Simply put: Meta's whole business model of using new services to scrape data to (most/all of) their other services breaks with basic EU law. It's precisely a type of model that the GDPR set out to prevent.
To add to this, it's also very clear that Threads isn't really ready to launch, but as a company you can't ignore Twitter shooting itself in the face. The Threads that launched is barebones. I...
To add to this, it's also very clear that Threads isn't really ready to launch, but as a company you can't ignore Twitter shooting itself in the face.
The Threads that launched is barebones. I expect usage to drop to near zero in a week or so, especially now that Twitter reverted it's moronic "must be logged in & limits" rule.
That isn't to say that Threads will be a failure. Twitter is still going down and Threads is positioning itself to pickup the users. But real Threads user adoption (including EU users) will be later in the year once they've added more useful features and figured out how to handle the EU issues.
The time to strike is now, so they striked. Assuming Threads is popular with the US market, the EU market will join when it's available.
Elon hasn't reverted his changes on requiring a twitter account to browse twitter. Only individual tweets can be viewed without an account, and not any of its replies nor any other content of the...
The Threads that launched is barebones. I expect usage to drop to near zero in a week or so, especially now that Twitter reverted it's moronic "must be logged in & limits" rule.
Elon hasn't reverted his changes on requiring a twitter account to browse twitter. Only individual tweets can be viewed without an account, and not any of its replies nor any other content of the account who posted them. Services like nitter are, notably, dead in the water still because of these changes.
You're right. It's difficult to keep track of rapid unhinged changes. Honestly it's going to be a weird couple of months. Twitter is dying, Threads is building. I'd like to say there is...
You're right. It's difficult to keep track of rapid unhinged changes. Honestly it's going to be a weird couple of months. Twitter is dying, Threads is building.
I'd like to say there is opportunity for Mastodon here, maybe a few "big names" will be give up on both and move there, at least for a bit, but probably not.
Mastodon isn't really trying hard to replace Twitter. I was part of the wave leaving Twitter for new shores. I signed up to Mastodon, spend maybe a week, two at most, on there, before giving up on...
Mastodon isn't really trying hard to replace Twitter. I was part of the wave leaving Twitter for new shores. I signed up to Mastodon, spend maybe a week, two at most, on there, before giving up on it. I think a lot of people did. It's just a pain to deal with unless you read the manuals, so to speak. Mastodon was basically 'appointed' as the new twitter alternative by a lot of twitter refugees. They didn't have a lack of new users or sign ups, but most new people who arrived didn't stick around. If Threads doesn't take off and users try Mastodon again most likely the same thing will happen.
So I hear this "read the manuals" or "do your research" argument but I don't get it. You install the app, it says "create a Mastodon.social account", you click the button, create the account, and...
So I hear this "read the manuals" or "do your research" argument but I don't get it.
You install the app, it says "create a Mastodon.social account", you click the button, create the account, and you're in.
Yes I know you might want to pick the "right" server, but they federate with each other. It doesn't really matter which one you pick.
Instead of saying I'm @foobar on Twitter and I'm @foo_bar on Threads, I now say I'm @foobar@mastodon.social on Mastodon. But realistically the second part doesn't matter since if I put in just @foobar on Mastodon I'm going to figure out pretty quickly who I wanted.
I'm aware that technically there are some small subtle things that matter in all this, but if Twitter and Threads users just made all their accounts on mastodon.social it would really just all work out just fine.
Creating my account was easy. But I don't have a twitter just to tweet my own stuff, I mainly follow others. When I joined mastodon I was actively discouraged from joining mastodon.social. from...
Creating my account was easy. But I don't have a twitter just to tweet my own stuff, I mainly follow others.
When I joined mastodon I was actively discouraged from joining mastodon.social. from what I recall it was either completely closed or they were telling people NOT to join it and go to another server instead. So I did. I went to mastodon.world
Only to find out that some of the accounts I used to follow were on world, and some were on social, and others were somewhere else completely. And while it was straightforward to find them on my server, it really wasn't to find them on completely different servers.
Your example, let's just follow everyone on mastodon.social, was exactly what I wanted and hoped for. But the whole point of the fediverse seems to be that it's spread out, so instead there's like 10 different twitters or 10 different threads, some folks are on one and others are on another and nobody is telling you or teaching you how you can follow and connect to everyone you want to see, without needing to have 10 accounts and 10 websites.
So maybe this is an issue that used to exist, but it definitely doesn't now. I created my account on a random network (social.linux.pizza), if I click the search hashtag button and search for...
So maybe this is an issue that used to exist, but it definitely doesn't now.
I created my account on a random network (social.linux.pizza), if I click the search hashtag button and search for "Mark Ruffalo" , I get two results. One that is definitely Mark Ruffalo (@mastodon.social), one that definitely isn't.
Maybe I search "George Takei" instead, I found him @universeodon.com.
Exactly. Just look at all the data Threads collects when you use the app on iOS. It's a privacy disaster.
Simply put: Meta's whole business model of using new services to scrape data to (most/all of) their other services breaks with basic EU law. It's precisely a type of model that the GDPR set out to prevent.
Exactly. Just look at all the data Threads collects when you use the app on iOS. It's a privacy disaster.
I would assume the permissions requested are identical to those already requested from Instagram (and likely Facebook), not that it makes it any less invasive. For comparison's sake, here's what...
I would assume the permissions requested are identical to those already requested from Instagram (and likely Facebook), not that it makes it any less invasive.
For comparison's sake, here's what those permissions look like for Threads vs. Twitter.
That was my assumption too. I am on threads. A huge part of why I am okay using it is because I already use Instagram and Facebook, so a lot of the data Threads would collect on me they probably...
That was my assumption too. I am on threads. A huge part of why I am okay using it is because I already use Instagram and Facebook, so a lot of the data Threads would collect on me they probably already have taken from the other two sources anyway.
I am based in the UK. We have it here. The fact we do is just another example of the impact of Brexit. Not the same level of data protection. The fact most British websites still abide by those...
I am based in the UK. We have it here. The fact we do is just another example of the impact of Brexit. Not the same level of data protection. The fact most British websites still abide by those rules is because they also want to operate in the EU. But apps that can choose not to launch elsewhere really can milk our data pretty easily.
The fact that Threads' launch has been halted in the EU is either telling that Meta is out to gather their users' data or that the EU has unclear rules on how federated social media should operate...
The fact that Threads' launch has been halted in the EU is either telling that Meta is out to gather their users' data or that the EU has unclear rules on how federated social media should operate to be in compliance with the GDPR (intuition suggests the former as being more likely). Either way, I'm glad that until it's clear how they want to operate this app they won't be allowed here.
How is it possible then if it works in the EU if you install the .APK yourself? It's not region locked so as I understand it they still collect the same data for me as they do in the US.
How is it possible then if it works in the EU if you install the .APK yourself? It's not region locked so as I understand it they still collect the same data for me as they do in the US.
Another possible and not unlikely reason is that Meta wants to pressure the EU. Show them the consequences of too harsh regulations. At least, that's what some EU policy people and tech journos think.
Another possible and not unlikely reason is that Meta wants to pressure the EU. Show them the consequences of too harsh regulations. At least, that's what some EU policy people and tech journos think.
If that is the case, then the EU should simply let them. They've said things like "the EU doesn't need facebook" before and it'd be great if they kept their word and showed Meta they aren't...
If that is the case, then the EU should simply let them. They've said things like "the EU doesn't need facebook" before and it'd be great if they kept their word and showed Meta they aren't bluffing. We have too much privacy and data to lose otherwise.
I'm no businessman but only Meta would really be negatively affected, right? There might be some disappointment or pushback by EU residents, but I doubt anybody's going to seriously petition,...
I'm no businessman but only Meta would really be negatively affected, right? There might be some disappointment or pushback by EU residents, but I doubt anybody's going to seriously petition, protest or riot over not being allowed to use Zuckerburg's newest data combine harvester; if they're really desperate they'll just get around it with a VPN anyways. So all that will really happen is a few people will make angry social media posts about it, and Meta will lose out on most of a 450 million person market.
Oh no, people are just going to continue using Twitter in the EU. Sure showed that dastardly EU! 😂 It's far more likely that they had to rush this hard, capitalize on the opportunity Elon Manchild...
Oh no, people are just going to continue using Twitter in the EU. Sure showed that dastardly EU! 😂
It's far more likely that they had to rush this hard, capitalize on the opportunity Elon Manchild afforded them. And in the process couldn't put in the work they needed to fully separate the data from this from the Instagram data as per this regulation. Threads feels like a rehashing/revival of something Instagram tried before, so just reviving the code was probably much faster than building it from scratch, but as a result it shares databases and user accounts and stuff.
I imagine that they have a roadmap which includes many of the things that are being discussed right now that would bring it into feature parity with Twitter: GDPR Compliance Web UI Direct...
I imagine that they have a roadmap which includes many of the things that are being discussed right now that would bring it into feature parity with Twitter:
GDPR Compliance
Web UI
Direct Messaging
Trending Topics
Hashtags
Feed Filtering Capabilities
Deleting your Threads account without your Instagram account
...and they were faced with a decision that they could either launch in 2024 with all those things, or launch right now with a scaled-down, minimum-viable product while Twitter is embroiled in a shitstorm, and then attempt to iterate as rapidly as possible. To me, who works with product development, it's pretty damn impressive that they were able to fly under the radar, dramatically shift scope, and launch an entirely new platform basically overnight as smoothly as they have. It's not without its problems, to be sure, but they haven't had any showstoppers, and have been able to scale up to 30 million users without so much as a burp so far.
My guess is that they are/will be throwing ungodly amounts of development resources towards Threads in the short term and we'll be seeing some of these features sooner rather than later. GDPR compliance is likely going to be high on the list since Zuckerberg has said that he wants to hit 1 billion users before he starts thinking about monetization, and you know that dude is all about the monetization.
Don't forget translations as well! My (dutch) mum is on facebook, and all options and functions on there come translated by default for her. I was happy using reddit as I am bilingual but for some...
Don't forget translations as well! My (dutch) mum is on facebook, and all options and functions on there come translated by default for her. I was happy using reddit as I am bilingual but for some only using English is still a hurdle. Given Threads is currently super bare bones, it's very possible they haven't gotten translations for the full collection of EU languages yet
I'm assuming they'll figure it out. It's not like Facebook or Instagram or Whatsapp isn't usable in the EU. But America is a very desirable market to launch in. It's a single set of (usually...
I'm assuming they'll figure it out. It's not like Facebook or Instagram or Whatsapp isn't usable in the EU. But America is a very desirable market to launch in. It's a single set of (usually lighter) regulations, a common language, a common (ish, well, at least more common than Europe) culture, and very wealthy market. Europe will come, sooner or later.
I highly recommend these two threads/articles from the last week that shed a lot of light on the matter:
https://tildes.net/~tech/17jb/no_instagram_threads_app_in_the_eu_irelands_data_protection_commission_says_metas_new_twitter_rival#comments
https://tildes.net/~tech/17jg/meta_loses_appeal_on_how_it_harvests_data_in_germany
Simply put: Meta's whole business model of using new services to scrape data to (most/all of) their other services breaks with basic EU law. It's precisely a type of model that the GDPR set out to prevent.
To add to this, it's also very clear that Threads isn't really ready to launch, but as a company you can't ignore Twitter shooting itself in the face.
The Threads that launched is barebones. I expect usage to drop to near zero in a week or so, especially now that Twitter reverted it's moronic "must be logged in & limits" rule.
That isn't to say that Threads will be a failure. Twitter is still going down and Threads is positioning itself to pickup the users. But real Threads user adoption (including EU users) will be later in the year once they've added more useful features and figured out how to handle the EU issues.
The time to strike is now, so they striked. Assuming Threads is popular with the US market, the EU market will join when it's available.
Elon hasn't reverted his changes on requiring a twitter account to browse twitter. Only individual tweets can be viewed without an account, and not any of its replies nor any other content of the account who posted them. Services like nitter are, notably, dead in the water still because of these changes.
You're right. It's difficult to keep track of rapid unhinged changes. Honestly it's going to be a weird couple of months. Twitter is dying, Threads is building.
I'd like to say there is opportunity for Mastodon here, maybe a few "big names" will be give up on both and move there, at least for a bit, but probably not.
Mastodon isn't really trying hard to replace Twitter. I was part of the wave leaving Twitter for new shores. I signed up to Mastodon, spend maybe a week, two at most, on there, before giving up on it. I think a lot of people did. It's just a pain to deal with unless you read the manuals, so to speak. Mastodon was basically 'appointed' as the new twitter alternative by a lot of twitter refugees. They didn't have a lack of new users or sign ups, but most new people who arrived didn't stick around. If Threads doesn't take off and users try Mastodon again most likely the same thing will happen.
So I hear this "read the manuals" or "do your research" argument but I don't get it.
You install the app, it says "create a Mastodon.social account", you click the button, create the account, and you're in.
Yes I know you might want to pick the "right" server, but they federate with each other. It doesn't really matter which one you pick.
Instead of saying I'm @foobar on Twitter and I'm @foo_bar on Threads, I now say I'm @foobar@mastodon.social on Mastodon. But realistically the second part doesn't matter since if I put in just @foobar on Mastodon I'm going to figure out pretty quickly who I wanted.
I'm aware that technically there are some small subtle things that matter in all this, but if Twitter and Threads users just made all their accounts on mastodon.social it would really just all work out just fine.
Creating my account was easy. But I don't have a twitter just to tweet my own stuff, I mainly follow others.
When I joined mastodon I was actively discouraged from joining mastodon.social. from what I recall it was either completely closed or they were telling people NOT to join it and go to another server instead. So I did. I went to mastodon.world
Only to find out that some of the accounts I used to follow were on world, and some were on social, and others were somewhere else completely. And while it was straightforward to find them on my server, it really wasn't to find them on completely different servers.
Your example, let's just follow everyone on mastodon.social, was exactly what I wanted and hoped for. But the whole point of the fediverse seems to be that it's spread out, so instead there's like 10 different twitters or 10 different threads, some folks are on one and others are on another and nobody is telling you or teaching you how you can follow and connect to everyone you want to see, without needing to have 10 accounts and 10 websites.
So maybe this is an issue that used to exist, but it definitely doesn't now.
I created my account on a random network (social.linux.pizza), if I click the search hashtag button and search for "Mark Ruffalo" , I get two results. One that is definitely Mark Ruffalo (@mastodon.social), one that definitely isn't.
Maybe I search "George Takei" instead, I found him @universeodon.com.
Different instances really don't matter.
Oh, just tested it and you are right! The accounts I used to be unable to find now show up! Maybe they made an update. Thanks!
Nitter is back up.
Exactly. Just look at all the data Threads collects when you use the app on iOS. It's a privacy disaster.
I would assume the permissions requested are identical to those already requested from Instagram (and likely Facebook), not that it makes it any less invasive.
For comparison's sake, here's what those permissions look like for Threads vs. Twitter.
That was my assumption too. I am on threads. A huge part of why I am okay using it is because I already use Instagram and Facebook, so a lot of the data Threads would collect on me they probably already have taken from the other two sources anyway.
Yikes. I was going to download it to check it out but there is just no reason it needs all of that; that's a hard no from me.
Fuck that, all that just to shitpost?
I am based in the UK. We have it here. The fact we do is just another example of the impact of Brexit. Not the same level of data protection. The fact most British websites still abide by those rules is because they also want to operate in the EU. But apps that can choose not to launch elsewhere really can milk our data pretty easily.
The fact that Threads' launch has been halted in the EU is either telling that Meta is out to gather their users' data or that the EU has unclear rules on how federated social media should operate to be in compliance with the GDPR (intuition suggests the former as being more likely). Either way, I'm glad that until it's clear how they want to operate this app they won't be allowed here.
How is it possible then if it works in the EU if you install the .APK yourself? It's not region locked so as I understand it they still collect the same data for me as they do in the US.
It's likely just halted on the app/play store in the EU instead of any active blocking on the application itself.
Another possible and not unlikely reason is that Meta wants to pressure the EU. Show them the consequences of too harsh regulations. At least, that's what some EU policy people and tech journos think.
If that is the case, then the EU should simply let them. They've said things like "the EU doesn't need facebook" before and it'd be great if they kept their word and showed Meta they aren't bluffing. We have too much privacy and data to lose otherwise.
I'm no businessman but only Meta would really be negatively affected, right? There might be some disappointment or pushback by EU residents, but I doubt anybody's going to seriously petition, protest or riot over not being allowed to use Zuckerburg's newest data combine harvester; if they're really desperate they'll just get around it with a VPN anyways. So all that will really happen is a few people will make angry social media posts about it, and Meta will lose out on most of a 450 million person market.
Oh no, people are just going to continue using Twitter in the EU. Sure showed that dastardly EU! 😂
It's far more likely that they had to rush this hard, capitalize on the opportunity Elon Manchild afforded them. And in the process couldn't put in the work they needed to fully separate the data from this from the Instagram data as per this regulation. Threads feels like a rehashing/revival of something Instagram tried before, so just reviving the code was probably much faster than building it from scratch, but as a result it shares databases and user accounts and stuff.
I imagine that they have a roadmap which includes many of the things that are being discussed right now that would bring it into feature parity with Twitter:
...and they were faced with a decision that they could either launch in 2024 with all those things, or launch right now with a scaled-down, minimum-viable product while Twitter is embroiled in a shitstorm, and then attempt to iterate as rapidly as possible. To me, who works with product development, it's pretty damn impressive that they were able to fly under the radar, dramatically shift scope, and launch an entirely new platform basically overnight as smoothly as they have. It's not without its problems, to be sure, but they haven't had any showstoppers, and have been able to scale up to 30 million users without so much as a burp so far.
My guess is that they are/will be throwing ungodly amounts of development resources towards Threads in the short term and we'll be seeing some of these features sooner rather than later. GDPR compliance is likely going to be high on the list since Zuckerberg has said that he wants to hit 1 billion users before he starts thinking about monetization, and you know that dude is all about the monetization.
Don't forget translations as well! My (dutch) mum is on facebook, and all options and functions on there come translated by default for her. I was happy using reddit as I am bilingual but for some only using English is still a hurdle. Given Threads is currently super bare bones, it's very possible they haven't gotten translations for the full collection of EU languages yet
I'm assuming they'll figure it out. It's not like Facebook or Instagram or Whatsapp isn't usable in the EU. But America is a very desirable market to launch in. It's a single set of (usually lighter) regulations, a common language, a common (ish, well, at least more common than Europe) culture, and very wealthy market. Europe will come, sooner or later.