14 votes

Elon Musk says shelter-in-place orders during COVID-19 are ‘fascist’—‘Give people back their goddamn freedom.’

31 comments

  1. [17]
    kari
    (edited )
    Link
    The same man who thought he came up with an idea when he suggested tunnels for cars, a.k.a. worse subways. Elon Musk is incredibly smart but he's also an asshole who doesn't care about "the...

    The same man who thought he came up with an idea when he suggested tunnels for cars, a.k.a. worse subways. Elon Musk is incredibly smart but he's also an asshole who doesn't care about "the poors".

    E: I expanded on this below, but my biggest issue with ending shelter-in-place orders is that those who need to stay home because of various medical vulnerabilities, or even just those who don’t feel safe going out yet, will lose out on unemployment if the country re-opens. To me, the health of vulnerable people is more important than some people being bored at home.

    8 votes
    1. [11]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. [9]
        vakieh
        Link Parent
        It stayed in place after the flooded cave debacle, it'll survive this. Basically a libertarian trump cult at this point.

        It stayed in place after the flooded cave debacle, it'll survive this. Basically a libertarian trump cult at this point.

        11 votes
        1. [9]
          Comment deleted by author
          Link Parent
          1. [8]
            vakieh
            Link Parent
            Trump managed to become elected the President of the United States while simultaneously being thicker than a brain-dead pistachio. Say what you want about how much of a cunt he is, that's far, FAR...

            Trump managed to become elected the President of the United States while simultaneously being thicker than a brain-dead pistachio. Say what you want about how much of a cunt he is, that's far, FAR more impressive to me than anything Musk has done.

            3 votes
            1. [7]
              Autoxidation
              Link Parent
              Tesla and SpaceX aren't impressive to you? First accomplished reusable rockets, Mars plans, first real electric vehicles, first all electric car company, the main proponent of electric cars for...

              Tesla and SpaceX aren't impressive to you? First accomplished reusable rockets, Mars plans, first real electric vehicles, first all electric car company, the main proponent of electric cars for the past 12 years, solar roofs, grid level battery storage... Musk has given real benefit to society and his companies are still relatively young with huge room for growth. For all his misgivings, he's done some great things, and will continue to do so.

              Certainly more accomplished than being a hateful bigot and winning many voters who share the same views. And Musk has real wealth (if you view that as a measure of accomplishment) compared to Trump.

              8 votes
              1. [6]
                vakieh
                Link Parent
                This is exactly what makes it a cult - Musk didn't do those things, a large group of people who happen to include Musk did that. He funded it with the money he got from Paypal, sure, but the...

                This is exactly what makes it a cult - Musk didn't do those things, a large group of people who happen to include Musk did that. He funded it with the money he got from Paypal, sure, but the achievements of SpaceX and Tesla are not the achievements of Musk. If you hand a random person a bunch of money, sometimes you get a Trump, sometimes you get a Musk. Neither are worthy of hero-worship for it.

                17 votes
                1. [5]
                  Comment deleted by author
                  Link Parent
                  1. [3]
                    deciduous
                    Link Parent
                    Elon Musk also got his money from his parents who owned an Emerald Mine in apartheid South Africa. He is clearly better than Trump, but that's a low bar. And given his desire to let ten of...

                    Elon Musk also got his money from his parents who owned an Emerald Mine in apartheid South Africa. He is clearly better than Trump, but that's a low bar.

                    And given his desire to let ten of thousands die, I would also say he is not a very good person. I have tons of respect for the engineers, programmers, factory workers, and other employees at Musk's companies, but little for Musk.

                    9 votes
                    1. [2]
                      Comment deleted by author
                      Link Parent
                      1. deciduous
                        Link Parent
                        Musk doesn't want his liberty. He wants other people to be forced to work for him. Musk is free to go build Tesla's by himself. He can cut his own hair and pour his own drinks if he wants to. Musk...

                        We've come a long way from "Give me liberty, or give me death" huh?

                        Musk doesn't want his liberty. He wants other people to be forced to work for him. Musk is free to go build Tesla's by himself. He can cut his own hair and pour his own drinks if he wants to.

                        Musk is only okay with people dying to reopen the economy because he knows he won't be one of them. He would never risk his own life working.

                        1 vote
                    2. Autoxidation
                      Link Parent
                      Do you have a source for this? Because I think you are uninformed here. Musk disavowed his dad (who he resents) and moved to Canada when he was 17, "living with various relatives of his mother and...

                      Elon Musk also got his money from his parents who owned an Emerald Mine in apartheid South Africa. He is clearly better than Trump, but that's a low bar.

                      Do you have a source for this? Because I think you are uninformed here. Musk disavowed his dad (who he resents) and moved to Canada when he was 17, "living with various relatives of his mother and surviving on a dollar a day eating hot dogs and oranges." All of his money came from starting zip2 with his brother, followed by X.com and Paypal.

                      2 votes
                  2. skybrian
                    Link Parent
                    A bit of history: Musk's money was important, yes, but Tesla wasn't founded by Musk. The co-founders were Martin Eberhard and Marc Tarpenning. There was a messy breakup after some schedule delays...

                    A bit of history: Musk's money was important, yes, but Tesla wasn't founded by Musk. The co-founders were Martin Eberhard and Marc Tarpenning. There was a messy breakup after some schedule delays that put the company at great financial risk, and Musk took over. Who knows what would have happened if they had originally found funding from someone else?

                    It so happens I worked for Marc and Martin at a previous startup they founded, during the dot-com boom.

                    9 votes
                2. Autoxidation
                  Link Parent
                  Musk funded and lead (and in the case of SpaceX, created) those companies in those directions and, for better or worse, is the face of both Tesla and SpaceX. Who reveals every major new Tesla...

                  Musk funded and lead (and in the case of SpaceX, created) those companies in those directions and, for better or worse, is the face of both Tesla and SpaceX. Who reveals every major new Tesla vehicle to the public? Who shows off every new rocket and is at every first launch? It was his vision of them that made them what they are today.

                  How can you look at either of those companies and not think that Musk makes every major decision for them?

                  Musk didn't do those things, a large group of people who happen to include Musk did that.

                  By that measure, Trump's never done a damn thing in his life.

                  If you hand a random person a bunch of money, sometimes you get a Trump, sometimes you get a Musk.

                  Where are all of the lottery winners making cutting edge tech companies???

                  5 votes
      2. kari
        Link Parent
        Oh me too. Someone I know is obsessed with Elon and thinks he can do no wrong. Like I think Elon is smart and a lot of his companies are pretty great, but some of his opinions are less than ideal.

        Oh me too. Someone I know is obsessed with Elon and thinks he can do no wrong. Like I think Elon is smart and a lot of his companies are pretty great, but some of his opinions are less than ideal.

        3 votes
    2. [6]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      That seems like an excessively binary take on it, since it looks like the Boring company's approach might have some advantages in some situations, such as cost to build. It's not worse in every...

      That seems like an excessively binary take on it, since it looks like the Boring company's approach might have some advantages in some situations, such as cost to build. It's not worse in every way than subways.

      Especially now that public transportation isn't looking so great?

      8 votes
      1. [3]
        kari
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        That’s fair. My biggest problem with the idea is that things like his car tunnels would be restrictive towards anyone who can’t afford an electric car. Sure, they definitely aren’t worse in every...

        That’s fair. My biggest problem with the idea is that things like his car tunnels would be restrictive towards anyone who can’t afford an electric car. Sure, they definitely aren’t worse in every way but I think that public transport tends to be a better solution than building what amounts to underground toll roads. And sure, public transport is not a great idea during a pandemic but this will end eventually. I dunno ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

        I guess something more fairly related to this post is the fact that if we re-open the country and businesses begin to re-open, then some people will have to go to work and die OR stay home and lose out on unemployment. The whole point of these shelters-in-place is to protect those who can’t weather COVID on their own, and I feel like ending these orders just kicks them to the curb.

        4 votes
        1. [2]
          skybrian
          Link Parent
          The first project they're likely to complete is the Las Vegas convention center loop, which as far as I can tell isn't about having your own car at all. The idea is to have driverless electric...

          The first project they're likely to complete is the Las Vegas convention center loop, which as far as I can tell isn't about having your own car at all. The idea is to have driverless electric cars in the tunnel. It doesn't go very far, though, more like a low-capacity airport shuttle. Maybe if the project goes well, they'll extend it?

          Yeah, if we had UBI I would be somewhat more sympathetic towards letting people make their own choices, which would probably result in wage increases during the pandemic.

          2 votes
          1. kari
            Link Parent
            See, I'm not entirely against that usage of his tunnels and electric cars. The thing I was more against was when, sometime last year, he tweeted about how public transport is awful and instead we...

            See, I'm not entirely against that usage of his tunnels and electric cars. The thing I was more against was when, sometime last year, he tweeted about how public transport is awful and instead we should create underground tunnels that are only for drivers with electric cars.

            As far as this goes, I think he's too focused on trying to basically privatize subways into something that they don't need to be. Something like an airport shuttle seems like an actually good use of the technology, in my opinion.

            2 votes
      2. [2]
        Chobbes
        Link Parent
        I really don't think it's fair to say that public transportation isn't looking so great? Of course there's some disadvantages over having a personal car, and relatively rare situations like a...

        I really don't think it's fair to say that public transportation isn't looking so great? Of course there's some disadvantages over having a personal car, and relatively rare situations like a pandemic can make public transit less than ideal... But it seems like you can have your public transit cake and eat it too? South Korea is much more heavily dependent on public transportation than the US is, and they seem to be doing quite well. Given an appropriate response, public transportation may be a non-issue.

        3 votes
        1. skybrian
          Link Parent
          Yeah, it will probably come back, though perhaps with more mask-wearing like they do in Asia? We're getting a reminder of the advantages of having your own car, though.

          Yeah, it will probably come back, though perhaps with more mask-wearing like they do in Asia? We're getting a reminder of the advantages of having your own car, though.

          1 vote
  2. [4]
    emdash
    Link
    Full transcription of what he said here.

    Full transcription of what he said here.

    5 votes
    1. [3]
      LukeZaz
      Link Parent
      Christ. I've been giving Elon the benefit of the doubt for years now, generally rooting for him, if not strongly. Starlink fucking up astronomy made me wonder, but this seals it. This is...

      Christ. I've been giving Elon the benefit of the doubt for years now, generally rooting for him, if not strongly. Starlink fucking up astronomy made me wonder, but this seals it. This is ridiculous, and even the most charitable interpretation I can come up with for this paints him as ignorant.

      12 votes
      1. [2]
        thundergolfer
        Link Parent
        Ignorance also seems unlikely, given how smart he is. He's more than capable of understanding what's going on, which leads me to think he's deliberately leaning into the right-wing talking points...

        Ignorance also seems unlikely, given how smart he is. He's more than capable of understanding what's going on, which leads me to think he's deliberately leaning into the right-wing talking points because it benefits him.

        5 votes
        1. gpl
          Link Parent
          Elon wants to keep Tesla's numbers up so he gets over $600 million in stock options:

          Elon wants to keep Tesla's numbers up so he gets over $600 million in stock options:

          Six weeks ago, with U.S. stock indices and Tesla shares plunging as the scope of the severity of the COVID-19 pandemic unfolded, the odds Musk would achieve the first tranche of his 12-part $55 billion compensation package looked slim. Yet Forbes now estimates the stock’s 100% rebound from a recent low-point on March 18 has Tesla on track to hit both six-month and 30-day market cap averages of $100 billion in early May. Once that happens, the company’s board would award Musk 1.69 million Tesla shares that, factoring in an exercise price of $350.02 share, would have a net value of at least $600 million. Tesla’s rebound far outpaced the 18% increase in the S&P 500 and GM’s 30% rise since March 18.

          14 votes
  3. [8]
    Turtle
    Link
    Who cares? Why did they even write an article about this? Just because he's rich and successful, it doesn't mean his opinion is relevant or important...

    Who cares? Why did they even write an article about this? Just because he's rich and successful, it doesn't mean his opinion is relevant or important...

    5 votes
    1. [3]
      emdash
      Link Parent
      The great thing about Tildes is you can ignore topics at a very discrete level if you're not interested, or if you "don't care"! Some people do. You can either ignore this particular post, or...

      The great thing about Tildes is you can ignore topics at a very discrete level if you're not interested, or if you "don't care"! Some people do. You can either ignore this particular post, or ignore posts tagged as elon musk completely—there's options available that make comments like this unnecessary.

      10 votes
      1. Turtle
        Link Parent
        I guess what I was trying to say here isn't only that I personally find this uninteresting. I just think that, objectively speaking, this can't be classified as high quality content. There is...

        I guess what I was trying to say here isn't only that I personally find this uninteresting. I just think that, objectively speaking, this can't be classified as high quality content. There is nothing of substance in the article that can't be gleaned from the title. And what does that leave you? [Celebrity] does [dumb shit]. And we have enough of that on Reddit. I would expect (and hope) to receive a similar response if I posted a picture of a Trump tweet, for example.

        5 votes
      2. Algernon_Asimov
        Link Parent
        I was considering writing a comment like @Turtle's. I probably wouldn't have written the comment because I know full well that a dismissive comment is just noise. But I still agree with @Turtle's...

        I was considering writing a comment like @Turtle's. I probably wouldn't have written the comment because I know full well that a dismissive comment is just noise. But I still agree with @Turtle's sentiments.

        I said here just a couple of days ago "We can't be chasing down every single rabbit hole in every single tweet by this man. Focus on what's actually happening, rather than the demented ravings of one deluded old man." I was talking about someone else (guess who?), but that sentiment applies equally to Elon Musk.

        I get why you posted it. But crazy people saying crazy things shouldn't be newsworthy. Crazy people saying crazy things should be ignored, and their crazy rants should not be given any exposure.

        2 votes
    2. BuckeyeSundae
      Link Parent
      It's also not hard to see his self-interest in getting the economy going again for his bottom line.

      It's also not hard to see his self-interest in getting the economy going again for his bottom line.

      9 votes
    3. [3]
      stu2b50
      Link Parent
      Well, it does actually. His opinion is relevant because many people listen to him.

      Well, it does actually. His opinion is relevant because many people listen to him.

      1 vote
      1. [2]
        Turtle
        Link Parent
        Lots of people listen to Trump. That doesn't mean we have to (or should) make a topic every time he tweets something stupid. He tweets a lot of stupid things. Same with Elon. He says a lot of dumb...

        Lots of people listen to Trump. That doesn't mean we have to (or should) make a topic every time he tweets something stupid. He tweets a lot of stupid things. Same with Elon. He says a lot of dumb shit. This isn't newsworthy.

        6 votes
        1. stu2b50
          Link Parent
          That's a great example of why people should care, though. Trump is the kind of giving stupid opinions. And when does a particularly egregious example is the injecting bleach incident -- and people...

          That's a great example of why people should care, though. Trump is the kind of giving stupid opinions. And when does a particularly egregious example is the injecting bleach incident -- and people ACTUALLY ingested and injected disinfectant in response.

          That's why it's a story; because the effects that it has on people is real, and that matters. The fact that Elon, whom many people internet "worship" for whatever reason, said this will cause more people to violate stay-at-home orders.

          3 votes
  4. Kuromantis
    Link
    Damn shame, I remember when he was being a weeb for PR.

    Damn shame, I remember when he was being a weeb for PR.

    2 votes