My first reaction is this sounds terrible. What was wrong with email? On the other hand, under three minutes wastes less time than a lot of other corporate things. Maybe an AI can convert it to email.
Google plans to launch Vids in a public beta this summer. Some Workspace customers have been testing it already, and Behr says she’s already seeing some trends emerge. Most Vids are short, she says — under three minutes. Most are things like pitches, training videos, updates, and videos celebrating accomplishments or people. Behr says she has replaced her weekly recap emails with Vids, “and I get a lot of feedback that people like it because they can see my facial expressions when I’m talking about things.”
My first reaction is this sounds terrible. What was wrong with email? On the other hand, under three minutes wastes less time than a lot of other corporate things.
Neurotypical people communicate a ton of information, both transmitting as well as receiving, via body language. They need those innumerable non-verbal cues, like tone of voice, expression, and on...
Neurotypical people communicate a ton of information, both transmitting as well as receiving, via body language. They need those innumerable non-verbal cues, like tone of voice, expression, and on and on and on.
This tool is something by NTs for NTs. They feel incomplete trying to communicate via text-only. When they can only transmit pure information, without all those extra channels they rely on in person, they feel like there are things missing.
Meanwhile, I just finished reading The Big Short by Lewis and one of the guys who saw the mortgage collapse coming is autistic. (Actually, I think another was as well, Eisman along with Burry, but only Burry was explicitly mentioned as such). And while he didn't figure it out until he'd had a son who was diagnosed by the school or whoever, he had figured out pretty early in his life in-person didn't work so well for him. People constantly took him wrong, and nothing about the face-to-face experience benefited him in return; so he communicated mostly via email or forums.
A tool like this, in regular use, would fuck him over. Especially if (when?) it becomes a regular thing, and people wonder "but why don't you vid chat me?" And they won't understand "because I don't want to" or "because face-to-face is distracting for me" or "because it's a negative in how I can try to interact" or anything similar as an answer.
They'll just have one more tool to use to shuffle "the weirdos" off into a forgotten corner. Lovely.
I'm pretty NT and TBH, communicating via email/chat/txt is fine. I don't need those non-verbal cues to get my work done. Regardless, it's Google. It'll either fail or be killed off in a year or...
I'm pretty NT and TBH, communicating via email/chat/txt is fine. I don't need those non-verbal cues to get my work done. Regardless, it's Google. It'll either fail or be killed off in a year or so. I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Maybe it's not all NTs, but a certain type of people, such as marketing HR types....many of those I know always want to talk and be acknowledged in person and have meetings and whatnot instead of...
Maybe it's not all NTs, but a certain type of people, such as marketing HR types....many of those I know always want to talk and be acknowledged in person and have meetings and whatnot instead of text.
This comes across as a bit insulting and condescending towards “neurotypical” people. Saying they “feel” they need all of these extra channels to get a message across, unlike the Autists who can...
This comes across as a bit insulting and condescending towards “neurotypical” people. Saying they “feel” they need all of these extra channels to get a message across, unlike the Autists who can “transmit pure information”. The other channels are as much pure, real information as the written word, and, like I’m hoping has happened here, the “pure [text] information” is just as easy to misunderstand even when taken at face value.
As somebody is pretty far away from being Neuro Typical... It's not only neuro typicals who might use this? What are you talking about? It's extremely important for people to be able to read body...
As somebody is pretty far away from being Neuro Typical... It's not only neuro typicals who might use this? What are you talking about?
It's extremely important for people to be able to read body language, NT or not.
You're really misunderstanding what this product is, who it's for, and I'm not sure you have a real understanding of what "neurotypical" actually means. First, this is just Google's latest attempt...
You're really misunderstanding what this product is, who it's for, and I'm not sure you have a real understanding of what "neurotypical" actually means.
First, this is just Google's latest attempt at doing shit a startup (Loom) is doing in the office productivity suite. It's likely to not go anywhere. I'm surprised they're even willing to integrate it into Workspace. But nobody uses Google's "startup-killing" features of Workspace (eg. their chat thing, I don't even know its name because it's changed like 7 times, and I'm a highly active Workspace user).
You'll note that it's complete and utter bullshit to say "Google’s latest Workspace app reflects the way people talk at work now" when this tool doesn't even exist today, with only a passing mention of the competition. So keep your worries at bay for a while at least, this isn't actually a thing, the author of the article is just paid to pretend it is.
Second: This trend that you're here participating in, of pointing the finger at "NT people" and blaming random shit on "them" is adversarial and just a different flavour of blaming random shit on immigrants/boomers/white men/millenials/[insert country here]. You're perpetuating the idea that a group of people is at fault for something most of that group has zero idea exists and doesn't actually care about. Really; if anyone's not neurotypical it's, like, a lot of Google's dev & design crew. Less nowadays but still a lot, because inertia.
I don't find "neurotypical" a particularly useful label. I have pretty severe ADHD but I make it work for me, and people can't tell until they get to really see how I operate for a while. And I occasionally find Looms useful, occasionally not. I guess I'm socially aware enough to know when you can convey information over text, and when a voice or a face can be reassuring. Is it really that crazy to you that different media are more adapted to different situations?
Put it this way: You can put the exact same information in a text message and an email. And yet, it's very inappropriate to fire someone over text, and really weird to ask someone on a date by email. So do you not think that, when the actual contents and format change, it'll have different use cases?
Orrrrr... Because words on a page are nice? I can scan text more easily than a video. I can read as fast as or as slow as I want instantly (no settings gear > playback speed > 2x clicks) I can...
and people wonder "but why don't you vid chat me?" And they won't understand "because I don't want to" or "because face-to-face is distracting for me" or "because it's a negative in how I can try to interact" or anything similar as an answer.
Orrrrr... Because words on a page are nice?
I can scan text more easily than a video.
I can read as fast as or as slow as I want instantly (no settings gear > playback speed > 2x clicks)
I can skip ahead, or reread faster than tracking through a video.
No need to hit pause, I determine how long something stays in front of me, not the video creator determining that 3 seconds is enough time to view, consider, and understand a 4 coupling Feynman diagram.
I really don't understand the constant urge of certain people to move away from the written word. Videos, simulations, animations, etc. are all good in their own way, but trying to turn every type of knowledge transfer into a 30s - 5min video just seems silly to me.
Also, I can't use control+F on a video to find the part of an otherwise long article/video about everything related to setting up my car's dash, when all I wanted to know was the one button to...
Also, I can't use control+F on a video to find the part of an otherwise long article/video about everything related to setting up my car's dash, when all I wanted to know was the one button to push to change the speed dial from kph to mph.
A little while ago there was a bit of a trend on linkedin (at least around here) where recruiters would send a "personalized" video message with their sales pitch to people. Mostly just the young...
A little while ago there was a bit of a trend on linkedin (at least around here) where recruiters would send a "personalized" video message with their sales pitch to people. Mostly just the young female recruiters targeting a male audience and basically just reading stuff from their profile.
This description reminds me of those videos. I guess I am looking forward to the first recruitment video made by Vids :P
Same here, more over... most of the ppl suck at talking. I feel there are some niches where it could be useful. To show how to do something on a gui or irl but not so much at work expecially...
Same here, more over... most of the ppl suck at talking.
I feel there are some niches where it could be useful. To show how to do something on a gui or irl but not so much at work expecially because most of the ppt I get are just word documents made into slides and I suspect if this vids will get traction I will probably get a word document converted into slides... converted into a video. Nice... :/
One area where vids are much better than emails is for instructions on how to do a thing on a computer. It can take me 15 minutes to write unambiguous instructions on how to get to a particular...
One area where vids are much better than emails is for instructions on how to do a thing on a computer. It can take me 15 minutes to write unambiguous instructions on how to get to a particular setting, but a video can, barring UI changes, be made to be clear in a matter of moments. It's not a general purpose tool, but small video clips absolutely have their place.
They have tools for this already, but I see it in sales emails mostly. Videos can be good for trying to grab people's attention, but I would be pretty annoyed if I had to put on headphones to read...
They have tools for this already, but I see it in sales emails mostly. Videos can be good for trying to grab people's attention, but I would be pretty annoyed if I had to put on headphones to read an email from my boss.
That's a good point. Reading is generally faster than watching a video with a fixed length, it's a large reason I prefer written articles over videos. Having to pause everything you're doing to...
That's a good point. Reading is generally faster than watching a video with a fixed length, it's a large reason I prefer written articles over videos. Having to pause everything you're doing to listen to a video feels more disruptive to work flow than reading an email. This is especially key when some people will ABSOLUTELY send very lengthy and overall unnecessary videos. Easier to skim a rambly email for key points than listen to a 10-minute ramble, especially if you need to consult it again later for reference.
If you pair it with a speech-to-text engine and watch it at like 4x normal speed, it's almost as good as a dictated email. This is how I work with one of my coworkers who keeps sending me Loom videos.
If you pair it with a speech-to-text engine and watch it at like 4x normal speed, it's almost as good as a dictated email.
This is how I work with one of my coworkers who keeps sending me Loom videos.
My first reaction is this sounds terrible. What was wrong with email? On the other hand, under three minutes wastes less time than a lot of other corporate things.
Maybe an AI can convert it to email.
Neurotypical people communicate a ton of information, both transmitting as well as receiving, via body language. They need those innumerable non-verbal cues, like tone of voice, expression, and on and on and on.
This tool is something by NTs for NTs. They feel incomplete trying to communicate via text-only. When they can only transmit pure information, without all those extra channels they rely on in person, they feel like there are things missing.
Meanwhile, I just finished reading The Big Short by Lewis and one of the guys who saw the mortgage collapse coming is autistic. (Actually, I think another was as well, Eisman along with Burry, but only Burry was explicitly mentioned as such). And while he didn't figure it out until he'd had a son who was diagnosed by the school or whoever, he had figured out pretty early in his life in-person didn't work so well for him. People constantly took him wrong, and nothing about the face-to-face experience benefited him in return; so he communicated mostly via email or forums.
A tool like this, in regular use, would fuck him over. Especially if (when?) it becomes a regular thing, and people wonder "but why don't you vid chat me?" And they won't understand "because I don't want to" or "because face-to-face is distracting for me" or "because it's a negative in how I can try to interact" or anything similar as an answer.
They'll just have one more tool to use to shuffle "the weirdos" off into a forgotten corner. Lovely.
I'm pretty NT and TBH, communicating via email/chat/txt is fine. I don't need those non-verbal cues to get my work done. Regardless, it's Google. It'll either fail or be killed off in a year or so. I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Maybe it's not all NTs, but a certain type of people, such as marketing HR types....many of those I know always want to talk and be acknowledged in person and have meetings and whatnot instead of text.
I actually work in HR, :D
Well, I do IT in HR, but still.
Do you think your regular HR folks would love this video feature?
This comes across as a bit insulting and condescending towards “neurotypical” people. Saying they “feel” they need all of these extra channels to get a message across, unlike the Autists who can “transmit pure information”. The other channels are as much pure, real information as the written word, and, like I’m hoping has happened here, the “pure [text] information” is just as easy to misunderstand even when taken at face value.
The comment is like the Predator movie from 2018 where it says that autism is the next step in human evolution
As somebody is pretty far away from being Neuro Typical... It's not only neuro typicals who might use this? What are you talking about?
It's extremely important for people to be able to read body language, NT or not.
You're really misunderstanding what this product is, who it's for, and I'm not sure you have a real understanding of what "neurotypical" actually means.
First, this is just Google's latest attempt at doing shit a startup (Loom) is doing in the office productivity suite. It's likely to not go anywhere. I'm surprised they're even willing to integrate it into Workspace. But nobody uses Google's "startup-killing" features of Workspace (eg. their chat thing, I don't even know its name because it's changed like 7 times, and I'm a highly active Workspace user).
You'll note that it's complete and utter bullshit to say "Google’s latest Workspace app reflects the way people talk at work now" when this tool doesn't even exist today, with only a passing mention of the competition. So keep your worries at bay for a while at least, this isn't actually a thing, the author of the article is just paid to pretend it is.
Second: This trend that you're here participating in, of pointing the finger at "NT people" and blaming random shit on "them" is adversarial and just a different flavour of blaming random shit on immigrants/boomers/white men/millenials/[insert country here]. You're perpetuating the idea that a group of people is at fault for something most of that group has zero idea exists and doesn't actually care about. Really; if anyone's not neurotypical it's, like, a lot of Google's dev & design crew. Less nowadays but still a lot, because inertia.
I don't find "neurotypical" a particularly useful label. I have pretty severe ADHD but I make it work for me, and people can't tell until they get to really see how I operate for a while. And I occasionally find Looms useful, occasionally not. I guess I'm socially aware enough to know when you can convey information over text, and when a voice or a face can be reassuring. Is it really that crazy to you that different media are more adapted to different situations?
Put it this way: You can put the exact same information in a text message and an email. And yet, it's very inappropriate to fire someone over text, and really weird to ask someone on a date by email. So do you not think that, when the actual contents and format change, it'll have different use cases?
Orrrrr... Because words on a page are nice?
I can scan text more easily than a video.
I can read as fast as or as slow as I want instantly (no settings gear > playback speed > 2x clicks)
I can skip ahead, or reread faster than tracking through a video.
No need to hit pause, I determine how long something stays in front of me, not the video creator determining that 3 seconds is enough time to view, consider, and understand a 4 coupling Feynman diagram.
I really don't understand the constant urge of certain people to move away from the written word. Videos, simulations, animations, etc. are all good in their own way, but trying to turn every type of knowledge transfer into a 30s - 5min video just seems silly to me.
I really miss the era of RTFM.
Also, I can't use control+F on a video to find the part of an otherwise long article/video about everything related to setting up my car's dash, when all I wanted to know was the one button to push to change the speed dial from kph to mph.
Sometimes the weirdos in the corner found a startup and do pretty well.
A little while ago there was a bit of a trend on linkedin (at least around here) where recruiters would send a "personalized" video message with their sales pitch to people. Mostly just the young female recruiters targeting a male audience and basically just reading stuff from their profile.
This description reminds me of those videos. I guess I am looking forward to the first recruitment video made by Vids :P
Same here, more over... most of the ppl suck at talking.
I feel there are some niches where it could be useful. To show how to do something on a gui or irl but not so much at work expecially because most of the ppt I get are just word documents made into slides and I suspect if this vids will get traction I will probably get a word document converted into slides... converted into a video. Nice... :/
One area where vids are much better than emails is for instructions on how to do a thing on a computer. It can take me 15 minutes to write unambiguous instructions on how to get to a particular setting, but a video can, barring UI changes, be made to be clear in a matter of moments. It's not a general purpose tool, but small video clips absolutely have their place.
They have tools for this already, but I see it in sales emails mostly. Videos can be good for trying to grab people's attention, but I would be pretty annoyed if I had to put on headphones to read an email from my boss.
That's a good point. Reading is generally faster than watching a video with a fixed length, it's a large reason I prefer written articles over videos. Having to pause everything you're doing to listen to a video feels more disruptive to work flow than reading an email. This is especially key when some people will ABSOLUTELY send very lengthy and overall unnecessary videos. Easier to skim a rambly email for key points than listen to a 10-minute ramble, especially if you need to consult it again later for reference.
If you pair it with a speech-to-text engine and watch it at like 4x normal speed, it's almost as good as a dictated email.
This is how I work with one of my coworkers who keeps sending me Loom videos.
If anyone dares to send me a vid instead of a text email I'll just ignore it.
Thankfully, they are likely easy to filter.