I definitely applaud alignment on basic vehicle interfaces like charging ports. It's a necessary move. But I'll admit the fanboy in me is annoyed that the Tesla standard is the one to use. Clearly...
I definitely applaud alignment on basic vehicle interfaces like charging ports. It's a necessary move.
But I'll admit the fanboy in me is annoyed that the Tesla standard is the one to use. Clearly they beat everyone to market and have the best infrastructure in the US. But I feel like given the opportunity I'd bet Porsche could develop a better technology.
It is a little annoying that people give them credit for "standardizing connectors" when CCS already was standard on every EV except Teslas (and older Nissans I guess, but they at least moved...
It is a little annoying that people give them credit for "standardizing connectors" when CCS already was standard on every EV except Teslas (and older Nissans I guess, but they at least moved over)
Kinda does seem like a nicer connector though, so it's not like I'm upset about it or anything.
From what I understand NACS still uses the communication standard CCS does, which is why it's backwards-compatible with CCS cars via an adapter. The industry is standardizing on NACS because Tesla...
From what I understand NACS still uses the communication standard CCS does, which is why it's backwards-compatible with CCS cars via an adapter. The industry is standardizing on NACS because Tesla budged a bit to allow everyone to meet fairly in the middle; they released design information on how their connector works and they are updating their (newer) superchargers to speak with CCS and work with other manufacturers.
I'm a little annoyed too - the hydraulic cooled cables is in theory a better solution than Tesla's sensored cable, because CCS's hydraulic cables will cool the cable rather than downrate the power being delivered. But in practice the sensored cable is much easier to use because it's much lighter, and only a portion of the charging time will actually need the full rating in any case, where it will already be cool from disuse. The simplicity also makes it more reliable overall and less likely to break down.
Nothing to say they still can't develop a better plug and offer it. Perhaps make it work in the same footprint so the port can accept NACS and whatever new plug they make. Then Porsche can partner...
Nothing to say they still can't develop a better plug and offer it. Perhaps make it work in the same footprint so the port can accept NACS and whatever new plug they make.
Then Porsche can partner with tracks to offer their special chargers so that owners can use them on track days or something.
I hope the same thing, and I don't know what VW/Porsche are working on with respect to future charging stalls, but that might be a ways off. The last one I read about Porsche building was 320kW,...
Nothing to say [Porsche] still can't develop a better plug and offer it. Perhaps make it work in the same footprint so the port can accept NACS and whatever new plug they make.
I hope the same thing, and I don't know what VW/Porsche are working on with respect to future charging stalls, but that might be a ways off. The last one I read about Porsche building was 320kW, though they're obviously capable of throwing any amount of money at the problem that they want.
Tesla has already begun installing its Supercharger v4 stalls in some locations and while the software limits it to the same 250kW charging as the v3, it's designed to go to 615kW and allegedly can scale to 1,000kW (1MW) on the same cable. You can see a comparison image of the cable designs here.
In November 2023, Lotus (now owned by China's Geely, who also owns Volvo) released their Lotus Flash Charger with charging up to 480kW. So those will be at tracks, dealerships, and some specialty locations I would imagine, but Tesla really has the advantage here and will be able to get their Supercharger v4 stalls rolled out faster than their competitors. They also have the most stalls/connectors (50,000+) at a large number of stations (1,900+) in the US and makes up the majority of all charging locales. Tesla's deployment of charging stations is further behind in China and Europe, but I think their number and brand recognition is only going to accelerate as competition ramps up.
Tesla's smartest EV move so far is not their cars. It's the foundational work they did to install the Supercharger network and thus, set the standard for charging. I have several friends in our EV...
Tesla's smartest EV move so far is not their cars. It's the foundational work they did to install the Supercharger network and thus, set the standard for charging.
I have several friends in our EV owners group with all makes and models of EVs and universally the number one complaint from non-Tesla owners is that often the charging stations they use are not functioning properly. Either the apps are flaky, the charger won't initiate charging, the charging is brutally slow, or they are simply out of order and aren't fixed in a timely manner. I never hear that from Tesla owners.
Im not a Tesla fanboy and I dont think they even make the best EVs but they definitely got the charging infrastructure correct. Smart move.
There is still a difference between NACS Tesla and NACS Standard. The physical design is the same, but the protocol is different and NACS (Standard) still uses the CCS protocol, so conversion is...
There is still a difference between NACS Tesla and NACS Standard. The physical design is the same, but the protocol is different and NACS (Standard) still uses the CCS protocol, so conversion is easy if they decide to rollback or change to something else like CCS2 (that EU uses) as they get non-tesla related power infrastructure in place.
VW is one of the last major automakers to bend the knee to Tesla’s superior charging network. Now, only Stellantis remains uncommitted.
Volkswagen Group, which also owns Audi, Porsche, and Scout Motors, is finally doing what nearly every other automaker has already done: announce its intention to adopt Tesla’s electric vehicle charging standard.
VW said it is “exploring adapter solutions” so that its current EV owners can access Tesla’s Supercharger network and expects to have something to roll out by 2025. That same year, you’ll start to see new VW electric vehicles rolling off the assembly line with Tesla’s charging port natively installed. All told, VW says the deal will give its customers access to 15,000 Supercharger locations in North America.
I definitely applaud alignment on basic vehicle interfaces like charging ports. It's a necessary move.
But I'll admit the fanboy in me is annoyed that the Tesla standard is the one to use. Clearly they beat everyone to market and have the best infrastructure in the US. But I feel like given the opportunity I'd bet Porsche could develop a better technology.
It is a little annoying that people give them credit for "standardizing connectors" when CCS already was standard on every EV except Teslas (and older Nissans I guess, but they at least moved over)
Kinda does seem like a nicer connector though, so it's not like I'm upset about it or anything.
From what I understand NACS still uses the communication standard CCS does, which is why it's backwards-compatible with CCS cars via an adapter. The industry is standardizing on NACS because Tesla budged a bit to allow everyone to meet fairly in the middle; they released design information on how their connector works and they are updating their (newer) superchargers to speak with CCS and work with other manufacturers.
I'm a little annoyed too - the hydraulic cooled cables is in theory a better solution than Tesla's sensored cable, because CCS's hydraulic cables will cool the cable rather than downrate the power being delivered. But in practice the sensored cable is much easier to use because it's much lighter, and only a portion of the charging time will actually need the full rating in any case, where it will already be cool from disuse. The simplicity also makes it more reliable overall and less likely to break down.
Nothing to say they still can't develop a better plug and offer it. Perhaps make it work in the same footprint so the port can accept NACS and whatever new plug they make.
Then Porsche can partner with tracks to offer their special chargers so that owners can use them on track days or something.
I hope the same thing, and I don't know what VW/Porsche are working on with respect to future charging stalls, but that might be a ways off. The last one I read about Porsche building was 320kW, though they're obviously capable of throwing any amount of money at the problem that they want.
Tesla has already begun installing its Supercharger v4 stalls in some locations and while the software limits it to the same 250kW charging as the v3, it's designed to go to 615kW and allegedly can scale to 1,000kW (1MW) on the same cable. You can see a comparison image of the cable designs here.
In November 2023, Lotus (now owned by China's Geely, who also owns Volvo) released their Lotus Flash Charger with charging up to 480kW. So those will be at tracks, dealerships, and some specialty locations I would imagine, but Tesla really has the advantage here and will be able to get their Supercharger v4 stalls rolled out faster than their competitors. They also have the most stalls/connectors (50,000+) at a large number of stations (1,900+) in the US and makes up the majority of all charging locales. Tesla's deployment of charging stations is further behind in China and Europe, but I think their number and brand recognition is only going to accelerate as competition ramps up.
Tesla's smartest EV move so far is not their cars. It's the foundational work they did to install the Supercharger network and thus, set the standard for charging.
I have several friends in our EV owners group with all makes and models of EVs and universally the number one complaint from non-Tesla owners is that often the charging stations they use are not functioning properly. Either the apps are flaky, the charger won't initiate charging, the charging is brutally slow, or they are simply out of order and aren't fixed in a timely manner. I never hear that from Tesla owners.
Im not a Tesla fanboy and I dont think they even make the best EVs but they definitely got the charging infrastructure correct. Smart move.
There is still a difference between NACS Tesla and NACS Standard. The physical design is the same, but the protocol is different and NACS (Standard) still uses the CCS protocol, so conversion is easy if they decide to rollback or change to something else like CCS2 (that EU uses) as they get non-tesla related power infrastructure in place.