after Charlie Kirk comments in ~tv
Grayscail Link ParentI gotta say though, its pretty wild seeing so many people suddenly act like they care about the Jimmy Kimmel show. I dont think Ive ever seen someone talk about the show without dunking on it...I gotta say though, its pretty wild seeing so many people suddenly act like they care about the Jimmy Kimmel show. I dont think Ive ever seen someone talk about the show without dunking on it until this week.
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Comment on Some thoughts on violence in ~society
Grayscail LinkI am immediately skeptical of this guys understanding of gaming culture. Its like that King of the Hill episode where Hank tries to play GTA. Except Hank ends up learning to appreciate the game....Reveling in violence unfortunately has the potential to interfere with the average person’s enjoyment of the game, at least among those with some trace of conscience.
I am immediately skeptical of this guys understanding of gaming culture.
Its like that King of the Hill episode where Hank tries to play GTA. Except Hank ends up learning to appreciate the game.
Noob mindset aside, I think he makes a good point. I think people naturally have some amount of antisocial tendencies that they are forced to keep under control in civil society. That creates tension you cant hold in forever so people need some kind of outlet. So when there are certain socially acceptable forms of antisocial behavior, like being a jerk in the context of political activism or competitions or a mosh pit, people will gravitate toward those outlets.
And to some extent, the knowledge that they can only indulge in that behavior in limited quantities might lead people to overindulge in those moments and actually be worse overall than if they had just never tried to restrain themselves to begin with.
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Comment on Many lonely people would rather deal with a robot than interact with an actual human, according to research co-led by Newcastle University in ~health.mental
Grayscail LinkHonestly that makes a ton of sense. If you are feeling starved and are craving food, you dont go drink a diet soda. I understand the reflexive idea of if a person is lonely just add more social...Honestly that makes a ton of sense.
If you are feeling starved and are craving food, you dont go drink a diet soda.
I understand the reflexive idea of if a person is lonely just add more social interactions but really think about it for a second, would you get anything substantial out of it?
If you feel bad because you dont have loved ones or close friends to talk to, and then you go to the grocery store and opt out of the self checkout and some cashier goes "Are you a member of our rewards program?" Thats not going to do anything for you.
I dont know, maybe extroverted people really do feel some kind of benefit from that. But to me it makes perfect sense to not want to engage in hollow conversation when you are already feeling socially deficient.
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Comment on Is the concept of debate completely useless? in ~talk
Grayscail Link"Debates" ride a fine line between discussion and argument. Argument is useless. Two people just insisting on their own perspectives and actively trying to reject whatever the other person is..."Debates" ride a fine line between discussion and argument.
Argument is useless. Two people just insisting on their own perspectives and actively trying to reject whatever the other person is saying by any means possible does not go anywhere. Discussion is purposeful, where you are trying to understand the other persons perspective, but arent necessarily needing to end with either side winning or needing to change their minds.
I know neither of those words really mean exactly what I described but Im just trying to separate those two concepts.
If you can keep a debate mostly discussion and just a little bit of argument it could be useful. The reason it feels like it is not is because some people really enjoy arguing, or are so firmly committed to their position that they could never genuinely consider an alternate perspective, even if they wanted to, so the balance is heavily tipped toward argumentation.
Unfortunately, the kind of people who are best suited to having productive discussions are probably the least likely to want to engage in public discourse, because they dont like pointless arguing any more than you do, so they avoid getting involved, and the pepole you are left with are correspondingly more likely to be people who engage in arguing more.
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Comment on What games have you been playing, and what's your opinion on them? in ~games
Grayscail (edited )LinkI have just started Shinobi: Art of Vengeance. Im having a blast so far. Its a hack and slash side scroller with large sprawling maps. I really love the ninja in Neo Tokyo vibe, and the 2d sprites...I have just started Shinobi: Art of Vengeance.
Im having a blast so far. Its a hack and slash side scroller with large sprawling maps.
I really love the ninja in Neo Tokyo vibe, and the 2d sprites blend really well with the variety of art styles in the various stages to make a really aesthetically pleasing composite.
The combat so far has been really fun and dynamic. There core game encourages you to be proactive and blitz your enemies to stun lock them, while managing your dodges to account for having 3-5 enemies attacking.
There are a number of extra challenges in both combat and platforming to encourage revisitng stages and exploration. The game has been regularly introducing new skills and abilities to facilitate the platforming.
All in all Ive really enjoyed it so far. Im in the 3rd story segment so far, so Ill see how it progresses from here.
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Comment on <deleted topic> in ~arts
Grayscail (edited )Link ParentI think its somewhat juvenile, like people are enjoying the thrill of saying a "bad" word even if its not real. It comes across to me like people imitating a bigot for fun, but trying to do so in...I think its somewhat juvenile, like people are enjoying the thrill of saying a "bad" word even if its not real.
It comes across to me like people imitating a bigot for fun, but trying to do so in a way that wont get them in trouble. Like, Im not a racist but I enjoy the aesthetic of pretending to be horrible, so Im going to be racist to rocks or something else innocuous in order to get away with it.
I mean, I dont doubt that there is a lot of negative sentiment around AI, but I feel that this trend is not really a genuine manifestation of that resentment, its just people engaging in ironic humor.
Beyond that, if I was going to describe the "enslurrification" of culture it would be about how I feel public discourse is becoming more hateful and more centered around labelling people with terrible words so they can be disregarded as monsters rather than people. Its emergent from the rapidly increasing polarization that has been going on in society over the past decade or so.
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Comment on <deleted topic> in ~arts
Grayscail LinkI was really expecting this to be a commentary on the recent trend of trying to manufacture the word "clanker" into a new slur against AI which I have been seeing recently. But the "slur" in...I was really expecting this to be a commentary on the recent trend of trying to manufacture the word "clanker" into a new slur against AI which I have been seeing recently.
But the "slur" in "enslurrification" actually refers to "slurry".
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Comment on Denmark ending letter deliveries is a sign of the digital times in ~society
Grayscail LinkLike 95% of my mail is just junk I have to immediately toss in the recycling anyway.Like 95% of my mail is just junk I have to immediately toss in the recycling anyway.
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Comment on Famous cognitive psychology experiments that failed to replicate in ~science
Grayscail LinkThis reminds me of that Harvard professor Francesca Gino who built a career based on studying honesty and ethical behavior and had studies like "If you sign an honesty pledge at the top of an exam...This reminds me of that Harvard professor Francesca Gino who built a career based on studying honesty and ethical behavior and had studies like "If you sign an honesty pledge at the top of an exam you are less likely to cheat", but then it came out that she had been fabricating data to make it look like she got a positive result.
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Comment on <deleted topic> in ~life.men
Grayscail Link ParentThe risk of giving people with body dysmorphia the bodies they desire is that their desires are warped by a distorted perspective. People like Eugenia Cooney have gotten the bodies they desire,...The risk of giving people with body dysmorphia the bodies they desire is that their desires are warped by a distorted perspective.
People like Eugenia Cooney have gotten the bodies they desire, but I dont know if I would say thats a good thing for their health.
I dont know the science, maybe its totally fine and healthy, but I cant help but wonder if there are long term negative side effects to snapping your legs in half and reconstructing them if you dont need to.
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Comment on What happened to your first car? in ~transport
Grayscail LinkMy first car was a used Nissan. It got me through half of highschool and all of college. Over the years it started developing problems. The main one being something wrong with the transmission....My first car was a used Nissan. It got me through half of highschool and all of college.
Over the years it started developing problems. The main one being something wrong with the transmission. When I would try to shift it would hang. It was an automatic transmission but when I had to shift to Drive it would just be stuck with the "clutch" applied for a few seconds before rattling into place. I tried taking it to a mechanic once but I was told that with the age of the car any transmission work would cost more than the car was worth.
About a year into my first job I was driving down the highway running some errands. I heard a loud noise and a shake and smoke started coming out of the hood and the gas pedal stopped responding. I was going around 70-80 miles per hour so I used the momentum of the car to move to the rightmost lane and into the nearest exit. As soon as I got to a place where I wasnt going to block traffic I stopped at the side of the road and called for a tow truck.
Apparently the engine exploded. No idea what exactly happened, but there was baseball sized hole in the bottom of my car. The mechanic told me that the car was scrapped, which I already figured, so I just donated it to some charity that was collecting recyclable cars and accepted it.
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Comment on If you're a programmer, are you ever going to believe an AGI is actually 'I'? in ~tech
Grayscail LinkI can look behind the curtain of human intelligence too. Open up someones skull and youll see a brain filled with neurons sending signals around. I can physically look at each neuron and...I can look behind the curtain of human intelligence too. Open up someones skull and youll see a brain filled with neurons sending signals around. I can physically look at each neuron and understand what its doing and how, and I can see how different neurons connect together to produce more complex behaviors. Doesnt mean I understand consciousness, or what the brain as a whole is doing.
Similarly, I can look at the source code or architecture of a given AI, and I can describe mechanically how it works, but ultimately the "intelligence" will be in the form of a giant list of coefficients that mean nothing to me beyond being a list of numbers.
Its completely plausible to me that some combination of feedback loops and pattern recognition could contain the fundamental essence of what we consider as intelligence. But only because I have a vague idea at best of what intelligence is.
Well there is inherent randomness to an AI, even if its only pseudorandom. Like the initial weights used to create the model or the random shuffling of training data order. So that creates a kind of initial seed value that would make different iterations distinct and unique. Then you build off that initial random state by comparing to other stuff to make a work thats coherent but still individualized.
To try to map that onto human experience, if I was trying to write a unique song Id probably just make up random melodies in my head until I stumbled upon something that sounded good to me, and then Id build off that melody by trying to figure out harmonies and music theory and other sort of standardized methods for figuring out music. I could imagine an AI being capable of doing something like that just fine.
So if you take that original output and use it as part of your input vector for future works, you get a set of works that all kind of correlated to whatever style the first one had, but each still having randomness and variations.
As for what you say about AI devaluing art, thats probably true. I think thats natural. Civization is always changing and people need to adapt to keep up.