19 votes

What are your thoughts on the BAT system?

I have recently been getting into the Brave browser and they have a system called BAT. I'm still not totally clear on all the intricacies, but the basic idea is that they have a universal token that can be given to content creators, instead of using advertising. Here's a link because I probably messed up that description somehow. So what are your thoughts on it?

35 comments

  1. [7]
    unknown user
    Link
    Maybe it's my learned grumpiness, or maybe it's my bad experience with start-ups, or maybe it's all the cryptocurrency scandals, but the moment I see this word, I have one instinct: run.

    Blockchain

    Maybe it's my learned grumpiness, or maybe it's my bad experience with start-ups, or maybe it's all the cryptocurrency scandals, but the moment I see this word, I have one instinct: run.

    31 votes
    1. papasquat
      Link Parent
      For some reason, any new, profitable industry attracts a certain type of complete scumbag. They're all exactly alike. They're stupid and uninspired, but they project themselves as intelligent and...

      For some reason, any new, profitable industry attracts a certain type of complete scumbag. They're all exactly alike. They're stupid and uninspired, but they project themselves as intelligent and visionary. They think they're much more talented than they are, and profess to want to "change the world", but in actuality just want to make as much money as possible at all costs. They're usually younger and male, do a lot of drugs, and brag about having sex with lots of women.

      I don't know where these guys come from, but they're like roaches any time any sort of new field, industry, or product starts getting popular. They displace the people who invented the thing and actually care about it and run it to the ground. This happened in everything from mobile app development, to cryptocurrencies, to e-cigarretes, to "hoverboards", to drones. It's like they're the new gold prospectors, but instead of being quaint and charming with long beards and ten gallon hats, they spike their hair and wear sandals everywhere.

      Cryptocurrency for me started as something fascinating from a technical perspective, to something that libertarians and anarchocapitalists thought would revolutionize everything about the world (for the better!) somehow, to being co-opted by these lowlives. I completely resent the entire field now and the well has been poisoned enough that I don't take anything that even purports to use the technology seriously anymore.

      20 votes
    2. [3]
      PopeRigby
      Link Parent
      I skimmed the Wikipedia article and I'm somewhat confused. What's bad about block chain?

      I skimmed the Wikipedia article and I'm somewhat confused. What's bad about block chain?

      5 votes
      1. unknown user
        Link Parent
        Blockchain the technology? Nothing. Just a clever way to build distributed append-only databases. Blockchain the hype? Oh boy. It's the classical example of someone being so infatuated with their...

        Blockchain the technology? Nothing. Just a clever way to build distributed append-only databases.

        Blockchain the hype? Oh boy. It's the classical example of someone being so infatuated with their hammer that everything (banking systems, democracy, medicine, you name it) is now a nail. I could go on for several paragraphs, but @papasquat above did it for me.

        21 votes
      2. Fdashstop
        Link Parent
        It's not what's wrong with it, it's what it means these days: essentially nothing. Depending on your age, you may remember when everything was an E-something or other. The use of the term...

        It's not what's wrong with it, it's what it means these days: essentially nothing. Depending on your age, you may remember when everything was an E-something or other. The use of the term blockchain is starting to become that.

        5 votes
    3. RapidEyeMovement
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Basically if you are not taking Blockchain seriously you are going to looked like a dinosaur in many fields. Now that is not to say that people are not taking advantage of those in the...

      Basically if you are not taking Blockchain seriously you are going to looked like a dinosaur in many fields.

      Now that is not to say that people are not taking advantage of those in the cryptocurrency realm, but block chain is going to be a core technology in may sectors moving forward.

      1 vote
    4. meghan
      Link Parent
      nope, that's the correct response

      nope, that's the correct response

      5 votes
  2. [2]
    Diff
    Link
    I wish it wasn't a block chain. I'm all for making ads better. On my own website my biggest pain point is the single Google ad banner on top of my page. It drags the whole thing down. Loads...

    I wish it wasn't a block chain. I'm all for making ads better. On my own website my biggest pain point is the single Google ad banner on top of my page. It drags the whole thing down. Loads slower, the ads break many of Google's own recommendations for performance and loading speed, and the huge invasion of privacy.

    Actually just yesterday I was looking into seeing if it was possible to host Brave ads on my site, but seeing as their only payout is some block chain thing, it kind of turned me off investigating any further. It's too much effort to convert that into something I can feed back into the hosting bills.

    13 votes
    1. KapteinB
      Link Parent
      I use Flattr myself. The concept is basically the same; you set up a monthly budget you want to support content creators with, the extension tracks how much time you spend on different web sites,...

      I use Flattr myself.

      The concept is basically the same; you set up a monthly budget you want to support content creators with, the extension tracks how much time you spend on different web sites, and once a month your budget is split among those you visited. The big difference is that Flattr pays you in good old fiat money.

      7 votes
  3. [6]
    thisonemakesyouthink
    Link
    BAT is a very good system I believe and I've had my eye on it for a while. It's a great way to say thanks to a content creator (this includes websites, youtubers, twitch streamers, etc) without...

    BAT is a very good system I believe and I've had my eye on it for a while. It's a great way to say thanks to a content creator (this includes websites, youtubers, twitch streamers, etc) without sitting through ads. I'm usually okay with ads to support creators but lately youtube especially has been expecting more and more of ad viewers, like 11 minute unskippable ads back to back (on a 10 minute video). This is why I believe BAT to be a good system, and a better more direct way to support content creators.

    A new system like this will never be without its naysayers, and it does have it's drawbacks. For example, right now you can only use it through the Brave browser, which is very limited compared to something like firefox or even google chrome, which makes me not want to use it has my main browser. However, I think the system has potential and we'll never know if we don't try.

    9 votes
    1. [4]
      PopeRigby
      Link Parent
      The new Brave beta actually has all the Chrome extensions now. The only thing holding it back now is mainly the lack of sync. They're implementing that now though. You should give it a shot. It...

      The new Brave beta actually has all the Chrome extensions now. The only thing holding it back now is mainly the lack of sync. They're implementing that now though. You should give it a shot. It even has a built-in dark mode.

      6 votes
      1. thisonemakesyouthink
        Link Parent
        That's cool, unfortunately there are just a lot of firefox only extensions I use too, firefox just has so much more customization.

        That's cool, unfortunately there are just a lot of firefox only extensions I use too, firefox just has so much more customization.

        5 votes
      2. [2]
        tildez
        Link Parent
        I'm on the normal release channel and it syncs settings, history, and bookmarks.

        I'm on the normal release channel and it syncs settings, history, and bookmarks.

        2 votes
        1. PopeRigby
          Link Parent
          Yeah that's true. It's just that one doesn't have chrome extensions and the sync doesn't work from phones to desktop and vice-versa.

          Yeah that's true. It's just that one doesn't have chrome extensions and the sync doesn't work from phones to desktop and vice-versa.

  4. [13]
    Eva
    Link
    An alright-ish system built by a terrible, terrible person: Homophobe, environmental-terrorist, creator of Javascript, Brendan Eich. (Okay yeah the ecoterrorist bit is stretching a bit but we'd be...

    An alright-ish system built by a terrible, terrible person:

    Homophobe, environmental-terrorist, creator of Javascript, Brendan Eich.

    (Okay yeah the ecoterrorist bit is stretching a bit but we'd be so much better off environmentally if Javascript wasn't a thing. I stand entirely by the homophobe comment, though, given Eich's history.)

    3 votes
    1. [11]
      PopeRigby
      Link Parent
      Homophobe? I've never heard that. Can you link me to something he's said?

      Homophobe? I've never heard that. Can you link me to something he's said?

      2 votes
      1. [10]
        Eva
        Link Parent
        Better, I can link you to what he's supported financially: http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2014/04/04/brendan_eich_supported_prop_8_which_was_worse_than_you_remember.html
        4 votes
        1. [9]
          PopeRigby
          Link Parent
          Damn. That's really upsetting. I really like Brave also. What am I supposed to do about that?

          Damn. That's really upsetting. I really like Brave also. What am I supposed to do about that?

          1 vote
          1. [8]
            Eva
            Link Parent
            Honestly? I just wouldn't buy into BAT. BAT's the only thing about Brave that they're actually monetising, so just take what they give and buy no more BAT, really.

            Honestly? I just wouldn't buy into BAT. BAT's the only thing about Brave that they're actually monetising, so just take what they give and buy no more BAT, really.

            2 votes
            1. [7]
              PopeRigby
              Link Parent
              I haven't even bought BAT. They just give it for free every month. A weekly budget of sorts.

              I haven't even bought BAT. They just give it for free every month. A weekly budget of sorts.

              1 vote
              1. [6]
                Eva
                Link Parent
                Yep! Take advantage of that (if so inclined, maybe send some toward pro-LGBT causes), but I couldn't recommend buying any.

                Yep! Take advantage of that (if so inclined, maybe send some toward pro-LGBT causes), but I couldn't recommend buying any.

                3 votes
                1. PopeRigby
                  Link Parent
                  That's just so frustrating. I wanted to get behind Brave but now I don't know. Should I not support the entire thing because the CEO is an asshole? Ugh. I don't really know.

                  That's just so frustrating. I wanted to get behind Brave but now I don't know. Should I not support the entire thing because the CEO is an asshole? Ugh. I don't really know.

                  3 votes
                2. [5]
                  Comment deleted by author
                  Link Parent
                  1. [3]
                    Eva
                    Link Parent
                    It does. Why does Brave take 5% of my publisher contributions, isn’t this high compared to credit card fees which are typically 2.5%? Credit card interchange fees may appear to total only a bit...

                    It does.

                    Why does Brave take 5% of my publisher contributions, isn’t this high compared to credit card fees which are typically 2.5%?
                    
                    Credit card interchange fees may appear to total only a bit more than 2%, but due to chargebacks over fraud, merchants pay a heavy hidden fee. Also, our fee has to cover infrastructure costs which provide an always free Brave browser as well as the Brave Payments system for publisher support. It is our intention to minimize those fees as we grow and realize economies of scale.
                    

                    From the Brave Payments FAQ, found here: https://brave.com/faq-payments/#brave-fee

                    cc @lumbo7332

                    2 votes
                    1. [2]
                      PopeRigby
                      Link Parent
                      Damn. Of course

                      Damn. Of course

                      2 votes
                      1. KapteinB
                        Link Parent
                        If your goal is to support content creators, you could consider Flattr as an alternative.

                        If your goal is to support content creators, you could consider Flattr as an alternative.

                        1 vote
    2. Wren
      Link Parent
      Should we really trust any software this guy writes?

      Creator of Javascript

      Should we really trust any software this guy writes?

      2 votes
  5. [3]
    hoefijzer
    Link
    Truth be told, I have a relatively high standard when it comes to paying for things. And when I look at most content online, I'm hard pressed to find even a single one I'm willing to pay for. I...

    Truth be told, I have a relatively high standard when it comes to paying for things. And when I look at most content online, I'm hard pressed to find even a single one I'm willing to pay for. I oftentimes put money towards projects I really care about (Wikipedia or Linux for example), I pay a monthly fee for my VPN and I have a subscription for Netflix. I pay for them because there's nothing that can substitute for them, and there won't be any for the foreseeable future.

    But web content? So little of it is unique, I really can't justify the expense for myself. I know there would be a lot less content if people couldn't at the very least recuperate their expenses. It's just that I really wouldn't miss most of the online content, even if I enjoy it now. Maybe that's hypocritical. Maybe I have no right to consume content I'm not willing to pay for, one way or the other. But I think that when you make an active decision to put stuff out there for free, it should be for free. The marginal costs for providing me with free content are practically zero anyway, and it's not like I would've paid when given the option.

    So, er, back on-topic: I don't use it and I don't think I ever will.

    2 votes
    1. [2]
      PopeRigby
      Link Parent
      What about websites like Tildes?

      What about websites like Tildes?

      2 votes
      1. hoefijzer
        Link Parent
        It's definitely on my shortlist. Properly curated online communities are rare and they deserve at the very least deserve some income. Problem is, though, at the moment Patreon doesn't seem to...

        It's definitely on my shortlist. Properly curated online communities are rare and they deserve at the very least deserve some income. Problem is, though, at the moment Patreon doesn't seem to offer any options for me to pay without a credit card or Paypal, and I have neither.

        5 votes
  6. [4]
    unknown user
    Link
    AFAIU it's an automated system where what the user focuses their attention is measured by software and some sort of payment is made based on that data. Personally I'd never partecipate on that...

    AFAIU it's an automated system where what the user focuses their attention is measured by software and some sort of payment is made based on that data. Personally I'd never partecipate on that because the payment happens without my express will. I'm waiting for micropayments and am participating in Patreon. I don't want to help out every website I lay my gaze upon, just like I don't pay for just checking out a book or newspaper or even the storefront at some shop. An example I've cited in a past comment was about a hypothetical far-right video on Youtube: if I was watching one to see what it was about or for critical purposes, I don't want to enrich the publishers thereof in any way, even anonymously.

    1 vote
    1. [3]
      PopeRigby
      Link Parent
      You can adjust so it doesn't do that actually

      You can adjust so it doesn't do that actually

      1. [2]
        unknown user
        Link Parent
        In that case is it possible to manually pay for a certain page / content? The website has too much text but too little information as to how this works in practice, unfortunately.

        In that case is it possible to manually pay for a certain page / content? The website has too much text but too little information as to how this works in practice, unfortunately.

        1. PopeRigby
          Link Parent
          It should have an option if you go to a website and click on the rewards menu

          It should have an option if you go to a website and click on the rewards menu