There's a lot I want to say, but it comes from a place of despair. As someone who long ago tried to do what Nex did, the last thing I want to do is open up that despair to others. I know how dark...
Exemplary
There's a lot I want to say, but it comes from a place of despair. As someone who long ago tried to do what Nex did, the last thing I want to do is open up that despair to others. I know how dark and deep it goes. I know how one's own despair looks around to validate itself in the despair of others. I'm almost certain there are people here who are struggling with that darkness right now, especially because of this news.
When I was in the depths, I was helped by sporadic, unexpected things that had a seemingly magical ability to pierce through the despair. These weren't usually big deals. They were often mere moments of beauty. Small kindnesses. Simple supports. Each one was a tiny breath of fresh air -- a spot of sunlight -- a glimmer of hope. These were fleeting, and at no point did they completely offset or reverse the despair, but they carried a significance and a meaning far greater than I could ever put into words. Despair was a pitch black night sky for me, but those moments acted as the faintest flickering of stars.
I want to share one of those moments here, in case it helps anyone.
After this news item broke today, I was walking around my classroom. I happened to see a tab open on one of my students' computers.
It had a simple search query: how to help trans kids
I had to fight back tears when I saw it. It was a moment of beauty -- simple, and small, but somehow worth the world.
If you are struggling with despair, please know that there is beauty out there. There is kindness and support and love. There are still stars shining in that dark black sky. I know -- believe me, I know -- how hard it can be to see them, but please try to remember that they're there, and that they never go away.
So Nex sprayed water on some bullies. The bullies then retaliated by hospitalizing them and driving them to suicide. Murder or not, I hope the bullies are still going to go away for a very long time..
So Nex sprayed water on some bullies. The bullies then retaliated by hospitalizing them and driving them to suicide. Murder or not, I hope the bullies are still going to go away for a very long time..
I don't actually hope they get imprisoned for a long time. I don't think that solves anything as I think they're a product of the culture of the district, city, state, etc. But every admin that...
I don't actually hope they get imprisoned for a long time. I don't think that solves anything as I think they're a product of the culture of the district, city, state, etc.
But every admin that didn't follow Title IX procedure, didn't follow policy on bullying and fighting, etc... absolutely.
Product of their environment or not, they still bullied someone both physically and mentally to the point of suicide. Letting them off with a stern talking to won't do shit for them. Nex is dead...
Product of their environment or not, they still bullied someone both physically and mentally to the point of suicide. Letting them off with a stern talking to won't do shit for them. Nex is dead and they were culpable in that, and they should have to take time to think about what they did, whether that be in prison or some other form of rehabilitation.
I don't think they should be "let off with a stern talking to" either. But "going away for a long time" typically means incarceration. They absolutely have culpability, but that is reduced by...
I don't think they should be "let off with a stern talking to" either. But "going away for a long time" typically means incarceration. They absolutely have culpability, but that is reduced by their age, and I am pretty opposed to our current criminal justice system being used on minors (and in general).
Do not confuse my opposition to long-term incarceration for minors with a lack of anger and grief over Nex's death, nor with a lack of desire for people to be held accountable.
Ideally no kids in school would have to go to prison. Prison should be for rehabilitation, but kids in school haven't even been habilitated yet. Even if a kid does something horrible, their...
Ideally no kids in school would have to go to prison. Prison should be for rehabilitation, but kids in school haven't even been habilitated yet. Even if a kid does something horrible, their upbringing and schools should be evaluated to see if there is a way to correct their behavior before graduation.
I would agree and it's absolutely awful how often it is. Black and brown children who are filtered straight into the criminal justice system from schools unwilling to or admittedly unable to deal...
I would agree and it's absolutely awful how often it is. Black and brown children who are filtered straight into the criminal justice system from schools unwilling to or admittedly unable to deal with some of their behavior. But the solution should not be prison in my opinion.
I'm not quite a prison abolitionist but I am increasingly convinced that abolition would probably lead to statistically less harm overall, even though there absolutely need to be other systems in place in reality and it probably will always need to be some way to separate certain individuals from society.
I think I agree with you in principle. And maybe I would be all the way with you if we were talking about light theft or something. However Nex was 16 and I think it's fair to assume their bullies...
I think I agree with you in principle. And maybe I would be all the way with you if we were talking about light theft or something.
However Nex was 16 and I think it's fair to assume their bullies are the same-ish age. These are not innocent children with no idea of wrong or right. Maybe they are a product of their environment. And yes, teenagers are highly impressionable. This superintendent and whomever else in their lives enabled this behavior should absolutely also be punished somehow, because I'm sure it incites or at least influences behavior like this to some degree.
But none of that takes away from the fact that they hospitalized their schoolmate. They did that out of their own volition and technically being minors does not excuse that. Again, assuming they are Nex's age.. they are just as capable of making their own decisions at 16 as they are at 18. Especially when it's a crime as gruesome as this.
I'm personally tired of dropping my principle because I find a case personally heinous. The justice system should not work on my whims. I never claimed they were innocent or incompetent to stand...
I think I agree with you in principle. And maybe I would be all the way with you if we were talking about light theft or something.
I'm personally tired of dropping my principle because I find a case personally heinous. The justice system should not work on my whims.
However Nex was 16 and I think it's fair to assume their bullies are the same-ish age. These are not innocent children with no idea of wrong or right. Maybe they are a product of their environment. And yes, teenagers are highly impressionable. This superintendent and whomever else in their lives enabled this behavior should absolutely also be punished somehow, because I'm sure it incites or at least influences behavior like this to some degree.
I never claimed they were innocent or incompetent to stand trial. I said I don't want them imprisoned for a long period of time. And I'd rather not have any child imprisoned at all. The adults should have consequences for failing to do their jobs and protect the children in their care. Nex was (likely by the news) frustrated by the bullying and harassment and made an impulsive choice to splash the other students with water. This was not a great choice. It was technically assault and/or battery depending on state law. It was also understandable and even predictable given their experiences and their age. We know nothing about these other teens so we're free to paint them as monsters rather than complex individuals. And I'd just rather not do that. Even when they've done something horrible.
But none of that takes away from the fact that they hospitalized their schoolmate. They did that out of their own volition and technically being minors does not excuse that. Again, assuming they are Nex's age.. they are just as capable of making their own decisions at 16 as they are at 18. Especially when it's a crime as gruesome as this.
We know that they're not as capable of making decisions at 16 as they are at 18 or 25 when they're brains hit the average age of full development. 18 may be arbitrary, but the idea that it's fine to keep pushing legal responsibility back younger while not allowing legal rights is less about actual culpability and more about making us feel good for being tough on crime.
And if you go based on what the criminal justice system would say, you can already hear the narrative. Nex "started" the fight, the girls may have been "carried away" but what did the politician say... They don't want "that filth" in Oklahoma, referring to trans teens? Legally, I'm not sure they'll determine there was a crime. Even if you and I both know that they should.
I am well aware there is no appropriate consequence in our current system for these girls. But prison demonstrably doesn't change them for the better. They will not be less queerphobic after time in prison. They will not be less violent. They will not be more fit for human society. All it'll do is make us feel better that Nex's death was avenged. Nex will still be dead. And nothing will have made the next trans teen in Owasso, OK safer.
I don't believe we know that these girls are white. But even if we did, absolutely not. And we do not fix systemic oppression and bias by expanding the harm we do. I'm tired of being like "I...
I don't believe we know that these girls are white. But even if we did, absolutely not.
And we do not fix systemic oppression and bias by expanding the harm we do. I'm tired of being like "I oppose long sentences and most of our criminal justice system .. except in this case where I think it's appropriate to get revenge via the justice system."
It's not good for black youth, it's not ok that schools throw Black and Brown youth, especially boys, into the pipeline to prison. It's not ok that Black youth in particular are aged up and perceived as either violent threats or sexual seducers, when they are children.
Or how about don't do that for the black boys... Just cause one group is wronged doesn't mean we should do the same to the other group. It means we should stop doing it to that group. It's stupid...
Or how about don't do that for the black boys... Just cause one group is wronged doesn't mean we should do the same to the other group. It means we should stop doing it to that group. It's stupid to just increase the harm done to make things equal. Decrease the harm done to make things equal.
Part of the issue is the superintendent who is vocally anti-trans and pro-bathroom restrictions. School is supposed to be a place where kids learn social norms and how to contribute to society....
Part of the issue is the superintendent who is vocally anti-trans and pro-bathroom restrictions. School is supposed to be a place where kids learn social norms and how to contribute to society. It's hard to teach acceptance to kids when the one in charge of their education is actively saying the opposite.
Agreed, that's why I want those admins held to account, criminally if possible, civilly and within their employment otherwise. I'm pessimistic about that happening but they should be.
Agreed, that's why I want those admins held to account, criminally if possible, civilly and within their employment otherwise. I'm pessimistic about that happening but they should be.
It's Oklahoma law that students use restrooms and locker rooms that match the sex on their birth certificates. I haven't read anything about the superintendent here, but it seems like state law...
It's Oklahoma law that students use restrooms and locker rooms that match the sex on their birth certificates. I haven't read anything about the superintendent here, but it seems like state law would supersede any school policy, so maybe lawmakers or voters are more to blame.
One can enforce a law you don't like (or work around it) without being vocally in support of it. (And being vocally anti-trans is just bonus bigotry on top of that. ) However to be clear it's the...
One can enforce a law you don't like (or work around it) without being vocally in support of it. (And being vocally anti-trans is just bonus bigotry on top of that. )
However to be clear it's the state superintendent Ryan Walters who is under fire here. I cannot speak to the district superintenden. Dr. Coates. One of Walters' major supporters is this guy:
According to emails from January 2022 obtained by Media Matters (and which Causby posted on his own Facebook page), Causby was rejected from both positions at Owasso Public Schools — the same school district Nex Benedict attended — because of violently anti-trans statements on social media and his podcast “Loud Mouths.” Causby specifically said on his podcast he had given his daughter permission to “kick the shit out of” any trans student they found using the school bathroom, and demanded trans kids “use the restroom legitimately” in a speech that same month to the Owasso school board."
And he put the Libs of TikTok lady on the state board to advise on school libraries. And a previous teacher that supported LGBTQ students was pushed out at Nex's school. And, and, and.
I believe that the police officer who discouraged Nex from pressing charges because *they could also be charged, as they technically appear to have started the fight, probably contributed to any...
I believe that the police officer who discouraged Nex from pressing charges because *they could also be charged, as they technically appear to have started the fight, probably contributed to any feelings of hopelessness.
I hate having to explain to students when there's not much police can do to help them, but our campus department is at least compassionate about those conversations and will help the students feel heard.
*My current understanding is that Nex used he/they pronouns depending on who he was around. I'm mostly defaulting to they because I'm not 100% sure if one is better than the other. And as someone who uses she/they it's not always consistent if there's a better one or not
Even if someone else instigates the fight, you're still not allowed to give them a concussion. Concussions can increase thoughts of suicidal ideation, but I don't know if you can pin that kind of...
Even if someone else instigates the fight, you're still not allowed to give them a concussion. Concussions can increase thoughts of suicidal ideation, but I don't know if you can pin that kind of result on the attackers. Maybe something like battery or aggravated battery (causing serious bodily injury) would be an appropriate charge for the attackers. Charged as minors since I don't believe in charging children as adults. People (like the cop who discouraged pressing charges) tend to minimize fights between young people, but clearly they can have serious consequences. I think people who take things too far should face consequences as well.
Whether the escalation is surprising or not doesn't matter that much to me. I think mob mentality for retaliation based on how emotional they get about the subject (like pranks) is disgusting....
Whether the escalation is surprising or not doesn't matter that much to me. I think mob mentality for retaliation based on how emotional they get about the subject (like pranks) is disgusting. There legal and moral limits to how much is a reasonable amount of escalation. You shouldn't get to knock someone out for throwing water at you without dealing with some consequences.
I think what I suggested is a bit of nuance. Some people are suggesting long prison sentences, which would mean murder and/or hate crime charges, which I think is too far. I suggested battery for causing injuries, which for adults is up to 90 days in jail, but they should be charged as minors, so probably something different and lesser than that.
There's a lot I want to say, but it comes from a place of despair. As someone who long ago tried to do what Nex did, the last thing I want to do is open up that despair to others. I know how dark and deep it goes. I know how one's own despair looks around to validate itself in the despair of others. I'm almost certain there are people here who are struggling with that darkness right now, especially because of this news.
When I was in the depths, I was helped by sporadic, unexpected things that had a seemingly magical ability to pierce through the despair. These weren't usually big deals. They were often mere moments of beauty. Small kindnesses. Simple supports. Each one was a tiny breath of fresh air -- a spot of sunlight -- a glimmer of hope. These were fleeting, and at no point did they completely offset or reverse the despair, but they carried a significance and a meaning far greater than I could ever put into words. Despair was a pitch black night sky for me, but those moments acted as the faintest flickering of stars.
I want to share one of those moments here, in case it helps anyone.
After this news item broke today, I was walking around my classroom. I happened to see a tab open on one of my students' computers.
It had a simple search query:
how to help trans kidsI had to fight back tears when I saw it. It was a moment of beauty -- simple, and small, but somehow worth the world.
If you are struggling with despair, please know that there is beauty out there. There is kindness and support and love. There are still stars shining in that dark black sky. I know -- believe me, I know -- how hard it can be to see them, but please try to remember that they're there, and that they never go away.
Glad you're still here đź’ś
So Nex sprayed water on some bullies. The bullies then retaliated by hospitalizing them and driving them to suicide. Murder or not, I hope the bullies are still going to go away for a very long time..
I don't actually hope they get imprisoned for a long time. I don't think that solves anything as I think they're a product of the culture of the district, city, state, etc.
But every admin that didn't follow Title IX procedure, didn't follow policy on bullying and fighting, etc... absolutely.
Product of their environment or not, they still bullied someone both physically and mentally to the point of suicide. Letting them off with a stern talking to won't do shit for them. Nex is dead and they were culpable in that, and they should have to take time to think about what they did, whether that be in prison or some other form of rehabilitation.
I don't think they should be "let off with a stern talking to" either. But "going away for a long time" typically means incarceration. They absolutely have culpability, but that is reduced by their age, and I am pretty opposed to our current criminal justice system being used on minors (and in general).
Do not confuse my opposition to long-term incarceration for minors with a lack of anger and grief over Nex's death, nor with a lack of desire for people to be held accountable.
Ideally no kids in school would have to go to prison. Prison should be for rehabilitation, but kids in school haven't even been habilitated yet. Even if a kid does something horrible, their upbringing and schools should be evaluated to see if there is a way to correct their behavior before graduation.
I would agree and it's absolutely awful how often it is. Black and brown children who are filtered straight into the criminal justice system from schools unwilling to or admittedly unable to deal with some of their behavior. But the solution should not be prison in my opinion.
I'm not quite a prison abolitionist but I am increasingly convinced that abolition would probably lead to statistically less harm overall, even though there absolutely need to be other systems in place in reality and it probably will always need to be some way to separate certain individuals from society.
I think I agree with you in principle. And maybe I would be all the way with you if we were talking about light theft or something.
However Nex was 16 and I think it's fair to assume their bullies are the same-ish age. These are not innocent children with no idea of wrong or right. Maybe they are a product of their environment. And yes, teenagers are highly impressionable. This superintendent and whomever else in their lives enabled this behavior should absolutely also be punished somehow, because I'm sure it incites or at least influences behavior like this to some degree.
But none of that takes away from the fact that they hospitalized their schoolmate. They did that out of their own volition and technically being minors does not excuse that. Again, assuming they are Nex's age.. they are just as capable of making their own decisions at 16 as they are at 18. Especially when it's a crime as gruesome as this.
I'm personally tired of dropping my principle because I find a case personally heinous. The justice system should not work on my whims.
I never claimed they were innocent or incompetent to stand trial. I said I don't want them imprisoned for a long period of time. And I'd rather not have any child imprisoned at all. The adults should have consequences for failing to do their jobs and protect the children in their care. Nex was (likely by the news) frustrated by the bullying and harassment and made an impulsive choice to splash the other students with water. This was not a great choice. It was technically assault and/or battery depending on state law. It was also understandable and even predictable given their experiences and their age. We know nothing about these other teens so we're free to paint them as monsters rather than complex individuals. And I'd just rather not do that. Even when they've done something horrible.
We know that they're not as capable of making decisions at 16 as they are at 18 or 25 when they're brains hit the average age of full development. 18 may be arbitrary, but the idea that it's fine to keep pushing legal responsibility back younger while not allowing legal rights is less about actual culpability and more about making us feel good for being tough on crime.
And if you go based on what the criminal justice system would say, you can already hear the narrative. Nex "started" the fight, the girls may have been "carried away" but what did the politician say... They don't want "that filth" in Oklahoma, referring to trans teens? Legally, I'm not sure they'll determine there was a crime. Even if you and I both know that they should.
I am well aware there is no appropriate consequence in our current system for these girls. But prison demonstrably doesn't change them for the better. They will not be less queerphobic after time in prison. They will not be less violent. They will not be more fit for human society. All it'll do is make us feel better that Nex's death was avenged. Nex will still be dead. And nothing will have made the next trans teen in Owasso, OK safer.
Try them as adults. If it's good enough for black boys that age, it's good enough for a couple of white girls.
I don't believe we know that these girls are white. But even if we did, absolutely not.
And we do not fix systemic oppression and bias by expanding the harm we do. I'm tired of being like "I oppose long sentences and most of our criminal justice system .. except in this case where I think it's appropriate to get revenge via the justice system."
It's not good for black youth, it's not ok that schools throw Black and Brown youth, especially boys, into the pipeline to prison. It's not ok that Black youth in particular are aged up and perceived as either violent threats or sexual seducers, when they are children.
Or how about don't do that for the black boys... Just cause one group is wronged doesn't mean we should do the same to the other group. It means we should stop doing it to that group. It's stupid to just increase the harm done to make things equal. Decrease the harm done to make things equal.
Part of the issue is the superintendent who is vocally anti-trans and pro-bathroom restrictions. School is supposed to be a place where kids learn social norms and how to contribute to society. It's hard to teach acceptance to kids when the one in charge of their education is actively saying the opposite.
Agreed, that's why I want those admins held to account, criminally if possible, civilly and within their employment otherwise. I'm pessimistic about that happening but they should be.
It's Oklahoma law that students use restrooms and locker rooms that match the sex on their birth certificates. I haven't read anything about the superintendent here, but it seems like state law would supersede any school policy, so maybe lawmakers or voters are more to blame.
One can enforce a law you don't like (or work around it) without being vocally in support of it. (And being vocally anti-trans is just bonus bigotry on top of that. )
However to be clear it's the state superintendent Ryan Walters who is under fire here. I cannot speak to the district superintenden. Dr. Coates. One of Walters' major supporters is this guy:
https://www.them.us/story/ryan-walters-ron-causby-top-oklahoma-schools-official-under-fire-ties-anti-trans-influencer
And he put the Libs of TikTok lady on the state board to advise on school libraries. And a previous teacher that supported LGBTQ students was pushed out at Nex's school. And, and, and.
Thanks for the info. That does sound unhinged.
That's true, but the superintendent and school employees can speak out against the law and encourage acceptance instead of fanning the flames.
The superintendent should be sent to prison. What a despicable human being.
I believe that the police officer who discouraged Nex from pressing charges because *they could also be charged, as they technically appear to have started the fight, probably contributed to any feelings of hopelessness.
I hate having to explain to students when there's not much police can do to help them, but our campus department is at least compassionate about those conversations and will help the students feel heard.
*My current understanding is that Nex used he/they pronouns depending on who he was around. I'm mostly defaulting to they because I'm not 100% sure if one is better than the other. And as someone who uses she/they it's not always consistent if there's a better one or not
Even if someone else instigates the fight, you're still not allowed to give them a concussion. Concussions can increase thoughts of suicidal ideation, but I don't know if you can pin that kind of result on the attackers. Maybe something like battery or aggravated battery (causing serious bodily injury) would be an appropriate charge for the attackers. Charged as minors since I don't believe in charging children as adults. People (like the cop who discouraged pressing charges) tend to minimize fights between young people, but clearly they can have serious consequences. I think people who take things too far should face consequences as well.
Whether the escalation is surprising or not doesn't matter that much to me. I think mob mentality for retaliation based on how emotional they get about the subject (like pranks) is disgusting. There legal and moral limits to how much is a reasonable amount of escalation. You shouldn't get to knock someone out for throwing water at you without dealing with some consequences.
I think what I suggested is a bit of nuance. Some people are suggesting long prison sentences, which would mean murder and/or hate crime charges, which I think is too far. I suggested battery for causing injuries, which for adults is up to 90 days in jail, but they should be charged as minors, so probably something different and lesser than that.