28 votes

Four former Volkswagen managers found guilty in German emissions trial

10 comments

  1. [9]
    Papavk
    Link
    Gifted link. While it's a very long time coming and probably not sufficient, it is nice to see some people be held accountable for the diesel cheating scandal.

    Gifted link.

    While it's a very long time coming and probably not sufficient, it is nice to see some people be held accountable for the diesel cheating scandal.

    9 votes
    1. [8]
      Omnicrola
      Link Parent
      As an American, I am simultaneously amazed and jealous of this level of legal accountability for executives in a company the size of VW.

      More than 30 former Volkswagen engineers and managers await trial in the case.

      As an American, I am simultaneously amazed and jealous of this level of legal accountability for executives in a company the size of VW.

      17 votes
      1. [7]
        MimicSquid
        Link Parent
        "engineers and managers" neatly avoids the C suite. If their boss says "Will no one rid me of thid troublesome efficiency requirement?" and they do so, is it not the bosses' fault?

        "engineers and managers" neatly avoids the C suite. If their boss says "Will no one rid me of thid troublesome efficiency requirement?" and they do so, is it not the bosses' fault?

        9 votes
        1. [2]
          patience_limited
          (edited )
          Link Parent
          From the article, it sounds like they're still in the process of prosecuting another 30 executives, including the former CEO: I find it just barely plausible that the CEO didn't know the details...

          From the article, it sounds like they're still in the process of prosecuting another 30 executives, including the former CEO:

          Among them is Martin Winterkorn, a former chief executive of the company. His trial has been on hold because he is in poor health. It is unclear when or if the proceedings will continue. Mr. Winterkorn has repeatedly denied wrongdoing.

          I find it just barely plausible that the CEO didn't know the details of the emissions cheating (see "Business Idiots"). At the same time it should be criminally culpable for a chief executive to be deliberately ignorant while fostering an ethical culture this bad.

          17 votes
          1. redbearsam
            Link Parent
            Wow well that article took me an hour to read, but it was pretty good

            Wow well that article took me an hour to read, but it was pretty good

            1 vote
        2. [4]
          Omnicrola
          Link Parent
          I'm unclear just from this article if the C suite was involved or not. If they were, I agree they should absolutely face similar if not even harsher penalties. The article also uses "executives"...

          I'm unclear just from this article if the C suite was involved or not. If they were, I agree they should absolutely face similar if not even harsher penalties.

          The article also uses "executives" (article text) and "managers" (article title) to refer to the same people, so I'm also uncertain how far up the chain the penalties have reached.

          4 votes
          1. [3]
            Papavk
            Link Parent
            The article left me thinking that it was upper middle management that both intentionally chose to make the software cheat and that they should cover it up (ie keep it amongst themselves)....

            The article left me thinking that it was upper middle management that both intentionally chose to make the software cheat and that they should cover it up (ie keep it amongst themselves). Nevertheless, it's hard to see how executives can't also be responsible for creating an environment where the apparent best path forward for leaders below them was to choose to break the law.

            5 votes
            1. [2]
              Minori
              Link Parent
              Sometimes people lie and cheat without telling you. It's impossible for a CEO to deeply know the details of everything going on in the company. It's just as likely a middle manager or director...

              Sometimes people lie and cheat without telling you. It's impossible for a CEO to deeply know the details of everything going on in the company. It's just as likely a middle manager or director could've created an environment where lying was encouraged.

              2 votes
              1. MimicSquid
                Link Parent
                That's what audits and reviews are for. As the C suite people will lie to you for their own purposes. You have to have someone with no stake in the project do a thorough review to tease out...

                That's what audits and reviews are for. As the C suite people will lie to you for their own purposes. You have to have someone with no stake in the project do a thorough review to tease out exactly this kind of concern.

                2 votes
  2. riQQ
    Link
    Two times prison sentence without suspension, two times with suspension

    Two of the managers received multiyear prison sentences, and two received suspended sentences. Jens Hadler, who oversaw diesel engine development, received the longest prison sentence, at four and a half years. Another ex-manager who worked in engine electronics, Hanno Jelden, received two years and seven months. The two men given suspended sentences were Heinz-Jakob Neusser, who was responsible for components development and was sentenced to one year and three months, and a man identified as Thorsten D., an emissions specialist who received one year and 10 months.

    Two times prison sentence without suspension, two times with suspension

    Ferdinand Dudenhöffer, director of the Center Automotive Research in Bochum, Germany, who worked at Volkswagen early in his career, called the four convicted men “scapegoats.” The scandal, he said, was the product of “a system based on fear and obedience created by authoritarian leaders.”

    The scandal has cost Volkswagen more than $30 billion in fines and legal fees.

    9 votes