It's astonishing how such massive settlements can just disappear from mainstream knowledge for centuries. I'm very excited to see what new discoveries come out about this and how they reshape our...
A huge ancient city has been found in the Amazon, hidden for thousands of years by lush vegetation.
The discovery changes what we know about the history of people living in the Amazon.
"It changes the way we see Amazonian cultures. Most people picture small groups, probably naked, living in huts and clearing land - this shows ancient people lived in complicated urban societies," says co-author Antoine Dorison.
The city was built around 2,500 years ago, and people lived there for up to 1,000 years, according to archaeologists.
It is difficult to accurately estimate how many people lived there at any one time, but scientists say it is certainly in the 10,000s if not 100,000s.
Researchers first found evidence of a city in the 1970s, but this is the first time a comprehensive survey has been completed, after 25 years of research.
It reveals a large, complex society that appears to be even bigger than the well-known Mayan societies in Mexico and Central America.
It's astonishing how such massive settlements can just disappear from mainstream knowledge for centuries. I'm very excited to see what new discoveries come out about this and how they reshape our understanding of South American civilization.
I was fascinated by the Inca, Maya, and Aztecs as a child--it would have blown my mind to learn about peoples like the Kilamope and Upano (not to mention Olmecs, Toltecs, Mapuche, etc.).
There are also several novels written and movies made I think of adventurous sailors who left the shores of Europe and Americas to explore the wild Amazons, some came back with mesmerizing tales...
There are also several novels written and movies made I think of adventurous sailors who left the shores of Europe and Americas to explore the wild Amazons, some came back with mesmerizing tales of adventures and others settled with those tribes permanently.
I think Robinson Crusoe is just one such novel among many.
Robinson Crusoe is (principally) set on a remote island in the Atlantic. It's also set in the 1600s, which is long after this discovered city (which was inhabited only up to at the latest 1500...
Robinson Crusoe is (principally) set on a remote island in the Atlantic. It's also set in the 1600s, which is long after this discovered city (which was inhabited only up to at the latest 1500 years ago apparently). This is from an entirely different era than the novels and movies you reference, one that predates European contact.
Multiple concurrent novel epidemics tearing through your population will do that. Once European diseases showed up basically any large settlement with extensive trade networks collapsed. The...
It's astonishing how such massive settlements can just disappear from mainstream knowledge for centuries
Multiple concurrent novel epidemics tearing through your population will do that. Once European diseases showed up basically any large settlement with extensive trade networks collapsed. The remaining people are too preoccupied with survival and riding out the subsequent genocide to write much down.
Given that this city was inhabited up until around 1500 years ago at most, well prior to colonization, it seems unlikely that European diseases played a role in this particular case. The larger...
Given that this city was inhabited up until around 1500 years ago at most, well prior to colonization, it seems unlikely that European diseases played a role in this particular case. The larger societies that experienced Europran contact and the subsequent genocides tend to be the ones that there is more mainstream knowledge about.
Agreed that this find wasn't abandoned due to colonization but it's also true that both the contact of European colonizers and the effects of colonization and imperialism themselves, devastated...
Agreed that this find wasn't abandoned due to colonization but it's also true that both the contact of European colonizers and the effects of colonization and imperialism themselves, devastated the history of the indigenous people of that time. Whether the story of this city had already been lost to time when Europeans arrived here en masse is impossible to say now.
I personally think it's more likely that there was some sort of cultural continuity or understanding of the past inhabitants of a city of that size. Even if mythologized or altered. But that didn't survive colonization.
That said, we've known there was a city there of some sort for 50 years but continued to think the people of the area never lived in cities....
I don't know enough about the area to know who the deacendants of the people who lived in that city are likely to be -- but I suppose that's part of the problem. There's pretty much zero education...
I don't know enough about the area to know who the deacendants of the people who lived in that city are likely to be -- but I suppose that's part of the problem. There's pretty much zero education at all about the Americas prior to European colonization. I don't think it's so much that the knowledge itself is lost but that it's simply not proliferated into the mainstream whatsoever. More due to a continuing legacy of Eurocentrism than anything else imo.
While it's possible the knowledge did survive in the local peoples, I'm suggesting it was probably lost through a combination of eurocentric racism and the deaths of indigenous peoples and...
While it's possible the knowledge did survive in the local peoples, I'm suggesting it was probably lost through a combination of eurocentric racism and the deaths of indigenous peoples and cultures - killing leaders and elders, wiping out population through disease and abuse, destroying ways of life by force.. hard to maintain your history under those circumstances.
The disregard for the abilities of native peoples and the lack of education on that history is just the capstone to that. Destroy a culture, then tell that people they're primitive for having no culture.
Oh I absolutely agree with you on all this. I think it's just also the case that what knowledge we do have, through archaeology or what histoey is preserved, is not proliferated into the...
Oh I absolutely agree with you on all this. I think it's just also the case that what knowledge we do have, through archaeology or what histoey is preserved, is not proliferated into the mainstream due to even more Eurocentrism in our society and educational system, on top of what you describe. It's sad.
I’m not talking about how the city disappeared, I’m talking about how knowledge of the city disappeared. Historical knowledge in mostly non-literate cultures with heavy oral tradition to transmit...
I’m not talking about how the city disappeared, I’m talking about how knowledge of the city disappeared. Historical knowledge in mostly non-literate cultures with heavy oral tradition to transmit that knowledge don’t fare well when all their elders and most of their middle aged people die in droves.
Something depressing (because it was inevitable) about most parts of the inhabited world is that farming has destroyed almost any possible settlements from Bronze Age cultures. The settled areas...
Something depressing (because it was inevitable) about most parts of the inhabited world is that farming has destroyed almost any possible settlements from Bronze Age cultures. The settled areas tend to have good soil and any mounds, roads and wooden remains get completely wiped out by large scale modern farming techniques.
In Poland the reason Biskupin (wood dates from ca. 747BCE) was preserved, is that it was in a swampy area that stopped the wood from decomposing as well as prevented farmers from using the soil.
So the amazing part about the Amazon is that you have these vast areas of fertile areas that have not been sifted and flattened through farming. It is probably our best bet to finding anything from a wood and earth mound culture that did not focus on stone structures like the Greeks, Mesopotamians, Mayans or Egyptians.
Even our „Eurocentric“ understanding is not Eurocentric for all of Europe… it is just easiest to study cultures that moved rocks or built temples on mountains like the Greeks. We will probably never know as much about the cultures of the world that did not leave behind stone temples, cities and graves. The Amazon is probably the best place to find a relatively intact example.
Sometimes it's easy to forget just how big these warehouses are. Sorry, couldn't resist. But, yeah, I think we'll keep discovering those given how dense the foliage is—unless, of course,...
Sometimes it's easy to forget just how big these warehouses are.
Sorry, couldn't resist. But, yeah, I think we'll keep discovering those given how dense the foliage is—unless, of course, unstoppable march of deforestation doesn't destroy them (because it's not like anyone is going to report the finding when it can stop work).
It's astonishing how such massive settlements can just disappear from mainstream knowledge for centuries. I'm very excited to see what new discoveries come out about this and how they reshape our understanding of South American civilization.
I was fascinated by the Inca, Maya, and Aztecs as a child--it would have blown my mind to learn about peoples like the Kilamope and Upano (not to mention Olmecs, Toltecs, Mapuche, etc.).
Those estimates on size and habitation are wild! I'm very keen to see what more can be learned of the cultures that developed there.
If only we knew more about the Olmecs, it's so sad.
These findings are fascinating and I'd love to know more.
There are also several novels written and movies made I think of adventurous sailors who left the shores of Europe and Americas to explore the wild Amazons, some came back with mesmerizing tales of adventures and others settled with those tribes permanently.
I think Robinson Crusoe is just one such novel among many.
Robinson Crusoe is (principally) set on a remote island in the Atlantic. It's also set in the 1600s, which is long after this discovered city (which was inhabited only up to at the latest 1500 years ago apparently). This is from an entirely different era than the novels and movies you reference, one that predates European contact.
Multiple concurrent novel epidemics tearing through your population will do that. Once European diseases showed up basically any large settlement with extensive trade networks collapsed. The remaining people are too preoccupied with survival and riding out the subsequent genocide to write much down.
Given that this city was inhabited up until around 1500 years ago at most, well prior to colonization, it seems unlikely that European diseases played a role in this particular case. The larger societies that experienced Europran contact and the subsequent genocides tend to be the ones that there is more mainstream knowledge about.
Agreed that this find wasn't abandoned due to colonization but it's also true that both the contact of European colonizers and the effects of colonization and imperialism themselves, devastated the history of the indigenous people of that time. Whether the story of this city had already been lost to time when Europeans arrived here en masse is impossible to say now.
I personally think it's more likely that there was some sort of cultural continuity or understanding of the past inhabitants of a city of that size. Even if mythologized or altered. But that didn't survive colonization.
That said, we've known there was a city there of some sort for 50 years but continued to think the people of the area never lived in cities....
I don't know enough about the area to know who the deacendants of the people who lived in that city are likely to be -- but I suppose that's part of the problem. There's pretty much zero education at all about the Americas prior to European colonization. I don't think it's so much that the knowledge itself is lost but that it's simply not proliferated into the mainstream whatsoever. More due to a continuing legacy of Eurocentrism than anything else imo.
While it's possible the knowledge did survive in the local peoples, I'm suggesting it was probably lost through a combination of eurocentric racism and the deaths of indigenous peoples and cultures - killing leaders and elders, wiping out population through disease and abuse, destroying ways of life by force.. hard to maintain your history under those circumstances.
The disregard for the abilities of native peoples and the lack of education on that history is just the capstone to that. Destroy a culture, then tell that people they're primitive for having no culture.
Oh I absolutely agree with you on all this. I think it's just also the case that what knowledge we do have, through archaeology or what histoey is preserved, is not proliferated into the mainstream due to even more Eurocentrism in our society and educational system, on top of what you describe. It's sad.
I’m not talking about how the city disappeared, I’m talking about how knowledge of the city disappeared. Historical knowledge in mostly non-literate cultures with heavy oral tradition to transmit that knowledge don’t fare well when all their elders and most of their middle aged people die in droves.
Something depressing (because it was inevitable) about most parts of the inhabited world is that farming has destroyed almost any possible settlements from Bronze Age cultures. The settled areas tend to have good soil and any mounds, roads and wooden remains get completely wiped out by large scale modern farming techniques.
In Poland the reason Biskupin (wood dates from ca. 747BCE) was preserved, is that it was in a swampy area that stopped the wood from decomposing as well as prevented farmers from using the soil.
So the amazing part about the Amazon is that you have these vast areas of fertile areas that have not been sifted and flattened through farming. It is probably our best bet to finding anything from a wood and earth mound culture that did not focus on stone structures like the Greeks, Mesopotamians, Mayans or Egyptians.
Even our „Eurocentric“ understanding is not Eurocentric for all of Europe… it is just easiest to study cultures that moved rocks or built temples on mountains like the Greeks. We will probably never know as much about the cultures of the world that did not leave behind stone temples, cities and graves. The Amazon is probably the best place to find a relatively intact example.
Sometimes it's easy to forget just how big these warehouses are.
Sorry, couldn't resist. But, yeah, I think we'll keep discovering those given how dense the foliage is—unless, of course, unstoppable march of deforestation doesn't destroy them (because it's not like anyone is going to report the finding when it can stop work).