Fan of this channel and this is a long one but for each of the 100 games, he has a small blurb about why he feels it's important to him (it's very subjective) and the lessons learned. It's an...
Fan of this channel and this is a long one but for each of the 100 games, he has a small blurb about why he feels it's important to him (it's very subjective) and the lessons learned. It's an enjoyable background listen for those who are in the middle of some mindless tasks at work.
I'd put it in exactly that category. It may introduce you to new games but there wasn't really anything new for me (though it really was just a background video, so I might've missed some). Partly...
I'd put it in exactly that category. It may introduce you to new games but there wasn't really anything new for me (though it really was just a background video, so I might've missed some). Partly that might be just because I've followed the channel for a long time so repeat topics were obviously familiar to me.
For someone totally new to game design this video is great! Though maybe a bit intimidating since it's a long video but in chunks it's fine and full of stuff without fluff. And it's probably useful for someone in the midst of designing game mechanics as a refresher -- maybe, I'm not a game designer so idk.
Full list of games, with timestamps, in this comment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWNXGfXOrro&lc=UgwsOVj2iga9hsRA8px4AaABAg Strangely there seem to have been zero lessons learned from 8-bit...
I get the impression that he wasn't playing games when those eras of computing happened and so went back to catch some genre defining games but didn't play everything as it came out.
I get the impression that he wasn't playing games when those eras of computing happened and so went back to catch some genre defining games but didn't play everything as it came out.
The guy looks pretty young when I've seen his face in videos. I doubt he's much older than me, and I was born in the late 90s. Doesn't take much effort not to have played games that came out...
The guy looks pretty young when I've seen his face in videos. I doubt he's much older than me, and I was born in the late 90s. Doesn't take much effort not to have played games that came out before you were born -- if anything it takes effort to go back and play influential titles from earlier days of gaming.
Right, but in that case I'd have expected no titles from before his birth. The fact that there were some old titles says that he was somewhat interested in going back, but perhaps not interested...
Right, but in that case I'd have expected no titles from before his birth. The fact that there were some old titles says that he was somewhat interested in going back, but perhaps not interested enough to go deeper. Which is fine. I just found the gap quite interesting.
Me, I would say these: Robotron 2084 (1982)—mostly, newer media is faster, but this very early twin-stick shooter makes every other entry in the genre look like they're running in slow motion....
Me, I would say these:
Robotron 2084 (1982)—mostly, newer media is faster, but this very early twin-stick shooter makes every other entry in the genre look like they're running in slow motion. Simple tight gameplay which just works.
Bubbles (1982)—while not the most loved of arcade games, a sink is such a unique setting, and the fluid movement of the gameplay fits it perfectly.
Sinistar (1983)—this game is super focused. While the Sinistar is gradually being build, you try to collect enough ammo to take it on. I love how focused this is, first the build-up, then the boss fight.
Impossible Mission (1984)—one of the earliest action roguelikes. It has the unique premise that the player has a lifespan of 6 hours, and each death means that you loose 10 minutes. Like in Pacman, the gameplay consist stealing stuff and escaping rather than fighting, underlying the feeling of powerlessness which is a key trope in the roguelike genre.
Scorched Earth (1991)—Solid turnbased local multiplayer.
Star Control II (1992)—The Super Melee combat with the various vastly different fighters (ranging from epic boss ships to suicide minions) show how awesome asymmetrical multiplayer can be.
ScruTiny in the Great Round (1995)—This is a stupid, artsy point-and-click experience, the kind of things which could only be created during the euphoric CD-rom revolution. Nevertheless, it's a great to show how you aren't forced to limit yourself to what is expected by the various genres of games. You can code pretty much anything if you want.
Star Control II is available as a free/open-source project called "The Ur-Quan Masters" these days. I never played it for the multiplayer, but the single-player is almost a kind of proto-Mass...
Star Control II is available as a free/open-source project called "The Ur-Quan Masters" these days.
I never played it for the multiplayer, but the single-player is almost a kind of proto-Mass Effect style space opera. There's a large world to explore, with lots of things to find, and importantly there's a ticking clock on some key story events such that the narrative doesn't just revolve around the player. The villans aren't just waiting for you to trigger their quest, they're going to keep doing their own thing unless you get busy stopping them quickly.
It looks like the open source port is different than the game on steam from who appear to be the original devs. Have you got any idea on if the port is the better experience? It seems like the...
It looks like the open source port is different than the game on steam from who appear to be the original devs. Have you got any idea on if the port is the better experience? It seems like the port has a proper Linux build so I'll probably go with that unless there's something major.
I think the Steam version is the open source build, just with some of the original voiceovers and music added back in. I haven't seen any discussion of it, but I imagine it might be possible to...
I think the Steam version is the open source build, just with some of the original voiceovers and music added back in.
I haven't seen any discussion of it, but I imagine it might be possible to grab the assets from the Steam version and plug them into the Linux version, but it's not something I've looked into at all yet.
Great list, thanks! Though most of the games on his list are modern, like from the last 15ish years and like he said it's his personal "meaningless" list but your games are interesting too.
Great list, thanks!
Though most of the games on his list are modern, like from the last 15ish years and like he said it's his personal "meaningless" list but your games are interesting too.
Throwing in Trinity (1986), it's an interactive fiction game about war. Jon Blow (Braid, The Witness) says it's one of the most interesting games he's played.
Throwing in Trinity (1986), it's an interactive fiction game about war. Jon Blow (Braid, The Witness) says it's one of the most interesting games he's played.
Of course all of this is personal. There's nothing to say that you can't learn the same lesson from a modern game that you would learn from the first game that introduced that concept. I think...
Of course all of this is personal. There's nothing to say that you can't learn the same lesson from a modern game that you would learn from the first game that introduced that concept. I think knowing the origin of any game design concept is empowering, but it's up to the individual. And of course it's not possible to play all the games and learn all the game design. So the video is fine, really. I just thought that the gap in coverage, which was pretty obvious to me, was quite interesting. On second glance there are in fact some titles from that period in there, but it's still a very recent-heavy list.
Anyway, ten suggestions of important/influential games and game design from me below ...tomorrow it would no doubt be a different list.
Alpha Waves (1990, first 3D platform game)
Chain Shot "SameGame" (1985, a puzzler as old as Tetris)
Chip's Challenge (1989, block pushing puzzlers)
GoldenEye 007 (1997, multi player arena shooter)
Hunter (1991, early/first open world 3D adventure, see Grand Theft Auto III from 2001)
Sim City, Civilization, Transport Tycoon, RollerCoaster Tycoon (~1990s, take your pick)
Super Mario 64 (1996, 3D platform also see Alpha Waves from 1990)
Super Mario Kart (1992, birthed a genre)
Super Mario World (1990, perhaps perfect?)
Wii Sports (2006, brought gaming to a whole new segment of society)
Couple games which weren't mentioned but definitely should have been: Braid (2008) - one of the original XBLA indie hits, designed by Jon Blow (who later designed The Witness, which is a great...
Couple games which weren't mentioned but definitely should have been:
Braid (2008) - one of the original XBLA indie hits, designed by Jon Blow (who later designed The Witness, which is a great game for teaching mechanics through play). It's a side-scrolling time-manipulation puzzle game which works very hard to explore mechanics to the fullest extent, even if that conflicts with being "fun". Everything about the game is well considered, and is one of the first to be considered an "art game". He released a 15 year anniversary edition this year with 15 hours of developer commentary, reworked music and visuals, and an extra set of puzzles. I'd highly recommend it.
Pathologic (2005) - Takes the question "is fun the only emotion games should evoke from players?" seriously. It's a survival RPG which uses its mechanics and dialogue to invoke powerlessness and deception in a way no other game on this list does. It's not a "fun" game and a lot of people bounce off, but it's tense and compelling in a way I've not seen attempted before. There's also an early-access reimagining on Steam called Pathologic 2.
It's been out in full release for years. I've had it installed for weeks and really need to actually get around to properly playing it. The atmosphere's fascinating, but you're right that it's not...
There's also an early-access reimagining on Steam called Pathologic 2.
It's been out in full release for years. I've had it installed for weeks and really need to actually get around to properly playing it. The atmosphere's fascinating, but you're right that it's not "fun." More like brooding horror novel full of despair, at least the part I've played so far, and I didn't get the impression it was planning to get any lighter. It feels a bit like China Mieville's novels to me--desperate, confusing, incredibly strange, but magnetic somehow.
Fan of this channel and this is a long one but for each of the 100 games, he has a small blurb about why he feels it's important to him (it's very subjective) and the lessons learned. It's an enjoyable background listen for those who are in the middle of some mindless tasks at work.
I'd put it in exactly that category. It may introduce you to new games but there wasn't really anything new for me (though it really was just a background video, so I might've missed some). Partly that might be just because I've followed the channel for a long time so repeat topics were obviously familiar to me.
For someone totally new to game design this video is great! Though maybe a bit intimidating since it's a long video but in chunks it's fine and full of stuff without fluff. And it's probably useful for someone in the midst of designing game mechanics as a refresher -- maybe, I'm not a game designer so idk.
Full list of games, with timestamps, in this comment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWNXGfXOrro&lc=UgwsOVj2iga9hsRA8px4AaABAg
Strangely there seem to have been zero lessons learned from 8-bit and 16-bit home computers. There's a gap from 1985 to about Y2K. Say it ain't so!
I get the impression that he wasn't playing games when those eras of computing happened and so went back to catch some genre defining games but didn't play everything as it came out.
Good point, I'm only half way through so I'm thinking since it's so subjective, much of his gaming experience excluded a lot of this stuff?
You'd have to work really hard to miss/forget about 15 years of gaming.
The guy looks pretty young when I've seen his face in videos. I doubt he's much older than me, and I was born in the late 90s. Doesn't take much effort not to have played games that came out before you were born -- if anything it takes effort to go back and play influential titles from earlier days of gaming.
Right, but in that case I'd have expected no titles from before his birth. The fact that there were some old titles says that he was somewhat interested in going back, but perhaps not interested enough to go deeper. Which is fine. I just found the gap quite interesting.
What games do you think he missed in terms of game design?
Me, I would say these:
Robotron 2084 (1982)—mostly, newer media is faster, but this very early twin-stick shooter makes every other entry in the genre look like they're running in slow motion. Simple tight gameplay which just works.
Bubbles (1982)—while not the most loved of arcade games, a sink is such a unique setting, and the fluid movement of the gameplay fits it perfectly.
Sinistar (1983)—this game is super focused. While the Sinistar is gradually being build, you try to collect enough ammo to take it on. I love how focused this is, first the build-up, then the boss fight.
Impossible Mission (1984)—one of the earliest action roguelikes. It has the unique premise that the player has a lifespan of 6 hours, and each death means that you loose 10 minutes. Like in Pacman, the gameplay consist stealing stuff and escaping rather than fighting, underlying the feeling of powerlessness which is a key trope in the roguelike genre.
Scorched Earth (1991)—Solid turnbased local multiplayer.
Star Control II (1992)—The Super Melee combat with the various vastly different fighters (ranging from epic boss ships to suicide minions) show how awesome asymmetrical multiplayer can be.
ScruTiny in the Great Round (1995)—This is a stupid, artsy point-and-click experience, the kind of things which could only be created during the euphoric CD-rom revolution. Nevertheless, it's a great to show how you aren't forced to limit yourself to what is expected by the various genres of games. You can code pretty much anything if you want.
Star Control II is available as a free/open-source project called "The Ur-Quan Masters" these days.
I never played it for the multiplayer, but the single-player is almost a kind of proto-Mass Effect style space opera. There's a large world to explore, with lots of things to find, and importantly there's a ticking clock on some key story events such that the narrative doesn't just revolve around the player. The villans aren't just waiting for you to trigger their quest, they're going to keep doing their own thing unless you get busy stopping them quickly.
It looks like the open source port is different than the game on steam from who appear to be the original devs. Have you got any idea on if the port is the better experience? It seems like the port has a proper Linux build so I'll probably go with that unless there's something major.
Community port
Steam
Aptitude command
apt-get install uqmI think the Steam version is the open source build, just with some of the original voiceovers and music added back in.
I haven't seen any discussion of it, but I imagine it might be possible to grab the assets from the Steam version and plug them into the Linux version, but it's not something I've looked into at all yet.
Great list, thanks!
Though most of the games on his list are modern, like from the last 15ish years and like he said it's his personal "meaningless" list but your games are interesting too.
Throwing in Trinity (1986), it's an interactive fiction game about war. Jon Blow (Braid, The Witness) says it's one of the most interesting games he's played.
I've never heard of any of these! But I'm a fan of point&click, even retro stuff, so I think I'll look into that last one.
Of course all of this is personal. There's nothing to say that you can't learn the same lesson from a modern game that you would learn from the first game that introduced that concept. I think knowing the origin of any game design concept is empowering, but it's up to the individual. And of course it's not possible to play all the games and learn all the game design. So the video is fine, really. I just thought that the gap in coverage, which was pretty obvious to me, was quite interesting. On second glance there are in fact some titles from that period in there, but it's still a very recent-heavy list.
Anyway, ten suggestions of important/influential games and game design from me below ...tomorrow it would no doubt be a different list.
Couple games which weren't mentioned but definitely should have been:
Braid (2008) - one of the original XBLA indie hits, designed by Jon Blow (who later designed The Witness, which is a great game for teaching mechanics through play). It's a side-scrolling time-manipulation puzzle game which works very hard to explore mechanics to the fullest extent, even if that conflicts with being "fun". Everything about the game is well considered, and is one of the first to be considered an "art game". He released a 15 year anniversary edition this year with 15 hours of developer commentary, reworked music and visuals, and an extra set of puzzles. I'd highly recommend it.
Pathologic (2005) - Takes the question "is fun the only emotion games should evoke from players?" seriously. It's a survival RPG which uses its mechanics and dialogue to invoke powerlessness and deception in a way no other game on this list does. It's not a "fun" game and a lot of people bounce off, but it's tense and compelling in a way I've not seen attempted before. There's also an early-access reimagining on Steam called Pathologic 2.
It's been out in full release for years. I've had it installed for weeks and really need to actually get around to properly playing it. The atmosphere's fascinating, but you're right that it's not "fun." More like brooding horror novel full of despair, at least the part I've played so far, and I didn't get the impression it was planning to get any lighter. It feels a bit like China Mieville's novels to me--desperate, confusing, incredibly strange, but magnetic somehow.