17 votes

US Soccer fails to deliver

Carli Lloyd & Alexi Lalas react
I've can't with the USMNT anymore. I have been so invested with the team over the years but US Soccer has one consistent failure after another. Yesterday after the failed Copa America campaign to tune back into what others are saying and once again I hear the same thing: US Soccer isn't going to change and stay the course! So there you have it everyone! Wondering what folks outside the USA think about our situation, what do you recommend or change if you could?

21 comments

  1. [3]
    DefinitelyNotAFae
    Link
    We have a men's team? Weird. /s I mostly have also given up on them. I'm a USWNT fan. I watch the men when they make the men's world cup but they leave me disappointed. (I also don't enjoy the...

    We have a men's team? Weird. /s

    I mostly have also given up on them. I'm a USWNT fan. I watch the men when they make the men's world cup but they leave me disappointed. (I also don't enjoy the men's game as much overall)

    7 votes
    1. [2]
      NonoAdomo
      Link Parent
      USMNT is just a perpetual disappointment machine. I expect nothing and still feel let down every time. People look at me funny when I say I prefer watching women's football, but between US and...

      USMNT is just a perpetual disappointment machine. I expect nothing and still feel let down every time. People look at me funny when I say I prefer watching women's football, but between US and Canada's women's teams, it's no surprise that I enjoy watching a more consistently good product.

      3 votes
      1. DefinitelyNotAFae
        Link Parent
        Agreed, I love the international women's game and how much more competitive it's become since my memory of watching the PK shootout (and sports bra reveal) on a small portable TV at a swim meet my...

        Agreed, I love the international women's game and how much more competitive it's become since my memory of watching the PK shootout (and sports bra reveal) on a small portable TV at a swim meet my siblings were competing in. I can always root for my team, but I can get into any of the national teams or follow the NWSL and just enjoy myself. The MMLS (if W has to be in all the women's sports I'm returning the favor ) just doesn't engage me either.

  2. [2]
    culturedleftfoot
    Link
    Long may it continue! Beyond my own taste for schadenfreude, I hope the US takes at least another generation before it becomes the powerhouse that its economy almost guarantees it will become....

    Wondering what folks outside the USA think about our situation

    Long may it continue!

    Beyond my own taste for schadenfreude, I hope the US takes at least another generation before it becomes the powerhouse that its economy almost guarantees it will become. Football is already going down a dark path with the financial stratification of European clubs; if there is any justice in the universe, the US will suffer continued disappointments until it reckons with the many changes needed within its infrastructure from the ground up, as @Power0utage alluded to, instead of it becoming a Major League big-bucks success story.

    It's also useful for the rest of the world to have something they can use to help Americans have some measure of humility. I have an American friend just shy of 50 years old that has become a big soccer fan within the past couple years, largely due to exposure through me. He's had to overcome decades of his own cultural bias against the sport, and yet we've had so many conversations after USA games where I had to explain both football's global history, as well as its historical context in the US, in an attempt to soothe his wounded ego. He's had real trouble overcoming that "USA #1!" entitlement, as if they have have some preordained right to just big-dick their way into supremacy now that he's paying attention.

    IMO a lot of his pain comes from watching/reading US soccer media, which has to compete for attention with the NBA, NFL, etc., and all the hyperbole ends up feeding unreasonable fan expectations. USMNT players simultaneously aren't really as bad or as good as they're made out to be. Performances are about where they should be. They've maybe even overperformed in the past 20 years.

    4 votes
    1. jredd23
      Link Parent
      Can't speak on your friend's experience but since I am an immigrant my experience is different even though I am in the same age group as your friend. Back in the late 70s and early 80s, football...

      Can't speak on your friend's experience but since I am an immigrant my experience is different even though I am in the same age group as your friend. Back in the late 70s and early 80s, football had I would say about as many fans as American football here in the NY metro area. Look up the NY Cosmos, their home games where in the old Giants stadium and they filled it. Local leagues were full of European immigrants along with Americans. It’s the place where I learned of English and German professional leagues, it's too bad that the German league isn't televised around here anymore. All that to say that IMO why at least here in the metro area football at Pro level by a lot of people have a high expectation and at least for me I had high expectations for MLS but no more. Sadly our players that are good or have potential NEED to get out the USA. Our problem isn't Economics as you have stated, it's player development and Front office maturity in the game.

      2 votes
  3. [7]
    fefellama
    Link
    Do you have any ideas on what needs to change? I don't follow the US much, but they could have definitely done better in that group. On paper they seem to be progressing (i.e. more of their...

    what do you recommend or change if you could?

    Do you have any ideas on what needs to change? I don't follow the US much, but they could have definitely done better in that group. On paper they seem to be progressing (i.e. more of their players are playing in Europe now than ever before), but then they miss out on the World Cup or crash out of this Copa America. Is it the management?

    Though side note: that Uruguay goal was ridiculous and should not have been given, even if it ultimately wouldn't have made much of a difference.

    2 votes
    1. TheFireTheft
      Link Parent
      To me the most obvious thing that needs to be fixed is the intensity level on the pitch, which I would guess is mostly a coaching thing. The intensity was there against Uruguay but we didn't play...

      To me the most obvious thing that needs to be fixed is the intensity level on the pitch, which I would guess is mostly a coaching thing. The intensity was there against Uruguay but we didn't play our two other opponents with anywhere near the same level of give-a-F... even after an early panic red card in the Panama game. It's as if we just assumed we were still going to win all along, and when that reality disappeared, we were okay with a draw... until that reality disappeared.

      I would argue that USMNT used to overperform because they were always scrappy, tough, hungry underdogs. Now they are underperforming (at least from a US fan's perspective -- maybe they're about par from the rest of the world's view) because they've been touted as the golden generation and we have players that can do some very fancy things with a soccer ball in countries far, far away.

      Tactically, we weren't set up to score any goals on Uruguay, so it shouldn't come as much of a surprise that we didn't. Granted, Haji Wright was a touch-pass away from giving Pepi an easy tap in. Also granted, Balogun went off with an injury. But most of the time it's just crosses, crosses, crosses, pray.

      I think our coach has made questionable subs that hurt us as well.

      And finally, it goes without saying that there are some massive fixes to the US soccer infrastructure that need to be addressed (but won't by 2026). The original hope was that we would confidently go into the World Cup, put forth a strong showing (quarter-finals or bust) and usher in a new era of soccer fandom and excitement in the USA. But now, we'll be going into the WC timidly because we don't (and won't) have any signature wins.

      I will say at this point, the one thing that could bring back confidence would be for the federation to take a massive risk and bring in a known, successful manager. But that won't happen, will it?

      It's all a crapshoot.

      3 votes
    2. Vito
      Link Parent
      The Uruguayan casters themselves were surprised it was given. I still think Uruguay played better.

      The Uruguayan casters themselves were surprised it was given. I still think Uruguay played better.

      2 votes
    3. [3]
      jredd23
      Link Parent
      I wish I did, that's why am asking for outsiders to provide insight.

      I wish I did, that's why am asking for outsiders to provide insight.

      2 votes
      1. [2]
        imperator
        Link Parent
        It's been awhile since I've watched USMNT. Growing up I played against Michael Bradley quite a bit when he lived in the Chicago area. The issue has been no super star. No one that helps drive team...

        It's been awhile since I've watched USMNT. Growing up I played against Michael Bradley quite a bit when he lived in the Chicago area.

        The issue has been no super star. No one that helps drive team cohesion. We still only produce mediocre players even those that are playing in Europe.

        1 vote
        1. Parliament
          Link Parent
          Christian Pulisic is a super star by American standards (6th on the all time goalscorer list at age 25), and he’s been great for team cohesion in the captain role. Team cohesion isn’t the problem...

          Christian Pulisic is a super star by American standards (6th on the all time goalscorer list at age 25), and he’s been great for team cohesion in the captain role. Team cohesion isn’t the problem with the current squad unless we’re talking about a cohesive tactical plan for each game rather than the relationships/chemistry between players.

          A better manager could get more out of this squad. The talent isn’t world class or necessarily some “golden generation”, but they’re absolutely underperforming. I watch these players do great things week in and week out for their clubs then fail miserably under a mediocre national team manager.

          1 vote
    4. DeepThought
      Link Parent
      So much young talent is wasted. Playing youth soccer at a high level is prohibitively expensive for huge segments of the population, many of whom are children of Latin American and African...

      So much young talent is wasted. Playing youth soccer at a high level is prohibitively expensive for huge segments of the population, many of whom are children of Latin American and African migrants who absolutely love the sport.

      Having said that, the criticism does feel a bit reactionary. At the WC the US played at the expected level given the quality of players at their disposal. And while the Copa was certainly disappointing, it really all came down to Weah's idiotic red card. There was nothing the manager could have done to prevent that.

      1 vote
  4. [7]
    TheFireTheft
    Link
    That's what the coaches, federation, and players (for the sake of covering their asses) are saying. The media has now turned fully against Gregg Berhalter. The vast majority of fans who were...

    US Soccer isn't going to change and stay the course!

    That's what the coaches, federation, and players (for the sake of covering their asses) are saying.

    The media has now turned fully against Gregg Berhalter. The vast majority of fans who were defenders have turned on him or have gone into hiding.

    The extreme pessimist in me says that the federation isn't going to make any significant coaching changes, but the dire situation we're in right now makes me slightly hopeful that folks are scrambling to make changes ahead of the World Cup.

    1 vote
    1. [6]
      jredd23
      Link Parent
      Let's hope, honestly I am gutted. After so much hype by the players, the federation to then see what we saw on the field is demoralizing. If I had a better idea of how to fix things I would have...

      Let's hope, honestly I am gutted. After so much hype by the players, the federation to then see what we saw on the field is demoralizing. If I had a better idea of how to fix things I would have stated them on this post, but I don't. I've gotten into heated conversations on big soccer forum but even that I can't do and haven't in long while. My hope with this post is that maybe with perspective outside the USA I can learn something new.

      1 vote
      1. [5]
        TheFireTheft
        Link Parent
        Unfortunately I can't help you with the outside perspective. I'm squarely an insider. But maybe it wouldn't for us (collectively, I'm gutted too) to reach through the gloom and pull out some...

        Unfortunately I can't help you with the outside perspective. I'm squarely an insider.

        But maybe it wouldn't for us (collectively, I'm gutted too) to reach through the gloom and pull out some positives. Off the top of my head:

        • MLS continues to improve in quality, year in, year out. So too does the academy system. It may be too little too late for 2026, but we're building out a USMNT farm system for the future.
        • Calan Sullivan
        • It appears that Balogun has finally started to find his stride with the team. It's possible that he has a ton more potential to unlock if we can find a more direct attacking style.
        • Speaking of, remember how desperate our striker situation was in the 22 WC? Seemingly overnight, that's one of our deepest spots (read: most competitive, which is what the players need)
        • Scally has proven himself as a capable defender (against some of the best players in the world even!) in this tournament/friendlies
        • Pulisic continues to be Pulisic.
        • Remember the MMA midfield that we all loved a few years ago? Well, Tyler Adams is still not 100%. I really think him not being able to give his all was affecting the other midfielders (or, McKennie's just getting lazy). Tyler will be back and he will have a positive impact on the game.
        • Antonee Robinson
        • We have the Olympics to look forward to!
        1 vote
        1. [4]
          jredd23
          Link Parent
          I've been hearing this for years now. Myself I gave up on MLS long before the USMNT. Compare J league to MLS, and well I think the MLS has miles to go before it actually shows quality like that of...

          MLS continues to improve in quality,

          I've been hearing this for years now. Myself I gave up on MLS long before the USMNT. Compare J league to MLS, and well I think the MLS has miles to go before it actually shows quality like that of J League, again IMO. Fundamental structure of US Soccer for player development is broken and I separate that from MLS. I don't recall who on the professional ranks that came from Europe stated that he was returning with his family because football development in the USA was too expensive. To expand our pool of players that needs to change and at least since I've been advocating and doing my own piece to help, it needs more. The argument of promotion/relegation of the MLS clouds that fact because everyone take to their own corner but I don't think that's the problem for us here in the states, it's player development. Once you have the talent, getting the coaching is easier. Who in their right mind as a TD replacement would come here with the players we currently have and system we have can think they have a chance to be successful? All the other things considered, yea they are positives.

          1. [3]
            TheFireTheft
            Link Parent
            Of course we have massive foundational problems with soccer, beginning with the pay-to-play aspect at a young age. In another comment, I mentioned that all of this needs fixing. I largely agree...

            Of course we have massive foundational problems with soccer, beginning with the pay-to-play aspect at a young age. In another comment, I mentioned that all of this needs fixing. I largely agree with your points.

            Regardless, my point was simply that the MLS has improved in quality, which it objectively* has over the past few decades.

            • See historical Opta power rankings or 538 rankings prior to 2023 when they stopped updating them

            Who in their right mind as a TD replacement would come here with the players we currently have and system we have can think they have a chance to be successful?

            (Not sure what TD stands for so I'll write around it)

            • Emil Forsberg
            • Petr Musa
            • Olivier Giroud
            • Lionel Messi
            • Chucky Lozano
            • Hector Herrerra
            • etc.

            Even with our flawed system, we are still able to pull in big names. Hopefully, more and more as the league grows in stature.

            MLS is carving out a niche with international players right now by (1) bringing in the old, retired, famous crew (Messi, Beckham, etc.) and (2) bringing in international talent that isn't quite Top Flight level but good enough to get out of their country and play competitive football for a decent to great amount of money.

            1. [2]
              jredd23
              Link Parent
              TD = Technical Director

              TD = Technical Director

              1. TheFireTheft
                Link Parent
                Ah lol. That changes my response entirely :)

                Ah lol. That changes my response entirely :)

  5. [2]
    thecardguy
    Link
    Soccer was neither invented by Americans nor are they able to dominate in it, so they really don't care about it. Okay, I'm only half-joking with this. Sometimes I wonder why America has never...

    Soccer was neither invented by Americans nor are they able to dominate in it, so they really don't care about it.

    Okay, I'm only half-joking with this.

    Sometimes I wonder why America has never really put as much effort into producing a strong soccer team as compared to other nations. While I myself am American, I wouldn't call myself the average American, entirely... at least partially because I decided to leave the country. But I feel like soccer has a lot of elements that, to put it simply... bore the average American. It rarely ever has flashy plays, for one thing- Gridiron football has your long throws into scoring, baseball has home runs, and basketball does three-pointers or free-throws. The closest thing soccer has is arguably bicycle kicks, and not only are those EXTREMELY rare, but they're also dangerous, to my understanding.

    ... of course, I feel the real reason is that it's because the US isn't able to compete on an international stage and be the best- other countries have been doing it longer and are much better- that it just does "not even gonna bother- instead, let's pour money and talent into things we ARE good at!"... which isn't entirely wrong. The whole idea of maximize your strengths and minimize weaknesses... a VERY prevalent attitude in America.

    1. culturedleftfoot
      Link Parent
      The stereotypical American cultural bias against soccer is essentially a remnant of anti-immigrant sentiment, as well as a form of social pressure to assimilate. However, like any kind of...

      The stereotypical American cultural bias against soccer is essentially a remnant of anti-immigrant sentiment, as well as a form of social pressure to assimilate. However, like any kind of xenophobic rhetoric, it doesn't make much sense - tons of Americans like hockey, and hockey is basically soccer on ice, with sticks. If you can follow one, you can follow the other.

      As far as boredom - there's a language barrier, so to speak, with getting into any sport, because as an outsider you don't understand any of the context. When people have an interpreter who is able to explain what's going on to them, they get into it. I saw the most unlikely group of middle- to-senior-age guys get into the Women's 2022 Euros, because there were enough other people following it when it was on that they could ask the occasional question and follow what exactly was happening. They ended up looking forward to the games, and the USA wasn't even in the tournament.

      The generations that have grown up with internet access and have exposure to people and cultures beyond their borders do not view soccer with any of the same hostility that previous generations did, even if they aren't all dreaming of being the next Ronaldo or Messi... yet. Franklin Foer's How Soccer Explains The World is a worthwhile read on the topic.

      1 vote