Accent diversity is fascinating
I committed an embarrassing gaffe today. I had ordered a keyboard online from a store from the Tyneside of north-eastern England: an area with a regional accent and dialect often referred to as ‘Geordie’. I habitually speak in a ‘home counties’ accent, which is sometimes regarded as a contemporary variety of received pronunciation (RP), though it sounds quite different to historical and conservative varieties of that accent. A salesman called me earlier to inform me that the keyboard I wanted was out of stock, but that they would be happy to refund me if I didn’t want to wait for new inventory. Seemingly between the accent difference and the poor audio quality inherent to phone calls I misinterpreted ‘keyboard’ as ‘cable’, insisting with increasing urgency that I have USB-C cables in plenty and that they needn’t worry about supplying one with the order. We both went about in circles for a few minutes until it dawned on me what I was doing, at which point intense embarrassment flushed over me. Oops!
Accent diversity in Britain is rich and regional. It's not hard to place where someone grew up based on their accent. Would you consider your country to be diverse in accents? Even so, are there instances of accent discrimination?
Oh boy, a chance to show off my favorite map! This is a map of all North American English Dialects, Based on Pronunciation Patterns, with links to audio or video clips of those accents. It's ludicrously complex and well documented, though the map is almost overwhelming in its complexity.
Holy data! Wow...immediately saving this. Thanks so much for posting it.
Wow, that's a fantastic resource. Sadly, I found quite a few dead links in the video section, but I'm definitely going to be spending more time with this.
Yeah, it was last maintained 5 years ago, and link rot is a sad reality of the current world.
Ludicrously complex indeed.
I think the Canadian details need to be flushed out.
As a Vancouverite, I would say that Ontarians sound distinctly different, and that even between southwestern Ontario (i.e. Thunderbay) and Torontonians there are characteristic differences.
I feel like Edmontonians have the most neutral Canadian English.
I live right by where there’s a red line between the north and the inland north, near Appleton. I definitely feel like the accent changes slightly when you head toward Green Bay.
This is so intricate - thank you!
I recently watched a comedy bit by Fred Armisen (linked below) where he highlights various accents within the US and it's amazing just how many accents there are in this country. Absolutely fascinating how it changes and merges with other accents as you move around the country.
https://youtu.be/G72tZdjnS2A
That's a great bit. Another (less comedic but no less interesting) take on the topic is this video:
https://youtu.be/H1KP4ztKK0A
It is truly fascinating to learn about how various dialects have changed and migrated over the relatively short history of the country.
I'm thrilled this resonated with you! I am fascinated by accents, dialects, etymologies, and all sorts of linguistic history. This is one of my favorite, if not my favorite, videos on the topic. As you say, it's very satisfying to watch and also informative and rich.
I hope you enjoy the second half as much as the first!
Yeah, he does a really good job. His videos are one of the things that helped get me interested in accents and pronunciation.
Lately I've been interested in the differences between modern English and older versions like from Shakespeare's time. This is one of my favorite videos on that. The link starts around 2:20. Around 4:50, they talk about an interesting pun on loins/lines in Romeo and Juliet.
Etymology is fascinating too, and helpful if you're learning a language or just want to expand your vocabulary.
My MIL from south Texas says “warsh” instead of “wash” and it drives me nuts. My wife didn’t carry that on but she did manage to hang on to “nekkid”.
It's pronounced "nekkid," and I refuse to accept anything else!
That was glorious to watch, thank you!
That was fantastic! I love how he can switch accents gradually as his pointer moves up and down the state.
I find it fascinating how different the dialects can be. Even just how many words there are for an apple core or the end piece of bread.
Yeah, absolutely. Schwäbisch sounds nice to me. Something about the rhythm and the diminutives. Like this.
Austrian is pretty. Round and lilting. Swiss German is the hardest for me to understand, but it's starting to grow on me as I understand it better. Or even how this guy talks, I find it charming. (Is that Fränkisch?)
I wanted to write how "die Abschnitt" is a really interesting gender, but I don't want to get too far off topic. I could talk about this kind of thing all day. Atlas der Alltagssprache is a fantastic resource and a huge time sink for the nerdy :)
What dialects stand out to you when you think about prejudices or stereotypes? Are there any that sound more....uneducated to you, or more sophisticated?
US here as well. I lived alllll over this country (had a family that moved a lot and then I kept traveling on my own) and I have gotten to experience so many unique micro-regional accents. Some of my favorites reside in the deep south but also New England has some amazingly ye olde style accents you can experience as well.
Though top of the list is probably the Gullah, though technically I suppose it's a whole other language. They live in the lowcountry portion of Georgia, the Carolinas and Florida and it's quite the accent. Maintains some traits dating back to their African heritage. Here's a video of someone speaking Gullah.
The US has an amazing diversity of accents and languages spoken.
Thanks for sharing this, dgtlanarchist!
I haven't yet appreciated the breadth of accents in the United States - I wonder why that is, given how much US-origin media we consume over on this side of the pond.
I recall hearing about the Gullah due to a biographical article about Clarence Thomas appearing in a newspaper here. That's so fascinating! I wonder how threatened the Gullah language is. Do you know whether many Gullah people speak the language or indeed consider there to be a separate language? (And more broadly - I'm completely ignorant - what makes something a creole rather than a dialect?)
A creole is when two languages combine and eventually turn into a new language. The new language starts out simple and gets more complex over time. It's similar to the original languages, but has its own vocabulary, pronunciation, and grammar.
An example would be Haitian Creole. The African languages spoken by the slaves mixed with French. A lot of the words come from French, but the grammar is different. For example, words don't have a plural form. So you wouldn't say "shoe" and "shoes." There's just one word for both.
A dialect is a version of a language that's spoken in a certain area. The pronunciation is often different, but the vocabulary and grammar are pretty much the same. Some words can be different (soda, pop, coke). And sometimes the grammar can be a little different. For example, "it needs to be washed." In Scottish English, it's OK to say "it needs washed." That wouldn't be considered a mistake. Some places in the U.S. talk like that too, and it likely came from Scottish or Irish immigrants.
Ahhhhh linguistics. The line between things is always murky and disputed. But as far as I'm aware it is in fact a creole that at least in name finds it's roots in the KiKongo language (Congo). It's an English creole with African loanwords and multiple African linguistic structural contributions.
As for your question about creole vs dialect my understanding (limited admittedly) is that a creole is the result of two or more languages mixing to become a pidgin that then becomes a creole once it is passed down. A dialect is more a style (pronunciation, spelling, etc) characteristic to an area.
A lovely little Kiwi accent joke:
Q: "What's a Hindu?"
A: "Lays eggs!"
What's funny about a shed?
Oddly enough, even a small place like New Zealand has (a very subtle) accent diversity.
Moving up to the North Island, I've had more than one person ask which part of the UK I was from.
I think people here won't be as offended by the language, as more by the trivial nature of the link.
(This really isn't the place for funny memes and jokes.)
But I figured as a second level comment, it's probably OK.
Plus I added something separately substantive to the discussion.
So hopefully no one tags it as noise. My other link however...
I'm very proud of my deck
That clip is fantastic. Always makes me laugh.
Much the same as yourself in England, you don't have to go far here in Scotland to hear regional differences in accent. I'm in Central Scotland so have a kind of in-between Edinburgh and Glasgow accent.
Then you've got the Fifer/Dundonian accent, the Aberdonian, the Southern Scottish and only god truly knows what they're saying in Inverness and further north, like something out of a Lovecraft novel!
I grew up in the south and feel that a southern accent marks someone with minimal education. Obviously you can find idiots anywhere but the use of the southern accent to mark someone as backwoods or redneck is a common thing in media.
Southerner here too. I'm a little embarrassed by admitting this, but I worked pretty hard to eliminate my accent for just this reason. It's frustrating that the southern accent is shorthand for ignorance in modern culture. There are plenty of ignorant people everywhere!
A lot of us end up having to do this, it is hard to be taken seriously with a strong southern accent due to the biases people have.
Unfortunately there is a heavy association with poor education and having a thick southern accent- and it is in many cases well earned, even growing up in the South and having had somewhat of an accent myself I still catch myself stereotyping when I hear a strong southern drawl.
I have also had to work as well to neutralize my native accent in adulthood for this reason.
Yeah. By the same token, I have met people who sound like they crawled out of the backwoods but were so so sharp and knowledgeable.
Denmark here and there is - compared to places like England - very little difference in regional accents. Except for two regions.
People from the island of Bornholm have a really strong accent and almost every other Danish person have a hard time understanding though! The language is still Danish of course but it sounds like some weird bastardisation of Danish and Swedish put together.
The second place is Southern Jutland and I'm not sure how to describe that accent. I guess it sounds kind of German? Or almost more like drunken singing than spoken words because it's so quick. Some words become a single vowel sound so it becomes really hard to understand for someone not from there!
Edit: just watched a video about the second one and it's apparently derived from Low German and Frisian
Another Dane here - You are right about Bornholm and Southern Jutland having the heaviest dialects but I think Danish dialects are quite diverse in general. Not to the point where we can't understand each other but definitely very different and distinct pronunciation from area to area. Coming from Funen, I find it interesting that you can actually hear which part of Funen people are from, by their dialect, even on such a small island; a popular test is to ask the person from Funen to say the words "bucket of water" (spand vand), and from their pronunciation you can quite easily hear if they're from the north, south east or west of the island. I'll see if I can find a video or sound clip documenting this.
Edit: to delete a repetition. Also I haven't been able to find a recording of the various pronunciations "spand vand" on Funen yet but I'm not done looking. I will report back!
I actually moved to Odense from Copenhagen a year ago! I did not know this about dialects on Funen (Funenish dialects? Funic? Funish?). I only really notice it when things like "og" become an "å" sound lol
I will look back to see if you find something, this is very interesting!
Welcome to Odense!
I still haven't found a recording of the dialects, but I'll post it when I find it! I remember northwest pronounced it "spaaand vaaand" and southeast (and Langeland) being something like"spåj våj"
I'm an American who has been learning Danish for years and it really is staggering how different the speech is of someone from Bornholm or South Jutland and the "standard" capital region dialect, I was surprised to learn that such a small country has such variation internally.
I have found even Norwegian to be more intelligible to me than my South-Jutlandic father in law's Danish.
My parents met in the RAF so I have a couple of accent quirks I've picked up, probably mostly from the Geordie side as my dad's accent is now very neutral, especially compared to his family members who stayed in his home city way over in the East Midlands. At one point when I was very young we lived on a base abroad which also had American families, I didn't realise understand the concept of regional accents until we moved back to England when I was about 6, I just thought it was part of everybody having their own sounding voice and was very surprised when a school friend asked me why my parents sounded so different to each other and if they were from a different country! We ended up in Wiltshire when we moved back so quite a distance from the origins of my parents accents, I'm pretty sure my mum was the only Geordie in a 15 mile radius so looking back I can see why she was so foreign sounding but at the time I was baffled.
30 years later I have the skilled local ear which allows me to tell exactly which nearby town someone is from, and definitely if they're from over the border to a different county, but it works the other way too - people who were truly born and bred here can tell that something is a bit off with my accent so I've been asked "where did you live before you moved here" or "so where are your parents from" quite a few times over the years! It's funny though, because I don't know what it is that they're picking up on, but I also can't definitively say how I can tell the difference between Town A and Town B's accents, I just kind of...feel it? I wouldn't say it's caused any sort of identity crisis, but I do wonder if I'll ever be able to truly blend in or if these unquantifiable differences will forever follow me.
I've had a similar issue recently. I was born in California but my dad is English, specifically from Birmingham with it's own "special" variety of accent, so I sometime pronounce things weird. I called a local brewery asking to order a "keg", an item I thought would be very straight forward to order, and they said "oh, we'll have Ad Astra", the bakery within the brewery, "talk to you about that". So they forwarded me to the bakery, which I thought was odd but maybe they just handled the orders. When I spoke with them I repeated I was looking to order a keg and they asked what flavor, which again odd, but I said I'd like the Herman's Pilsner. To which they replied "that would probably taste odd". To which I replied "why do you have it on offer if it tastes odd". To which they replied "some people like custom orders".
I sat there is stunned silence for maybe 10 seconds before asking if we were talking about a keg of beer, for people to drink at a party. They cracked up and said no, they thought I was asking about a cake. I forwarded back to the brewery main line and explained the miscommunication and ordered my keg. Fast forward to picking it up, I went to the counter and told them I was picking up a keg and got directed to a line on the other end of the building. When I reached the front they asked what I had ordered, and I said a keg, they said I wasn't on the list, and so I asked if it was a keg of beer and they said they were only for bakery orders and I'd have to talk to the bar staff....
TLDR: However I'm saying keg sounds like cake, I can't hear it but everyone else can.
Canada checking in here. (PS these opinions are mine and paint with possibly unfairly broad strokes). You know I'm Canadian because I'm already saying sorry. Haha.
Vancouver is becoming increasingly diverse, and I'd say we're more accustomed to adapting to English being spoken as a second language for people that there isn't a particular characteristic that would make you be able to identify someone as being from Vancouver. Sitting in a random cafe in a traditionally "caucasian" part of town right now I hear a variety of accents and foreigners speaking English.
I've heard that US news anchors try to speak an English that is similar to what we speak here in urban Western Canada. No quotes, no citations, just pure hearsay.
Edmontonians to me feel like they have to most statistically neutral English (as heard just roaming around if that makes sense).
On the other hand, if someone is from the Maritimes (Canadian Atlantic seaboard), you can definitely tell they are from there. The "ar" as in "part" seem to be the hardest for them to drop when they move out west and is a dead giveaway.
Southwestern Ontario also seems to have a distinctive accent. I can't suss out the exact characteristics but you know when someone is from rural Ontario.
Quebeckers / francophones obviously stand out as well, both in accent and often in demeanour (for better or worse).
Interestingly enough, a lot of rural First Nations groups across Canada all seem to share a similar way of speech (if they sound different at all that is to say). What I mean is that across Canada, there seems to be a distinctly First Nations English accent that shares common characteristics despite the geographical distances.
Your caricature lumberjack in red flannel spouting, "Ohhh yah, aboot thaaaht, oh yah, yah, I knooow, eh?!" is sprinkled around everywhere and surprises even me. "Holy crap, that guy is so Canadian!"
You’re absolutely correct about accents of news anchors. I believe if a new anchor has a really strong accent they learn this basic American accent. I’ve watched news broadcasts in many different parts of the country and they all sound exactly the same
The first time I met someone from Newfoundland I was astounded, she had an accent I can only describe as abandoned Irish... I didn't really get a hint of what I think of as Canadian, obviously what I think of as Canadian is pretty much what I've heard from TV and movies though.
I'm Scottish and I found it fascinating, we normally have no real issue with any Irish accent for obvious reasons but hers was unique to the point I had to really, really concentrate.
The US is definitely diverse, but I feel that's to be expected with how large and vast it is, along with the heavy history of immigration. Makes sense that communities would blend together and form new accents. I'm more impressed by the variety you can find in smaller countries like in Europe.
On that note, if you ever want to feel weird, look up videos on how to speak with your accent. Saw one once for mine (typical midwestern), and it's just so odd to hear someone describe all the verbal quirks and pronunciation patterns you never notice. It honestly still feels weird to call my accent, well, an accent, since I'm so used to it being "normal" and it's not particularly famous as an accent.
I'm from the US but live in Ireland, so I can relate! I'm used to most Irish accents by now, but a thick Limerick or Kerry accent still throws me way off. It's even worse if they're talking at native speed!
Edit: to add on the point re: accent discrimination, I haven't really seen much firsthand, but Northside/Inner City Dublin accents certainly carry some classist stigma, and I've read about people being pre-judged for being from certain areas with that accent.
In the US I’d say it’s pretty diverse. I have a job where I do relay for the deaf and HOH so I can pretty easily differentiate between accents. Midwest especially farther north you are, sound more Canadian. There’s a dialect in Louisiana that is intelligible to me. New England is pretty hard to understand. But people in the middle of the country pretty much all sound the same.
I just spent this past weekend in Boston, MA and talk about accent shock. I'm from the US south and I'm not sure you can get two more distinct accents in the US. I love the Boston accent though, it just has a quality that I could listen to all day.
After learning (only the surface-level schooling) a couple different languages, I wish I would have studied linguistics at school. I find it fascinating, not even just accents, but the way certain languages and dialects are produced physically by the mouth, tongue, and throat. Speaking English natively, then learning some French, then some Arabic, just the different ways sounds are produced are fun to learn, lol!