New PMG video? Oh hell yeah. I love that they got more into it as the story went on. Lots of giggling during the beginning, but full concentration by the end. And as always, PMG with the great...
New PMG video? Oh hell yeah.
I love that they got more into it as the story went on. Lots of giggling during the beginning, but full concentration by the end.
And as always, PMG with the great journalism at the end, talking about the actual problems facing the business. Feels like such a niche product/experience. I hope this video helps them get some bookings to keep them afloat! It looks awesome!
With the notable exception of their Disco Elysium documentary which served as a pro capitalist anti labor piece of propaganda. https://youtu.be/K1b5zyvsUBY
With the notable exception of their Disco Elysium documentary which served as a pro capitalist anti labor piece of propaganda.
In your opinion. However, my own opinion of the video after watching it and submitting it here was quite different: So I highly recommend people just watch the actual video and judge it for...
In this video, People Make Games delves really deep into all the various allegations and lawsuits surrounding Disco Elysium and the studio behind it, ZA/UM, and IMO does some incredible investigative journalism on the subject. They even went so far as to interview ZA/UM's CEO, Ilmar Kompus, as well as a bunch of other current+former employees (one of whom, Argo Tuulik, was also a founding member of the original ZA/UM Cultural Association artist collective, is still with the company, and strongly disagrees with Robert Kurvitz's version of events). It puts everything in context, and shows just how insanely complicated and murky ZA/UM's history, ownership, and the current legal situation really is.
And just my personal opinion, but despite how dodgy the whole ownership debacle was, and how shady many of the investors were/are, the video also does not paint a very flattering picture of Robert Kurvitz, or his partner Helen Hindpere either. Kurvitz is talked about by all the other employees as being incredibly difficult to work with/for, toxic, selfish, and self-aggrandizing, and Hindpere as a bit of slacker who didn't actually do much work at the company, and didn't actually do much writing either despite her job title. Aleksander Rostov is about the only person that was talked about fondly by the others, but also as being a bit of a stooge for Kurvitz.
So take all that for what you will... but to me the whole things sounds like an absolute mess. Kurvitz may have been naive, and taken advantage of when it came to ownership shares of the company and its IP, but it doesn't sound like he's entirely innocent here either. And regardless of whether he should have been given a larger slice of the pie for his original ideas for the world, and his contributions to the game, it still sounds like he was actually fired for genuine cause (esp if he really did try to steal the game's source code, as was alleged, and sounds likely).
So I highly recommend people just watch the actual video and judge it for themselves, rather than relying on the judgment of any random internet strangers (myself included).
I too have watched that video (probably when you posted it way back when) and I agree that 'absolute mess' is the appropriate way to describe that whole debacle. Seems like there's a lot of...
Exemplary
I too have watched that video (probably when you posted it way back when) and I agree that 'absolute mess' is the appropriate way to describe that whole debacle. Seems like there's a lot of shitty-ness from all involved parties, which makes it difficult to determine with any sort of certainty what actually went down.
I strongly disagree with the "pro capitalist anti labor piece of propaganda" comment above. Especially since People Make Games has been very vocal about supporting workers, children, people, and more. They're the first to point out when they don't have the full picture, and they explicitly do everything they can to protect workers who they interview for their videos. In fact, the very lengths they went through to get the real story of what went on behind Disco Elysium's controversy disproves any sort of suggestion of propaganda. They went all the way to Estonia for christ's sake, even sat through court proceedings just to make sure they portrayed things as accurately as possible.
Here's my follow-up topic if you care to discuss further https://tildes.net/~games/1o1z/a_response_to_pmgs_disco_elysium_investigation_stushi#comment-fmdi To be clear, I am not saying that wrot...
To be clear, I am not saying that wrot large they are pro capital, but that documentary in particular directly furthered the existing PR campaign against the workers, and rightful owners, of the Disco Elysium IP.
I posted a topic here to discuss this in more detail, if you're interested https://tildes.net/~games/1o1z/a_response_to_pmgs_disco_elysium_investigation_stushi#comment-fmdi
I watched this last night. This kinda thing thing is so up my street. I love these immersive experiences and I'm really glad to see people are trying so hard to make them a reality. I think it...
I watched this last night. This kinda thing thing is so up my street. I love these immersive experiences and I'm really glad to see people are trying so hard to make them a reality.
I think it could go either way as Quinns notes at the end. Like these really immersive experiences I think only really appeal to a sub culture, but is there enough people and are we willing to pay for it?
This experience seems nut, like the capital cost and the fact they have live actors for the entire experience is insane. Normally these kinda things they have minimal staff and they just dump you in a repeatable experience (an excape room is a great example of this, all the material in there is a video, text or something, never actual actors).
Really impressive, but extremely expensive. I'd love to go but wrong country lol.
There are many rooms with actors, and they are really fun (they can give much more subtle hints). But not that many actors, no. Problem with escape rooms is that customers can do them only once,...
Normally these kinda things they have minimal staff and they just dump you in a repeatable experience (an excape room is a great example of this, all the material in there is a video, text or something, never actual actors).
There are many rooms with actors, and they are really fun (they can give much more subtle hints). But not that many actors, no.
Problem with escape rooms is that customers can do them only once, so by definition you will not get any repeat customers. Looks like a very tough business to me. With this star ship setup you can run multiple scenarios with the same group, so your "marketing cost / group" should be lower than an escape room.
New PMG video? Oh hell yeah.
I love that they got more into it as the story went on. Lots of giggling during the beginning, but full concentration by the end.
And as always, PMG with the great journalism at the end, talking about the actual problems facing the business. Feels like such a niche product/experience. I hope this video helps them get some bookings to keep them afloat! It looks awesome!
With the notable exception of their Disco Elysium documentary which served as a pro capitalist anti labor piece of propaganda.
https://youtu.be/K1b5zyvsUBY
In your opinion. However, my own opinion of the video after watching it and submitting it here was quite different:
So I highly recommend people just watch the actual video and judge it for themselves, rather than relying on the judgment of any random internet strangers (myself included).
I too have watched that video (probably when you posted it way back when) and I agree that 'absolute mess' is the appropriate way to describe that whole debacle. Seems like there's a lot of shitty-ness from all involved parties, which makes it difficult to determine with any sort of certainty what actually went down.
I strongly disagree with the "pro capitalist anti labor piece of propaganda" comment above. Especially since People Make Games has been very vocal about supporting workers, children, people, and more. They're the first to point out when they don't have the full picture, and they explicitly do everything they can to protect workers who they interview for their videos. In fact, the very lengths they went through to get the real story of what went on behind Disco Elysium's controversy disproves any sort of suggestion of propaganda. They went all the way to Estonia for christ's sake, even sat through court proceedings just to make sure they portrayed things as accurately as possible.
Calling them anti-labor or pro-capitalist is just mindblowing to me! They even published a whole dang video about how video games are failing the working class! They have a two-part series on how Valve treats their employees! And another two-part series on how Roblox takes advantage of not just kids, but young developers! Extreme Crunch Culture and Abuse in South East Asian Outsourcing Studios. The Games Industry Must Not Stay Silent on Palestine. The list goes on and on. Hell the entire point of their name is that it's real human beings that make games and we should remember that when discussing gaming journalism! They're about as working-class friendly as you can get.
Here's my follow-up topic if you care to discuss further https://tildes.net/~games/1o1z/a_response_to_pmgs_disco_elysium_investigation_stushi#comment-fmdi
To be clear, I am not saying that wrot large they are pro capital, but that documentary in particular directly furthered the existing PR campaign against the workers, and rightful owners, of the Disco Elysium IP.
I posted a topic here to discuss this in more detail, if you're interested https://tildes.net/~games/1o1z/a_response_to_pmgs_disco_elysium_investigation_stushi#comment-fmdi
I watched this last night. This kinda thing thing is so up my street. I love these immersive experiences and I'm really glad to see people are trying so hard to make them a reality.
I think it could go either way as Quinns notes at the end. Like these really immersive experiences I think only really appeal to a sub culture, but is there enough people and are we willing to pay for it?
This experience seems nut, like the capital cost and the fact they have live actors for the entire experience is insane. Normally these kinda things they have minimal staff and they just dump you in a repeatable experience (an excape room is a great example of this, all the material in there is a video, text or something, never actual actors).
Really impressive, but extremely expensive. I'd love to go but wrong country lol.
There are many rooms with actors, and they are really fun (they can give much more subtle hints). But not that many actors, no.
Problem with escape rooms is that customers can do them only once, so by definition you will not get any repeat customers. Looks like a very tough business to me. With this star ship setup you can run multiple scenarios with the same group, so your "marketing cost / group" should be lower than an escape room.
Looks amazing, but only with the right group. Same as it works with escape rooms then :)