61
votes
A pregnant woman in Texas whose fetus has trisomy 18 was granted a court order for an abortion
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- Title
- Texas judge grants pregnant woman's request to get an abortion
- Published
- Dec 7 2023
- Word count
- 333 words
One of the tactics the TX State's Attorney office has been using in the other lawsuit is arguing that the women should sue their doctors, not the State because the State made the relevant exceptions, the doctors just wouldn't do it.
Now they're arguing the State will be directly harmed if an abortion is allowed and that they'll prosecute the doctor, persecute the hospitals, and encouraged others to use the "bounty" law as well.
I really loathe Ken Paxton but I wish the courts would tell him he can't have it both ways, at the bare minimum.
It's going to take a case like Savita Halappanavar I fear.
I was waiting on this verdict to see how it'll play out with the other lawsuit. It just baffles me that they're arguing that the state wold be directly harmed and threatening to sue the hospitals/doctors. This is craziness..... I wonder how this response would impact the ongoing lawsuit now that the state is responding this way.
From a very practical perspective, I do not understand why this woman is still in Texas, I know at this point she's gone far enough that somebody could still try to go after her with a civil suit if she left the state for an abortion. But at the same time don't die while trying to follow this law. Or while trying to challenge this law. (Which I'm not sure she's doing on a larger scale, nor do I expect her to be responsible for doing so)
I can see your point, but I can say that I've read articles where folks going to states with abortion access have experienced long wait times. It might be that she tried but couldn't find an appointment that was soon enough considering how urgent her case is. Another idea is how fast this lawsuit came up and a decision was made - I felt it was pretty quick. So this might have been the faster way for her. Or she did both and waited to see which one would come through faster for her....
It's more me wanting her to be able to get out. Illinois or Colorado could almost certainly have provided services in the time she's had multiple ER visits.
This isn't me criticizing her just like, wanting her to be ok.
Oh totally agree with you there!
Looked her up and found this on her Wikipedia page:
WTF, Ireland?
Ireland is a very Catholic country still, and it took this level - sepsis that wasn't immediately fatal, though it turned out to be ultimately - for something to change.
I'm not truly sure it would change the politicians minds here, but Americans overwhelmingly support at least some amount of abortion access. Few people want someone to die.
I figured it would have to do with Ireland's Catholicism, but still... life imprisonment! Did they not see the tragic irony/hypocrisy in that?
And yeah, I agree with you. Unfortunately, I feel like the only thing capable of changing a lot of the societal problems we have here in the US is a critical mass of people getting fed up with the consequences of these shitty policies. And sadly that means that some preventable tragedies will occur. They definitely shouldn't, but they absolutely will.
My general persuasion is that most people across the political spectrum have good intentions and largely want the same ends (freedom, human prosperity, improved quality of life, etc) but disagree strongly on the methods that get us there.
Ghouls like this strain my theory. It feels like senseless cruelty, directed at a married mother no less; it's not like they're doing it to punish a woman for having sex outside marriage (and therefore discourage future women from having extra marital sex.)
Unfortunately there's a pretty large subset of people who believe the only method to get us there is to force everyone to abide by their specific interpretation of the principles of their faith. Freedom is only allowed within the bounds of what they deem Right.
I would find using the law to punish an unmarried woman for having sex equally abhorrent, as a likely permanently unmarried woman.
I also tend to prefer to believe that people are reasonable and have good intentions. But I think anyone of the attorneys defending the state on this now are culpable.
Agreed. However at least there'd seem to be a point to the cruelty. In this case, it seems entirely senseless.
And it's back on hold.
Texas Supreme Court Temporarily Halts Court-Approved Abortion
shessh... I was just reading an article. Honestly, I feel like it's when people start dying from this and states are sued that we'll start seeing changes......and that sucks.
Woman Who Sought Court-Ordered Abortion Is Leaving Texas for Procedure
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/11/us/texas-abortion-kate-cox.html
I'm very happy she's leaving. She's 20+ weeks now.
Literally just saw this article, I'm glad she's doing this because this is just ridiculous. Safer for her to just do this for her health; I wonder if she'll join the other lawsuit.
I wouldn't be shocked if she ends up having her current lawsuit dismissed for lack of standing. Which will be particularly ironic if the attorney general then decides to go after her in some way
a post about this from the excellent Abortion, Every Day substack:
A Country of "Walking Coffins": Kate Cox is leaving Texas to get an abortion. But what if there was no place to go?
The answer to those questions is no. There's not a plan. They're the dog that caught the car and somehow it's possibly the only thing preventing a second round of Trump.
I'm going to piggy back on your comment a little bit.
I don't want to assume the outcome of an election a year away, but I think Trump's themes this time are not as appealing to voters as they were . He is no longer seen as a savvy businessman by as many people. He's no longer a complete outsider. He has a record in office to evaluate. His campaign focus is all on 'they done me dirty. They're corrupt. I'm going to get revenge'. In 2016 I thought Hillary's message came across as self centered and talking down to people. She kept saying I'm qualified and I'm ready to lead. Politics is transactional, not a meritocracy. This time I think Trump is not focused enough on what he can offer to do for his voters.
I also think that the trials are hurting his chances. Abortion is definitely also in the mix as motivation to vote and distinguishing factor between the parties.
I don't think anyone beats Trump in the primary right now. But I think abortion may be one of the major things that gets white women in particular to reevaluate their Republican votes. I suspect that the overturn of Roe will turn out to be the thing that stops Trump's second term more than apathy. A "third" party Republican run could arguably do as much but that's where I'd lay my "very much not a political analyst" odds.
I agree with you that it is motivating people who might otherwise not have bothered to participate. Also the news around all the medical complications is ugly, along with that poor girl from Ohio and the Indiana AG who went after a doctor for helping a ten year old. Republicans are no longer free to say I'm against abortion but with these reasonable exceptions.
I just think the other factors I named are also working against Trump this time. Some of the same people who cared about Hilary's email server and 'wiped it with a cloth' disingenuous response will also have cared a lot about classified documents in the bathroom of a resort.
And the SCOTX ruled against her, essentially saying (if I understand correctly) that though the law references both life threatening and loss of a major bodily function, it's only the former that counts due to the way the law is written.
I hope she can stay out of Texas forever. She's literally now a test case for being sued under their bounty law. (or her husband or lawyer or mom or whoever goes with her).
Texas Supreme Court Rules Against Woman Who Sought Court-Approved Abortion https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/11/us/texas-abortion-kate-cox.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
As a total aside the tagging and sorting system here is a full mystery to me.
This isn't so much a health article IMO, it's a law/news one (I really would rather it be moved out of health), and as very few tags pop up as auto fill suggestions when you're typing it's all a guessing game in the moment.
But then others know it all and change everything and while i appreciate the help, I'd rather it be less muddled and more clear, ya know?
@cfabbro can you assist with moving it out of health? It doesn't align with the other posts there.
Yeah, the suggestion system is a bit kludged together, so not always that useful. And the tagging conventions are largely unspoken, unwritten, and were established ad-hoc over time, so are kinda hard to explain or formalize into documentation. You mostly have to just get a feel for them over time by looking at a bunch of other tags, and viewing all the tag edits.
But TBH it's not super important for the person submitting to get all the tags exactly correct, so don't worry about them too much. They're mostly used by Tildes search, and to allow people to filter out and browse by particular tags.
And, sure.... makes sense. I moved it back to ~news for you.
I appreciate the help. It's more an internal feeling of inadequacy at failing to even get the country/state thing right or if I don't put USA there's one person that posts a reminder to. Etc. so I feel like I want to be a good citizen and do my part but also that I'm bad at it.
Thanks for the move, I even double checked health and yeah it was a bad fit with the other topics imo.
I know it only matters a little - but it also clearly matters or it wouldn't happen, ya know?
NP. But no need to feel inadequate, or like a bad netizen for getting a few things incorrect. Tildes is a collaborative effort. And if it makes you feel any better, I've been here since Day 1, submit quite a lot, tag a ton of other people's posts, and even I still regularly get my tags edited/corrected by @mycketforvirrad (who seems to have a photographic memory, and appears able to somehow remember every single tag that's ever been applied, and their exact formatting). ;)
Yeah I try not to take things personally, but I have 'being a good netizen' inscribed on a merit badge in my brain somewhere I think and just want to do well
I really could do with a photographic memory. That would be neat!
I already struggle enough with embarrassing memories from my past popping back into my head randomly, and making me feel uncomfortable all over again... so a photographic memory sounds like a nightmare to me! :P
Currently, law is only a tag. Legal articles end up in many different groups.
Some tags are frequently blocked, like politics or Donald Trump. If the content is not something someone wants to block, I don't worry about exact tags
I knew law was a tag, but Health seemed like a bad fit was all!
For sure. : )
Not criticizing at all. I also complain when the librarians and indexers here sort my post in a way I disagree with.