22 votes

Cargobike recommendations and advice

My wife and I had a baby a few months ago and we learned that you can put a carseat in the front of a front load cargo bike starting at 3 months. I was already keen for a cargo bike, as was my wife, so we're taking the dive. There are a few common brands available in the USA, namely Urban Arrow, Omnium, and Harry vs Larry's Bullit Bike, and while those are still in contention we're currently in Munich and considering buying one and getting it home. Lots context on what we're thinking and doing and then to questions.

I was able to test drive the Muli Classic and the Carrie from Riese and Muller as representatives of shorter bikes, and we're considering the Load from Riese and Muller, the Loven's s75, the Urban Arrow Family, and the Bakfietz.nl Cruiser. We also rented the Lovens for the month we're here and pick it up today.

Ok, so we have a few questions on our plate. Do we go compact cargobike - like a Muli - or do we go for the full family van - like a Lovens or Urban Arrow? Within those categories are there any considerations we need to be mindful of like repairability? Our concern is that the Bafang engine is loved by all but seemingly hard to get parts for stateside. Whereas Bosch or Shimano would be easier. Could we rock a non-electric version like the Muli Muscle, or is that impractical?

I've been able to talk to a few owners and everyone loves the bike they have. The Muli guys love the Muli. The Lovens moms love the Lovens. It's great signal that cargobikes generally work well for the people interested in them, but not much as to which way we should go.

Last is context on what we hope to do and what we want to use it for. I'd love to go down to a 1 car family. We live within 6 blocks of all our core needs - grocery store, hardware store, pharmacy, repair places - and within .5 miles of our main recreation areas - the forest and the beach - so largely we're set walking. But there are so many great things that are just outside that area, within about 10 miles, that a cargobike would be great to have - parks, larger stores, everything really. And our Costco is about 500 feet off the main municipal bike trail so I would Looooooove to do my Costco runs on the bike. We also have one kiddo and there will likely be a second. I'm going to be getting a shotgun seat for my normal townie and mountain bikes for when the kids are old enough, but I'd also really love to be able to ferry them to school, have their friends join us, and make it the primary transport until for the family. Our friends in town have a street legal golf cart and I'd love to do something similar with the cargo bike. There is some possibility that we end up with 2, like a Muli and a Lovens, but with storage space that is currently very impractical. Also we live up a hill - about 150ft elevation gain over 5 blocks - from the main trail that connects us to the surrounding towns. We live a weird place where our pennisula is bisected by a military base and golf course so that is literally the only way to access any of the other surrounding towns. Also I'm currently a deep memeber of the Surly gang and am finding myself drawn to bikes like that - probably why the Muli keeps coming up on here - but realize that may be a foolish way to choose a family cargo bike. Also the price range is fairly steep $5-10k, so I'm trying to be level headed about it.

I'd love to hear about your experiences with cargobikes: what you rode, what you loved, what you'd skip. If you have friends or family who have indulged. Or just any thoughts really! I realize it's a small group that owns them so any info helps!

14 comments

  1. [2]
    Gazook89
    (edited )
    Link
    Hi! I saw the title of your post while on my phone on the couch, read the first paragraph or so and jumped up and ran to the computer. I love talking about my bike! I have an Urban Arrow Family,...
    • Exemplary

    Hi! I saw the title of your post while on my phone on the couch, read the first paragraph or so and jumped up and ran to the computer. I love talking about my bike!

    I have an Urban Arrow Family, circa 2024 (not the newer model that seems sleek as hell). For me, a new bike was just always going to be better than the old 1990s steel frame road bike I had from college, pulling an old burley trailer. I used that bike, with a front/handlebar mount, for my first kid through babyhood before getting the trailer when they were old enough for it. The new Urban Arrow was purchased the week our second kid was born. We only have one small car, and bought the bike instead of another car. I waited until she was about 2.5 months old to put her in a NUNA car seat, with the car seat adapter. She's 16 months now, and today I hit 2,000 miles on the bike. The other kid is 5 years old right now.

    We bike year round, in Minneapolis Minnesota. I have snow tires with the spikes, and getting those swapped in the fall and spring is my twice annual visit to the bike shop where they just check things over. I bike about every day, through the winter as well, though this last winter I took a month long break during our federal occupation. The bike does well in the snow on the streets, though you definitely move a bit slower out of caution. It's nice not having a chain or exposed derailleur, instead just a belt drive with internal shimano hub. But, the belt did break on one winter day. Both shops I engaged with (one was closer to me, the other was where I bought the bike) were flabbergasted, and the belt manufacturer called me for details, because apparently that very rarely happens so they wanted the details. It was under warranty and everything was fixed up once the new belt arrived.

    We also have the rain cover for the bucket, so I've strung up little battery powered fairy lights inside to give some extra light during the winter. Then I bundle the kids up and pile a puffy blanket on them. I've never heard complaints about cold. The baby, about 9-12 months old at this point, frequently got her naps done in the bike and frequently was left outside in the bike in front of a coffee shop to finish up a nap while I got some hot brew. The "cafe lock" on the back wheel is excellent for this purpose.

    I'm going to switch to bullet points otherwise this will be a novel. These are the points I bring up when talking to people about it, which happens several times a week-- people ask and I'm chatty about it:

    Urban Arrow points

    • When I'm doing preschool pickup and the kids are all muddy from playing in puddles, a lot of parents agonize over filthy kids in the back seat of their car....I don't. I just put them in the bike, muddy shoes and all, and by the time we are home the mud has dried, flaked off, and fallen out the bottom of the bike onto the road. Same goes for wet kids at the pool- let them air dry.
    • At preschool pickup, the parents call my bike the "mobile playground". I've had 7-8 kids playing on my bike at once, hanging off the bucket, sitting on the seat, standing on each peddle....they love it. The little siblings (2 year olds) love to sit in it, too, and play with the buckles, the bell, the light.
    • At preschool pickup, I pull right up to the door or bring it to the sidewalk near the play area, and don't have to worry about parking spots. In fact, you'll rarely think about parking at all, anywhere (sometimes you will, though). With my bike right there, I have my bluetooth speaker, snacks, easy drop-off of school crafts into my panniers.
    • My kids love riding in it. I'm not sure if that's partly because they just expect it, or they actually like it. But my 16mth kid points at the backdoor in the morning until she is in it. She happily seats herself. When we are parked somewhere, she has no qualms just sitting in it either buckled or unbuckled. She has taken more naps in it than outside of it. It's easier to talk to my older kid, and point at things.

    General points about e-bikes:

    • It's so nice to be able to bike as far as I want without having to worry about the return trip. The assurance that comes from "I can just use some assist on the way back" means less mental overhead when planning or wondering if you should turn back mid-trip.
    • I used to volunteer at a place, and on my old bike I was guaranteed to be sweating bullets in the summer months when I arrived. With the e-bike, I could more casually pedal and arrive with a dry shirt.
    • I hear a lot of people say "but ebikes mean you aren't getting the exercise of a normal bike". But if e-assist means you are going to be on the bike much more often, you are still exercising more. And, any reasonable ebike will be pedal assist, and you can increase or decrease the level of assist on the fly with a button. 60-70% of my trips are "no assist", and the other 30-40% is split between the lowest and second lowest level of assist....very rarely do i touch the top two levels ("sport" and "turbo"), and almost always on accident. You can keep exercising as much as you want to, but you can go further than you normally would and be confident you'll be able to get back home.
    • Don't worry so much about range, is the impression I've got. When buying an electric car, range is very important for many people. If it runs out of juice, you are boned. But with a pedal assist bike you can always just pedal home. It might suck, but you can do it. And, if you know you have a long trip ahead of you, you can wisely manage your power and really extend it. I think my highest mileage in a single day was about 38 miles, and I believe I came home with ~30% of battery remaining. A few times a week I do 12-16 miles a day and I don't even bother starting with a full charge or charging it when I get home. What I tell people is "you (or your kids) will get bored of the ride before you run out of battery". Edit: I just remembered that I talked to someone who took their 5 year old on an UA from La Crosse, WI to Wisconsin Dells, WI, a 100 mile trip, and had no issues.
    • The assist is most useful for hills, and for "getting off the line" at a stoplight where you are with traffic. Doing the little "wobble" from stopped to going isn't a good idea when you've got cars around you, so having some power to maintain a straight line helps. But once you've got some inertia behind your 112lb bike (before kids/gear), it rolls nice.

    Extra Bits

    • We had the car seat adapter which worked well with a Nuna car seat. Keep the springs greased up, though, they can get squeeky which stinks if you have a sleeping baby. The car seat faces you from the front of the bucket. The older kid, 4 at the time, easily slipped her legs under the car seat. This was great because we could also have a third kid in there on the bench seat, too.
    • We've moved to a "toddler" seat that straps to the normal bench seat, side by side with the now 5 year old. Unfortunately, this means we can't bring a friend with us. They do sell a "front bench" too, but we just aren't going to spring for it.
    • I have two big pannier bags on the back. These are just nice for the extra storage but also organization. Keeps stuff safe for when muddy shoes are coming into the bucket, and I stored the puffy blanket and big-ass chain lock in it. Sidenote: I don't use that chain lock much, but keep it with me in case I feel it's needed.
    • I recently bought a Schleptastic Tow Monster, for pulling a 20in kid bike. I haven't had much experience with it yet (I got it last week), but I had an unsupported rear rack but through emails with the owner of Schleptastic we figured it out. Jonah there was fantastically communicative and supportive.
    • I have a Wonderboom bluetooth speaker that just fits inside my expandable water bottle holder, and I basically can't ride a bike without it.

    closing

    I recommend bikes. I recommend e-bikes. I recommend cargo ebikes. I recommend a bakfiets (front bucket). Our urban arrow has been good, but I'm sure they all are nice. One knock against it is that it is big. For us, in a single stall garage, it barely fits with our small car. But it does fit, and if we had bought another car we definitely would not have had enough room for both cars. We don't pay for gas. Or car repairs. We do pay for bike insurance to cover theft, but that's <$200 year.

    The tagline I always tell people who ask about cost: "It's a very expensive bike, but a very cheap car".

    Happy to answer questions!

    10 votes
    1. rosco
      Link Parent
      What an amazing write up!!! I really appreciate you pouring so much thought and detail into it! It's easy to imagine the fun we'll be having from the way you describe it! I'm definitely going to...

      What an amazing write up!!! I really appreciate you pouring so much thought and detail into it! It's easy to imagine the fun we'll be having from the way you describe it! I'm definitely going to be stealing all the little touches like the sting lights and the Wonderboom. i've got more to noodle on here but feeling very confident with our choice to invest! Thank you so much!

      Also, I'd love to hear more about the Schleptastic Tow Monster once you have some miles using it. Sounds like the perfect option as the kiddos get older.

      3 votes
  2. rosco
    Link
    Calling out @gpl and @DynamoSunshirt specifically based on the recent bike thread and Dynamo's wealth of knowledge with biking - I'm guessing there is cargo knowledge in there too ;). Cheers!

    Calling out @gpl and @DynamoSunshirt specifically based on the recent bike thread and Dynamo's wealth of knowledge with biking - I'm guessing there is cargo knowledge in there too ;). Cheers!

    3 votes
  3. [2]
    Hobofarmer
    Link
    I used the Aventon Abound for a few years. My kids loved it. I loved it. I never had issues, the battery life and range was great, and it felt stable. It's not a front load bike though.

    I used the Aventon Abound for a few years. My kids loved it. I loved it. I never had issues, the battery life and range was great, and it felt stable. It's not a front load bike though.

    3 votes
    1. rosco
      Link Parent
      Sounds like any way you can get them rolling is perfect! We might switch over to a backloader after the baby stage but TBD on how we like the front loader!

      Sounds like any way you can get them rolling is perfect! We might switch over to a backloader after the baby stage but TBD on how we like the front loader!

      1 vote
  4. [5]
    lostwax
    Link
    I used two variants of cargo bike when my son was smaller. First was an old mountain bike with a Crust Clydesdale fork on the front and a kid seat bolted to the back. Second was essentially a...

    I used two variants of cargo bike when my son was smaller. First was an old mountain bike with a Crust Clydesdale fork on the front and a kid seat bolted to the back. Second was essentially a bigger version of the same thing, a Dutch Workcycles FR8. Neither were electric.

    I found they were good for up to maybe half of your ten mile range, beyond that I would probably want the electric push. I loved the mountain bike set-up and have retained that just for me and hated the Workcycles - overbuilt to the point of perversity and heaviness and geometry that suits Dutch people lolling about, not people that ride bikes normally. It did the job though and it was better than getting in the car. Both of these were a fraction of the cost of what you're looking at.

    Probably the only lesson for you from the above is that you can choose basically anything and as long as you can fit what you need and achieve the distance you need you'll be fine. All of the options you've outlined would work, pick the cheapest that puts you in the position you like to ride in and doesn't feel like a battleship. Given you ride a surly I'd be surprised if you like the riding position of anything Dutch. Bullits on the other hand have a good rep in this regard.

    Finally, yes, cargo bikes work so well when you have little kids, you aren't wrong about that impression. For most things, much better than a car.

    1 vote
    1. [2]
      GOTO10
      Link Parent
      And from what I heard, also much more fun for the kids.

      For most things, much better than a car.

      And from what I heard, also much more fun for the kids.

      1 vote
      1. lostwax
        Link Parent
        Yep, the car got complaints, bike never did.

        Yep, the car got complaints, bike never did.

        1 vote
    2. [2]
      rosco
      Link Parent
      Great call outs all around. The main issue here we're trying to solve for it that this will be shared by me and my wife. She wants a step through so unless we have a major shift after trialing,...

      Great call outs all around. The main issue here we're trying to solve for it that this will be shared by me and my wife. She wants a step through so unless we have a major shift after trialing, that's likely what we'll get. We also need a bigger frontend specifically to mount the carseat, so not necessarily one of the land boats, but at least something with enough room for that.

      I've heard the Bullit is the "bikers bike", sounds like the muli is similar, though it felt twitchy as hell when I rode it. The other ones do feel much more like seadoos, not in a bad way though.

      1 vote
      1. lostwax
        Link Parent
        Be wary of over emphasising the initial need for a car seat, that's only necessary for the first year (or less?), at which point you can move to a kid seat. That initial time is swamped by the...

        Be wary of over emphasising the initial need for a car seat, that's only necessary for the first year (or less?), at which point you can move to a kid seat. That initial time is swamped by the time after. We put up with a trailer for the earlier period.

        1 vote
  5. [3]
    thumbsupemoji
    Link
    these are obviously much nicer bikes lol, but we did very well with a bright orange radwagon until everyone was too big for it

    these are obviously much nicer bikes lol, but we did very well with a bright orange radwagon until everyone was too big for it

    1 vote
    1. Gazook89
      Link Parent
      Careful of radwagon though, they went through bankruptcy after a big recall due to batteries catching fire. Happened to an old college friend of mine. Just a quick web search now tells me they...

      Careful of radwagon though, they went through bankruptcy after a big recall due to batteries catching fire. Happened to an old college friend of mine.

      Just a quick web search now tells me they were acquired and are maybe back to making bikes again, so maybe newer models will be better....but you may find older ones heavily discounted online with potential issues.

      5 votes
    2. rosco
      Link Parent
      I'd go for a back loader but we need the front end cargo bike for the carseat mounts. When they are older the world is our oyster!

      I'd go for a back loader but we need the front end cargo bike for the carseat mounts. When they are older the world is our oyster!

      2 votes
  6. Fal
    Link
    cargo bike? uhhhhh no car go beep beep you feeling alright there man?

    cargo bike?

    uhhhhh no car go beep beep

    you feeling alright there man?