Ok, after actually watching one of her videos I'd like to say I am thoroughly confused. I watched her Thanksgiving video - $20 for a thanksgiving meal. She bought all canned, dehydrated, or...
Ok, after actually watching one of her videos I'd like to say I am thoroughly confused.
I watched her Thanksgiving video - $20 for a thanksgiving meal. She bought all canned, dehydrated, or prepared foods from the dollar store. Having shopped for thanksgiving, I think she could do so much better with better quality food.
I go with my wife to buy the turkey every year. Last year she bought one of those that you need to pre-order and was all organic. It was like $85 dollars. And honestly for an entire 16lb bird I think that makes sense. But the year before we just picked on up from Safeway like 3 weeks before Thanksgiving. It was 20lbs and cost us $9 dollars. I was so blown away when I saw the total at the checkout that I said "let's go, let's go, let's go..." - giggling to myself like a manic - because I thought they had forgot to ring up the turkey (I'm not that way with mom and pop's, but safeway can get bent.) My wife pulls out the recipe, and no, we had paid... it had just been 9 dollars. For an entire 20lb bird. We served it up at a friendsgiving with 12 people, sent folks home with some and still ate that thing for weeks! I used all the bones and veggie off cuts to make an amazing stock. None of that is to be had with canned turkey.
Hell a 10lb bag of russet potatoes is $6 from Costco. That's another like 20 meals of potatoes. To be honest, milk and butter would probably clean out my last $5, but I'm getting probably 10 times the amount of food she's getting in the video.
I think this is what grinds me up about the state of our food systems. If you rely on a dollar store for food - and in many places that is the only place to get groceries - than just like the video almost all of your calories are coming from oreo pie, biscuits, stuffing, and mac & cheese. And all of those are suuuuuper calorie dense. So you end up with low nutrition and high calorie. And for seemingly, no money saved.
I also shop the canned and dehydrated food sections of walmarts et al for when I go backpacking, and I'll just say that there are few places I come out of cursing the high cost of goods more than a Walmart with packs of tuna/salmon, dehydrated potatos, and seasoning packets. Others can push back on me with this, but I just don't see how it's more economical. You can do more, cheaper, with better products with a Costco membership than anything you can do at Dollartree or Walmart.
Last thing and then I'll get off my high horse. If you're ever on food stamps, see if your state has a market match program. They will match your EBT benefits up to $20 per trip. I ate like a king on food stamps because of that program. I believe everyone should get the oreos, soda, and the indulgences they want on assistance programs, but I'm glad some states are making healthy food access a priority.
Many poor folks don't have full kitchens, or the cost of running the oven all day for a turkey - which you didn't account for any seasoning at all btw so that is a very bland turkey, one of the...
Many poor folks don't have full kitchens, or the cost of running the oven all day for a turkey - which you didn't account for any seasoning at all btw so that is a very bland turkey, one of the harder things to cook well anyway - can be prohibitive. You proved against point, even with an unreasonably good deal on a turkey, you could only pull off two dishes. Assuming you also have a full kitchen, a roaster, knives sharp enough to handle a turkey, seasonings, the physical ability to peel and mash potatoes (more knives, knife skills and utensils, and a giant pot) you can have 20lbs of turkey and 10lbs of mashed potatoes. No biggie!
Dollar Tree Dinners is a creator who makes holiday meals with Dollar Tree food among other things, because the pricing is consistent and many folks in areas that are otherwise food deserts have access to a Dollar Tree. There was a video going around this last year of a guy that ran into someone with the items for DTD's Thanksgiving meal in her cart, and he asked her if that's what she was doing and she said this was her first time she's able to make a special meal for kids for the holidays.
My partner and I get SNAP in addition to his disability and my salary. (If we were married we wouldn't qualify, the fact he'd lose his Medicaid coverage is what makes marriage not an option). He is physically disabled. He has to buy a lot more convenience food because while he can cook it's not always easy and he doesn't have the energy/spoons a lot of nights. A tub of yogurt is likely to go bad when he falls asleep without putting it up, but individual yogurts are less wasteful and feel more appealing when he's nauseated. Rinse repeat for frozen or canned foods. And he doesn't have young kids to manage and has me to help him.
Yes, a turkey is cheaper per pound, maybe, if you get lucky on that price but it's not always feasible and bland turkey and mashed potatoes isn't all of a Thanksgiving meal either. (And that's not covering whether Costco even makes sense, is accessible by public transport, is easy to get bulk items home via transit, or if you have storage space for that much food. Plus finding the money for the membership. ). I don't think other people on EBT are unaware of what you're saying, I just don't think what's practical for you, or for my family is practical for every family on SNAP.
I appreciate what you're saying and I appreciate that she makes the videos to give folks ideas. For people who don't have the energy, the time, or the ability it's a great stand in. There are lots...
I appreciate what you're saying and I appreciate that she makes the videos to give folks ideas. For people who don't have the energy, the time, or the ability it's a great stand in. There are lots of barriers to being able to cook in the way I described and I shouldn't have been so dismissive and flippant. I do have blinders when it comes to ability and I have my own weird relationship with EBT.
SNAP was really the biggest indulgence I had for a few years and it really radicalized me. I got really intense about price per ounce, like actually pulling things off the shelf and comparing food price by weight. I went so far as to bike 7 miles to the nearest Costco and haul things home that way - with a jerry rigged back rack made of a reinforced plant nursery bin because my normal milk crate wasn't big enough - just because of how much of a better deal it was. But the two things I had in excess during that period were time and health. I could spend an afternoon figuring out a Costco run and could pull it off on a bike. I had time to poke around the woods for mushrooms. Hell I also had woods nearby. I had a lot of privileges to make it work, you're right.
I do think for those who can make it work, getting away from packet meals is a more economical and healthy option. Not in the obsessive way that I did, but trying to get out of the loop where it's expensive to be poor. I'm not joking when I say that buying 3 expensive REI packer meals per day of a backpacking trip can often be cheaper than a run to Walmart for dehydrated potatoes, pasta, or fish. That isn't a value proposition that should be true.
I'm glad you guys are getting the most out of EBT and I hope it's been a boon for you as well when things are tight.
Time and health are not things most folks surviving on SNAP have spare. It's not something I have and I don't qualify for it individually. Genuinely, we don't even have an REI closer than 2 hours...
Time and health are not things most folks surviving on SNAP have spare. It's not something I have and I don't qualify for it individually.
Genuinely, we don't even have an REI closer than 2 hours away. But we have Aldi. In my small town we have an expensive IGA and a not much cheaper Dollar General "Market" where theoretically they have produce and groceries but the dairy and produce cooler has been broken for a month. So even here, I have to do grocery shopping on my way out of nearby city from work. And we live here because of the housing crisis in nearby city.
People using the videos linked here to make it don't have "bike 7 miles to shop at Costco" time, nor likely access to Costco, or even to a standard grocery store without perhaps a lot of planning for a ride back. I agree that getting away from packaged food would be great but if your grocery option is legitimately Dollar Tree, or you're disabled, or your kids have to do some cooking while you're not at home, this isn't necessarily a reasonable goal.
I get what you're saying, just trying to ground it in lived experiences - not just mine - of more typical SNAP users.
Sorry, I wasn't trying to be argumentative with that last comment, I agree you're right most folks didn't have my experience with EBT. I was in a very fortunate and privileged position, minus the...
Sorry, I wasn't trying to be argumentative with that last comment, I agree you're right most folks didn't have my experience with EBT. I was in a very fortunate and privileged position, minus the chronic underemployment and financial stress. You made really great points and I agree with almost all of them.
I didn't mean that someone should go to REI for food. REI is expensive, those meals are expensive. I was blown away at how much dehydrated and shelf stable food cost at Walmart. I went in thinking I was being fiscally responsible and walked out with sticker shock. It really sucks that it's expensive to be poor. Like you pointed out it sucks that if people don't have the space to store food or the appliances to cook it then they'll be eating food that requires a microwave or hot water kettle. I was just surprised how expensive that food is.
I really appreciate you sharing your insights and I am giving a rosey picture of what you can do with EBT. And I'm sorry for the miscommunication on the last comment. I've got Covid at the moment and I think my comments are coming across with more defensiveness and curtness than I would hope. Thanks for following up!
No worries at all, also I hope you feel better soon. I just see a lot of folks thinking they can explain poverty to poor people and in my experience poor people already know it would be great to...
No worries at all, also I hope you feel better soon.
I just see a lot of folks thinking they can explain poverty to poor people and in my experience poor people already know it would be great to have fresh foods, so if they don't it's because of other reasons. I know you weren't aiming for that. I also know I'm in a very privileged situation myself which just makes me feel like if my grocery access isn't great, others' access is likely to be even worse! In my case we're more in a "we're stable but not secure" stage now. And that's not the most reassuring either.
I haven't tried to buy much dehydrated from Walmart barring instant mashed potatoes or the occasional soup/dip/seasoning mix but yeah shelf stable meal options aren't great. I struggle even with stuff to put in the fridge at work sometimes that isn't junk, even if it doesn't look like traditional "lunch"
Shit does suck, and I wish we did more to take care of folks that were struggling. I do appreciate your experience and you sharing it, I just try to speak up on the topic when I can.
i don't follow any of the points about mashed potatoes. you certainly don't need to peel the potatoes (i wouldn't bother anyway), and you can mash with a fork. and most people do have the physical...
i don't follow any of the points about mashed potatoes. you certainly don't need to peel the potatoes (i wouldn't bother anyway), and you can mash with a fork. and most people do have the physical ability to mash potatoes (of course some can't, but i don't think it's a major problem for most people. and a large pot is ... not at all hard to get? or a rice cooker if you don't have a stovetop. i don't really care for for potatoes, but they are a widespread staple
obviously there is a market for instant mashed potatoes, since they sell them. i just don't see it
I was talking about making ten lbs of potatoes for Thanksgiving dinner, by folks on a super low food budget. In my experience that's a lot of physical labor. You can't just jump all the hurdles by...
I was talking about making ten lbs of potatoes for Thanksgiving dinner, by folks on a super low food budget. In my experience that's a lot of physical labor. You can't just jump all the hurdles by saying "most people can...". Yes, most people can, though at this income disability is much more likely. (And mashing ten lbs, would be a lot to do by fork. Making the entire twenty bucks into a meal was part of the presumption) The point was all of those things are hurdles that may not be jumpable by everyone. You may not have stovetop, cooking that many potatoes for Thanksgiving dinner in a rice cooker is probably taking what, ten rounds of cooking at least? I'm not sure the number of folks on such a low income they're looking at these $10-20 meals for the holidays have a rice cooker and know how to utilize it for homemade mashed potatoes.
But ultimately when folks are wanting to make a special holiday or birthday meal, they're wanting to have a special dessert, or a couple of sides (or a casserole that hits the green beans/potatoes/stuffing notes). But if they can and want to make a turkey and potatoes, great. My partner was a chef, and he makes amazing homemade mashed potatoes and if he had to do it fully solo there would not be potatoes for dinner.
That's fair and I agree. If they had linked the youtube channel then it would have seemed more like promotion, rather than the the point of the article: people are struggling.
That's fair and I agree. If they had linked the youtube channel then it would have seemed more like promotion, rather than the the point of the article: people are struggling.
What I've found really interesting about inflation post pandemic, is how it's really been hitting the low cost, affordable goods but not really touching high end goods. I've always bought the most...
What I've found really interesting about inflation post pandemic, is how it's really been hitting the low cost, affordable goods but not really touching high end goods. I've always bought the most expensive eggs, even when I was making 15 an hour. When I was an undergrad I was in a class called culture through food and we ended up going to see things like factory farming - in our case chickens - firsthand. After that I couldn't do it. So when the debate around eggs sprung up last election around eggs it confused the hell out of me.
My eggs were no more expensive now than they had been pre-covid. I always paid between 5-7 dollars. So when they were 6 or 7 dollars that felt normal. But everything else had gone through the roof! The cereal I get - Rice Crispies - was 3x what it had been. Same with most of my non-Costco staples. And then it struck me, the high end foods I bought had gone up by maybe 5% but the low end went up 300%
It makes me wonder how much inflation isn't being felt my the majority of upper middle class folks, and why there seems to be a misunderstanding by many centrist liberals on the "state of the economy". For folks like my mom, who shop at Wholefoods and at the upper end of the spectrum, they don't see just how much things changed. They don't feel the pinch. So to them I think it sounds like everyone is making mountains out of mole hills.
And it feels this way across the board. Pre-covid we could go to any of our normal local restaurants for date night and expect to walk away with a bill of $50-60 dollars. Those same restaurants are impossible to get out of under 100-120 now. Ironically, the ones that cost over $100 to go to before, the nice restaurants with perfected ambiance and decadent food. They haven't risen much. No they are just slightly more expensive than your average mom and pop, not double the cost.
I'd be curious to hear if others are experiencing this as well.
Interesting observation. I wonder if it is due to higher priced food having a lot of padding/price gouging already built in so the need to raise the prices isn't felt as much.
Interesting observation. I wonder if it is due to higher priced food having a lot of padding/price gouging already built in so the need to raise the prices isn't felt as much.
Basics around the world are more expensive due to events like the Ukrainian war raising oil prices. I don't think price increases are limited to staples. Highly processed foods are largely made...
Basics around the world are more expensive due to events like the Ukrainian war raising oil prices. I don't think price increases are limited to staples.
Highly processed foods are largely made from those staples, so they're not immune to rising costs. They might have more profit margin buffer to avoid price increases?
I haven't seen much evidence that only basics are increasing in price.
Commodity wheat prices went up a lot due to the Ukraine war, but they went back down again (in part because Ukraine routed around the blockade) and they're back to 2020 levels....
Commodity wheat prices went up a lot due to the Ukraine war, but they went back down again (in part because Ukraine routed around the blockade) and they're back to 2020 levels.
But the cost of this sort of bulk ingredient is only a small part of the retail price for most food. Stores have to pay for transportation, rent, and labor, too. I'd guess that's why prices are significantly higher in California than upstate New York.
I thinking more like the cheap version of standards (maybe basics in the right word). So the milk, yogurt, bread, eggs, etc... Like, my loaf from the farmers market has been $8-10 from before the...
I thinking more like the cheap version of standards (maybe basics in the right word). So the milk, yogurt, bread, eggs, etc... Like, my loaf from the farmers market has been $8-10 from before the pandemic and still is. Somehow a loaf of orowheat caught up in that same period when it used to be $4-6 before.
Same can be said for bacon. In my area, Niman Ranch was the top quality one I could get - around $10 a pack prepandemic. Now most of the section is around $10, when it used to be $5 or $6 and Niman is now $11.
This video from eight years ago has always stuck in my mind. A then college student challenged herself to live off of only $10.50 for a week. It stuck in my head for what a miserable existence it...
This video from eight years ago has always stuck in my mind. A then college student challenged herself to live off of only $10.50 for a week. It stuck in my head for what a miserable existence it must have been.
That $10.50 was 2017 pre-greedflation money too. Not the $10 in 2025 money the sisters in the video talked about.
During my first month living on my own I had a total of $30 for food and I had no experience in actually cooking my own food (my "living on my own" was not by choice). It was obviously terrible...
During my first month living on my own I had a total of $30 for food and I had no experience in actually cooking my own food (my "living on my own" was not by choice). It was obviously terrible and I'm sure that don't need to go into the details on that part, but it instilled in me a life long fear of food scarcity that none of my friends or coworkers have really been able to understand. I am doing well now, but it definitely lead to me always trying to financially support local food banks for those that need it.
The comment about fresh fruit and vegetables being a luxury reminded me of the video posted here several months ago, where the head of the FDA was saying something about parents intentionally...
The comment about fresh fruit and vegetables being a luxury reminded me of the video posted here several months ago, where the head of the FDA was saying something about parents intentionally hurting their children by not providing them with that type of food.
I don’t know if the clips shown were representative of their typical videos, but I noticed that they seemed to be shopping in a lot of different places. There’s another example of how your time is considered to be worth less when your income is lower.
For anyone else who loves asparagus as much as I do and has a bit of land, it’s very easy to grow from bare roots that cost less than $2 each. You can’t harvest it for the first couple of years, but after that it only costs the water/fertilizer you put into it and should live for over a decade.
I mean pretty much by definition your time is worth less when your income is lower. If society valued your time more then you'd be paid more for using it at work.
I mean pretty much by definition your time is worth less when your income is lower. If society valued your time more then you'd be paid more for using it at work.
Processed foods and meat are tax dollar subsidized. When people are hungry what fills them right now takes priority even if it isn't best for their long term health.
Processed foods and meat are tax dollar subsidized. When people are hungry what fills them right now takes priority even if it isn't best for their long term health.
Many people are talking about how they are upset at the state of the food systems in the US, and you brought up the line that did it for me. Vegetables quite literally grow up from the ground. If...
Many people are talking about how they are upset at the state of the food systems in the US, and you brought up the line that did it for me.
Vegetables quite literally grow up from the ground. If you live in an area where any kind of plant can grow, you can almost certainly grow a vegetable. So having them be unaffordable means that we have serious problems.
These sisters are from Tennessee. I did a quick search on the agriculture in that state, and it looks like their largest agricultural product is beef and chicken. When talking about crops specifically their most common crops are soy and corn. While it would be great if people were eating that soy and corn, let's be real here; those crops are being raised for animal feed. Did you know that only about 16% of crops on earth are grown for human consumption? The vast majority of it gets eaten by animals. So basically, people who live in those areas are having their health sacrificed to fatten animals to be slaughtered.
I live in California, where we have a lot of agriculture and fresh vegetables are very easy to get. Here, vegetables are relatively inexpensive regardless of if they are fresh or otherwise preserved, and meat pretty expensive. So to me, the American South has always been kind of like a food bizzaro land; a place where vegetables are expensive but meat is relatively cheap. I've literally had someone tell me that in Texas beef is cheaper than beans, which I sincerely hope was just a bad faith argument.
And the thing is that meat is not sustainable. Globally, animals make roughly 17% of the global consumption of calories. Prices for meat have skyrocketed far higher and faster than any other food product when I compare prices I've paid for them in the past, and it's only as cheap as it is now because of some extremely heavy subsidies and breathtakingly unethical and immoral acts becoming normalized. How much more stress will this system take before it snaps? More importantly, what is going to happen to the people who live in these meat-dependent communities in the meanwhile?
Also, CNN and others never link to the sisters' youtube channel. Here it is:
https://www.youtube.com/@SouthernFrugalMomma
Ok, after actually watching one of her videos I'd like to say I am thoroughly confused.
I watched her Thanksgiving video - $20 for a thanksgiving meal. She bought all canned, dehydrated, or prepared foods from the dollar store. Having shopped for thanksgiving, I think she could do so much better with better quality food.
I go with my wife to buy the turkey every year. Last year she bought one of those that you need to pre-order and was all organic. It was like $85 dollars. And honestly for an entire 16lb bird I think that makes sense. But the year before we just picked on up from Safeway like 3 weeks before Thanksgiving. It was 20lbs and cost us $9 dollars. I was so blown away when I saw the total at the checkout that I said "let's go, let's go, let's go..." - giggling to myself like a manic - because I thought they had forgot to ring up the turkey (I'm not that way with mom and pop's, but safeway can get bent.) My wife pulls out the recipe, and no, we had paid... it had just been 9 dollars. For an entire 20lb bird. We served it up at a friendsgiving with 12 people, sent folks home with some and still ate that thing for weeks! I used all the bones and veggie off cuts to make an amazing stock. None of that is to be had with canned turkey.
Hell a 10lb bag of russet potatoes is $6 from Costco. That's another like 20 meals of potatoes. To be honest, milk and butter would probably clean out my last $5, but I'm getting probably 10 times the amount of food she's getting in the video.
I think this is what grinds me up about the state of our food systems. If you rely on a dollar store for food - and in many places that is the only place to get groceries - than just like the video almost all of your calories are coming from oreo pie, biscuits, stuffing, and mac & cheese. And all of those are suuuuuper calorie dense. So you end up with low nutrition and high calorie. And for seemingly, no money saved.
I also shop the canned and dehydrated food sections of walmarts et al for when I go backpacking, and I'll just say that there are few places I come out of cursing the high cost of goods more than a Walmart with packs of tuna/salmon, dehydrated potatos, and seasoning packets. Others can push back on me with this, but I just don't see how it's more economical. You can do more, cheaper, with better products with a Costco membership than anything you can do at Dollartree or Walmart.
Last thing and then I'll get off my high horse. If you're ever on food stamps, see if your state has a market match program. They will match your EBT benefits up to $20 per trip. I ate like a king on food stamps because of that program. I believe everyone should get the oreos, soda, and the indulgences they want on assistance programs, but I'm glad some states are making healthy food access a priority.
Many poor folks don't have full kitchens, or the cost of running the oven all day for a turkey - which you didn't account for any seasoning at all btw so that is a very bland turkey, one of the harder things to cook well anyway - can be prohibitive. You proved against point, even with an unreasonably good deal on a turkey, you could only pull off two dishes. Assuming you also have a full kitchen, a roaster, knives sharp enough to handle a turkey, seasonings, the physical ability to peel and mash potatoes (more knives, knife skills and utensils, and a giant pot) you can have 20lbs of turkey and 10lbs of mashed potatoes. No biggie!
Dollar Tree Dinners is a creator who makes holiday meals with Dollar Tree food among other things, because the pricing is consistent and many folks in areas that are otherwise food deserts have access to a Dollar Tree. There was a video going around this last year of a guy that ran into someone with the items for DTD's Thanksgiving meal in her cart, and he asked her if that's what she was doing and she said this was her first time she's able to make a special meal for kids for the holidays.
My partner and I get SNAP in addition to his disability and my salary. (If we were married we wouldn't qualify, the fact he'd lose his Medicaid coverage is what makes marriage not an option). He is physically disabled. He has to buy a lot more convenience food because while he can cook it's not always easy and he doesn't have the energy/spoons a lot of nights. A tub of yogurt is likely to go bad when he falls asleep without putting it up, but individual yogurts are less wasteful and feel more appealing when he's nauseated. Rinse repeat for frozen or canned foods. And he doesn't have young kids to manage and has me to help him.
Yes, a turkey is cheaper per pound, maybe, if you get lucky on that price but it's not always feasible and bland turkey and mashed potatoes isn't all of a Thanksgiving meal either. (And that's not covering whether Costco even makes sense, is accessible by public transport, is easy to get bulk items home via transit, or if you have storage space for that much food. Plus finding the money for the membership. ). I don't think other people on EBT are unaware of what you're saying, I just don't think what's practical for you, or for my family is practical for every family on SNAP.
I appreciate what you're saying and I appreciate that she makes the videos to give folks ideas. For people who don't have the energy, the time, or the ability it's a great stand in. There are lots of barriers to being able to cook in the way I described and I shouldn't have been so dismissive and flippant. I do have blinders when it comes to ability and I have my own weird relationship with EBT.
SNAP was really the biggest indulgence I had for a few years and it really radicalized me. I got really intense about price per ounce, like actually pulling things off the shelf and comparing food price by weight. I went so far as to bike 7 miles to the nearest Costco and haul things home that way - with a jerry rigged back rack made of a reinforced plant nursery bin because my normal milk crate wasn't big enough - just because of how much of a better deal it was. But the two things I had in excess during that period were time and health. I could spend an afternoon figuring out a Costco run and could pull it off on a bike. I had time to poke around the woods for mushrooms. Hell I also had woods nearby. I had a lot of privileges to make it work, you're right.
I do think for those who can make it work, getting away from packet meals is a more economical and healthy option. Not in the obsessive way that I did, but trying to get out of the loop where it's expensive to be poor. I'm not joking when I say that buying 3 expensive REI packer meals per day of a backpacking trip can often be cheaper than a run to Walmart for dehydrated potatoes, pasta, or fish. That isn't a value proposition that should be true.
I'm glad you guys are getting the most out of EBT and I hope it's been a boon for you as well when things are tight.
Time and health are not things most folks surviving on SNAP have spare. It's not something I have and I don't qualify for it individually.
Genuinely, we don't even have an REI closer than 2 hours away. But we have Aldi. In my small town we have an expensive IGA and a not much cheaper Dollar General "Market" where theoretically they have produce and groceries but the dairy and produce cooler has been broken for a month. So even here, I have to do grocery shopping on my way out of nearby city from work. And we live here because of the housing crisis in nearby city.
People using the videos linked here to make it don't have "bike 7 miles to shop at Costco" time, nor likely access to Costco, or even to a standard grocery store without perhaps a lot of planning for a ride back. I agree that getting away from packaged food would be great but if your grocery option is legitimately Dollar Tree, or you're disabled, or your kids have to do some cooking while you're not at home, this isn't necessarily a reasonable goal.
I get what you're saying, just trying to ground it in lived experiences - not just mine - of more typical SNAP users.
Sorry, I wasn't trying to be argumentative with that last comment, I agree you're right most folks didn't have my experience with EBT. I was in a very fortunate and privileged position, minus the chronic underemployment and financial stress. You made really great points and I agree with almost all of them.
I didn't mean that someone should go to REI for food. REI is expensive, those meals are expensive. I was blown away at how much dehydrated and shelf stable food cost at Walmart. I went in thinking I was being fiscally responsible and walked out with sticker shock. It really sucks that it's expensive to be poor. Like you pointed out it sucks that if people don't have the space to store food or the appliances to cook it then they'll be eating food that requires a microwave or hot water kettle. I was just surprised how expensive that food is.
I really appreciate you sharing your insights and I am giving a rosey picture of what you can do with EBT. And I'm sorry for the miscommunication on the last comment. I've got Covid at the moment and I think my comments are coming across with more defensiveness and curtness than I would hope. Thanks for following up!
No worries at all, also I hope you feel better soon.
I just see a lot of folks thinking they can explain poverty to poor people and in my experience poor people already know it would be great to have fresh foods, so if they don't it's because of other reasons. I know you weren't aiming for that. I also know I'm in a very privileged situation myself which just makes me feel like if my grocery access isn't great, others' access is likely to be even worse! In my case we're more in a "we're stable but not secure" stage now. And that's not the most reassuring either.
I haven't tried to buy much dehydrated from Walmart barring instant mashed potatoes or the occasional soup/dip/seasoning mix but yeah shelf stable meal options aren't great. I struggle even with stuff to put in the fridge at work sometimes that isn't junk, even if it doesn't look like traditional "lunch"
Shit does suck, and I wish we did more to take care of folks that were struggling. I do appreciate your experience and you sharing it, I just try to speak up on the topic when I can.
i don't follow any of the points about mashed potatoes. you certainly don't need to peel the potatoes (i wouldn't bother anyway), and you can mash with a fork. and most people do have the physical ability to mash potatoes (of course some can't, but i don't think it's a major problem for most people. and a large pot is ... not at all hard to get? or a rice cooker if you don't have a stovetop. i don't really care for for potatoes, but they are a widespread staple
obviously there is a market for instant mashed potatoes, since they sell them. i just don't see it
I was talking about making ten lbs of potatoes for Thanksgiving dinner, by folks on a super low food budget. In my experience that's a lot of physical labor. You can't just jump all the hurdles by saying "most people can...". Yes, most people can, though at this income disability is much more likely. (And mashing ten lbs, would be a lot to do by fork. Making the entire twenty bucks into a meal was part of the presumption) The point was all of those things are hurdles that may not be jumpable by everyone. You may not have stovetop, cooking that many potatoes for Thanksgiving dinner in a rice cooker is probably taking what, ten rounds of cooking at least? I'm not sure the number of folks on such a low income they're looking at these $10-20 meals for the holidays have a rice cooker and know how to utilize it for homemade mashed potatoes.
But ultimately when folks are wanting to make a special holiday or birthday meal, they're wanting to have a special dessert, or a couple of sides (or a casserole that hits the green beans/potatoes/stuffing notes). But if they can and want to make a turkey and potatoes, great. My partner was a chef, and he makes amazing homemade mashed potatoes and if he had to do it fully solo there would not be potatoes for dinner.
I can't articulate why, but I thought that was good. I don't think CNN want to look like they are promoting their channel.
That's fair and I agree. If they had linked the youtube channel then it would have seemed more like promotion, rather than the the point of the article: people are struggling.
From the video:
This is such a messed up view, for someone living in a representative democracy.
It isn't even the most messed up view in the interview. I think the stated belief that tariffs would lower prices tops that. Oy!
Totally unrelated, but here's a collection of cookbook recipes from the great depression.
Not the video you think it is from the title. No tips, but looking at why they have to scrounge. Less then 6 minutes.
What I've found really interesting about inflation post pandemic, is how it's really been hitting the low cost, affordable goods but not really touching high end goods. I've always bought the most expensive eggs, even when I was making 15 an hour. When I was an undergrad I was in a class called culture through food and we ended up going to see things like factory farming - in our case chickens - firsthand. After that I couldn't do it. So when the debate around eggs sprung up last election around eggs it confused the hell out of me.
My eggs were no more expensive now than they had been pre-covid. I always paid between 5-7 dollars. So when they were 6 or 7 dollars that felt normal. But everything else had gone through the roof! The cereal I get - Rice Crispies - was 3x what it had been. Same with most of my non-Costco staples. And then it struck me, the high end foods I bought had gone up by maybe 5% but the low end went up 300%
It makes me wonder how much inflation isn't being felt my the majority of upper middle class folks, and why there seems to be a misunderstanding by many centrist liberals on the "state of the economy". For folks like my mom, who shop at Wholefoods and at the upper end of the spectrum, they don't see just how much things changed. They don't feel the pinch. So to them I think it sounds like everyone is making mountains out of mole hills.
And it feels this way across the board. Pre-covid we could go to any of our normal local restaurants for date night and expect to walk away with a bill of $50-60 dollars. Those same restaurants are impossible to get out of under 100-120 now. Ironically, the ones that cost over $100 to go to before, the nice restaurants with perfected ambiance and decadent food. They haven't risen much. No they are just slightly more expensive than your average mom and pop, not double the cost.
I'd be curious to hear if others are experiencing this as well.
Interesting observation. I wonder if it is due to higher priced food having a lot of padding/price gouging already built in so the need to raise the prices isn't felt as much.
Basics around the world are more expensive due to events like the Ukrainian war raising oil prices. I don't think price increases are limited to staples.
Highly processed foods are largely made from those staples, so they're not immune to rising costs. They might have more profit margin buffer to avoid price increases?
I haven't seen much evidence that only basics are increasing in price.
Commodity wheat prices went up a lot due to the Ukraine war, but they went back down again (in part because Ukraine routed around the blockade) and they're back to 2020 levels.
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/wheat
Looks like it's a similar story for corn:
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/corn
But the cost of this sort of bulk ingredient is only a small part of the retail price for most food. Stores have to pay for transportation, rent, and labor, too. I'd guess that's why prices are significantly higher in California than upstate New York.
I thinking more like the cheap version of standards (maybe basics in the right word). So the milk, yogurt, bread, eggs, etc... Like, my loaf from the farmers market has been $8-10 from before the pandemic and still is. Somehow a loaf of orowheat caught up in that same period when it used to be $4-6 before.
Same can be said for bacon. In my area, Niman Ranch was the top quality one I could get - around $10 a pack prepandemic. Now most of the section is around $10, when it used to be $5 or $6 and Niman is now $11.
This video from eight years ago has always stuck in my mind. A then college student challenged herself to live off of only $10.50 for a week. It stuck in my head for what a miserable existence it must have been.
That $10.50 was 2017 pre-greedflation money too. Not the $10 in 2025 money the sisters in the video talked about.
During my first month living on my own I had a total of $30 for food and I had no experience in actually cooking my own food (my "living on my own" was not by choice). It was obviously terrible and I'm sure that don't need to go into the details on that part, but it instilled in me a life long fear of food scarcity that none of my friends or coworkers have really been able to understand. I am doing well now, but it definitely lead to me always trying to financially support local food banks for those that need it.
I make food donations twice a year.
Given everything going on maybe I should step that up.
The comment about fresh fruit and vegetables being a luxury reminded me of the video posted here several months ago, where the head of the FDA was saying something about parents intentionally hurting their children by not providing them with that type of food.
I don’t know if the clips shown were representative of their typical videos, but I noticed that they seemed to be shopping in a lot of different places. There’s another example of how your time is considered to be worth less when your income is lower.
For anyone else who loves asparagus as much as I do and has a bit of land, it’s very easy to grow from bare roots that cost less than $2 each. You can’t harvest it for the first couple of years, but after that it only costs the water/fertilizer you put into it and should live for over a decade.
I mean pretty much by definition your time is worth less when your income is lower. If society valued your time more then you'd be paid more for using it at work.
Processed foods and meat are tax dollar subsidized. When people are hungry what fills them right now takes priority even if it isn't best for their long term health.
I’m not arguing against that at all, the statement made be remember what he’d said.
Many people are talking about how they are upset at the state of the food systems in the US, and you brought up the line that did it for me.
Vegetables quite literally grow up from the ground. If you live in an area where any kind of plant can grow, you can almost certainly grow a vegetable. So having them be unaffordable means that we have serious problems.
These sisters are from Tennessee. I did a quick search on the agriculture in that state, and it looks like their largest agricultural product is beef and chicken. When talking about crops specifically their most common crops are soy and corn. While it would be great if people were eating that soy and corn, let's be real here; those crops are being raised for animal feed. Did you know that only about 16% of crops on earth are grown for human consumption? The vast majority of it gets eaten by animals. So basically, people who live in those areas are having their health sacrificed to fatten animals to be slaughtered.
I live in California, where we have a lot of agriculture and fresh vegetables are very easy to get. Here, vegetables are relatively inexpensive regardless of if they are fresh or otherwise preserved, and meat pretty expensive. So to me, the American South has always been kind of like a food bizzaro land; a place where vegetables are expensive but meat is relatively cheap. I've literally had someone tell me that in Texas beef is cheaper than beans, which I sincerely hope was just a bad faith argument.
And the thing is that meat is not sustainable. Globally, animals make roughly 17% of the global consumption of calories. Prices for meat have skyrocketed far higher and faster than any other food product when I compare prices I've paid for them in the past, and it's only as cheap as it is now because of some extremely heavy subsidies and breathtakingly unethical and immoral acts becoming normalized. How much more stress will this system take before it snaps? More importantly, what is going to happen to the people who live in these meat-dependent communities in the meanwhile?