Watching my female tenant's life come apart - a dilemma
Ive been in the home rental business for 35 years, enough time to see the same scenario before, but it leaves me just as vexed this time as it has before.
The issue is a young couple, about 23 years old, who have been together for a year. She is openly and admittedly 'madly in love' with her boyfriend, going so far as to announce on the initial walk through, that they want the suite because "its so quiet and peaceful and we are going to have a baby here" A bit too much information.
They were fine during the interview, and all their checks were passable - both former landlords I contacted gave them a thumbs up for paying their rent on time and keeping the place clean. Everything was fine except for his credit score which was very poor - but thats not unusual for someone that young who is still learning how to control their finances.
There is another young couple in the lower suite and they met and exchanged pleasantries and seemed to hit it off initially. But one week in, I got the first text from the basement tenants saying that there was yelling and screaming upstairs. I was startled because it seemed unusual compared to the public face they presented. I asked the tenants to inform me if it happened again. Maybe it was just one very bad day I hoped.
It did happen again. The next day at 5 am they were shouting so loudly that I could hear them over the basement tenants phone. I asked the tenants to call the police because it was domestic violence. They were about to call when everything went quiet again and they chose to wait.
There was a lull for a bit and then the third week I got an early morning text again. This time they were not only yelling at each other, they were screaming at another couple, friends supposedly, who were staying with them. There was loud banging and "it sounded like chairs being thrown around"
I told them to call the police, which they did this time but by the time the police arrived everything was calm again. Moments after they left though, everything erupted and the two guys ended up in a fight on the back lawn, Fists went flying and someone got punched although at this point its unclear who punched whom.
The police were called back and according to the account I got, the boyfriend was arrested. He says he wasn't and the police wont give me the report without his permission.
So yesterday I went to talk to them and inspect the house. I cant see any visible damage however it could easily be hidden by the goods piled against the wall, they're still unpacking as they've only been in for a month.
And then my dilemma begins. I KNOW this is a toxic relationship. Ive met this kind of guy before. Smooth talker, good looking, believes he can charm anyone any time. When I told him about the three reports of excessive noise and violence his first reaction was "it won't happen again" and his second was "I will call the other tenants and explain, Im sure we can work this out"
No buddy, no you cant. Because you're an abuser. And you'll do what all abusers do. You'll try to quiet the noise for a time, try to make your girlfriend use a forced whisper instead of an open cry, but it will only be a matter of a week or two and you're going to lose your temper again and we'll be right back where we are now, but probably even worse, because your character has been exposed.
And then I struggle with my place as a landlord but also as a caring human. I LIKE these people. They were charming and fun to get to know. I did extra work for them, getting new appliances in place because she's a specialty cook and loves to be in the kitchen. I made sure everything was 100% because I wanted them to be happy and have a nice place for them and if it happened, their new baby.
But now Im very concerned for her future. She doesnt seem to realize just how deep she is into this toxic mess of a relationship. His comment was 'we fight like most couples' and I abruptly cut him off: "NO! NOT like most couples! Most couples dont wake up the neighbors at 5 am with a screaming match and have a fist fight on the lawn where the cops get called" He looked slightly sheepish for a second and then went right back to his charm defense, saying he would work it out and they just needed 'another chance'.
The reason I think I may want to say more is because of Mercedes. She and her boyfriend rented from me about 10 years ago. It was the same scenario - charming, good looking but very angry boyfriend who lost his temper and went around the house damaging walls and smashing a porcelain sink. He was so rabid I actually brought a friend along to give them their eviction notice because I feared for my safety. That wasnt unjustified and his rage was palpable and extremely scary.
But when he was out of the room I asked Mercedes if she was ok. She said she was nervous, scared, but ok. I said 'I hope you're not going to go with him when he leaves' and she shook her head. The light bulb had come on. "No, the second he's out the door Im out of here. I hope I never see him again." Thank god she was finally seeing things clearly.
I came across her again a year ago online and just sent a friendly hello and if she remembered me and the house. She not only remembered me, she thanked me for helping her escape her hellish relationship. She said she was now in a very good and loving relationship and she couldn't believe how blind she was to even move in with Mr. Toxic in the first place. She said their eviction was a important turning point in her life.
And I see Mercedes in this new tenant. Im just not sure she realizes what she's got herself into. Or else she does and she's not sure how to get out because I cant imagine how violent his reaction would be if she tried to leave.
Which leaves me stuck. They are new to this area. They said they dont have many friends and family is a long way away, so there's no one close who is seeing what the basement tenants and I saw. And we're not sure what to do. The basement tenants are so scared of him they dont even want to be in the same house.
What do you say or not say to someone in this situation? Saying nothing seems irresponsible. Saying too much seems dangerous at least to her safety. So... what do you do? How do I figure out if she even wants help? And if I say something too soon, or too late, he may turn on her and get even more violent...
Domestic abuse situations are tricky. You can easily make things worse. Call a local domestic abuse shelter, ask them for advice on how to deal with the situation.
You had a tenant getting into a fist fight with a guest. Check the local tenant landlord laws and see if you have enough to evict that guy.
Oh we definitely have enough to evict him. Its already in motion.
Awesome!
The best you can do is be open to alternative arrangements that help tide her over if he needs to go. Very often, the financial burden of living on your own stops women from fully separating from an abuser. If you have other places for cheaper or you are able to let her stay on her own for a while for a lower rent, then say so if it comes up. Just don't suggest it out of the blue because she will tell him, and he might convince her to "fake a breakup" to get lower rent.
Abused people, especially abused women, are usually brainwashed to be incredibly loyal to their abuser. This kind of situation rarely happens without her having had less than ideal role models from home as well, and you should just assume that everything you tell her will reach his ears.
As someone that has been both in such a relationship, and supported others while they figured out that they needed to leave, and even supported them while choosing to stay for a while due to circumstances making it even worse if they left (yes, there are so many ways in which it can be better to intentionally stay and pretend like nothing has changed):
You can't make a difference, so don't try as it will only backfire. Make sure that whatever dealings you have with them are in front of both of them so that he can't claim you say this or that to make her feel even more disempowered.
You can make a difference if she seems open to hearing what you have to say. But don't expect to make much of a difference.
Treating her with respect and as if she has dignity is important. Even if you know what he does. People so often treat victims as if they are sorry little creatures, and while it may feel like it helps, it only furthers the abusers behaviours by not treating adults like the adults they are. Not saying to be harsh or mean, just standard respect and politeness.
Get support for your own sake. Seconhand trauma is very, very real. Please do not dismiss it as "it's not happening to me, so my emotional stress isn't important here". Very often, being an onlooker causes more distress in many ways. You are not even the person it is happening to, you are also somewhat powerless to help unless you get invited to do so in some way. The powerlessness is a shortcut to emotional stress, sometimes even traumatic responses.
Keep logging all the events, keep copies of all communication, keep being the no-bullshit older voice. Try to keep communication written when possible, always CC both of their private emails if possible.
You can't really do much unless you are invited to do so. But simply by being rational and no nonsense, you are making an impression. Someone standing up to the smooth talker by saying something as little as. "No, it's not." at the right time without elaborating can mean the world to a victim. This kind of personality makes most people repulsed, and so the only thing a victim sees is often that nobody else really minds what is being said and done. Nobody says anything, everybody goes along with it. Because the only people that feel okay to hang around overtly abusive people will be very okay with such behaviour. A victim will literally only see that "everyone is okay with it, nobody speaks up".
Making a huge fuss only makes you look just as dramatic as the abusive person. So keeping it simple and short is often a small seed on normality that can grow in their minds over time.
While I don't want to victim blame, she could also be a part of what is going on, be it intentionally or unintentionally. Victims often have behaviours that serve to protect them in some way in abusive situations but are actually really weird or wrong for most normal people. You won't neccessarily know just from looking at it from the outside.
Keep focusing on what is important: This behaviour isn't okay, isn't normal, and will eventually be grounds for terminating the lease. You are just the landlord, and your role here is only to be the landlord. A humane and empathetic one maybe, but landlord nonetheless.
Get support. Talk to someone in real life. Don't carry this story alone. This is bringing up experiences from the past, on top of being inherently painful in itself too.
I am sorry you are having to deal with this, but take it from someone that was in a relationship like that for many years: You are dealing with something so different from normal life that easy quick-fixes do not exist, and you are mostly powerless to do much at all except be helpful if you are asked to be.
Many, many great quotes here I gotta remember this for when this comes up in my circles but in particular this resonated with me deeply:
Isolate, normalize, dismiss: huge huge part of the abusers handbook. If the landlord is looking the other way, and the police are being police, and the downstairs neighbors are keeping quiet, then this is "normal", and the warped mentality is that she just gotta suffer through it for love and for the highs of the hoovering phase that will surely follow. I wonder if the original comment of OP's house being in a "quiet neighborhood" was part of the charm because in a busier area more people will notice and she has to manage the fury more carefully.
Heartbreaking. And good call on @GoWestYoungMan taking care of himself as well from the helplessness of second hand abuse.
Think of your other tenants. Life is hard dealing with yelling and screaming. They deserve your concern as a landlord too.
Oh they've definitely been top of mind. We've been in constant communication since they first texted me. And they are indeed some of the nicest people Ive ever rented to. I feel very badly that this has all happened on their watch and Ive already apologized to them - I didnt cause the situation but I feel like I did a bad job in picking the abusive tenant... I only hope they stay and dont get scared off because judging by our last conversation this has stressed them out pretty badly. It just sucks all the way around.
Please work on remining yourself that you didn't do anything wrong by "picking the abuser" as a tenant. This is faulty logic in that he didn't act like that in front of you then, did he.
Fair point. I just feel bad for the other tenants. They're leaving and now we're ALL dealing with the fallout from the abusers actions. I vacillate between wanting to lecture him and kick him in the shins, neither of which Im sure would be effective in this situation.
The other tenants are leaving? And you are kicking out the angry tenant?
Best wishes in a tough situation
The angry tenant has agreed to leave voluntarily. If he doesnt the next option is eviction through the courts which will follow him.
The other tenants are leaving out of fear. Which really sucks. Im going to try and convince them to come back once angry man is gone by giving them two free months rent.
I mean, I would be hard pressed to not let it slip to her that his behaviour isn't like most mens, and that there are way better men out there.
Not that it would be helpful, but I am but a regular human and I would struggle to not say something. It is probably for the best if you don't say too much though.
I hope you have emotional support and feel like you're handling this as best as you can. Feeling competent can help protect against long lasting emotional struggles.
[Redacted rant]
Yikes, I can understand. And as a former renter my hope is that you, my landlord, will communicate with me to promise to get rid of them immediately and act on it in a timely manner. Otherwise I'm going to quietly start looking to leave myself.
Thanks for sharing the additional backstory of Mercedes. Have a chat with the girlfriend on the front lawn when he's not home: tell her the story of Mercedes and everything you wrote here. Tell her you, as a older man who loves his wife and has all your stuff together, your evaluation of what a man is like and what a relationship is like, and give the boyfriend a failing grade. Sometimes battered people need permission from authoritative figures before they can feel like their own opinions and thoughts are valid. She can tell herself "this isn't normal I have to leave" 100 times, and be set back to 0 when she hears one person tell her "well all relationships have bumps" because her self worth is so low.
Sometimes she has to have the plausible deniability of having no choice before that choice becomes safe for her.
He has to go: he's an immediate danger to the girlfriend and your investments and your other tenants, if he couldn't even keep up his game face for a single month.
The next step I have no idea about:
Is it possible to evict the boyfriend and let her stay for a bit while she gets her feet under her? Will she need a restraining order?
I would suggest slipping her the number of a domestic violence crisis hotline.
Dealing with abused women can be very frustrating. The intermittent reinforcement, and the highs from reconciliation are addictive. Skilled abusers work to destroy autonomy and self esteem. They work hard to make the outside world seem scarier than they are
Good for you for caring but she might not be ready to leave yet. Your other tenants deserve peace and safety
Edit. These dynamics are not unique to straight couples, but that doesn't apply here.
It's insane when I hear about stories like this online or from people I know, because to me it feels like people that level this kind of abuse on a partner are almost another species.
I can't fathom the mindset that would allow someone to consistently scream at their partner. I've never yelled at anyone I've been with, and I can't imagine the state of mind that I'd have to be in for that to be the case.
It makes me think about a number of things, like, does everyone have the capacity to be a domestic abuser on some level, and it's just the right triggers in the right times and the right order that brings it out? Or are people who abuse their SOs fundementally different from everyone else? Is it the result of a defective gene, or in upbringing somehow?
How do they view their behavior? Is it something they actively plan out and know is wrong? Do they see themselves as the bad guy, and somehow enjoy that?
Or do they somehow use some sort of rationalization or justification for why it's ok in that case? If so, what are those justifications, and do they apply to everyone, or just them, in their eyes. If they do justify their behavior, is there anything that could make them view it any more objectively so they they stop? Is there such a thing as a former abuser, or is inevitable that they'll just go on to do it again because of that innate defect that I was wondering about earlier? Is the abuse the result of something they perceived their partner has done? Or is this just how relationships work in their eyes? How much of it is conscious versus just running on autopilot?
Kinda boggles my mind when I compare people like that with most of the people I know in relationships, who seem to be attentive, caring, and very concerned with their partners well being.
Hmmmmmmm capacity probably, but likelihood no. I think by the time you're an adult, after many years in a long term relationship, if you're not already doing this you're not gonna turn into someone who does it. What I mean by capacity is, every single person knows that "shaking babies is bad", but when someone is alone, and running on no sleep for weeks or months, and baby is screaming and you've done everything and exhausted every option and there's no end....there's at least a flash that needs to be rationally shut down right? So right triggers + lack of support + inability to self monitor, with emphasis on that last one there, is a capacity in all of us. The likelihood is probably determined by habits and long standing patterns of behaviour.
However, in cases of elder abuse by long term caregivers who used to be loving family members, that capacity (prolonged triggers, no support) is pushed and pushed and pushed all day every day, until a previously not there pattern of behaviour starts to emerge, and is nurtured over a long time where small tiny "venting" actions are not caught/corrected/punished externally or internally, and there continues to be no checks and no reliefs....and then eventually a monster is nurtured to maturity.
Absolutely. There's a pretty scary PSA that aired in Alberta a long while ago, "She spilled my coffee" -- extreme domestic violence trigger warning applies. Anyway the tag line is "You wouldn't get away with it here (in public), you shouldn't get away with it at home." The point is that they absolutely know. That's why it's "domestic" violence, not out in the public violence from one's partner violence.... OP even mentioned that this is a "type": very very charming.
I would....suggest....that they know they have power, and that power is very enjoyable. Out in public, they know what brings them "face" and they know what looks good and what signals success and what exudes charm. In private, there's no one to give them that externalized high from being esteemed, so they switch to a different source of feeling powerful about themselves. This is why they often ask the victims to keep silent: they know the abusive behaviour is not a marker of success in wider society.
Probably lots of different kinds..... "I deserve respect and I wasn't receiving respect" is a common theme, I think. Or "traditions"* or "everyone's like this at home" or "I saw worse growing up and this is me being restrained / kind". By "traditions" I mean inherited garbage mentalities like "when I come home from a hard day of work I expect XYZ" or "other spouses can afford XYZ for their partners but you can't even manage ABC" or "you made me lose face in front of [someone with higher social hierarchy]" kinds of "traditions". There's probably some internalized self hatred and fear of not being respected due to up bringing or not living up to others who seem to command respect, and then when that self image becomes shaky, the internal fear and shame and helplessness transforms externally into anger to vent onto another person, and hitting or yelling and otherwise making another person small/hurt gives them a sense of control and power and strength.
That's for the justice and rehabilitation system to figure out, not for friends or victims. In my opinion "logically" seeing it won't produce meaningful change because abuse is a kind of mental short cut, a habit formed from earliest ways of relating to other people. Abusers probably need to be heavily supervised when in contact with anyone they have any sort of power over, for a long time, until they learn to deal with their own anger/shame and whatever it is going on with them, or they'll easily back slide into this because it probably genuinely feels great to be in control and be free from negative emotions about themselves, albeit briefly. I think people are capable of great change: but this is not so much a cognitive choice, as a "way of relating to oneself and another" that's learned from a young age and put through a lifetime of practice. It'll be tough. Being in some (professional or penal or personal) relationships where they have totally no power over the others might be a good place to start. But charmers are very good at normal relationships among peers / those with power, and old patterns might re-emerge whenever they are again alone with someone with less power.
Really informative reply that answered a lot of my questions, thanks! Do you have a background in dealing with this type of stuff?
Now you have me wondering if there is anyone who used to be an abuser who is truly reformed and feels horrible at his past actions.
I do know supposedly of some one on reddit who was a stalker who reddit convinced that what he was doing was not normal and that he had issues to actually go see a therapist and he did come back later (I can't remember how late, I only saw his last post or two and read backwards) and pretty much say he realized he had some huge issues and he was working with a therapist about it and that reddit was right about everything about him. But that is more stalkerish (but that can end violently too but I think it's not quite the same mindset as an abuser but part of me thinks I may be wrong on that). Also, it's reddit so who knows how valid it was or if he just realized how to say the right things (but he certainly did seem to realize that he had issues and that he needed to just leave the person he was stalking alone and forget her).
If you're interested in understanding the mindset of an abuser better, I highly recommend Why Does He Do That? by Lundy Bancroft. It's not perfect (in particular it's pretty gender-essentialist about it), but it's written by someone who worked with a lot of abusers personally in a rehabilitative setting, so it's got a lot of good insight into how they think and justify their behavior.
I don't have the emotional spoons to help with the main thing.
But arrest records and court records are public in most (all?) states. If you're in the US, you can usually Google (Your County) circuit clerk/circuit court public access and find them. You'd need his name and sometimes birthdate.
Some don't put them online, but most do in my experience so it's worth looking.
I believe he is in Canada
Yeah that's fair, wasn't sure and don't know their public access.
Unfortunately dont think that applies in Canada.
The internet suggests that provincial courts do post this stuff publically, but you'd definitely have to do some searching for your local area and any other governmental levels as needed
Not sure what you saw, but no, I talked to the police directly and they dont give out that info. If he was actually charged AND convicted there might be a publicly available record, but judging from the situation I dont think he got more than a simple ticket. Unfortunately.. Nonetheless Ive talked to them since and made it clear that they either move or be evicted and they are in the process of looking for another place. At this time she sounds like shes on board and wanting to go with him. Not good.
It may take years or decades of poor treatment before she is ready. I hope she learns about the help available to women in her situation. Domestic violence counselors give abused people a space to talk through their situation at their own pace.
What does the girlfriend say about the fighting? Does she think it is normal?