Seeking advice and resources for keeping chickens
I'm sad to admit it, but several members of my household have a crippling egg addiction and all our local suppliers are getting pretty stingy with prices. So we're breaking into the supply chain and getting the good stuff right at the source
But seriously, looking to get some chickens soon and it's been difficult finding spesific details. Most of the resources I see either paint chickens as exceptionally easy and self sufficient, or details extremely technical info for business farmers. Just based on the info I can put together, I'm building a small coop (2.5m^2) and fencing a run that can extend out to about 10m^2. Think it should be enough for 5 or 6 birds and I'll line the house out with plenty of straw and make a little nesting nook. I'll need to let them out in the morning, feed them grain and kitchen scraps, close them up at night and keep a temporary pen for broody hens.
Is that it? Do I have to get spesific breeds or types? Will it be better to raise them from young or just get fully grown? Temps range from -5C to 32C trough the year so do they need insulation or cooling? Are the eggs just safe to eat straight out the chicken? What are the best chicken pun names?
Most importantly, are they good to keep around kids? My toddler has a very... enthusiastic love for animals but I know birds will not put up with her the way the cats or dog do. And is there any hygiene or parasite risks I need to be aware of?
Would really appreciate any advice or anecdotes people have to share about these animals.
It turns out that raising chickens is really expensive and doesn't balance against the cost of buying eggs. This NYT piece talks about it some more, but it also provides a resource for the DIY approach, since that's that you've actually asked for here.
https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/blog/egg-shortage-dont-get-inflation-chickens/
That said, if you want to raise chickens for the experience or for any other non- economic reasons, I wish you the best!
I highly recommend reading this article. It reflects the basic realities of chicken raising (waiting six months for the first tiny eggs... retiring older hens, etc.). However, there are some things not covered here; chickens can get parasites like mites and common pet parasites, like fleas and ticks, which the average chicken novice may not be able to recognize and can take out the flock. Feeding them is expensive (this IS covered in the article and is the main point), and so is your time in handling and caring for them, as their bedding and pen will need to be mucked out. Chickens are typically more of a hobby unless you get enough eggs that they pay for their own food, but with feed costs up, too, that might be hard.
I grew up reading Storey's Guides to Raising (insert animal here), but I think a decent amount of information can be found on the internet. We raised chickens, usually half a dozen at a time. Our biggest issue was predators, though we did deal with parasites, too. There were at least six different predators we dealt with - coyotes, raccoons, eagle, hawk, owl, ermine. This was pretty traumatizing as a child because once we proofed the coop in one fashion, something else would come up, and another bird or two would be lost.
Other things to know: eggs are pretty shelf stable until they are washed. (Don't get a rooster if you want this to be true.) Wash immediately before food prep and you won't have to refrigerate them, or if you do wash them, refrigerate just as you would do with store bought eggs. The chickens themselves are generally pretty easy and can have delightful personalities. Roosters are hit and miss, would not recommend... but if you get chicks, it is possible some may end up being roosters. Find good homes for them if you can. They can absolutely turn on you and beat you up.
Young chicks will need heat lamps. They need to be raised inside. Once they are big enough to be outside, and are laying, you'll potentially want lights running on timers in their coop in the winter to maintain egg production (not sure if this is still something people do but basically it tricks the chicken's brain into thinking it's still egg-laying season).
A lot of what I know comes from selling chicks at a farm store and raising them myself. They are super cute and can even be snuggly, but if it tells you anything, this isn't really the time I would want to be getting into it. Everything is so expensive right now, and with 6 months of expenses up front before you see ANY ROI... it probably makes sense to keep buying eggs.
Huh, I didn't know this. Do freshly laid eggs have some protective coating that water removes causing them to spoil?
It's more like the water (especially with solvents) makes the shell more permeable for the bacteria that are already on the outside of the egg. Check out https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3951326/ for details (and some super cool pictures from a scanning electron microscope).
So basically if you are a factory, you wash and refrigerate. If you are producing small quantities, you wash before cooking.
My grandmother kept the eggs in a cool cellar (~16°C; basically a cave) without any further treatment until cooking.
Just to add to mordae’s post, washing removes the cuticle from eggs (which is a protective, water soluble coating) which then allows the bacteria on the egg shell to migrate inwards, as they explained.
Yeah. There are some cool images from a scanning electron microscope of the cuticle and pores exposed after washing in the NIH paper. I kinda knew about it before, but this post made me actually look it up and those pictures made it pretty clear what's happening.
In Europe eggs are sold unwashed, and are not expected to be kept in a fridge. Afaik it's only in the USA that eggs are washed, as "consumers" are squeamish about their eggs looking totally clean.
The starting cost as with everything is a lot naturally. I aggree with you, I wouldn't raise chickens for trying to cut on eggs, even if you would raise them for their meat too. They are more like pets tbh who provide you eggs for good care, one upside is that the eggs are good quality, usually better than store bought. I remember them laying their first egg and tbh I don't see it as a downside, it's a good experience imo raising them and seeing them give you their first egg in return. Ofc the eggs are small at first but it is what it is, they gave you as much as they could. I never had problems with parasites though, it might be because they always had a roof above them, as for the ticks/mites we haven't had those either. We might be lucky and it just connected to the location where we live. As for loosing your chickens it's a possibility. We had two chickens that were sort of say "disabled", one had their beak split and the other had a broken leg which healed not in the best way (we recieved them this way). We never had problem with a rooster tbh, even when we had 3 at the same time. They can be pretty sort of say "pissed" when you let them out in the morning, they are all puffed up and breath heavily, though only one "attacked" us in the year we had them. Even the one who "attacked" me only gave me a light peck and I have found a workaroung for it, I believe it might be connected to the pecking order, roosters in the morning beat up the others I think it is to enforce the pecking order but even then they just chase around the chicks, give them a few pecks and eventually calm down, going on with their day. Even the one who pecked me I think they only did because in the morning he was blinded by rage and didn't notice who I was, the workaround was that I waited for him to calm down and eventually I could go outside. Otherwise that he was a kind rooster as all of the 3, never had problem with them. Even if it would see "brutal", them chasing around chickens they never had any injury, not even a light one. And roosters have vary in personality, one of them was a more strict one, who were more protective of the group, the other is (our current rooster) a gentleman, and the last one is the horny type who wanted to get on top of all the chickens. Ofc if the main rooster wouldn't be the one doing the deed they would rush over and stop the other. Aside from that most of the time the chickens wouldn't always let lower postion rooster to get on top of them. The roosters never fought with eachother, the main one would chase around the lower ones and peck them in the morning but aside from that they only had staring contest throughout the day. They never beat up eachother bloody. We ended up cutting down one and gifting the other one to a family friend as 6 chickens couldn't keep up with 3 roosters, it showed it wore them out. Another thing you might have to consider is the deed can get hard on the roosters favourite chickens, as their claws damage the chickens feathers, in extremes leaving their backs exposed. A workaround for this is buying hen saddles to not have them hurt. The chickens have more variety of personalities too, from more curious ones to kind ones, to motherly ones all the way to more unsure ones. They are wonderful animals and I love them. All in all that's all I can say now.
Thanks for the in depth reply! My experience with roosters involves being attacked by one daily as a child until my mom couldn't stand it anymore and had someone come and take him. I don't remember much more than flapping wings and trying to get him to leave me alone, but she has said that I would emerge from the chicken coop with bruises and she had to pull him off me more than once. There's probably a reason I don't remember - it's not something one would want to! So yeah having had that experience, it's something I relay to others. Even though good roosters exist, evil ones do, too. (My favorite male bird has been a huge turkey who showed off, stomped around and quivered for head pets.)
No problem! Yeah maybe we were just lucky to not get that one. If it's that violent than ofc we would get rid of it too, no one wants to get bruised daily by some evil rooster. I think it's defenetily connected to them being pissed off in the morning, in the other parts of the day they are pretty chill (ofc this could vary but as far as I read roosters are on a high alert throughout the day because of the predators). I have thinked about getting a turkey but afaik they are pretty hard to maintain, I heard they get diseases easily. They do make funny sounds though so that's an added benefit. That's cute I like kind animals.
Really appreciate the insights. Did some quick math on feed costing and I can see how it'll add up, even for a small hobby flock.
Thinking about predators, I can only think of a pair of hawks that come around for a few weeks in the spring, the local feral cats and a few snakes the occasional snake so I'll definitely have to consider proofing. There was also a spate of exotic big cat escapes in the last year but I'll have bigger problems if that's in my yard.
Thinking about the headache of roosters and chicks, I'll probably consider mature birds and that'll add to the costs.
So it's definitely a lot to consider.
Thanks.
The maths works out a lot better when you (a) don't feed your hens grain (it's not very good for them, buy proper chicken feed, which is cheaper anyway) and (b) compare like eggs for like. Even the best, most expensive, organic, ultra-free range eggs are not in the same league of quality to an egg still warm from being laid a few minutes ago.
We always bought hens that were approaching laying age because messing about with chicks is a lot of work, and requires more equipment. I don't think I had a hen that was unproductive for more than a few weeks.
You're always going to lose some. No coop is entirely fox/snake/whatever proof, you can only ever deter them not stop them entirely. I've lost entire (small) flocks in a single night to foxes. Also at some point you'll probably have to kill one or two. It's fine, it's part of raising animals and a great learning experience for kids. Although depending on their age maybe don't have them there for the actual deed (especially because it's very easy to go a bit hard on the neck-breaking and... well... things come off). I have always suggested people don't name hens - they're livestock, not pets. Treat them well but they're a resource, not part of the family.
I still think it's worth doing. The eggs are so good. And if you have food scraps, the hens will turn those into more eggs, saving you more money. Plus when you move the coop/run (and you do have to move it a few times a year), the "enhanced" soil it was on is excellent for the garden.
I'm curious if you had any dogs on your property? You mentioned foxes which we don't have a lot of around my parts but raccoons and a few varmints do get in to hen houses. Our dogs kept the property pretty locked down and in the couple years I was living on the farm we didn't lose any chickens.
When we had hens at this house we had two dogs. But they lived inside at night. We're in the middle of a city though, so lots of foxes (some estimates I've read suggest many UK cities have a higher density of foxes than if the cities weren't there!). Had two serious attacks in maybe three years, and some minor ones.
Funnily enough when we lived in the countryside we had no problems with foxes, but we were right next to a grouse shooting estate so the groundskeeper had the fox situation well under control.
Another thing with predators: even if you completely predator-proof the chicken area, there is another predator and it's living in the coop the whole time. Chickens are basically (literally) dinosaurs and if they decide to gang up on one of their own they will literally peck it to death. If you raise enough of them this will happen and it's a PITA.
You are in for a fun time! Getting them as babies is great for making sure they are comfortable around you later on, but it also means you have to keep them indoors for the first 4 weeks at least, with a heat lamp. Your house will smell, unless you have a garage or something. See if you can find a place in your area that rescues discarded chickens!!! You can adopt chickens that are already laying age.
Research the type of predators in your area and do NOT cut corners when it comes to reinforcing you coop and run. Raccoons are real cute until you see one rip a ducks skull open and chomp it's brain while it's still alive. Avoid these traumatic experiences by investing in high quality coop and run design.
Thanks for the advice. Just called the animal shelter and they don't see many discarded chickens in the city but they'll ask around. We did chat about some horrendous chicken operations they help shut down. Illegal meat and egg suppliers are big money and they regularly raid basements or warehouses. It does not sound pretty. Unfortunately, almost all the birds need to be put down.
They did have a lot of details on the local predators and pests. I knew of feral cats, snakes and hawks and planning for it, but there has been a big mite problem lately. I'll also need to lookout for rodants that can sneak into coops and break eggs or spread illnesses.
Consider aerial predators as well. We have lost chickens to birds of prey. Eagles and hawks will both go after chickens. A covered coop is helpful in this regard, and also helps keep flighty chickens contained.
I don't know too much about raising chickens (haven't done it myself), but maybe you can get some actionable information from this YouTuber family I'm following (they are great overall).
https://www.youtube.com/@TheSeasonalHomestead/search?query=chickens
Wish you and your family well.
Hens are fine with kids, just don't get a rooster. And they ARE pretty easy in most cases.
You should insulate the pen a bit and try to keep it out of full sun.
Related, and also worth mentioning since you're somewhere with winter weather, @SloMoMonday, be careful what heat lamps you use in your chicken coop. PTFE/Teflon coated bulbs emit gasses which chickens are especially sensitive to, and it can kill them.
https://www.poultrydvm.com/condition/ptfe-toxicosis
(that site looks like it has a ton of other good info, BTW)
I don't keep chickens but I learned about that when I was researching infrared bulbs for my DIY infrared sauna.
My family used to have a couple of chickens when I was younger. Chickens are fairly docile and can often enjoy being picked up and can be happy with some petting, but they can be incredibly vile creatures too. Their claws aren't just for show. Keep kids away from angry chickens and don't let kids antagonise them.
I was a kid when we had the chickens and I've never had an issue with the ladies. They're happy as long as you feed them and are gentle. An overactive toddler that runs after the chickens may spell trouble.
Take your kid to a petting farm and see how they are around chickens. It could be a teaching moment.
Beware of chicken math !
We have a flock of 7 hens that we got as chicks. Since they can't really be sexxed as chicks we ended up with 2 roosters that we traded for hens from where we got the chicks from. That is something you might want to prepare for if you get them as chicks.
"Pecking order" is a real thing. One of the replacement chicks was not taken well by some of the other girls. There is a difference between a gentle beating and "hate pecking" as I call it. We ended up separating our bullied hen and a really docile companion for her from the rest of the flock for a little bit until the replacement chick was accepted/got big enough.
Chickens are both really good and really bad for your garden/yard. Their poop makes a great fertilizer since it is high in nitrogen. Be sure to mix it in the soil well though since it will burn your plants due to the nitrogen concentration. However, they'll also destroy pretty much any and every plant they come across and forget harvesting any vegetable or fruit they can reach. This will include grass, btw. One of the things we did was buy some of those plastic trough style planters from a box store (3 feet long, maybe 5 inches wide) and planted herbs that are good for chickens (Bee balm, oregano, etc) and put cages around them. They can still pick at the plants but can't get to the roots/stalks so the plant just gets trimmed by them.
Things like roosts and runs can be expensive but they can also be pretty cheap if you're creative enough and have even basic carpentry skills (can use a hammer or drill). We scanned Marketplace and Craigslist for a 10x10 dog kennel ($30) that we put around their night coop (this was premade and we spent way too much money on). We made a laying coop for them (much cheaper than premade coop) and originally it and them in a run that was a portable RV carport thing that we also got used on the cheap off FB ($80). I fashioned a door out of fence pickets ($2 a board) and some 2x4s I had laying around (I am by no means a handyman but it wasn't too hard and wasn't half bad if I do say so). I enclosed it with bird netting and zip ties. I had the legs sitting in 5 gallon buckets of sand and it worked alright for a bit. Unfortunately, a massive gust of wind in a storm flipped it. After that we let them free range in our back yard during the day and put them in the kennel/coop at night.
I don't really think the cost of laying crumbles (food) and grit all that expensive and we give them most of our scraps or ends of things we cut. They're omnivores so they don't just eat vegetables. They'll pick a turkey or chicken carcass clean. They'll turn into little velociraptors when given garden pests like hornworms (the bane of my tomato plants). You can offset their food costs by making friends with a food pantry or produce stand and seeing if they have stuff that they don't think is fit for humans (floppy, wilted or bruised). If it is moldy I wouldn't give that part to the chickens and cut around it.
Our chickens are as much a source of relaxation as a food source for us. We'll sit on the back porch and listen to their coos and "bwwwauuuuuuup"s after a particularly hard day.
I've heard of this chicken math and I'm setting a hard limit of six. But we wont count the ones with names because they're part of the family. And we shouldn't count every 3rd rooster because they make the same noise as 2. And I we cant count gifted birds because they're not really the ones we want.... Yeh, I can see the issue.
The plan is to build the coop with the mountain of scrap I'm hoarding. Picked up a damaged play house and framing it with all the leftover lumber from other projects. Want to have the coop attached to a small inner-run that is completely enclosed. Then I want to use 2.5m rebar poles and wire mesh to frame an outer-run that I can adjust the size of. Also got plenty of shade cloth and tarp around to set up shades if need be but I'm taking down any potential sail the second wind picks up. I do think the whole setup might turn out to turn out a little Mad Max-ish so I might follow your lead with some neat planter boxes.
Thanks for the advice.
I am not a chicken expert, but I grew up around a hobby farm that kept chickens, and got back into keeping some chickens myself a few years ago.
I'll start by saying that @JurisSpecter raises an important issue to consider regarding feed costs and whether you'll actually save money by raising your own eggs. I don't think it's off topic. You also have to consider your investment into the coop, run, and other equipment. I wouldn't recommend doing it just to save money.
Your coop and run sound like a good size, and I think you'll find there is space for more than 5 or 6 birds. I highly recommend building or buying a feeder with a hopper that holds enough grain for a number of days, and automating the door between the coop and the run if possible. That way they are somewhat self sufficient if you can't make it out to the coop on a particular morning for whatever reason.
I've read not to feed layer pellets to hens until they are fully grown, as layer pellets contain too much calcium for birds that are not producing eggs. Laying hens must have either layer pellets or have their feed supplemented with calcium in some form (crushed oyster shellsl in a separate bin are an option, and you can dry and crushed egg shells as well). Also, chickens will intentionally ingest grit to aid in their digestion, and this grit wears out and must be replaced. If they don't have access to soil with small rock particles, you must provide grit for them. Baby chicks need smaller grit then adult birds.
Breed definitely matters for egg production! Hens from some breeds will lay an egg just about daily. Also, some breeds tend to keep producing throughout the winter months, while others stop completely. In my experience (and by the literature), Rhode Island reds lay prolifically and keep producing throughout the winter. Americaunas produce fairly well in the summer, and stop almost entirely in winter. Lots of info is available for egg production numbers for different breeds. If you run a light in their coop during the winter to extend the "daytime," this can increase rates.
It's fun to raise the birds from chicks, and I recommend it. Depending on the breed and the individual birds, you can get them to be quite tame.
They should weather those temps (breed dependent), insulation will make it nicer for them. Definitely make sure they have good ventilation in the heat, and don't let the water freeze.
Eggs are safe to eat right out of the hen, but be aware the shell has been in contact with feces. You can wash them but I've read this removes a protective coating and makes the eggs not last as long. We don't always wash them, but we do if there is poop stuck to the shell. Don't get it in your frying pan.
Our young daughter loves watching the chickens. We have had some tame ones that will come right up to her, but be aware they are curious and investigate anything/everything to see if it's edible by pecking it. Beaks can be painful on small hands. We currently have a somewhat standoffish rooster that I don't trust around her - roosters develop spurs, are frequently protective and sometimes just mean, and are more likely to attack smaller people. Don't trust one around your kids unless you know it well. Hens can also be mean, so maybe don't trust any of them unless you know them well.
Hope this helps. I'm typing on my phone so going to stop now. If you have questions, please ask.
Thanks for the info.
Learning just how important feed is to produce animals and the costing is considerable. I'd like to know how much of their diet can be supplemented with kitchen scraps and waste food. Remember my gran having buckets of stuff for her chickens and even giving them yogurt and cheese curds. She'd even threaten to throw us in the bucket if we were particularly bad.
Been looking at the locally available breeds we have more hardy European breeds like Bantams and Orpingtons. There's one breeder with beautiful American Brahma's but those giants look like a feed vaccuums. We might start with a small mix of docile hybrid breeds to find our footing. If it goes well, we'll consider hand rearing some pure breed chicks next year.
But thanks so much for sharing your experiences. Hope your little girl shows that rooster who's boss.
Yeah, throw them all the scraps you can! You may find things they don't like, but they are pretty voracious and will turn the scraps into eggs.
We also let them out of the run for a portion of the day to free range, and they eat all kinds of things. Just make sure they have feed as well, and as mentioned some source of calcium.
I'd love to get some Buff Orpingtons in the future! Going up we generally had a mix of Rhode Island Reds, Americaunas, and Barred Rocks. We also sometimes had bantams, they are pretty neat.
Our little girl is definitely confident around the chickens, and she'd probably work it out with the rooster, but am still wary when she's around him. I've seen wounds from spurs and they are not pretty.
Best of luck with the chickens! I think you will enjoy your new adventure.
If you live in an urban area in the USA, test your soil for lead. Leaded gasoline as well as some other sources contaminated a lot of land, and chickens can pick that up and pass that through their eggs.
Backyard Chickens and the Risk of Lead Exposure
I don't have advice on raising them but one thing to keep in mind is knowing if the area where you live allows you to have chickens. I lived in a suburban neighborhood where someone had a rooster. That bastard crowed every morning at 7:20 a.m. Animal control eventually came and took them because it wasn't allowed in our area.
I have no experience in raising chickens, but what about avian flu? I can't find a status update other than this June NPR article saying that the most recent outbreak has "eased". Per the US Economic Research Service, egg supplies are recovering, and prices are dropping.
I found this UK blogger's page on protecting backyard flocks easy to follow, but the US Department of Agriculture also has resources. The gist is that you would clean frequently, wear PPE, practice good hygiene, get an automatic feeder, control for rodents, and keep wild fowl out. Legal regulations also vary by city, state, and country. For example, the city of Sacramento, CA, USA has a plethora of requirements, including annual fees per chicken on top of the base permit.
My wife has been raising chickens for about 5 years now. We've gone through ups and downs with them but I know so much more about it then before she talked me in to doing this. My first lesson was that being asked to pick up a pullet at tractor supply with the dog food on my way home from work meant that that I was also getting a group of 9 probably female Chickens to bring home. So as a chicken raiser husband I can tell you that her chickens are super social and shouldn't be raised individually. There are many types of them, my favorites are the "designer" chickens called Silkies or Naked Necks because they look like little feathered muppet dinosaurs. If you live with any predators nearby try not to let your kids name your chickens and also make sure you dig your fence down a couple feet around your coop. We've have had a few cullings of our flocks that have my kids devastated despite our best effort to protect the birds. If you're successful, the eggs you'll get won't need refrigeration at all as long as you don't wash them after their layed... we leave ours on the counter in a decorative spiral wire rack... Gifts of "farm fresh" eggs make great neighbors where a rooster crowing loudly at all waking hours does not. If you find one of your pullets has a rooster Facebook marketplace is a good way to find someone to take it. Oh yeah chickens make an "egg laying" call that is still pretty loud but not as frequent or as annoying as a rooster. Chickens are ok... Good luck with yours! We didn't do it for the money savings but for the overall experience.