18 votes

Daily thread - United States 2021 transition of power - January 12

This thread is posted daily - please try to post all relevant US political content in here, such as news, updates, opinion articles, etc. Extremely significant events may warrant a separate topic, but almost all should be posted in here.

This is an inherently political thread; please try to avoid antagonistic arguments and bickering matches. Comment threads that devolve into unproductive arguments may be removed so that the overall topic is able to continue.

35 comments

  1. [4]
    psi
    (edited )
    Link
    Six hours of paralysis: Inside Trump’s failure to act after a mob stormed the Capitol This is the first article I've read which recounts the day from Trump's perspective. It should surprise no one...

    Six hours of paralysis: Inside Trump’s failure to act after a mob stormed the Capitol

    This is the first article I've read which recounts the day from Trump's perspective. It should surprise no one to learn that Trump was more interested in watching the chaos unfold on TV than attempting to quell the riot, rebuffing pleas from desperate lawmakers (of his own party!) and former aides in the meantime.

    [T]he president himself was busy enjoying the spectacle. Trump watched with interest, buoyed to see that his supporters were fighting so hard on his behalf, one close adviser said.
    [...]
    Several Republican members of Congress also called White House aides, begging them to get Trump’s attention and have him call for the violence to end. The lawmakers reiterated that they had been loyal Trump supporters and were even willing to vote against the electoral college results — but were now scared for their lives, officials said.

    Hell, Trump didn't even bother to check on Pence.

    Even as his supporters at the Capitol chanted for Pence to be hanged, Trump never called the vice president to check on him or his family. Marc Short, Pence’s chief of staff, eventually called the White House to let them know that Pence and his team were okay, after receiving no outreach from the president or anyone else in the White House.

    Ultimately Trump took some action only after realizing he might lose allies in contesting the electoral count, not out of concern for their safety. And even then he resisted distancing himself from the insurrectionists.

    Shortly after 2:30 p.m., the group finally persuaded Trump to send a tweet: “Please support our Capitol Police and Law Enforcement,” he wrote. “They are truly on the side of our Country. Stay peaceful!”




    But the Twitter missive was insufficient, and the president had not wanted to include the final instruction to “stay peaceful,” according to one person familiar with the discussions.

    20 votes
    1. [2]
      xnaas
      Link Parent
      Pence isn't my favorite guy in the world, by any means, but damn...that's just cold.

      Even as his supporters at the Capitol chanted for Pence to be hanged, Trump never called the vice president to check on him or his family. Marc Short, Pence’s chief of staff, eventually called the White House to let them know that Pence and his team were okay, after receiving no outreach from the president or anyone else in the White House.

      Pence isn't my favorite guy in the world, by any means, but damn...that's just cold.

      12 votes
      1. Parliament
        Link Parent
        As heinous as it was for Trump to send a mob of terrorists to kill Pence, it's hard for me not to have a "you reap what you sow" attitude towards him.

        As heinous as it was for Trump to send a mob of terrorists to kill Pence, it's hard for me not to have a "you reap what you sow" attitude towards him.

        14 votes
    2. Omnicrola
      Link Parent
      JFC. The leading member of the House, of the president's own party, had to resort to going on TV and hoping that the president saw him, so that maybe the president would tell the armed mob outside...

      McCarthy did eventually reach Trump, but later told allies that he found the president distracted. So McCarthy repeatedly appeared on television to describe the mayhem, an adviser said, in an effort to explain just how dire the situation was.

      JFC. The leading member of the House, of the president's own party, had to resort to going on TV and hoping that the president saw him, so that maybe the president would tell the armed mob outside the Capital to go home.

      11 votes
  2. [5]
    dubteedub
    Link
    The FBI just released a new report that completely undercuts the US Capitol Police's and other agencies claims that there was no intelligence suggesting a violent attack on the Capitol and our...

    The FBI just released a new report that completely undercuts the US Capitol Police's and other agencies claims that there was no intelligence suggesting a violent attack on the Capitol and our legislative branch.

    A day before rioters stormed Congress, an FBI office in Virginia issued an explicit internal warning that extremists were preparing to travel to Washington to commit violence and “war,” according to an internal document reviewed by The Washington Post that contradicts a senior official’s declaration the bureau had no intelligence indicating anyone at last week’s pro-Trump protest planned to do harm.

    17 votes
    1. [4]
      dubteedub
      Link Parent
      This afternoon the FBI held its first major briefing post-Capitol insurrection. Some major highlights are: The FBI has opened 160 case files already and has many many more planned. "That's just...

      This afternoon the FBI held its first major briefing post-Capitol insurrection.

      Some major highlights are:

      • The FBI has opened 160 case files already and has many many more planned. "That's just the tip of the iceberg."

      • 70 individuals have already been charged

      • Received 100,000 pieces of digital media from public

      • “Even if you left DC, agents from our local field offices will be knocking on your door.”

      Reuters Article - FBI opens 160 cases related to storming of U.S. Capitol

      Full video here - LIVE: FBI and DOJ brief on last week's US Capitol riots.

      Other highlights from Twitter here:

      Acting U.S. attorney Michael Sherwin on U.S. Capitol investigation.

      "I think the scope and scale of this investigation in these cases are really unprecedented not only in FBI history but really in DOJ history."

      He says the Capitol Grounds are, essentially, a crime scene.

      SHERWIN adds this is just the beginning.

      He says they're charging some of these suspects quickly on the first possible charge, which buys law enforcement time to develop far more significant investigations leading to bigger charges.

      SHERWIN: "We're looking at significant felony cases tied to sedition and conspiracy."

      This is all really huge. I definitely have been apprehensive as some of those charged so far were given pretty lenient charges worth only a year or two. With sedition and conspiracy on the table, we are talking a whole different ball game. I hope these terrorists live every day in fear in the coming days and weeks waiting for that knock on their door.

      16 votes
      1. [2]
        cfabbro
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        Isn't that just how criminal prosecution generally works in the US though? I.e. Initial charges are almost always just for the most obvious and easy to prove crimes, so they can quickly make...

        I definitely have been apprehensive as some of those charged so far were given pretty lenient charges worth only a year or two.

        Isn't that just how criminal prosecution generally works in the US though? I.e. Initial charges are almost always just for the most obvious and easy to prove crimes, so they can quickly make arrests, and justify warrants to collect more evidence... but afterwards they will typically add more serious charges to the list if/when they uncover enough evidence to justify them.

        10 votes
      2. Omnicrola
        Link Parent
        Was curious, so I looked up the penalties for sedition. The relevant US title code is 18 US 2384, which lists a maximum of 20 years in prison, along with a fine. There's an interesting history of...

        SHERWIN: "We're looking at significant felony cases tied to sedition and conspiracy."

        Was curious, so I looked up the penalties for sedition. The relevant US title code is 18 US 2384, which lists a maximum of 20 years in prison, along with a fine. There's an interesting history of people accused/convicted of "seditious conspiracy" on Wikipedia. The more broad page on sedition in general has some additional history which includes some examples of people who where accused/charged, who where either acquitted or their sentences later commuted.

        8 votes
  3. dubteedub
    Link
    Third House Democrat tests positive for COVID-19 after Capitol riots I honestly loathe every Republican so much.

    Rep. Brad Schneider (D-Ill.) said Tuesday he tested positive for COVID-19 after a pro-Trump mob forced a lockdown at the Capitol last week, making him the third Democrat to contract the virus since the deadly riots. Schneider said he was in close contact with several Republican lawmakers who refused to wear masks during the siege.

    Rep. Pramila Jayapal (D-Wash.), the chair of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, announced Tuesday she tested positive after being locked down with Republicans who “cruelly refused to wear a mask” while in hiding from rioters.

    Rep. Bonnie Watson Coleman (D-N.J.), a 75-year-old cancer survivor, has also tested positive.

    I honestly loathe every Republican so much.

    16 votes
  4. [4]
    Deimos
    Link
    Sheldon Adelson died on Monday. He was a massive donor for Republican and conservative groups ($218 million in the 2020 cycle), and the largest Trump donor.

    Sheldon Adelson died on Monday. He was a massive donor for Republican and conservative groups ($218 million in the 2020 cycle), and the largest Trump donor.

    14 votes
    1. [2]
      Micycle_the_Bichael
      Link Parent
      Honest question: Do you (you reading of this question, not only Deimos) think that this news really means anything (strictly speaking about politics, I don't want to get into a debate about the...

      Honest question: Do you (you reading of this question, not only Deimos) think that this news really means anything (strictly speaking about politics, I don't want to get into a debate about the value of human life or morality)? I assume most of his money is staying within the family, and his wife is a Trump Megadoner. Does his death mean anything? I guess this also makes me wonder politically speaking, does there become a point where you're so wealthy your monetary value eclipses any individual political belief you hold because your wealth will be handed down for generations?

      5 votes
      1. MimicSquid
        Link Parent
        From a scan of her wikipedia article, it looks like Miriam's interest is much more focused on Israel and medicine than on Trump in particular. Beyond that, it's hard to say what her goals will be...

        From a scan of her wikipedia article, it looks like Miriam's interest is much more focused on Israel and medicine than on Trump in particular. Beyond that, it's hard to say what her goals will be separate from her late husband.

        9 votes
    2. Adys
      Link Parent
      I do think it's gross to celebrate other people's deaths, but I'll put it this way: 2021 is looking up already. What a timing, too. He's like the human representation of the Trump party, and he's...

      I do think it's gross to celebrate other people's deaths, but I'll put it this way: 2021 is looking up already.

      What a timing, too. He's like the human representation of the Trump party, and he's dying alongside it.

  5. [6]
    ras
    Link
    McConnell is said to be pleased about impeachment, believing it will be easier to purge Trump from the G.O.P. I have to say I'll be pretty surprised if this is true. Even with Mitch's support do...

    McConnell is said to be pleased about impeachment, believing it will be easier to purge Trump from the G.O.P.

    I have to say I'll be pretty surprised if this is true. Even with Mitch's support do you guys think they could whip enough other Republicans to vote for conviction?

    13 votes
    1. spit-evil-olive-tips
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Seems completely believable to me. They got what they wanted from Trump (a 6-3 SCOTUS majority & hundreds of lower court judges, tax cuts for the rich, massive deregulation / administrative law...

      Seems completely believable to me. They got what they wanted from Trump (a 6-3 SCOTUS majority & hundreds of lower court judges, tax cuts for the rich, massive deregulation / administrative law rollbacks). Now that he's political deadweight they're going to use this as an excuse to cut him loose.

      edit:

      Credit to Jamelle Bouie on twitter for this - another benefit from McConnell's POV is that they can prevent Trump from running in 2024. That would divide the Republicans into two factions similar to what we saw in the 2016 primary. Taking him out of the equation allows them to unify around a message of "nope, no fascism here, we got rid of that and we're a totally normal political party again..."

      15 votes
    2. streblo
      Link Parent
      Another way to read it is that he can be pleased about the Democrats impeaching while not planning to vote and convict. That said, there is enough upside for Republicans, especially the Senate, in...

      Another way to read it is that he can be pleased about the Democrats impeaching while not planning to vote and convict.

      That said, there is enough upside for Republicans, especially the Senate, in opting for a clean break. It's definitely possible they have the numbers.

      9 votes
    3. Icarus
      Link Parent
      Add Liz Cheney to the mix as well. Here is what she had to say: Edit: And John Katko. Estimates are between 10-20 Republicans will vote to impeach tomorrow.

      Add Liz Cheney to the mix as well. Here is what she had to say:

      Much more will become clear in coming days and weeks, but what we know now is enough. The President of the United States summoned this mob, assembled the mob, and lit the flame of this attack. Everything that followed was his doing. None of this would have happened without the President. The President could have immediately and forcefully intervened to stop the violence. He did not. There has never been a greater betrayal by a President of the United States of his office and his oath to the Constitution.

      Edit: And John Katko. Estimates are between 10-20 Republicans will vote to impeach tomorrow.

      8 votes
    4. vord
      Link Parent
      McConnell is a sleezy scumbag who will do anything and everything to enable the worst of the Republican agenda. If he wasn't, he wouldn't have blocked Obama's Supreme Court nominations. This...

      McConnell is a sleezy scumbag who will do anything and everything to enable the worst of the Republican agenda. If he wasn't, he wouldn't have blocked Obama's Supreme Court nominations.

      This impeachment, at least for the Republicans, is just posturing to distance themselves from Trump in his last grasps to retain power. If it wasn't, they would have supported the first impeachment, or at the bare minimum given it a proper review.

      7 votes
    5. Amarok
      Link Parent
      I would have said it wasn't likely or even possible, however Trump and his cohorts are being such rampant asshats about all of this that the republicans may have to do it just to protect...

      I would have said it wasn't likely or even possible, however Trump and his cohorts are being such rampant asshats about all of this that the republicans may have to do it just to protect themselves from reprisals.

      Another factor here is the ongoing investigations. The FBI can and will ask representatives to match their timing to the investigation. If for example they believe there's a credible threat that impeachment may trigger something, they may ask for a delay. On the other hand, immediate impeachment torpedoes Trump's use of pardons to shield these people, so they could press the other way on those grounds. It really depends on what the bureau is thinking, and they aren't sharing that information with the general public.

      We're so far from anything resembling normal right now that everything is truly up in the air.

      5 votes
    1. dubteedub
      Link Parent
      It has been pretty funny to see a lot of right-wing grifters and media personalities bemoaning how their Twitter follower counts are dropping by tens of thousands of accounts. Like they are just...

      It has been pretty funny to see a lot of right-wing grifters and media personalities bemoaning how their Twitter follower counts are dropping by tens of thousands of accounts. Like they are just outing the fact that their follower base was full of hardcore insurrectionists and conspiracy theorists that are either getting kicked off of the platform or are leaving in protest.

      It is also extremely frustrating that Twitter (along with other social media sites) could have done all this years ago. There is no reason they should have let these Qanon folks fester and radicalize each other for years on their site when everyone paying attention has been sounding alarm bells for years about the potential for violence.

      22 votes
    2. JakeTheDog
      Link Parent
      I’m worried that this will fuel motivation to ban encryption-based messaging.

      The online far right is moving underground

      I’m worried that this will fuel motivation to ban encryption-based messaging.

      11 votes
  6. [2]
    spit-evil-olive-tips
    Link
    GitHub is facing employee backlash after the firing of a Jewish employee who suggested 'Nazis are about' on the day of the US Capitol siege
    10 votes
    1. suspended
      Link Parent
      Nothing makes my blood boil more than antisemitism. Billions of these people have been murdered under a banner of 'God'. I can't think of any degree of insanity higher than this.

      Nothing makes my blood boil more than antisemitism. Billions of these people have been murdered under a banner of 'God'. I can't think of any degree of insanity higher than this.

      5 votes
  7. dredmorbius
    Link
    YouTube suspends Trump's channel after violating policy on inciting violence...

    YouTube suspends Trump's channel after violating policy on inciting violence

    (Reuters) - Alphabet Inc’s YouTube said on Tuesday it has suspended Donald Trump’s channel as it violated policies for inciting violence after last week’s assault on the U.S. Capitol by the president’s supporters.

    Online platforms and social media companies are distancing themselves from, and taking action against, those that encouraged or engaged in the violence in Washington, DC.

    Trump’s channel is now prevented from uploading new videos or livestreams for a minimum of seven days, which may be extended, Youtube said in a statement. ...

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-youtube-trump/youtube-suspends-trumps-channel-after-violating-policy-on-inciting-violence-idUSKBN29I0F9

    8 votes
  8. [2]
    suspended
    Link
    New terror threat points to plot to surround Capitol, lawmaker says
    7 votes
    1. Omnicrola
      Link Parent
      Since it's a pandemic and there shouldn't be crowds anyway, I'd love to see the inauguration stage completely deserted and the ceremony take place somewhere else. Let the idiots storm the stage...

      Since it's a pandemic and there shouldn't be crowds anyway, I'd love to see the inauguration stage completely deserted and the ceremony take place somewhere else. Let the idiots storm the stage and attack a stage full of mannequins or something.

      8 votes
  9. cfabbro
    Link
    PayPal Dumps GiveSendGo, the 'Christian' Crowdfunding Site Used By Proud Boys

    PayPal Dumps GiveSendGo, the 'Christian' Crowdfunding Site Used By Proud Boys

    This morning PayPal confirmed to Gizmodo that it has cut ties with GiveSendGo, the Christian crowdfunding platform which hosts fundraisers for, among other causes, Kenosha shooter Kyle Rittenhouse and Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio.

    A GiveSendGo spokesperson confirmed that it’s parted ways with mainstream fintech companies, for unnamed reasons. “We have/are changing/moved away from our previous payment solutions (examples. WePay, Stripe, Paypal etc) and are implementing/working with our own solutions to continue providing efficient service to our users,” the spokesperson told Gizmodo via email. They added that the company would prefer not to divulge its current payment processing method at this time.

    The site continues to be hosted by Amazon Web Services—which is relevant because AWS made the unusual decision to cut ties with conservative Twitter clone Parler late last week.

    Over the past few months, GoFundMe, too, has removed several fundraisers “attempting to challenge the legitimate results of the 2020 election,” it said in a statement shared with Gizmodo. The company said that it will continue to remove such fundraisers, as well as those “for travel expenses to a future political event where there’s risk of violence by the attendees.”

    7 votes
  10. MonkeyPants
    Link
    Trump says ‘tremendous anger’ in nation over impeachment Curiously, I haven't seen this covered in Fox News or OANN yet.

    Trump says ‘tremendous anger’ in nation over impeachment

    Trump is blaming Democratic congressional foes for “tremendous anger.”

    Trump took no responsibility Tuesday for the deadly mob invasion of the building but also said he wanted “no violence.”

    Curiously, I haven't seen this covered in Fox News or OANN yet.

    6 votes
  11. [2]
    floweringmind
    Link
    There are still many places they can go to, but what has been done has helped. The 16th - 20th will really show how much they have been impacted. Here are some of the places: gab, minds, and some...

    There are still many places they can go to, but what has been done has helped. The 16th - 20th will really show how much they have been impacted.

    Here are some of the places:
    gab, minds, and some reddit feeds. Minds says that they avoid their kind of content but I have seen a lot of the hate speech hidden in memes.

    3 votes