A bit surprised (and glad) to see this. Those thunderbolt ports being modular and easy to replace is huge though. Those ports and/or USB-C ports have historically (at least in my experience...
A bit surprised (and glad) to see this. Those thunderbolt ports being modular and easy to replace is huge though. Those ports and/or USB-C ports have historically (at least in my experience supporting them) been a common failure point through wear and tear in an office environment, that used to require entire motherboard replacement.
I'm a bit skeptical/cynical, despite the Lenovo reps' comments which were a bit over-the-top and almost sounded written by a marketing team or something, whether the company really cares about this, but I'm glad it's happening regardless, that least some people care inside Lenovo, and that iFixit has found the right way to communicate with companies to get them on board with these kinds of changes. I don't want to punish a good deed by being overly negative, but it's one of these things that I have a sinking feeling won't last. But they could very well prove me wrong, and maybe iFixit's influence will help them do so.
Thinkpads being extremely repairable is unambiguously a good thing, especially since they often do make for good Linux machines
I’ve actually somehow never broken a USB-C port. I’m not entirely sure how. I suppose it is because up until about 5 years ago it was because nothing I owned actually used it outside of my phone...
I’ve actually somehow never broken a USB-C port. I’m not entirely sure how. I suppose it is because up until about 5 years ago it was because nothing I owned actually used it outside of my phone at the time (and seriously - it was so shitty that it took so long for manufacturers to adopt it). It wasn’t until I got my M1 MacBook Air that I actually needed to use it regularly because it was the only way to charge it, and even then the battery life was so good I didn’t need to do it so often.
Offtopic, just sharing it as good news: probably thanks to the spread of right to repair laws relatively easily repairable USB-C ports are already available. I don't know of any devices that use...
Those ports and/or USB-C ports have historically (at least in my experience supporting them) been a common failure point through wear and tear in an office environment, that used to require entire motherboard replacement.
Offtopic, just sharing it as good news: probably thanks to the spread of right to repair laws relatively easily repairable USB-C ports are already available. I don't know of any devices that use them yet (haven't really looked though) and they're kind of expensive for now, but both is likely to change soon since adoption of similar stuff will likely be mandatory. So in time this too will hopefully be a thing of the past.
Wow. Looks like my Framework. This was completely off my radar until now. I always liked Thinkpads -- I actually still have a 14-year-old one, gamely plugging away, 24/7, as a spare local server....
Wow. Looks like my Framework. This was completely off my radar until now.
I always liked Thinkpads -- I actually still have a 14-year-old one, gamely plugging away, 24/7, as a spare local server. But I've always thought of them as "regular" laptops ... meaning, fuggedabout repair/upgrade.
Gonna have to dig into this some more.
Wouldn't it be glorious if Lenovo and Framework (and anyone else out there, working on this angle) started to develop compatibility? Framework parts in your Lenovo laptop, and vice versa? ... dare to dream.
I have one from 2010 or so, and after a screen and battery replacement a few years ago, it's as good as new. Obviously the batter was easy, but the screen was as well. First time replacing a...
I have one from 2010 or so, and after a screen and battery replacement a few years ago, it's as good as new. Obviously the batter was easy, but the screen was as well. First time replacing a laptop screen and I was underslept and a little intoxicated at the time.
I hate to be that guy, but Lenovo and iFixit have a partnership, so a 10/10 review by iFixit is a little like grading your own homework and/or biased towards driving sales to their partnership....
I hate to be that guy, but Lenovo and iFixit have a partnership, so a 10/10 review by iFixit is a little like grading your own homework and/or biased towards driving sales to their partnership.
Not to diminish the benefits to repairability. As a ThinkPad owner whose trackpad needs replacing, this is a welcome alternative to my current strategy of just dealing with it.
That being said, as a daily driver of a Framework laptop, the repairability is only one aspect. I would prefer to see upgradability as well, particularly in this era of RAM/Storage/GPU scarcity. I may only have an opportunity to upgrade one component at a time and I would hope that as ThinkPads become more modularized the ability to upgrade becomes part of their business strategy.
I mean, sure, it's a partnership, but that partnership seems to wholly consist of iFixit providing consulting about assessing and assisting with ideas for repairability and similar features. If...
I mean, sure, it's a partnership, but that partnership seems to wholly consist of iFixit providing consulting about assessing and assisting with ideas for repairability and similar features.
If the partnership has a commission aspect or in some way pays iFixit per sale, then I feel like the criticism would hold more strongly. Or, if said partnership was exclusive and means they'd never partner with anyone else. Is there any evidence this is anything more than iFixit simply providing repairability consultation? If not, I don't get the "driving sales" angle- though I could say that's a good idea too, because the more people that buy repairable products, the more Lenovo might be inclined to keep it going forward
If a partnership is what it takes to get manufacturers on board then I don't see it as a negative that iFixit has found a way to work with companies that they're receptive to
I will concede that it could still have some effect of questionable significance on their ability to score it objectively, but I doubt it goes any deeper than that. And that's coming from me, who typically defaults to the cynical take (and I am still cynical about Lenovo's commitment to the idea)
Upgradability would be nice, though I think getting Lenovo even to this point was probably a struggle. While some parts will be upgradable (less focus on soldered RAM, SSDs, or other modules which is great), getting them to Framework level is probably an uphill battle. I don't envision a world where you can buy a new generation of motherboard and CPU and pop it in your Thinkpad chassis as much as I would love that
I also felt this was a little suspicious. They're talking about LPCAMM2 RAM as a huge benefit. As I understand it, it's currently only made by Micron, and currently only used by Lenovo. When I...
I also felt this was a little suspicious. They're talking about LPCAMM2 RAM as a huge benefit. As I understand it, it's currently only made by Micron, and currently only used by Lenovo.
When I looked it up, the fourth search result is this video, made by iFixit, sponsored by Micron and Lenovo.
I mean, I guess it's a cool new form factor for ultra slim laptops that's not soldered... But as far as I know Thinkpad T/P series has never had soldered RAM. Neither have HP Elitebook/Zbook, or Dell Latitude/Precision. Professional grade laptops have always been super repairable. In fact, I recall Elitebooks from the 8000 series until the 800 G1 series had sliding, spring loaded latches to open them literally toollessly. You could upgrade RAM with literally nothing but your bare hands and a stick of RAM.
They're bragging about an M.2 slot. This is completely bog standard on anything that's not an ultrabook/mac. Every professional laptop will have one. Am I out of touch here? Has something changed very recently? I thought only ultra-slim or Apple laptops typically have soldered SSDs.
And then, if you're bragging about eliminating "bulky" SODIMMs for this new proprietary RAM format, why are you also bragging about using M.2 slots that are roughly the same physical height?
I dunno, maybe I'm a cynical old man (I am) but something about this partnership and this review doesn't pass the sniff test.
I'm also not influenced by the fact that my current daily driver is a specced out Thinkpad P15 Gen2 that has had to be sent in for warranty 4 times now and has huge unsolved problems with nearly every linux distro. I'm still willing to believe I'm an outlier and that Thinkpads are really the best at linux support and I've just been incredibly unlucky.
I've got a similar Lenovo device that I had to send in for warranty repair and two of the things highlighted in this iFixit post are actually significant for the issues I faced. My system needed...
I've got a similar Lenovo device that I had to send in for warranty repair and two of the things highlighted in this iFixit post are actually significant for the issues I faced.
A modular cooling system, with an independently replaceable fan
Fully modular Thunderbolt ports
My system needed the motherboard replaced to repair a USB port, and needed a heatsink and fan combination replaced to fix a faulty fan. And my system is nearly out of warranty, and the issue with the fan concerns me because the fan cannot be replaced independent of the heatsink, at least not easily anyhow. For $90 they sell the heatsink and fan together as one piece. That's not really a good price in my opinion when the issue is just a bad bearing in the fan and I highly suspect it's fairly common for those fans to fail considering their design. It's also more of a hassle to repair than it should be. Replacing a fan should easier than that. Replacing a motherboard for USB ports is way more common so I wasn't surprised by that, but for an out of warranty situation I would be quite disappointed if I was in that situation. It probably wouldn't even be worth repairing at that point for what they charge for a new motherboard. $1300 for a new motherboard, that's almost twice what I paid for this.
Awesome to see and I'm excited to own one in a couple of years when they're fully depreciated and sold off by the businesses buying them now. I'm a sucker for Thinkpads. I've owned more than half...
Awesome to see and I'm excited to own one in a couple of years when they're fully depreciated and sold off by the businesses buying them now.
I'm a sucker for Thinkpads. I've owned more than half a dozen now in 10 years or so and currently own two, I look forward to many more.
I applause them! It's great seeing at least someone doing at least one of their line up made to be completely and easily serviceable. Maybe the future will not be as dark as I thought.
I applause them! It's great seeing at least someone doing at least one of their line up made to be completely and easily serviceable. Maybe the future will not be as dark as I thought.
Just in time for Windows to become an AI Slop Nightmare. Somehow I doubt IT's going to let me install Linux. I wonder if I can convince them to let me get a MacBook Neo... nah, probably now. We're...
Just in time for Windows to become an AI Slop Nightmare. Somehow I doubt IT's going to let me install Linux. I wonder if I can convince them to let me get a MacBook Neo... nah, probably now. We're probably on The Good Ship Microslop until it vanishes beneath the waves.
I've actually had very good luck if you can demonstrate: You will be more productive You will not be a malware vector You don't need desktop support This will probably not apply in places where...
I've actually had very good luck if you can demonstrate:
You will be more productive
You will not be a malware vector
You don't need desktop support
This will probably not apply in places where consequences of data leaks are severe.
Yes. I mention the MacBook Neo in the comment. I’m sure it’s been tagged as noise by now. Edit: looking at it again, no this was a comment about the Lenovo, but I brought up the MacBook as well.
Yes. I mention the MacBook Neo in the comment. I’m sure it’s been tagged as noise by now.
Edit: looking at it again, no this was a comment about the Lenovo, but I brought up the MacBook as well.
A bit surprised (and glad) to see this. Those thunderbolt ports being modular and easy to replace is huge though. Those ports and/or USB-C ports have historically (at least in my experience supporting them) been a common failure point through wear and tear in an office environment, that used to require entire motherboard replacement.
I'm a bit skeptical/cynical, despite the Lenovo reps' comments which were a bit over-the-top and almost sounded written by a marketing team or something, whether the company really cares about this, but I'm glad it's happening regardless, that least some people care inside Lenovo, and that iFixit has found the right way to communicate with companies to get them on board with these kinds of changes. I don't want to punish a good deed by being overly negative, but it's one of these things that I have a sinking feeling won't last. But they could very well prove me wrong, and maybe iFixit's influence will help them do so.
Thinkpads being extremely repairable is unambiguously a good thing, especially since they often do make for good Linux machines
I’ve actually somehow never broken a USB-C port. I’m not entirely sure how. I suppose it is because up until about 5 years ago it was because nothing I owned actually used it outside of my phone at the time (and seriously - it was so shitty that it took so long for manufacturers to adopt it). It wasn’t until I got my M1 MacBook Air that I actually needed to use it regularly because it was the only way to charge it, and even then the battery life was so good I didn’t need to do it so often.
Offtopic, just sharing it as good news: probably thanks to the spread of right to repair laws relatively easily repairable USB-C ports are already available. I don't know of any devices that use them yet (haven't really looked though) and they're kind of expensive for now, but both is likely to change soon since adoption of similar stuff will likely be mandatory. So in time this too will hopefully be a thing of the past.
Wow. Looks like my Framework. This was completely off my radar until now.
I always liked Thinkpads -- I actually still have a 14-year-old one, gamely plugging away, 24/7, as a spare local server. But I've always thought of them as "regular" laptops ... meaning, fuggedabout repair/upgrade.
Gonna have to dig into this some more.
Wouldn't it be glorious if Lenovo and Framework (and anyone else out there, working on this angle) started to develop compatibility? Framework parts in your Lenovo laptop, and vice versa? ... dare to dream.
I have one from 2010 or so, and after a screen and battery replacement a few years ago, it's as good as new. Obviously the batter was easy, but the screen was as well. First time replacing a laptop screen and I was underslept and a little intoxicated at the time.
I hate to be that guy, but Lenovo and iFixit have a partnership, so a 10/10 review by iFixit is a little like grading your own homework and/or biased towards driving sales to their partnership.
Not to diminish the benefits to repairability. As a ThinkPad owner whose trackpad needs replacing, this is a welcome alternative to my current strategy of just dealing with it.
That being said, as a daily driver of a Framework laptop, the repairability is only one aspect. I would prefer to see upgradability as well, particularly in this era of RAM/Storage/GPU scarcity. I may only have an opportunity to upgrade one component at a time and I would hope that as ThinkPads become more modularized the ability to upgrade becomes part of their business strategy.
I mean, sure, it's a partnership, but that partnership seems to wholly consist of iFixit providing consulting about assessing and assisting with ideas for repairability and similar features.
If the partnership has a commission aspect or in some way pays iFixit per sale, then I feel like the criticism would hold more strongly. Or, if said partnership was exclusive and means they'd never partner with anyone else. Is there any evidence this is anything more than iFixit simply providing repairability consultation? If not, I don't get the "driving sales" angle- though I could say that's a good idea too, because the more people that buy repairable products, the more Lenovo might be inclined to keep it going forward
If a partnership is what it takes to get manufacturers on board then I don't see it as a negative that iFixit has found a way to work with companies that they're receptive to
I will concede that it could still have some effect of questionable significance on their ability to score it objectively, but I doubt it goes any deeper than that. And that's coming from me, who typically defaults to the cynical take (and I am still cynical about Lenovo's commitment to the idea)
Upgradability would be nice, though I think getting Lenovo even to this point was probably a struggle. While some parts will be upgradable (less focus on soldered RAM, SSDs, or other modules which is great), getting them to Framework level is probably an uphill battle. I don't envision a world where you can buy a new generation of motherboard and CPU and pop it in your Thinkpad chassis as much as I would love that
I also felt this was a little suspicious. They're talking about LPCAMM2 RAM as a huge benefit. As I understand it, it's currently only made by Micron, and currently only used by Lenovo.
When I looked it up, the fourth search result is this video, made by iFixit, sponsored by Micron and Lenovo.
I mean, I guess it's a cool new form factor for ultra slim laptops that's not soldered... But as far as I know Thinkpad T/P series has never had soldered RAM. Neither have HP Elitebook/Zbook, or Dell Latitude/Precision. Professional grade laptops have always been super repairable. In fact, I recall Elitebooks from the 8000 series until the 800 G1 series had sliding, spring loaded latches to open them literally toollessly. You could upgrade RAM with literally nothing but your bare hands and a stick of RAM.
They're bragging about an M.2 slot. This is completely bog standard on anything that's not an ultrabook/mac. Every professional laptop will have one. Am I out of touch here? Has something changed very recently? I thought only ultra-slim or Apple laptops typically have soldered SSDs.
And then, if you're bragging about eliminating "bulky" SODIMMs for this new proprietary RAM format, why are you also bragging about using M.2 slots that are roughly the same physical height?
I dunno, maybe I'm a cynical old man (I am) but something about this partnership and this review doesn't pass the sniff test.
I'm also not influenced by the fact that my current daily driver is a specced out Thinkpad P15 Gen2 that has had to be sent in for warranty 4 times now and has huge unsolved problems with nearly every linux distro. I'm still willing to believe I'm an outlier and that Thinkpads are really the best at linux support and I've just been incredibly unlucky.
I've got a similar Lenovo device that I had to send in for warranty repair and two of the things highlighted in this iFixit post are actually significant for the issues I faced.
My system needed the motherboard replaced to repair a USB port, and needed a heatsink and fan combination replaced to fix a faulty fan. And my system is nearly out of warranty, and the issue with the fan concerns me because the fan cannot be replaced independent of the heatsink, at least not easily anyhow. For $90 they sell the heatsink and fan together as one piece. That's not really a good price in my opinion when the issue is just a bad bearing in the fan and I highly suspect it's fairly common for those fans to fail considering their design. It's also more of a hassle to repair than it should be. Replacing a fan should easier than that. Replacing a motherboard for USB ports is way more common so I wasn't surprised by that, but for an out of warranty situation I would be quite disappointed if I was in that situation. It probably wouldn't even be worth repairing at that point for what they charge for a new motherboard. $1300 for a new motherboard, that's almost twice what I paid for this.
Awesome to see and I'm excited to own one in a couple of years when they're fully depreciated and sold off by the businesses buying them now.
I'm a sucker for Thinkpads. I've owned more than half a dozen now in 10 years or so and currently own two, I look forward to many more.
I applause them! It's great seeing at least someone doing at least one of their line up made to be completely and easily serviceable. Maybe the future will not be as dark as I thought.
Been casually looking for a replacement to my M1 MacBook Pro for a bit now, was leaning towards Framework but this is a bit more appealing!
Just in time for Windows to become an AI Slop Nightmare. Somehow I doubt IT's going to let me install Linux. I wonder if I can convince them to let me get a MacBook Neo... nah, probably now. We're probably on The Good Ship Microslop until it vanishes beneath the waves.
But think of the respect you could earn by quitting your job over the IT department’s choice of OS.
True… but respect doesn’t feed my cat, unfortunately.
I've actually had very good luck if you can demonstrate:
This will probably not apply in places where consequences of data leaks are severe.
Might be worth attempting.
I've had coworkers have similiar luck with Mac, which tends to conform at least a little to the various spyware needs of an enterprise.
I'm confused, was this supposed to be a comment on the Macbook Neo announcement?
Yes. I mention the MacBook Neo in the comment. I’m sure it’s been tagged as noise by now.
Edit: looking at it again, no this was a comment about the Lenovo, but I brought up the MacBook as well.