I had to look these up. Aside from unnecessary things like touch controls, screens, and logic boards that are known for going out and being next to impossible to replace the only feature I can...
“People order a $10,000 fridge and have been waiting since May,” he said.
I had to look these up. Aside from unnecessary things like touch controls, screens, and logic boards that are known for going out and being next to impossible to replace the only feature I can find that seems to be of use at the $10k level are water heaters so it can also be your kettle. Of note that this feature is also available on refrigerators that are $7k less at the same size.
There’s something to be said about the amount of devices I have scattered around my counters and cupboards. I’d pay to integrate more of them into other appliances. Not for $10k but...
There’s something to be said about the amount of devices I have scattered around my counters and cupboards. I’d pay to integrate more of them into other appliances. Not for $10k but...
For anyone else who's curious, at that end of the market you're likely to be looking at brands like Gaggenau or Sub Zero - the former being more "designer" (with a lot of the actual components...
For anyone else who's curious, at that end of the market you're likely to be looking at brands like Gaggenau or Sub Zero - the former being more "designer" (with a lot of the actual components being shared with Bosch: good quality, but available at 10% of the price), the latter targeting a similar market but selling as "the absolute best fridge you can get, no compromises, cost be damned". I don't think either represent anything resembling good value, but it's interesting to see the difference in selling points between them.
I think I'm going to stick to a dumb fridge for as long as possible. Less complexity hopefully means it's less likely to fail. If a washer/dryer or dishwasher dies, I can wait a few days or weeks...
I think I'm going to stick to a dumb fridge for as long as possible. Less complexity hopefully means it's less likely to fail. If a washer/dryer or dishwasher dies, I can wait a few days or weeks while I get the money together to replace it. If a fridge dies, you've got hardly any time to get that thing replaced before the food inside goes to crap or you're stuck buying ice every day for a cooler.
Same. I have a dumb fridge I moved from my last house to this one and will likely come with me on the next move in 2-3 years. I "upgraded" it to the features that the new ones have by replacing...
Same. I have a dumb fridge I moved from my last house to this one and will likely come with me on the next move in 2-3 years. I "upgraded" it to the features that the new ones have by replacing the light bulb with an LED one when it died. It has an ice maker, an old-fashioned one where you have to open the freezer door and there's a bucket full of ice (I know! How do I live?!). It operates on a very simple set of switches and relays.
I've got the ice bucket feature too! Only downside to it is that if you don't push the bucket all the way back you'll end up with a freezer full of ice cubes because the automatic on/off is so...
I've got the ice bucket feature too! Only downside to it is that if you don't push the bucket all the way back you'll end up with a freezer full of ice cubes because the automatic on/off is so simple it doesn't care if the bucket's where it should be or not.
Eh. I just moved, but my previous apartment came with a 20 year old fridge. I did the math, and before I decided to move I was seriously considering replacing the fridge even though I would...
Eh. I just moved, but my previous apartment came with a 20 year old fridge. I did the math, and before I decided to move I was seriously considering replacing the fridge even though I would certainly have left the replacement in the apartment when I moved. The new fridge would have paid for itself in electricity savings in 1-2 years.
When the energy savings is so great that it makes economic sense for me to basically buy my landlord a fridge, is "repair not replace" really the sane choice?
For the individual, in that example, clearly not. For the environment, it's a maybe. Pricing externalities is something that hasn't really been done well, or at all in many cases, so if your...
For the individual, in that example, clearly not. For the environment, it's a maybe. Pricing externalities is something that hasn't really been done well, or at all in many cases, so if your electricity is overpriced relative to its resource footprint and the fridge is underpriced by that same metric then there's a good chance that the financially sensible choice is at odds with the environmentally sensible one.
All that said, 20 years is a damn good lifetime for most consumer products, so you're quite possibly operating at the extreme where both incentives actually are aligned. The more common case of cheap, broken appliances being thrown out at the 5-8 year mark is a different matter.
I was interested as well, because those were absolutely numbers that I pulled out of the air. I found some data from Consumer Reports - most manufacturers seem to be suggesting an expected...
I was interested as well, because those were absolutely numbers that I pulled out of the air. I found some data from Consumer Reports - most manufacturers seem to be suggesting an expected lifespan of about 10 years, with the data showing about a third of appliances across the board (40% of fridges specifically) developing a problem in the first five years.
It doesn't give figures on how much is repaired rather than thrown out, but I will say that I've seen a significant skew towards lower cost (i.e. sub-£200 fridges or cookers, sub-£300 washing machines), cheaply made, more "disposable" large appliances. They do say the average refrigerator repair comes in at $162, which is perilously close to the cost of a new low-end fridge.
It's the whole Sam Vimes "Boots" theory again. If you can afford to buy from Miele in the first place you'll probably spend less in the long run and you'll do better for the environment. If you have to get the cheapest possible option you'll likely find it harder and less economical to repair, go through three of them in 20 years, and spend more in total anyway.
Now it seems that customers looking to buy a refrigerator are facing long waiting times as models are back-ordered across the country. There are also shortages for other major appliances including dishwashers, dryers and some microwaves.
[...]
“People are spending more time at home and we’ve seen a record number not just for fridges but dishwashers, washing machines and dryers. If appliances are 15 to 20 years old, the more people they use them, the more likely they need to be replaced.”
[...]
“There’s no supply chain,” he said. “So if you order a fridge the manufacturers are working at 25-50 percent capacity, there’s a problem,” he explained, saying that due to coronavirus factories are working with limited help. “The imports are taking forever. It’s a supply chain issue.”
I will say I can kind of understand this. I moved in to my house in spring of 2019 and while I'm not sure it's got all the original appliances, they're definitely older. I talked last year about...
I will say I can kind of understand this. I moved in to my house in spring of 2019 and while I'm not sure it's got all the original appliances, they're definitely older. I talked last year about maybe replacing them in the next 5 years or so, but having spent so much time at home I've now been considering moving that timeline up.
This story only hints at a larger problem. Long Gangly Supply Lines. This will get worse as world wide Volatility increases. In times of stability, supply chains maximize for the cheapest price on...
This story only hints at a larger problem. Long Gangly Supply Lines. This will get worse as world wide Volatility increases.
In times of stability, supply chains maximize for the cheapest price on a component and source it from their. If it come Asia, South America, or Africa it doesn't matter as long as it is the cheapest (that fits in spec). In a world in chaos all those long gangly supply lines that used to maximize profit per unit sold become liabilities. Total factory out puts will decline as the factory idle time increase while waiting on parts. [*] This also results in decreased profit per unit sold
In an world with increased unpredictability the obvious answer is to secure supply lines, mostly through shortening and bringing them back in house where possible. This might have the side effect of localizing manufacturing. Much like what the Japanese have done with their Auto industry.
*Notes: Now this is an over simplified example, most/all manufacturers have secondary suppliers for most components that cause work stoppages on a line. But the secondary suppliers are themselves in most cases unable to produce those components as well. So the net effect is the same.
This article is all over the place, but it is interesting because it points out that their is a problem. You have this line. That contradicts this line. You also have the LG talking head...
This article is all over the place, but it is interesting because it points out that their is a problem.
You have this line.
...we’ve seen a record number not just for fridges but dishwashers, washing machines and dryers. If appliances are 15 to 20 years old, the more people they use them, the more likely they need to be replaced.”
That contradicts this line.
Glickman said that the reason there are no fridges to be had has less to do with demand and everything to do with the supply chain.
You also have the LG talking head acknowledging that their is a problem but at the same time saying 'not us tho, we are doing fine'
Taylor said there has been an industry-wide disruption in the supply chain, from factories to warehouses, though he noted that LG has mostly avoided major disruptions, but the specific model you want may not be available.
Which is just transparent doublespeak, for yes they are having the same problems as everyone else.
I had to look these up. Aside from unnecessary things like touch controls, screens, and logic boards that are known for going out and being next to impossible to replace the only feature I can find that seems to be of use at the $10k level are water heaters so it can also be your kettle. Of note that this feature is also available on refrigerators that are $7k less at the same size.
Or you could buy a $20 electric kettle and put it on your counter.
I'm skeptical that you would know anything about how to make a proper hot beverage.
There’s something to be said about the amount of devices I have scattered around my counters and cupboards. I’d pay to integrate more of them into other appliances. Not for $10k but...
For anyone else who's curious, at that end of the market you're likely to be looking at brands like Gaggenau or Sub Zero - the former being more "designer" (with a lot of the actual components being shared with Bosch: good quality, but available at 10% of the price), the latter targeting a similar market but selling as "the absolute best fridge you can get, no compromises, cost be damned". I don't think either represent anything resembling good value, but it's interesting to see the difference in selling points between them.
I think I'm going to stick to a dumb fridge for as long as possible. Less complexity hopefully means it's less likely to fail. If a washer/dryer or dishwasher dies, I can wait a few days or weeks while I get the money together to replace it. If a fridge dies, you've got hardly any time to get that thing replaced before the food inside goes to crap or you're stuck buying ice every day for a cooler.
Same. I have a dumb fridge I moved from my last house to this one and will likely come with me on the next move in 2-3 years. I "upgraded" it to the features that the new ones have by replacing the light bulb with an LED one when it died. It has an ice maker, an old-fashioned one where you have to open the freezer door and there's a bucket full of ice (I know! How do I live?!). It operates on a very simple set of switches and relays.
I've got the ice bucket feature too! Only downside to it is that if you don't push the bucket all the way back you'll end up with a freezer full of ice cubes because the automatic on/off is so simple it doesn't care if the bucket's where it should be or not.
Good. Encourage everyone to repair not replace.
Eh. I just moved, but my previous apartment came with a 20 year old fridge. I did the math, and before I decided to move I was seriously considering replacing the fridge even though I would certainly have left the replacement in the apartment when I moved. The new fridge would have paid for itself in electricity savings in 1-2 years.
When the energy savings is so great that it makes economic sense for me to basically buy my landlord a fridge, is "repair not replace" really the sane choice?
For the individual, in that example, clearly not. For the environment, it's a maybe. Pricing externalities is something that hasn't really been done well, or at all in many cases, so if your electricity is overpriced relative to its resource footprint and the fridge is underpriced by that same metric then there's a good chance that the financially sensible choice is at odds with the environmentally sensible one.
All that said, 20 years is a damn good lifetime for most consumer products, so you're quite possibly operating at the extreme where both incentives actually are aligned. The more common case of cheap, broken appliances being thrown out at the 5-8 year mark is a different matter.
I wonder if there's any actual data on that. 5-8 years certainly doesn't jive with my own experience.
I was interested as well, because those were absolutely numbers that I pulled out of the air. I found some data from Consumer Reports - most manufacturers seem to be suggesting an expected lifespan of about 10 years, with the data showing about a third of appliances across the board (40% of fridges specifically) developing a problem in the first five years.
It doesn't give figures on how much is repaired rather than thrown out, but I will say that I've seen a significant skew towards lower cost (i.e. sub-£200 fridges or cookers, sub-£300 washing machines), cheaply made, more "disposable" large appliances. They do say the average refrigerator repair comes in at $162, which is perilously close to the cost of a new low-end fridge.
It's the whole Sam Vimes "Boots" theory again. If you can afford to buy from Miele in the first place you'll probably spend less in the long run and you'll do better for the environment. If you have to get the cheapest possible option you'll likely find it harder and less economical to repair, go through three of them in 20 years, and spend more in total anyway.
From the article:
[...]
[...]
I will say I can kind of understand this. I moved in to my house in spring of 2019 and while I'm not sure it's got all the original appliances, they're definitely older. I talked last year about maybe replacing them in the next 5 years or so, but having spent so much time at home I've now been considering moving that timeline up.
This story only hints at a larger problem. Long Gangly Supply Lines. This will get worse as world wide Volatility increases.
In times of stability, supply chains maximize for the cheapest price on a component and source it from their. If it come Asia, South America, or Africa it doesn't matter as long as it is the cheapest (that fits in spec). In a world in chaos all those long gangly supply lines that used to maximize profit per unit sold become liabilities. Total factory out puts will decline as the factory idle time increase while waiting on parts. [*] This also results in decreased profit per unit sold
In an world with increased unpredictability the obvious answer is to secure supply lines, mostly through shortening and bringing them back in house where possible. This might have the side effect of localizing manufacturing. Much like what the Japanese have done with their Auto industry.
*Notes: Now this is an over simplified example, most/all manufacturers have secondary suppliers for most components that cause work stoppages on a line. But the secondary suppliers are themselves in most cases unable to produce those components as well. So the net effect is the same.
Unfortunately this article doesn't get to the bottom of why it's happening. The reporter interviewed some people and quoted their guesses.
This article is all over the place, but it is interesting because it points out that their is a problem.
You have this line.
That contradicts this line.
You also have the LG talking head acknowledging that their is a problem but at the same time saying 'not us tho, we are doing fine'
Which is just transparent doublespeak, for yes they are having the same problems as everyone else.