17 votes

The Falcon and The Winter Soldier | Episode 1 Discussion Thread

14 comments

  1. [4]
    Grzmot
    Link
    The action intro sequence was kinda good but also kinda bad. The moment those doors got opened everyone should've been sucked out, instead Falcon just pushed in and we got a fairly decent fist...

    The action intro sequence was kinda good but also kinda bad. The moment those doors got opened everyone should've been sucked out, instead Falcon just pushed in and we got a fairly decent fist fight. Also those dudes very quickly changed during a fight scene. Also the convoy of that soldier completely disappeared and he was suddenly just alone, I'm fairly certain he wasn't even in the driver's seat at the start.. Also for terrorists they really had just a shitton of helicopters, those things just kept popping up.

    So the intro was kind of meh, but from that point on I think it got better.

    The fact that the heroes don't have some fund set up by Stark is just really mind-boggling though. Are you telling me that Tony Stark, who previously footed the bill for everything including desaster relief services seen in Age of Ultron didn't have some sort of contigency plans set up so the people on the right side could keep fighting without worrying about shit like paying off loans and trying to scrape by? Don't you think it would be more effective that way?

    That being said, I do like the central set up of the two characters trying to find their place in a new world. All the character building was cool.

    9 votes
    1. [3]
      Greg
      Link Parent
      Yeah, I was expecting the situation with the boat to pan out as the proud and stubborn sister refusing to take what she sees as a handout from Sam, who (in my mind) could have easily paid away all...

      Yeah, I was expecting the situation with the boat to pan out as the proud and stubborn sister refusing to take what she sees as a handout from Sam, who (in my mind) could have easily paid away all the comparatively small financial problems. The idea that he's actually, genuinely strapped for cash seems kind of weird to me.

      Not the biggest suspension of disbelief in the MCU by a long shot, but still a bit of an odd one!

      2 votes
      1. [2]
        mrbig
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        They clearly went that way because a broke hero: adds a convenient source of conflict makes it easier to address matters of race Those are great goals. But a little more effort into respecting the...

        The idea that he's actually, genuinely strapped for cash seems kind of weird to

        They clearly went that way because a broke hero:

        • adds a convenient source of conflict
        • makes it easier to address matters of race

        Those are great goals. But a little more effort into respecting the logic of the fictional universe would make the show more enjoyable for a lot of people.

        I can't think of any major issue besides that.

        2 votes
        1. SunSpotter
          Link Parent
          None of the new Disney shows have been perfect in that respect. Tbh The Mandalorian was fairly enjoyable overall but still stumbled a lot with logical and internal consistency. WandaVision maybe...

          But a little more effort into respecting the logic of the fictional universe would make the show more enjoyable for a lot of people.

          None of the new Disney shows have been perfect in that respect. Tbh The Mandalorian was fairly enjoyable overall but still stumbled a lot with logical and internal consistency. WandaVision maybe not as much, but it was also much more self-contained.

          I'm fine with overlooking nitpicky background level issues as long as the show makes sense and is enjoyable overall, but this first episode gives me mixed feelings. The intro felt like it was trying to be a proper Avengers movie too much, just over the top action and an unbelievable amount of resources being thrown around all at once even though the premise seemed like a simple terrorist kidnapping. I'm hoping that they'll continue to learn and adapt in future episodes/series rather than embrace the cheese as part of the style though.

          2 votes
  2. [4]
    smithsonian
    Link
    So, something I didn't really consider before this episode was how much of an impact that the un-Snap—when all of the people lost in The Snap suddenly returned—would have had on the world (and...

    So, something I didn't really consider before this episode was how much of an impact that the un-Snap—when all of the people lost in The Snap suddenly returned—would have had on the world (and every world, really).

    Half of the population suddenly disappearing would have certainly been chaos, but as far as society goes (e.g., food production, essential services, utilities, etc.), I think they would have been able to keep everything going without too much issue. Half as many people, half as much demand/need, and half as many workers to produce. Certainly some immediate chaos and issues, but existing stockpiles would now last twice as long, so the kinks could be worked out and production resumed before too much really runs out.

    But, the other half of the Blip wouldn't be as easy. The world population basically doubled in an instant. After five years, production and pipelines would have adapted to the much lower demand and wouldn't be able to spin back up to previous levels—even though there are twice as many workers—as quickly. Crops take time to prepare fields, sow, grow, harvest, process. Even if consumer goods production equipment had just ran at half capacity for the past five years, the logistics of getting the needed raw materials in to ramp that production back up to new levels would take months, of not longer.

    It just seems like the world should be in far more chaos in the wake of the Blip just due to the sudden scarcity and demand for pretty much everything.

    While the Snap would have been far more emotionally traumatic for the world, the sudden reappearance of billions of people would be far more problematic for society, despite the relief of so many loved ones being returned.

    9 votes
    1. [3]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. [2]
        Good_Apollo
        Link Parent
        My question is like what happened to people mid surgery? In airplanes? What about all the people crossing the street or driving cars? The blip didn’t technically kill anyone but bringing them back...

        My question is like what happened to people mid surgery? In airplanes? What about all the people crossing the street or driving cars? The blip didn’t technically kill anyone but bringing them back certainly killed a lot of people.

        3 votes
        1. moocow1452
          Link Parent
          According to Feige, Hulk made sure everyone came back safe. So presumably if they blipped while they were in a vehicle, they were brought back in a place where they're not in immediate harm. Mid...

          According to Feige, Hulk made sure everyone came back safe. So presumably if they blipped while they were in a vehicle, they were brought back in a place where they're not in immediate harm. Mid surgery, he might have patched them back up since he had the all powerful magic rocks, but given what we saw in the hospital environment in WandaVision, "out of immediate danger" probably has its limits.

          4 votes
    2. Greg
      Link Parent
      The emotional impact on both ends seems like it would be crushing. People aren't prepared to suddenly be reunited with loved ones they had grieved for, accepted as lost, and eventually moved on...

      The emotional impact on both ends seems like it would be crushing.

      People aren't prepared to suddenly be reunited with loved ones they had grieved for, accepted as lost, and eventually moved on from. That's an incredibly complex trauma to deal with once the initial elation wears off; doubly so for spouses who've remarried, orphans who have grown up in new families, teenagers who have had to become independent adults before their time.

      The opposite way around, too: those who were snapped returning to find that their family members didn't make it through the five years, that the people they 'left behind' died deaths of despair, or perhaps somehow worse: that their loved ones did move on happily without them.

      Between the huge logistical issues @Loire mentioned, the enormous emotional scarring left by the snap, and then the incredible trauma of the return it really does look like more than society could handle.

  3. [2]
    Good_Apollo
    Link
    So what did everyone think? I thought it was incredible, might as well have been a mainline MCU film honestly with the quality. After WandaVision leaving not the best taste in my mouth in the...

    So what did everyone think?

    I thought it was incredible, might as well have been a mainline MCU film honestly with the quality. After WandaVision leaving not the best taste in my mouth in the ending I didn’t know what to expect here but I was pleased with a banger of a first episode.

    I like how these shows are giving us better characterization for some heroes that never got a main focus in the movies.

    These two characters are really feeling the loss of Cap and seem unsure of their place in the world now, very veteran troubles. Sam is trying to pick up pieces with his family and Bucky is just stuck in his own head and in the wrong time.

    6 votes
    1. treed
      Link Parent
      One thing I appreciate about the timing of these new MCU shows is that it gives us not just the minor characters but also the space to have them react to the high profile deaths but also to Earth...

      One thing I appreciate about the timing of these new MCU shows is that it gives us not just the minor characters but also the space to have them react to the high profile deaths but also to Earth after the blip. Having this happen in the long-form media really gives that trauma room to breath.

      8 votes
  4. mrbig
    (edited )
    Link
    Loved the episode. It iwas both thrilling and emotional, with a great cliffhanger. Like @Grzmot pointed out, it really is odd for the Falcon to be broke, though. Even without the support of Tony...

    Loved the episode. It iwas both thrilling and emotional, with a great cliffhanger.

    Like @Grzmot pointed out, it really is odd for the Falcon to be broke, though. Even without the support of Tony Stark, he's a valuable asset and has a great working relationship with the military. He should be getting a lot of money from that alone.

    He is also a celebrity, and with that comes several sources of income that are unavailable to regular people. Not to mention many friends in high places.

    5 votes
  5. [2]
    Muffin
    Link
    I'm gonna keep watching for now. The first 10 minutes or so of action felt like it dragged on forever. I had to convince my fiancee to keep watching by saying "It can't be a whole episode of...

    I'm gonna keep watching for now. The first 10 minutes or so of action felt like it dragged on forever. I had to convince my fiancee to keep watching by saying "It can't be a whole episode of this".

    The reveal at the end was very well executed, and that gives me hope for the show as a whole.

    4 votes
    1. mrbig
      Link Parent
      Oh but it was some quality action! That said, my girlfriend would probably find the action boring too. She slept through John Wick.

      Oh but it was some quality action!

      That said, my girlfriend would probably find the action boring too. She slept through John Wick.

      2 votes
  6. moocow1452
    Link
    I'm not expecting the MCU to really criticize the American Military after SHIELD (actually Hydra the whole time) nearly bombing New York, but that's going to be a tricky line to walk if they're...

    I'm not expecting the MCU to really criticize the American Military after SHIELD (actually Hydra the whole time) nearly bombing New York, but that's going to be a tricky line to walk if they're going to introduce USAgent and the Flagsmashers.

    Mechanically though, kinda odd to not have the Falcon and the Winter Solider team up by the end of episode one, where Bucky is dealing with the melancholy of killing his friend's son years ago as a sleeper agent, and hasn't really been jostled from status quo yet, where as Sam has been called to adventure already.

    3 votes